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Old 2011-08-25, 20:03   Link #13661
Kenju of the Right
Imagine Breaker
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
*Joins GREMLIN*

I believe it was just to find him. And it crashing was probably just for fun
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He believes.
Even though he’s tired and one leg’s in the coffin, he believes.
He believes in his right fist,
in the path that his weapon creates,
in the scene when his weapon brutally hits the enemy’s body,
that his victory will bring about a wonderful future.
Kamijou Touma’s actions are based on trust.-

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Old 2011-08-25, 20:12   Link #13662
Mr.Kyon
I crack you up
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Age: 20
I think Gremlin is a pretty cool guy, eh crashes fortress and doesn't afraid of anything.
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Old 2011-08-25, 20:18   Link #13663
Kenju of the Right
Imagine Breaker
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Hell yeah their cool, an enemy of the science side is a friend of mine
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He believes.
Even though he’s tired and one leg’s in the coffin, he believes.
He believes in his right fist,
in the path that his weapon creates,
in the scene when his weapon brutally hits the enemy’s body,
that his victory will bring about a wonderful future.
Kamijou Touma’s actions are based on trust.-

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Old 2011-08-25, 20:40   Link #13664
Chaos2Frozen
The Evil Within
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Drangelic, or by a different name...
Age: 25
Have you guys wondered... If [Gremlin] was really an enemy of science, why did they use the Radiosonde Balloons in the first place? And why did they intentionally build a replica (of sorts) of the Star of Bethlehem to DROP onto the Earth?

It's got to be more than a bad sense of humor.
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Old 2011-08-25, 20:46   Link #13665
leukrota
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
... a TERRIBLE sense of humor?
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Old 2011-08-25, 21:57   Link #13666
Kuroi Hadou
Dark Energy
 
 
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Location: United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leukrota View Post
... a TERRIBLE sense of humor?
Probably symbolic irony.
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Old 2011-08-26, 00:19   Link #13667
leukrota
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
The talk on another thread about the limits of Imagine Breaker made me think about something.

Here are two quotes from Birdway on NT2:
Quote:
Imagine Breaker works exceedingly well when it is normalizing abnormal values, but it does not show much power when dealing with something that is uniform from the start. It only carries out destruction of things that have already had their harmony taken. ...For example, he does not destroy someone's soul when he touches them, and he does not destroy the planet when he touches it. Yet those things do indeed have supernatural power flowing through them.
Quote:
This isn't just limited to Imagine Breaker. Natural powers like yours are often initially set to conform to the environment or situation. And the natural Gemstones are people who received psychic powers via stimuli from the environment of Earth.
Would this mean that Imagine Breaker doesn't work well against Gemstones?
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Old 2011-08-26, 00:36   Link #13668
Drifting Wolf
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2011
I think what the statement implies is that Imagine Breaker itself is conformed to stopping things that have abnormalities, essentially magic and AIM. That is how it has 'changed' or 'adapted' to the situation at hand.

The same can be applied for Gemstones. Their powers are derived from the changes in environment and stimuli around them, affecting their Personal Reality and the growth of their powers. Imagine Breaker still works fine on them, it's just that since Gemstones get their power naturally, it's 'designed' to work best for them like how animals evolve and adapt to environments by mutating and stuff.\

Hence why Gemstones often have 'unexplained' ways of using their powers or have strange ones like 'Deep Blood'. They don't work within the boundaries of Science that creates Espers. They work 'outside' scientific methods of gaining their powers.
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Old 2011-08-26, 00:49   Link #13669
leukrota
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Oh, I see what she meant now.

Thanks for the input.

... now I really want to see Touma spar with Gunha, to see him "break" something that is beyond imagination.
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Old 2011-08-26, 00:50   Link #13670
Chaos2Frozen
The Evil Within
 
 
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Location: Drangelic, or by a different name...
Age: 25
Then the next question I guess is why is Imagine Breaker not considered a Gemstone power?
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Old 2011-08-26, 00:57   Link #13671
Kuroi Hadou
Dark Energy
 
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
Then the next question I guess is why is Imagine Breaker not considered a Gemstone power?
Probably because they had no way of measuring it. Touma was classified as Level 0; wouldn't a Gemstone power imply at least Level 1?
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Old 2011-08-26, 00:59   Link #13672
leukrota
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
Then the next question I guess is why is Imagine Breaker not considered a Gemstone power?
Good question... I think the only thing to go by is the fact that a genius like Kumokawa realized that he wasn't a Gemstone... I can only guess that despite some of them being unexplainable, they still must have something in common.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kuroi Hadou View Post
Probably because they had no way of measuring it. Touma was classified as Level 0; wouldn't a Gemstone power imply at least Level 1?
We don't even know if Himegami has an assigned level... Without vampires, how do you measure her power?
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Old 2011-08-26, 01:01   Link #13673
Marcus H.
Hunk o' Burning Love
 
 
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Quote:
Without vampires, how do you measure her power?
And even there are vampires, her powers are still as indescribable as "her powers kills vampires, end of story".
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Old 2011-08-26, 01:01   Link #13674
Kuroi Hadou
Dark Energy
 
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leukrota View Post
We don't even know if Himegami has an assigned level... Without vampires, how do you measure her power?
Except Touma's power was measured in the prologue of Volume 1, where the #3 Level 5 couldn't do a thing to him.

Himegami's power is a very specific phenomena; Touma's isn't.
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Old 2011-08-26, 01:07   Link #13675
Drifting Wolf
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Because Gemstones still emit AIM and emit huge amounts of it while Imagine Breaker emits... nothing? It doesn't even register on a scanner.
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Old 2011-08-26, 01:10   Link #13676
Chaos2Frozen
The Evil Within
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Drangelic, or by a different name...
Age: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kuroi Hadou View Post
Probably because they had no way of measuring it. Touma was classified as Level 0; wouldn't a Gemstone power imply at least Level 1?
I don't think that's it though- There's something about the nature of IB that Kumokawa thinks is different.

Quote:
And the natural Gemstones are people who received psychic powers via stimuli from the environment of Earth.
That might be a clue.
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Old 2011-08-26, 01:12   Link #13677
Kuroi Hadou
Dark Energy
 
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
I don't think that's it though- There's something about the nature of IB that Kumokawa thinks is different.
A divine origin?
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Old 2011-08-26, 01:14   Link #13678
Chaos2Frozen
The Evil Within
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Drangelic, or by a different name...
Age: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kuroi Hadou View Post
A divine origin?
You know, that term was never really used at all in the light novel ?

By definition, since Saints get their powers from the Son of God, that too can be considered [Divine Origin].
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Old 2011-08-26, 01:17   Link #13679
Kuroi Hadou
Dark Energy
 
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
You know, that term was never really used at all in the light novel ?
I know it's not.

Quote:
By definition, since Saints get their powers from the Son of God, that too can be considered [Divine Origin].
So can the member's of God's Right Seat, who have attributes of the Archangels and draw their powers from them. At the very least, there's no way in hell (pun not intended) Fiamma got the Holy Right without divine help.
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Old 2011-08-26, 01:25   Link #13680
leukrota
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Drifting Wolf View Post
Because Gemstones still emit AIM and emit huge amounts of it while Imagine Breaker emits... nothing? It doesn't even register on a scanner.
I don't think it's that simple, or Kumokawa wouldn't have investigated herself whether he was one or not. Judging from Kaizumi Tsugutoshi, the board of directors probably thought that he was a Gemstone, at least until Kumokawa's evaluation (if she even shared her discovery with them, maybe they still think he is one.)
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