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Old 2010-07-18, 14:28   Link #141
MikaMiaka
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Join Date: May 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zaseka View Post
Oh my, I wasn't aware that I was talking to Odagiri's lawyer :P No, I'm just pointing out my observations, if you can't see the "accidental similarities", then that is up to you. And for me, that is a form of plagiarism, maybe I'm over critical duo to being an artist myself, but it's just my 5 cents on the topic.

I don't really see any obvious plot similarities between uraboku and vk, tho. Now that would have really been a tad too much. It's just that we have all read a pile loads of fiction that deals with reincarnation, dragons, vampires, demons and such things, so we always like to relate things. But that is just how our minds work. I agree with MikaMiaka that it's a compiled work of various sources. And that is really what an original story is, you just have to make sure nobody else can directly trace back your sources.
Hmm, I don't know if I agree with your last sentence. It's a bit macabre to think that no real original art exists! That something we think original is but a plagiarized copy of an untraceable source -- that takes a nuanced level of admiration out of one's love for any given art.

As for the "accidental similarities" , I think maybe you're just mistaking genre animes for blatant plagiarism, a word I too think is too strong. It's basically about a group coming together to protect a female/male protagonist who will then lead them on a war that will demolish the dark side. Along the way, there are secret passages wherever they are living or traveling, an unfailingly loyal pet or best friend comes along for the journey and helps in little ways, a really cold but caring hot guy with a dreamy voice who is usually the main love interest, a hot headed individual, a cultured doctor, etc. The archetypes are in ALL of these reverse harem/BL harem titles. It's kinda the thing for this genre, it seems to me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by xxkathxx View Post
remind me if i'm wrong ... i just watched the latest episode. Yuki knows he & Luka were bound by a contract?

I don't think the anime has addressed that question yet.... i know the manga did in volume 2 or 3 (can't remember)
I don't know about the manga, but it seems like Yuki knows cause he was talking about it. But it seems like we aren't really told what the contract is yet. But Yuki spoke about it as if he knew all about it. Hmm.
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Old 2010-07-18, 17:35   Link #142
Irkalla
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikaMiaka View Post
Hmm, I don't know if I agree with your last sentence. It's a bit macabre to think that no real original art exists! That something we think original is but a plagiarized copy of an untraceable source -- that takes a nuanced level of admiration out of one's love for any given art.

As for the "accidental similarities" , I think maybe you're just mistaking genre animes for blatant plagiarism, a word I too think is too strong. It's basically about a group coming together to protect a female/male protagonist who will then lead them on a war that will demolish the dark side. Along the way, there are secret passages wherever they are living or traveling, an unfailingly loyal pet or best friend comes along for the journey and helps in little ways, a really cold but caring hot guy with a dreamy voice who is usually the main love interest, a hot headed individual, a cultured doctor, etc. The archetypes are in ALL of these reverse harem/BL harem titles. It's kinda the thing for this genre, it seems to me.
That is just my personal belief, I don't believe in absolute originality, not even in people. Chuck was right on with his, "nothing of me is original, I'm the combined effort of everyone I have ever known." And I think the same goes for art of any kind. In the end, it's just up to the fact that you use the knowledge you posses, twist it to make something that wasn't done too often before, and voilà, you have what is considered "original."

I wasn't talking about any kinda plot similarities, just the art, cover compositions and character designs that have basically the same attributes as the ones in Vk. And no, I can't just let this pass with the character archetype argument. So as far as I go, there are too many similarities for one not to notice the source/s. I have no beef with the plot itself, because, as you said, it's common in comics, and it's common for a reason. It just works, most of the time at least. You can't really say no to bishies and heavenly voices, yep.
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Old 2010-07-18, 18:35   Link #143
MikaMiaka
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zaseka View Post
That is just my personal belief, I don't believe in absolute originality, not even in people. Chuck was right on with his, "nothing of me is original, I'm the combined effort of everyone I have ever known." And I think the same goes for art of any kind. In the end, it's just up to the fact that you use the knowledge you posses, twist it to make something that wasn't done too often before, and voilà, you have what is considered "original."

I wasn't talking about any kinda plot similarities, just the art, cover compositions and character designs that have basically the same attributes as the ones in Vk. And no, I can't just let this pass with the character archetype argument. So as far as I go, there are too many similarities for one not to notice the source/s. I have no beef with the plot itself, because, as you said, it's commodn in comics, and it's common for a reason. It just works, most of the time at least. You can't really say no to bishies and heavenly voices, yep.
It's not really an argument. It's just a statement of fact. The characters are archetypes. But you think the details are enough to label it plagiarism. I disagree. The plot being different supports the non-plagiarism stance.
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Old 2010-07-18, 21:24   Link #144
karice67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zaseka View Post
That is just my personal belief, I don't believe in absolute originality, not even in people. Chuck was right on with his, "nothing of me is original, I'm the combined effort of everyone I have ever known." And I think the same goes for art of any kind. In the end, it's just up to the fact that you use the knowledge you posses, twist it to make something that wasn't done too often before, and voilà, you have what is considered "original."
I somewhat agree with you here - people are products of their environment. And as they grow up and encounter more, it becomes harder to do something that someone else hasn't done before, especially in this media-saturated world. But to a certain extent, it sounds like it all depends on semantics - i.e. how you define what it means to be "original", as compared to MikaMiaka, or to others.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zaseka View Post
I wasn't talking about any kinda plot similarities, just the art, cover compositions and character designs that have basically the same attributes as the ones in Vk. .
We've given our opinions on the character designs (though I'd possibly say more if I knew both artists work better - neither are on my 'must-buy' list)...but I personally don't pay enough attention to cover layouts (and haven't read most VK chapters for ages anyway). Would you mind actually posting some comparison shots so that we can see exactly what you're concerned about?

=========

edit: Been reading a bit of the manga, so @xxkathxx, now that I know what you're talking about...if Yuki's been told all the details about the contract, we weren't shown. But now I'm really starting to wonder how they're going to deal with everything that's been left out - some of it seems really important...
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Last edited by karice67; 2010-07-19 at 01:56.
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Old 2010-07-21, 05:24   Link #145
takodori
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Regarding ep.15, "Shogi Kaikan(将棋会館)" is a building which actually exists in Shibuya-ku Tokyo. Here is a photo of it.
http://blog.hokkaido-np.co.jp/onsite/P1000121.jpg

If a high school professional shogi player quits his job in the real world, the news may be covered in TV news at a golden time in Japan. Shogi is a very popular and traditional boardgame for all ages.
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Old 2010-07-21, 15:04   Link #146
MikaMiaka
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^^Haha, yeah, a shogi player pops up. I thought it was kinda random. Shows that he is an admired person, I suppose.

I like the set up for the next arc. Who are they fighting, Reiga again?
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Old 2010-08-07, 05:12   Link #147
SuperKnuckles
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Hmm, the exposition the last few episodes has been just amazing so far. Probably the best sets of exposition episodes in anime so far this year. I just wish all these expositions came a bit earlier, but I suppose it helps the mystery.
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Old 2010-08-19, 23:01   Link #148
xxkathxx
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Episode 19 was cool. I like the background story of Kuroto & Senshiro.

Spoiler:


I replayed the scene many many times when Luka talked about even among humans, there are brave acts (referring to the grandfather). I thought that scene was quite nice.

Last edited by xxkathxx; 2010-08-19 at 23:12.
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Old 2010-09-26, 14:12   Link #149
carmolita
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HUH ...I thought their was going to be another episode today ..only learn that number 24 was the last one... Does anyone know if it's going to continue or is this another one of those you have to read rhe manga????? I wanted to know more about the past including the contract

Last edited by carmolita; 2010-09-26 at 14:26.
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Old 2010-09-26, 15:33   Link #150
LKK
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carmolita View Post
HUH ...I thought their was going to be another episode today ..only learn that number 24 was the last one... Does anyone know if it's going to continue or is this another one of those you have to read rhe manga????? I wanted to know more about the past including the contract
I'm pretty sure this is a read the manga for more information situation.
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Old 2010-10-16, 16:21   Link #151
MikaMiaka
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Finally finished the series and I was left thinking, "what are the bad guys trying to accomplish again?" It never really wrapped up and we are just left with the sense that this battle will continue forever ever ever ever.

I feel like they wasted 1/3 of their 24 episodes. It's like there's nothing there in the end. Completely devoid of substance. How disappointing, since I really liked the mood and wish their relationships would have been better explored.
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Old 2011-08-31, 02:45   Link #152
sergel02
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I miss this show. I loved the shounen-ai in it, i felt it was done best in this
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