AnimeSuki Forums

Register Forum Rules FAQ Members List Social Groups Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   AnimeSuki Forum > Anime Discussion > Older Series > Nanoha

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 2011-09-06, 20:33   Link #1
DezoPenguin
Beta by Accident
*Author
 
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Maine
Age: 42
Nanoha Force Manga Theories & Speculation Thread

Not to put too fine a point on it, but can we keep the Force theories/speculation/discussion to the Force thread? This thread is for questions and answers for things that have fixed answers, and...pretty much anything about the Huckebein and the Eclipse are way too amorphous at this point.


[Mod edit]: Good idea, but instead of overburdening the Force thread, the theories and speculation can move here where they won't get in the way of the discussion about the manga itself.

Last edited by CrowKenobi; 2011-09-06 at 22:33. Reason: Edited thread open.
DezoPenguin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-09-07, 01:44   Link #2
Keroko
Adeptus Animus
*Author
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Age: 26
So... what would we discuss in the Force thread itself then?
__________________
Keroko is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-09-07, 01:52   Link #3
00-Raiser
Burst Mode
*Author
 
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Windsor, Ontario
Age: 27
Send a message via AIM to 00-Raiser
Yeah, talking about what things could mean and what they could lead to is an integral part of discussing current events. You can't really separate the two.
__________________
00-Raiser is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-09-07, 21:43   Link #4
CrowKenobi
Moderator
*Moderator
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: there... just there.
Except when that very thing derails the thread and prevents the discussion of "current events," i.e. the Force Manga itself.
__________________



CrowKenobi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-09-07, 21:47   Link #5
Rising Dragon
Goat Herder
*Author
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: The middle of the Middle of Nowhere
Age: 27
There's nothing current about Force at the moment. We get some spotty details about the latest raws, which we aren't allowed to post, and the translations are still 3 to 4 chapters behind. We debate and speculate on what information we get in that thread already--making it so this thread is the place to move that discussion to pretty much eliminates the need for that thread. You can't have both of them at the same time. We already proved that with the general Nanoha manga thread being active while there was a dedicated ViVid thread. One gets ignored in favor of the other. Ultimately, the point of this thread is wasted.
__________________
Rising Dragon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-09-07, 23:24   Link #6
00-Raiser
Burst Mode
*Author
 
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Windsor, Ontario
Age: 27
Send a message via AIM to 00-Raiser
With this division doesn't it mean that in the Force thread now we can only say "this is what happened" and we then have to come to this thread in order to say "this is what I think what just happened means"? The unnecessary step is self evident.
__________________
00-Raiser is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-09-08, 02:12   Link #7
itanshi1
Writer, Jester, MtG nerd
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Nanoha Used Car Dealership. RERISE!
Send a message via AIM to itanshi1 Send a message via MSN to itanshi1
Well if it were possible, then we'd not have buried news. :/

I can deal with not having this.
__________________
For those that belittle their favorite characters, complain about pairings, complain about oversexed images. Stop, thank you.

Fear Anxiety Doubt is but a fad. The life of a fad depends entirely on the willingness to support it. Difficulty is a choice. Determination is a path. Your next great idea after your destination is the true goal.
itanshi1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-09-10, 18:59   Link #8
Sunder the Gold
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
So, can someone explain that one Huckebein's teleportation abilities to me?

He's capable of quick, rapid short-range teleportation, right? Is this presented as something which should be impossible? Is there any reason given for why he's good at it?

Is he capable of long-range or interstellar teleportation, like the Wolkenritter?
Sunder the Gold is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-09-10, 19:12   Link #9
Keroko
Adeptus Animus
*Author
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Age: 26
Teleportation has never been explained at all, so we don't really have a clear answer on this. But the basics should be the same as any other teleportation you've seen. You disappear at one place and re-appear at another, traversing long distances in the blink of an eye.

Also, considering this is a discussion of current events and not future ones, where does this particular tidbit go? This thread or the other Force thread?
__________________
Keroko is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-09-10, 20:09   Link #10
Sunder the Gold
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
This thread isn't going anywhere. I decided to at least try and give it a semblence of purpose, and get some answers while I was at it.
Sunder the Gold is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-09-10, 20:16   Link #11
Justin_Brett
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Canada, Sault Ste. Marie
If it's meant to be super unique, I'll have to call bull. That's hardly something any mage couldn't do if they really put their mind to it.
Justin_Brett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-09-10, 20:51   Link #12
Tiresias
Labda Prakarsa Nirwikara
 
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Pekanbaru (UTC+07:00)
Age: 27
The significance of his teleportation, if any, is that none of our teleport-capable protagonists seemed to remember that they have one, so someone using it after such a long time came as a surprise (or at least a "damn, I forgot personal teleportation existed in this universe!") for the readers

---

To those who can understand the yet-to-be-translated chapters, did Mobile Section 6 perform any after action review after their messy battle? Properly analyzing what happened, why it happened, how it can be done better - all the basics?

Because skimming through the untranslated chapters, all I'm seeing are them training the Force trio and Ginga (is she even officially a part of MS6?) talking to Caladfwelch folks about the clone troopers Raptors.

What lessons have they learned from the previous battle?

Did they find any weakness in the Hucks anti-magic? From the fight with Cypha, is seems her anti-magic is an active skill instead of passive, so is it possible to overwhelm or ambush her before she could actually activate them?

There was mention of a power source problem, that the new toys ran out of battery fast. Will the solution for this - I recall a mana-to-electricity converter or such - be ready for the next engagement, what changes will it bring and how effective will it be?

The last time they fought, several members got badly injured including their commanding officer. Being wounded may be an acknowledged risk of being a soldier but it doesn't change the fact that they need a moment to reflect themselves. How are they going to fight from now on knowing that their previous approach had been unsuccessful? What team composition would be effective against their enemy?

One more thing. I still don't know how Nanoha (and Tsuzuki) plan on keeping her no-kill policy with a Strike Cannon. She can't exactly use magic to set it to stun as she have before, and it will left a bad taste in the mouth if they end up with the Kenshin Solution ("Don't worry, I used the back-side of my sword. Blunt trauma? What's that?")
__________________
Tiresias is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-09-10, 21:41   Link #13
Kuze
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
So uh, maybe Iíll bite.

Letís take a look at Touma. Nice guy, dangerous trigger to anger, still seems fairly normal even with all of the emotional baggage (and his own words of his magic being alright, chapter 3), so yeah, time to go over with a fine tooth comb (too much boredom! Bad project!)

Spoiler for Blah Blah Blah:


Now, question: Is there any reason why the theory thread that we already have is not suited to this, and in fact should have it instead of this thread?

EDIT:
Quote:
To those who can understand the yet-to-be-translated chapters, did Mobile Section 6 perform any after action review after their messy battle? Properly analyzing what happened, why it happened, how it can be done better - all the basics?
Rapid response: It's quickly glossed over. Vita is watching all kinds of videos in the infirmary, Hayate has been spending time doing it, Fate has been filing reports, but there has been nothing particularly specific about it, and I doubt there ever will be unless flashback in the middle of a fight.

More detailed discussion should probably go in the Military Decisions thread on page 2, I suppose.

Last edited by Kuze; 2011-09-10 at 21:52.
Kuze is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-09-10, 23:16   Link #14
Tiresias
Labda Prakarsa Nirwikara
 
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Pekanbaru (UTC+07:00)
Age: 27
It's glossed over? that's good!

Well actually it's kinda bad, since it highlights Tsuzuki's odd balancing of plot exposition and detail as usual (unless he's invoking Unspoken Plan Guarantee)
BUT what's good about it is that it means we can speculate(thus fulfilling the criteria for this thread ) what MS6's future course of action will be.

What do you guys think? Any thought on how MS6 will address the aforementioned points?

NOTE: Yes my question could fit the Military Decisions thread too, but my question also fit here so it goes both ways, and like Sunder I want to give this thread a try
__________________
Tiresias is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-09-11, 00:22   Link #15
Justin_Brett
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Canada, Sault Ste. Marie
I'm not sure it's such a good thing that we keep asking 'why' while we're reading this series.

Also, Aki said something in the TV Tropes thread about there being some explanation about why Section Six is the only one officially combating the Huckebein? Did it make any sense, or no?
Justin_Brett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-09-11, 03:03   Link #16
WarpObscura
Bibliophile
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: There's this dot on the world map...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin_Brett View Post
If it's meant to be super unique, I'll have to call bull. That's hardly something any mage couldn't do if they really put their mind to it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiresias View Post
The significance of his teleportation, if any, is that none of our teleport-capable protagonists seemed to remember that they have one, so someone using it after such a long time came as a surprise (or at least a "damn, I forgot personal teleportation existed in this universe!") for the readers
But Deville's Nightcrawler-style tactical in-combat teleports is a different kettle of fish from strategic, potentially cross-dimensional 'ports like Dimensional Transfer. It might be theoretically possible for any mage, but I should think it's not practical for the average Joe, or even most ~A-rankers. Maybe doing the calcs for the 'port in the heat of combat, and doing it quickly and frequently enough to be useful, is difficult? Whereas a strategic port may require much more complex work, not stuff you can cook up on the fly?
__________________

Yo dawg, I heard you like QB...

Thanks MAEt for the av!
WarpObscura is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-09-11, 03:56   Link #17
Justin_Brett
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Canada, Sault Ste. Marie
Well it's not like he was really going teleport-teleport-teleport every two seconds in the fight, was he? I only saw two obvious occurrences of it from him, anyway.

And yeah, that's what I meant. Compared to everything else the Hucks can do, it's hardly mind-blowing.
Justin_Brett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-09-11, 04:06   Link #18
Akiyoshi
The Flame Crussader
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Considering he can keep up with Fate one-on-one while being a Big Muscled Guy holding a humongous Axe-anchor thing i think his instant teleport has something to do. Still, Deville's teleport abilities seems to be the fastest seeing in the franchise(faster than Yuuno, Lutecia, Caro and Shamal's at least).
__________________
May 29 2010-2014

...4 yeargo, the day after never would be the same

~The ASFB~
Akiyoshi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-09-11, 04:46   Link #19
Zero Hurricane
I'm here for the reason..
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Surabaya, East Java, Indonesia
Age: 21
Send a message via Yahoo to Zero Hurricane Send a message via Skype™ to Zero Hurricane
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiresias View Post
What lessons have they learned from the previous battle?
Actually they have learned from experience since Strikers. Only, since the emergence or something Caled Techniques or whatever I said it, they've forgotten the source and basis of their ability to bring them to victory so far. In conclusion temporary, I said that their dependence on the AEC Equipment that makes them forget their own will power. When in fact there is a much more powerful than that garbage AEC Equipment, their basic of their own potential.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiresias View Post
Will the solution for this - I recall a mana-to-electricity converter or such - be ready for the next engagement, what changes will it bring and how effective will it be?
It looks pretty good, but even better is if they immediately make a weaponized vaccine that will be installed to each Device. Maybe such a high dosage magical tranquilizer that capable to destroying Eclipse influence once and for all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiresias View Post
One more thing. I still don't know how Nanoha (and Tsuzuki) plan on keeping her no-kill policy with a Strike Cannon. She can't exactly use magic to set it to stun as she have before, and it will left a bad taste in the mouth if they end up with the Kenshin Solution ("Don't worry, I used the back-side of my sword. Blunt trauma? What's that?")
At least put a hot lead into somebody's head, or more extreme, behead someone, could be a last resort when faced with such an enemy. As we know, since the Strikers, the enemy faced increasingly strong, even the enemy's behavior became more and more wild and uncontrollable. Even there is a enemy who couldn't be befriended.

As Mao Zedong said: "The true power grows out of the barrel of a gun."
__________________
"Use of deadly force is authorized"
Zero Hurricane is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-09-11, 09:23   Link #20
Sunder the Gold
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Akiyoshi View Post
Considering he can keep up with Fate one-on-one while being a Big Muscled Guy holding a humongous Axe-anchor thing i think his instant teleport has something to do. Still, Deville's teleport abilities seems to be the fastest seeing in the franchise(faster than Yuuno, Lutecia, Caro and Shamal's at least).
Every other teleporter in the franchise was aiming for a more distant location than Deville, and one they couldn't even see without magic.

It only makes sense that a short-range teleport to a place you can see would be faster, maybe even easier. Maybe even something that you learn as a intermediary step towards being able to teleport to other continents, let alone to other PLANETS.


Really it's probably the writers not wanting Yuuno to suddenly appear to support Nanoha against the Book of Darkness even when he totally could have.

Caro had various reasons why she didn't need to teleport or why she shouldn't.

Shamal was more valuable just outside of the battlefield than jumping into it, and her Windows of Travel allowed her to tele-attack with just her hands.

Fate has never demonstrated the ability to make a Dimensional Teleport that doesn't involve traveling to the Garden of Time, which might have had some sort of beacon or gateway to facilitate the spell for somemone who knew the password.

The Wolkenritter... Well, the side materials say that Dimensional Teleport isn't normally a spell Ancient Belkans learned or used, so short-range movement may be something they've never actively tried to master or incorporate into their fighting styles. Especially since they can already move pretty darn fast, conventionally. Probably went against their knightly idea of combat, just like shooting and bomdardment magic, and capture spells.
Sunder the Gold is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:00.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
We use Silk.