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Old 2011-09-16, 06:46   Link #1281
Masuzu
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Yes, It can cut anything...sort of.
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Old 2011-09-16, 06:59   Link #1282
ZeroXSEED
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Originally Posted by ZeroXSEED View Post
You ask me? Easy. Just make something that has the power output of an IS weapon.

If I can compare what's been shown in the anime, Laura's 21mm (.88 inch) HEAVY railgun has power output slightly surpassing 127mm Rheinmetal cannon of modern weaponry (I judged it from the explosion and destruction caused by it on the arena).
Spoiler for Rants, rants, rants:


My useless rant aside, Natasha is using some sort of anti-IS portable weapon in the V6 chapter 1. Unless Natasha is some sort of superhuman with implanted IS core, then we can assume that there's some sort of Anti-IS weapon that not been powered by IS core, and could be wielded by normal human.

Spoiler for Spoiler for Vol 6:


As you see though, her weapon is semi-automatic, instead of rapid firing/ barrage like Gospel's. So, the amount of energy needed would be large enoug. Even then, the possibility is limitless. Not to mention Chifuyu is able to use a real, IS weapon (which judging the length and size, I assume it would weight at least 10-20 kg).

Have our anti-villains bringing new type of high powered missile launcher or beam cannon (or in case of Irish, an I.S. scale beam dagger), and since most people are too cocky to admit conventional weapon is still effective, they'll be caught of guard.
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Thanks for the reply Zero. Having them use a rocket launcher and the IS pilots being too proud to even try to dodge would seem plausible.
Last question for now- Can Ichika's beam saber attack and hurt human beings? I plan to have him fight "Irish" in the chapter but it'll be pointless if his weapon won't affect "Irish" and he just starts bombarding Ichika with bullets and bombs till the fight's over. I want to make a balanced fight.
Make it Ichika fight unarmed (though still using ByakuShiki), although the rockets will sap their shield for the first barrage, the IS owner aren't too stupid to stay still for the second salvo.

I assume the fight was happened in the urban area, thus Irish & co. naturally has advantage using civilian building as both shield and restriction (an IS is about twice as large as normal human).

It'll be more of (deadly) Hide and seek game with our beloved terrorist using well-hidden weapons around the location and shooting Ichika & co, who fight not to kill but to capture.

So, with combination of proper tactics, it'll took a lot of time to catch them. EthernalRain seems well versed in Infantry tactic, so you may consult him about that one. Frontal assault is way too suicidal, remember.

EDIT: London's age of criminality is 10, even then, I believe there'll be compromise for Irish and his teenage comrades (who is a war orphan and raised by anti-IS terrorist so from certain point of view did not have a choice). Irish' adult comrades might not have a chance to redeem and might be sent to jail for years...
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Old 2011-09-16, 07:29   Link #1283
Eratas123
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Thanks for the advice Zero and Box. Using civilian buildings for cover had slipped my mind, I'll get started on chapter three soon once I work out all the kinks so please review and give feedback on it once I complete it.

I already have a plan on what Irish will do once he's beaten (look at the previous drafts posted) and I'll have to deal with his teammates choices since not all of them would willingly choose to fight with the things they've been fighting against for the past 10 years. But I'll burn that bridge when I get there.

Once again; Thank you for the help
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Old 2011-09-16, 07:50   Link #1284
Masuzu
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If you've ever seen the fight between the 08th MS Team and Gouf Custom,
you'll know just how good urban environments look in a mech battle.
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Old 2011-09-16, 07:58   Link #1285
Eratas123
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Does Charlottes IS use large versions of regular weaponry? She seems to be the only one who doesn't use energy apart from Laura.
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Old 2011-09-16, 08:12   Link #1286
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Originally Posted by Eratas123 View Post
Does Charlottes IS use large versions of regular weaponry? She seems to be the only one who doesn't use energy apart from Laura.
Its not only large, but POWERED up version, where else you have .54 caliber sniper rifle with destruction power of 90mm tank cannon? It's recoil also isn't something to be shrugged off. (beam weapon has no such problem)

It's seems that only generation 3+ that use energy weapon. Cecilia actually requested solid-firing weapon to counter ByakuShiki but was denied by her government. As a result, she caught in a beatdown spree every-time she's sparring with Ichika.

Ling weapon is not exactly energy weapon though, it's a shockwave/ compressed air cannon.

I believe it's really Izuru-sensei's mistake that Ichika is able to absorb it using Reiryaku Byakuya, but as an author, I can forgive such, because IS is more harem than SciFi. However, I'm also gonna change it in my fic to suit my understanding.

P.S. however, until now I don't exactly understand how Laura's AIC works in front of newtonian physic, but Ichika use something different to counter it...within law of physic. After all, he's not Emperor Orimura for nothing
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Old 2011-09-16, 08:25   Link #1287
Eratas123
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Charlotte will probably be the most threatening then since Chaff grenades and EMP jammers won't affect her IS since it doesn't use energy and won't get jammed.

Any Idea how guns can be jammed other than using copious amounts of water? Once again, sorry for asking all these questions, I'm trying to avoid as much plot holes as I can.
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Old 2011-09-16, 08:39   Link #1288
Masuzu
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How about EMP? Worked on the Transformers.

Also, it was mentioned that an IS won't feel recoil.

*much*
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Old 2011-09-16, 08:41   Link #1289
ZeroXSEED
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Originally Posted by Eratas123 View Post
Charlotte will probably be the most threatening then since Chaff grenades and EMP jammers won't affect her IS since it doesn't use energy and won't get jammed.

Any Idea how guns can be jammed other than using copious amounts of water? Once again, sorry for asking all these questions, I'm trying to avoid as much plot holes as I can.
Best use a really powerful EMP Bomb instead, it WILL affect all the IS and made them lose their structural strength (IS and their weapons are composed of Nano-components that can be stored as data, so it was the whole system and not only their weapons are affected, Charlotte's included).

However, as IS is designed for space exploration and all sort of radiation are common, even military grade EMP bomb (the size of 500kg dumb bomb, about the size of Laura/ Irish themselves) will only stun them for a few second until the IS can repair itself with better shielding and render other bomb useless.

But you know? one second in battlefield can make a big difference. During that time, the shield is nullified and the IS structure has many cracks, you can use copious amount of water to slow their recovery speed, and then chipping their armor little by little even if pesky Assault rifle is used.

Wait, did you mention Charlotte using her IS weapon? IS weapon are far too lethal and destructive, unless Chifuyu being out of character and told them to kill em all...
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Old 2011-09-16, 08:44   Link #1290
Eratas123
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EMP worked on the transformers? The reason I'm worried is I'm not sure if Charlottes guns will be jammed by EMP bursts since they're mechanical rather than energy based unlike everyone else.

EDIT: I know them using they're weapons are out of character but how else do they fight with Irish's team? If they're unarmed then what will they do if Irish's team goes inside a building or a subway? they can't exactly fit inside and the only person who can fight with their weapon is Rin since her shockwave can be used to stun and knock out enemies rather fillet them with holes *sigh* maybe I should have Ichika and Irish one on one while Kyuukai and his FRACTURE team fight his Teammates, that'll explain the whole willingness to fight using weaponry since Kyuukai isn't exactly a stranger to armed combat.
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Old 2011-09-16, 08:59   Link #1291
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eratas123 View Post
EMP worked on the transformers? The reason I'm worried is I'm not sure if Charlottes guns will be jammed by EMP bursts since they're mechanical rather than energy based unlike everyone else.

EDIT: I know them using they're weapons are out of character but how else do they fight with Irish's team? If they're unarmed then what will they do if Irish's team goes inside a building or a subway? they can't exactly fit inside and the only person who can fight with their weapon is Rin since her shockwave can be used to stun and knock out enemies rather fillet them with holes *sigh* maybe I should have Ichika and Irish one on one while Kyuukai and his FRACTURE team fight his Teammates, that'll explain the whole willingness to fight using weaponry since Kyuukai isn't exactly a stranger to armed combat.
Sending Kyuukai and his team was a good choice since they're used to KILL (yes, kill) people in previous experience.

In fact, I suggest you write a debate between Ichika & harem (who wanted to capture them even if it cost their own safety and caused a lot of destruction) and Kyukai & team (who use efficient method to kill them all and avoid property damage) after the fight, when Ichika saw Irish teammates are obliterated.

It'll pull the strain in Idealistic Ichika vs Cynical Kyuukai's relationship.

Anyway, I think we should reconsider the urban combat choice. Irish should know better that he's risking the safety of the Civilians...and you know? Once a character disregarded Civ's safety, they're irredeemable. It's called Moral Event Horizon, a point where a character crossed the line.

For example, better made Irish split out of his team and try to kill the IS user with less-destructive weapon like EMP bombs and low caliber gatling gun. That way, Irish is sorta different and still forgiveable, even if his actions are deemed idiotic.

But first discuss this with yer beta, I believe he would know what to do, that's what beta is for, and he owns the OC to boot. Anyway, it's your story and in the end you made the choice.

Edit: Shockwave? Stun? Why not, but all Irish's teammates will lose their hearing permanently due to overpessure
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Last edited by ZeroXSEED; 2011-09-16 at 09:21.
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Old 2011-09-16, 09:13   Link #1292
Masuzu
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They might not work on her weapons, but you can be damn sure her flight's gonna be messed up.

Also, she won't be able to use her AT-Field as long as the EMP is effective.
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Old 2011-09-16, 09:31   Link #1293
Eratas123
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Irish doesn't know what he's team is going to do, his job is to kidnap Cecilia which involves no civilian casualties.

Irish's team isn't exactly built on trust, since every member has a specific specialty and role they're only told what they're supposed to do and not what the other members do, only the squad leader knows everything. Irish won't know that his team is going to fight in an urban area nor the fact that innocent lives will be compromised. And also, not all the terrorists are anti-villains. Irish and some of his teammates may be redeemable but some of them are really monsters who'll sacrifice innocent lives for revenge on the IS. It's to show some black and black morality and one of the reasons why it's called "What lies in Shadow"

BTW, Characters can be redeemable even if they disregard innocent lives; Just look at Accelerator from To-Aru Majutsu no Index.
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Old 2011-09-16, 09:44   Link #1294
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eratas123 View Post
Irish doesn't know what he's team is going to do, his job is to kidnap Cecilia which involves no civilian casualties.

Irish's team isn't exactly built on trust, since every member has a specific specialty and role they're only told what they're supposed to do and not what the other members do, only the squad leader knows everything. Irish won't know that his team is going to fight in an urban area nor the fact that innocent lives will be compromised. And also, not all the terrorists are anti-villains. Irish and some of his teammates may be redeemable but some of them are really monsters who'll sacrifice innocent lives for revenge on the IS. It's to show some black and black morality and one of the reasons why it's called "What lies in Shadow"

BTW, Characters can be redeemable even if they disregard innocent lives; Just look at Accelerator from To-Aru Majutsu no Index.
In case of disregarding innocent lives: Well if you want to gamble with that choice, sure why not? BTW, I've never read Index/Railgun so I don't know.

However, I honestly support your Idea of Irish & co went to kidnap (thus lightly armed and less destructive, and less chance of killing innocents). The rest of terrorist who kill so many civilian can burn in FRACTURE's hands.

You mean black, gray and white morality in all those place? Here's trope card for ya.

Morality Kitchen Sink - Full Spectrum Color

FOR GREAT JUSTICE!
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Old 2011-09-16, 10:03   Link #1295
MeisterBabylon
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What you did there, I see.
The ending, see already, I can.

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Originally Posted by Eratas123 View Post
@MeisterBabylon - How did you know that? Thanks for the info either way cause I need alot of info on Tabane. How's your fic doing right now?
That bit of crack only exists in my fic. But I don't mind sharing the drugs.

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Originally Posted by ZeroXSEED View Post
Your fic or Eratas'?
Anyone's.

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...I wish I found that sooner, damn it, now crazy Idea popped onto my mind...

Spoiler for Prequel/ Crossover of sort:


Oh god imagine fandom's reaction...
Well... Not quite I imagined, but sweet.
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Old 2011-09-16, 11:19   Link #1296
ZeroXSEED
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ZeroXSEED: Code name of a narcotic substance often used by Fanfic writers, causing strange crossover popping up around the internet and and derailing the thread three times in a week.

But seriously, someone HAS to write that.

If you write that, PM me, if you're not going to use that idea, then I'm going to write it as part of Sacred Twin's back-stories.

For now, Chapter 6 is 65%.
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Old 2011-09-16, 11:52   Link #1297
Eratas123
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@ZeroXSEED and Box-kun- Thanks for all the advice. Should be able to post a draft of chapter 3 here in a couple of days give or take. please read and give feedback once it's posted.
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Old 2011-09-16, 22:58   Link #1298
ZeroXSEED
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Chapter 6 is done and will be sent to Blitz immediately.
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Old 2011-09-17, 05:36   Link #1299
wavehawk
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I'm still finishing up the last part of my fic challenge--It's really difficult tryign to write proper drama that not only keeps the characters in-character but developing logically.

Also, I seriously want to write this. Remember that sampler I posted a few posts back? Spoiler please.

Spoiler:
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Old 2011-09-17, 06:19   Link #1300
Eratas123
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@Wavehawk- Pretty chilling to put it mildly. What exactly is happening there? all I can tell is the girl is venting her frustration for Charlotte against somebody and she seems to particularly violent about it.
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