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View Poll Results: Steins;Gate - Episode 19 Rating
Perfect 10 40 47.06%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 26 30.59%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 11 12.94%
7 out of 10 : Good 8 9.41%
6 out of 10 : Average 0 0%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 0 0%
4 out of 10 : Poor 0 0%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 0 0%
Voters: 85. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2011-08-09, 23:00   Link #81
yuzen003
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Originally Posted by Reckoner View Post
The point is, Mayuri ends up dying in all these time lines precisely because of Moeka's actions with SERN. She is destined to death precisely because of her killing her on that day. Whether she knows about it or not in this timeline, her actions have already put them in the situation they are in.
I think that's up to debate, Okabe has learned that you will die when you are destined to die so is Mayuri's death set by the initial death by Moeka or did Moeka only kill her because it was time for her to die? In the current timeline it appears SERN is not even trying to capture the group but Mayuri still dies from unrelated causes.

Is it even possible to die before you are supposed to? I know Okabe wouldn't try with Mayuri, but he's got another test subject now (not that I think he would test it for ethical reasons).

Last edited by yuzen003; 2011-08-09 at 23:11.
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Old 2011-08-09, 23:10   Link #82
Jean Claymore
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Originally Posted by yuzen003 View Post
I think that's up to debate, Okabe has learned that you will die when you are destined to die so is Mayuri's death set by the initial death by Moeka or did Moeka only kill her because it was time for her to die? In the current timeline it appears SERN is not even trying to capture the group but Mayuri still dies from unrelated causes.
Yeah, FWIW it seems Mayuri's death is certain. I don't think her lifespan already ran out, but since Okabe hasn't found her 'cause of death', no matter in what situation she is she'll end up being killed.

Still laughing my ass off watching the scene Okabe hitting Moeka Oh boy, I could watch it for hours(originally posted in MAL)

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Old 2011-08-09, 23:17   Link #83
Archon_Wing
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FB FB FB FB why won't you respond? Damn facebook stalkers.

Excellent episode. It did a good job of showcasing just how much Okabe has gone down this path; where he's just so friggin obsessed with saving Mayuri.

And now he's willing to do anything, even if it means breaking Moeka. The atmosphere of that whole scene was pretty creepy and was one of the more thrilling parts of the anime, including 1 but 2 false starts where the Dmail does nothing! And we have the neighbors who are more concerned with the noise rather than what's happening.

Moeka herself became of interest. Apparently her self worth was so low that she would obey the orders of anyone willing to give her a place. It's said that most dangerous kind of fanaticism arises from desperation and despair, and they've successfully created someone that would kill even if they knew they were being used. But fortunately, this kind of manipulative tactic can often be broken by a genuine effort like what Okabe did here, laying out the whole situation and hammering in the facts that she will die and nobody, including FB will give a shit and the answer is revealed.

Kurisu also played a good support role, and it's kinda clear now that she cares quite deeply about Okabe.

Anyhow, I can't wait to see the next episode. 10/10
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Old 2011-08-09, 23:45   Link #84
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I honestly can't understand why Moeka is getting relentlessly white-knighted like this. Reckoner's got the right of it, she's already committed crimes even in this world's timeline, stealing the computer and selling out Okabe & Co. to SERN which is inevitably leading the world to tragedy.

I felt sorry for Moeka, she is tragic character in all this like several of the other heroines, but let's not sugarcoat it too much. Her self admission that she'd kill someone innocent if a text message from her benefactor told her too says everything.

In this instance, FB is essentially Charles Manson and Moeka is one of the Manson Family. In this timeline she's only gone to Mary Brunner levels of psychotic devotion to him but is more than willing to upgrade to Susan Atkins level at the drop of a hat if FB requests it.

Anyway, great episode, very intense and it's nice to get back to the central plotline after the detours with Rukako & Feris. 10/10 one of the best in the series so far.
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Old 2011-08-10, 00:33   Link #85
yuzen003
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Originally Posted by matapat View Post
I honestly can't understand why Moeka is getting relentlessly white-knighted like this. Reckoner's got the right of it, she's already committed crimes even in this world's timeline, stealing the computer and selling out Okabe & Co. to SERN which is inevitably leading the world to tragedy.
Personally, I just keep seeing people repeat the claims that Moeka sold out the group in this timeline or killed Mayuri as justification, but since she lacks the Reading Steiner ability, hasn't met the group in this timeline, and SERN is not attempting to capture the group she cannot do either of those in this timeline. There are plenty of reasons to punch her, her working for an evil organization aiming for world domination and he needs her phone at all costs would be more than enough. If the crime is stealing the IBN from the shrine that is a fact and I agree that's a reason to punch her, I just dispute the claims that the crimes of one timeline should carry over to another but others will think differently so I'll let the matter drop.

Seperately Suzuha was present before Moeka sent the d-mail so there must have been a dystopia prior to SERN obtaining the IBN, so claims that she is inevitably leading the world to tragedy might be an exaggeration.

Last edited by yuzen003; 2011-08-10 at 00:51.
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Old 2011-08-10, 00:46   Link #86
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Originally Posted by Midonin View Post
My answer to that is "Make sure the guy gets into art school". In this case, Moeka's "art school" is becoming a member of the lab.
Please, do not use Adolf Hitler as example ever. For all the every horrible things that have happened in World War II, we may not have things like the decolonization to happen, various people on Asuki would not even fucking born, for their birth are results of circumstances spawned from World War II.
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Old 2011-08-10, 01:06   Link #87
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Regarding Okarin, he is just human like the others and here is a fine quote from a certain manga - "Reason has no strength when up against instinct".
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Old 2011-08-10, 02:35   Link #88
Sheba
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Originally Posted by Utsuro no Hako View Post
You and I can't because we don't know the future. Our situation is not at all comparable to Okabe, who's facing a classic, "If you could go back in time, would you kill baby Hitler?" situation.
The world after Hitler is arguably better than the world before World War II.

In steins,gate, the future is much worse and pretty much in a dead end because of Sern and its absolute monopoly on time machine. We had the luxury to think and consider the consequences of killing Hitler, and why it is actually a bad idea. Okabe had John Titor to make him understand why the time machine is a bad idea in the long run.
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Old 2011-08-10, 03:05   Link #89
Dawnstorm
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Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
The irony is that at the end of the day, Moeka's unflinching dedication to "FB" is almost like a dark mirror image of Okabe's unflinching dedication to Mayuri. To have this anime's lead protagonist share a prominent character trait with the closest thing this anime has to a lead antagonist so far is deliciously poetic, and adds to how memorable Steins;Gate will likely prove to be for me.
This. Especially with respect to what he's done in the last two episodes. "Accepting what happens to you" (which is the only option you have without a time machine) has just become a matter of choosing world-lines according to your own selfish priorities...

***

This preview...

Spoiler for speculation:


***

Also: I find it interesting that everybody focusses on the punch. From Moeka's perspective, having the phone taken away was much more cruel. (And it can't have been easy for him.

@Landlady: I wonder if what Moeka was screaming ("Kaeshite"?) could be misheard or misinterpreted in Japanese to have sexual meaning? As if she were screaming in English "Give it to me!" (Just wondering; my Japanese is atrocious.)
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Old 2011-08-10, 04:01   Link #90
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I never thought it would happen, but this episode managed to make me feel pity for Moeka. It's become clear that she is also a victim in this story. FB, whoever he is, pretty much brainwashed her and then discarded her once she outlived her usefulness. If there's any real villain in this show, he's the one.

As for the controversial punch, you guys are blowing this issue it out of proportion. Okabe didn't punch her only for the sake of punching her or to punish her for her crimes, he did it because that hysterical bitch wouldn't let go of her freaking phone. He tried to talk her but she wouldn't listen. Tell me, what was he supposed to do exactly? Wait until she killed herself and retrieve the phone afterwards? That sure would have been more admirable to let her die, wouldn't it?

Anyway...

When was the time leap's limit extended to 4 days? I thought Okabe could only go back 48 hours into the past. Could he go even further back in time? I wish they'd tell us those things.

Once again, I was a bit puzzled by Okabe's lack of insight. After he found out Moeka was a spy, he should have considered the option that she didn't send a D-mail pertaining to her cellphone. Checking the history's Moeka's phone would have also been the very first thing I would have done after the first D-mail failed. I'll just assume Okabe wasn't thinking straight after what had just happened.
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Old 2011-08-10, 04:18   Link #91
Kirroha
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Originally Posted by Kanon View Post
When was the time leap's limit extended to 4 days? I thought Okabe could only go back 48 hours into the past. Could he go even further back in time? I wish they'd tell us those things.
It wasn't 4 days. He only jumped back 2 days, but because of his undoing of Ruka and Feyris' D-mails, they both pushed Mayuri's death back 1 day each. So 2+2=4 days left for him to save Mayuri.
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Old 2011-08-10, 04:27   Link #92
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Originally Posted by Kanon View Post
I never thought it would happen, but this episode managed to make me feel pity for Moeka. It's become clear that she is also a victim in this story. FB, whoever he is, pretty much brainwashed her and then discarded her once she outlived her usefulness. If there's any real villain in this show, he's the one.
True, at first, I really hated Moeka but now I see that there's more to her than just being an Abstergo SERN agent. People like her are the sort of people they can use to do any job for them, and perhaps carry out human experiments on as well. It's good that Okabe came when he did, or she'd have never broken out of her mad obsession.

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Originally Posted by Kanon View Post
As for the controversial punch, you guys are blowing this issue it out of proportion. Okabe didn't punch her only for the sake of punching her or to punish her for her crimes, he did it because that hysterical bitch wouldn't let go of her freaking phone. He tried to talk her but she wouldn't listen. Tell me, what was he supposed to do exactly? Wait until she killed herself and retrieve the phone afterwards? That sure would have been more admirable to let her die, wouldn't it?
There is that, and when you're stuck in that situation, and you have to do something to save the life of someone so important to you, then you have to do whatever it takes to get to where you want to be. That's why I have respect for Okabe here. When not getting the phone off of her meant letting her and the person who'se as good as a sister to him die, something had to be done. Chivalry and ethics had no place under the circumstances.
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Old 2011-08-10, 04:49   Link #93
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When was the time leap's limit extended to 4 days? I thought Okabe could only go back 48 hours into the past. Could he go even further back in time? I wish they'd tell us those things.
It's easy to assume that he time leaped twice. He did the same thing in Suzuha's arc to gain as much time as possible.

Quote:
Once again, I was a bit puzzled by Okabe's lack of insight. After he found out Moeka was a spy, he should have considered the option that she didn't send a D-mail pertaining to her cellphone. Checking the history's Moeka's phone would have also been the very first thing I would have done after the first D-mail failed. I'll just assume Okabe wasn't thinking straight after what had just happened.
Well, he started checking her history but went back into the apartment fearing that Moeka's screams would attract unwanted attention.
BTW Okarin is kinda stupid. He actually believed that Moeka sent herself a D-mail just to keep her old phone! I mean, hello? She is a SERN's spy! It isn't difficult to figure out that the phone thing was just an excuse.
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Old 2011-08-10, 05:15   Link #94
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Chivalry and ethics had no place under the circumstances.
Actually it does. People simply have little to no problem with Okabe atm because he hasn't done anything extreme... Otherwise you would've the same respect for FB and SERN.

Quote:
That sure would have been more admirable to let her die
A pretty good chance he would've let her die if it doesn't get in his way of saving Mayuri.
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Old 2011-08-10, 05:20   Link #95
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Actually it does. People simply have little to no problem with Okabe atm because he hasn't done anything extreme...
Eh, I've seen differently here. It's true that he hasn't done anything extreme, but considering the heat of the situation, I doubt any of that would've been in mind when he was trying to get the phone off Moeka's hands.

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A pretty good chance he would've let her die if it doesn't get in his way of saving Mayuri.
Which is actually doesn't. What Okabe needed was the phone and to send the D-mail from it (altho he does later find out it's better to send it from another phone), but considering Okabe has also taken pity for her, I doubt he would let her die either anyways. It's more correct to say that Okabe would let her die if it meant saving Mayuri, but that's not the case either.
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Old 2011-08-10, 06:04   Link #96
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Bleh, be glad he didn't lynch her, that was some amazing constraint on his part, if it was me i would've bathed her in a sea of knifes.
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Old 2011-08-10, 06:56   Link #97
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Lol that was freaking brutal. First he punches her and steals her phone, then he mind rapes her by making her see the timeline where she commits suicide. Can't blame him for it though. I do pity Moeka but he had reasons for doing both of those things. Kanon's right, he punched her to get the phone (though I don't doubt that he was glad to do so)
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Old 2011-08-10, 07:21   Link #98
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Moeka is a crazy bitch. FB will be Mayuri herself or Kirusu
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Old 2011-08-10, 08:38   Link #99
Essa Maneira
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Which is actually doesn't. What Okabe needed was the phone and to send the D-mail from it (altho he does later find out it's better to send it from another phone), but considering Okabe has also taken pity for her, I doubt he would let her die either anyways. It's more correct to say that Okabe would let her die if it meant saving Mayuri, but that's not the case either.
That worldline has decided that both Mayuri and Moeka will die. no choice but Okabe needs to fight it.
Spoiler for IF: After finding IBN 5100:
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Old 2011-08-10, 08:43   Link #100
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Originally Posted by Essa Maneira View Post
That worldline has decided that both Mayuri and Moeka will die. no choice but Okabe needs to fight it.
Spoiler for IF: After finding IBN 5100:
There is that, but I don't think that in the worldline, Moeka's and Mayuri's deaths are interconnected. I've got the distinct impression that the two are mutually exclusive. As long as Okabe is able to get his traces erased from Abstergo's SERN's database, that should be enough to bring them back to the previous world-line where the lab members are still unknown to them.
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