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View Poll Results: Hanasaku Iroha - Episode 19 Rating
Perfect 10 5 9.80%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 13 25.49%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 14 27.45%
7 out of 10 : Good 9 17.65%
6 out of 10 : Average 8 15.69%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 2 3.92%
4 out of 10 : Poor 0 0%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 0 0%
Voters: 51. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2011-08-07, 20:08   Link #21
Guardian Enzo
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Say what you will about Minchi, but give her just due as well. She's the only one with the sense to be annoyed by all the stupidity and time-wasting that goes on with this series.
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Old 2011-08-07, 20:15   Link #22
serenade_beta
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Drama!
...About... Omelet Rice...
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Old 2011-08-07, 20:28   Link #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo View Post
Say what you will about Minchi, but give her just due as well. She's the only one with the sense to be annoyed by all the stupidity and time-wasting that goes on with this series.
True, but she often gets drowned into it as well. She could indeed fit in this kind of sensible person role, but like I said she has much to learn from a certain someone.

Sadly this is what I may remember this series in a few years:



You gotta be cooler when you react to fail like...



and can lead up with a witty comment



Also, have people take you seriously when you're angry.

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Old 2011-08-07, 20:28   Link #24
Reckoner
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This episode captures almost everything that is wrong with the show.
  • Too much time spent on little short stories that makes the plot feel extremely superfluous.
  • The comedy is largely hit or miss, and too many times does it come at the cost of humilating some of its characters. While the Ohana fantasy of Kou might've been a tad funny, it desmaculaninated yet another character in this series.
  • Some characters just have to get off the screen. Jinomaru and Enishi are just painful saps of pitiful garbage lying on the side walk that no one wants to spend extended time looking at before they feel they need to GTFO of there like Tomoe in this episode.
  • The lack of an OST really makes the pace in certain spots feel even more slow than it otherwise would be with a sound track to set the mood.
  • The drama leaves its audience very apathetic to the events at play. Who the fuck cares about omelette rice? I actually cheered when Minko bitched that girl out. I mean wtf, are we freaking 5 years old?
  • The main theme of this show, learning to love your work, is really poorly integrated and feels overly forced at times into the show in a manner that makes the show seem preachy. I mean first we take a cliche plot line in this story like a cultural festival, and then we force in the idea of a cafe because it has to do with their work. We then showcase our characters loving to do what they're always doing, WORKING... There's learning to love your work, and then there's being obsessed with your work for unknown reasons. I don't feel this show has adequately answered why they love their work so much and what i means to them, the characters that is.
  • Underdeveloped cast. It is shocking to me that at this point we're still wasting time on episode arcs dedicated to specific characters which are supposed to unveil some greater understanding to many of the side cast when these said arcs in general have done very little for most of the characters. I mean look at Tomoe, what have we learned about her since her episode? In fact, she's barely had any screen time at all this episode for example except having to listen to Enishi make a fool of himself.

So once again I'm left befuddled by yet another Hanasaku episode that had extremely haphazard pacing and character development, and plot, and comedy, or what have you. 6/10
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Old 2011-08-07, 20:32   Link #25
marcosius
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bluescissors View Post
Who knows, Kou could be Beanman's grandson.
I don't think so, it would very farfetched to me. But the fact that Mameji have a son was really unexpected.
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Old 2011-08-07, 21:06   Link #26
Guardian Enzo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Archon_Wing View Post
True, but she often gets drowned into it as well. She could indeed fit in this kind of sensible person role, but like I said she has much to learn from a certain someone.

Sadly this is what I may remember this series in a few years:



You gotta be cooler when you react to fail like...



and can lead up with a witty comment



Also, have people take you seriously when you're angry.

Ah, but that's not a fair comparison. HanaIro long ago fell out of any possible comparison with TT, and comparing Minchi with Hiromi - a minor character in a lightweight entertainment with a major character in a substantial drama - doesn't give her a chance. Okada-sensei has made her choices with this show, and it seems that includes quite deliberately making it insubstantial and unfocused.

You could watch anime for many a season and not run into more than a few characters as well-written and complex as Hiromi...
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Old 2011-08-07, 21:14   Link #27
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Crossdressing Kou? lols

In any case, it's good to have him back, and still THE major player in Ohana's heart. Not that I care much anymore... Yuina > all XD
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Old 2011-08-07, 21:30   Link #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo View Post
Ah, but that's not a fair comparison. HanaIro long ago fell out of any possible comparison with TT, and comparing Minchi with Hiromi - a minor character in a lightweight entertainment with a major character in a substantial drama - doesn't give her a chance. Okada-sensei has made her choices with this show, and it seems that includes quite deliberately making it insubstantial and unfocused.

You could watch anime for many a season and not run into more than a few characters as well-written and complex as Hiromi...
Yes, but if there are role models to set standards for us, why not aim higher? Certainly some character traits work better than others. It's true it's unfair to make such comparisons, it is not the same type of show, but I think there's always standards for character quality. I purposely took the more superficial aspects here. It's not like I'm asking for in depth character studies.

And unfortunately, whatever Okada's reasons are, I still need to be able to take a character's struggle seriously even if this is supposed to be a more lighthearted series even if they may not be so deep.

But even with that all in mind, Minchi currently doesn't have that much to bring to the table to warrant 2 episodes at this point in the anime to be about her.

Sadly, instead of standing out on its own, this anime is starting to come across as Diet Tears to me.

Though TBH, I just wanted to post pics of Hiromi. Apologies.
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Old 2011-08-07, 21:56   Link #29
Guardian Enzo
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NEVER apologize for posting picture of Hiromi-dono.

I completely agree that we've seen nothing from Minchi to this point to justify wasting, sorry, devoting two episodes to her non-existent character arc. Which puts her in company with everyone in the show not named Ohana, Kou or Satsuki.

If you're going to compare, I guess you may as well use the finest example of the author's own work as a benchmark - valid point. If the current model doesn't measure up, guess that's just too bad.
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Old 2011-08-07, 22:04   Link #30
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So I assume that this show will never be judged on its own merits and will forever live in the comparative shadow of its predecessor?

Thank god I didn't like True Tears, so I can at least try and watch it with fewer biases. Helps me remember that this show isn't True Tears and isn't trying to be that show or any of it's characters (for better or for worse, YMMV). I still say that all the analysis and criticism of the show with True Tears as a template for most of them feels hollow and unfair.
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Old 2011-08-07, 22:09   Link #31
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Oh Tsurugi, you're such a cool beauty with a sharp tongue. The look on her face whenever she's embarassed is just priceless. I am however surprised that her bust size is rather small.
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Old 2011-08-07, 22:17   Link #32
Reckoner
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MeoTwister5 View Post
So I assume that this show will never be judged on its own merits and will forever live in the comparative shadow of its predecessor
What may these merits be? Excluding episodes 1, 2, and like 9-11 perhaps. What has this show done particularly well that deserves a lot of attention ignoring scenery porn.
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Old 2011-08-07, 22:21   Link #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MeoTwister5 View Post
So I assume that this show will never be judged on its own merits and will forever live in the comparative shadow of its predecessor?

Thank god I didn't like True Tears, so I can at least try and watch it with fewer biases. Helps me remember that this show isn't True Tears and isn't trying to be that show or any of it's characters (for better or for worse, YMMV). I still say that all the analysis and criticism of the show with True Tears as a template for most of them feels hollow and unfair.
Actually I'm not actually a fanboy of True Tears either; in fact I only watched a couple of episodes of that. I finished the series after I was about halfway done with Hana Iro. So rest assued, I was never judging the show along the expectations of "OMG this isn't True Tears." My opinion of Hana Saku's been pretty consistent even without knowledge of TT.

I don't fanboy over series; I do fanboy over characters. Hiromi's not really one of my favorites, but I really do like that kind of character. So when I look at Minichi, I keep thinking, she needs some tips.

Note that I never compared the stories or the atmosphere, because I understand they are meant to be different. However, presentation is something that if you already succeed in, I see no need to reinvent the wheel. It's not the same as copying and pasting, it's just knowing a winning formula and working with it.

But even if we don't compare the stories, there's many attributes of presentation that Hana Saku Iroha lacks. One of them is the BGM, which has been very lacking in this episode and past ones. This is just one of the few issues where I feel like they're not putting the same kind of effort or care and goes beyond the themes or intention of either series. Basically, even if True Tears didn't exist, I'd be saying the same thing, but I'd just be posting pics of something else.

The true comparison between the two, is that one of them let me ignore its flaws a lot more than the other...
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Old 2011-08-07, 22:31   Link #34
MeoTwister5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reckoner View Post
What may these merits be? Excluding episodes 1, 2, and like 9-11 perhaps. What has this show done particularly well that deserves a lot of attention ignoring scenery porn.
Wasn't my point actually. I was talking about whatever merits you find in this show (which obviously differs per person), they would be put up in comparison with Okada Mari's earlier works and ultimately judged on the basis of whether they were worse, match or surpass them, as if it would be the only basis of criticism. I think there are more ways to try and criticize the show than simply saying that Okada's x wasn't better than Okada's y. In the same way that I wouldn't simply write off or praise the show based solely on, say, her work in Ano Hina or Aria.

It's just an observation of mine that whenever it was time for people to judge the show, True Tears is always used as a static basis of comparison when other basis could also be used.
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Old 2011-08-07, 22:32   Link #35
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Much like what Guardian Enzo wrote after last episode, personal taste can be an amazingly varied thing.

With that in mind, I kind of liked this episode, and wavered between a 8 or 9/10, and settled on 8/10.

More takes on this episode in the spoiler space below (mainly to save space)


Spoiler for Episode 19 thoughts:
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Old 2011-08-07, 22:44   Link #36
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Originally Posted by MeoTwister5 View Post
It's just an observation of mine that whenever it was time for people to judge the show, True Tears is always used as a static basis of comparison when other basis could also be used.
I'm not one of the people constantly comparing this anime to True Tears for a comparison but there is legitimacy to people using True Tears as a base of comparison, like or dislike Hana Iro.

For one thing, not only is the writer the same, but the studio is the same. As viewers who may be familiar with this studio's past work, there is a certain level of expectation that comes with that. This includes a well told story, likable and developed character, and more. True Tears and Hana Iro, even if they are very different thematically, are both character centric stories about normal life.

To expect some basis of equal or better quality on these aspects, which have little to nothing to do with the kind of story being told, with a previous work of the studio is perfectly legitimate IMO.

No it doesn't have to be the next love triangle drama story with pretty visuals, but it better carry the same level of quality and detail that its predecessor had. Otherwise there is bound to be disappointment.
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Old 2011-08-07, 22:55   Link #37
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Could we please keep the references to TT to a minimum, please?
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Old 2011-08-07, 22:58   Link #38
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Could we please keep the references to TT to a minimum, please?
Done. If anyone wants to continue with me, they can continue in the general thread or w/e.

Crap, I wasn't meaning this to be such serious business.
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Old 2011-08-07, 23:10   Link #39
Reckoner
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Who else hates omelet rice girl? I thought her reaction was juvenile. She deserved a backhand to her face. She got off easy with Minko's scorn.
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Old 2011-08-07, 23:13   Link #40
Archon_Wing
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Who else hates omelet rice girl? I thought her reaction was juvenile. She deserved a backhand to her face. She got off easy with Minko's scorn.
Hmm, I would hate her, but she's too much of a peasant to be hated with losers like Jinomaru, Takako, and irrelevant guy.

Also, today's hate was reserved for Yuina for acting artificially cheery. It's been getting a bit too much.
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