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Old 2011-10-18, 17:47   Link #281
creb
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jan-Poo View Post
Because it is an established fact that stories where people can identify to the mc tend to be more successfull among a young demographic. And apparently magaka believe that their average reader is as pathetic as their main characters.


On a slightly more serious note, I've always assumed it was due to the rather misguided idea that using a weak/pathetic character gives the author a bigger canvas for character growth. Personally, I think "character growth" is incredibly over-emphasized when it comes to the constituents of what makes a good story, as plenty of my favorite stories had very little character growth. But, I'm not an author, or perhaps more importantly, publisher, that has access to marketing data that shows what the general public wants.
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Old 2011-10-18, 18:00   Link #282
FlareKnight
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Ouch. 9th definitely took a painful route in order to survive. Not easy to rationalize that getting stabbed in the eye is actually better than the cellphone getting stabbed. Obviously the phone goes so does she, but convincing herself that the phone is like a vital organ can't be that easy.

Yuki did alright in the end. Not surprising he's having all these breakdowns. Go from living quietly and now suddenly it's all about him. Actually convincing himself to use Yuno in the beginning. Might as well since her instincts and skills are up there. Of course everyone else is damned as we saw when she ran past all those classrooms. You do something that appears to be betraying Yuki and you are dead.

Interesting diary entry that Yuno had there at the end.
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Old 2011-10-18, 18:05   Link #283
Kagayaki
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kitten320 View Post
She could have stabbed Yuki to deah and then went bombing the school to get the 4th to come out. Like that she would 100% get at least one bird, and the most pathetic one at that.
Well, yes. That's probably the question we should be asking. It makes sense why she didn't immediately blow up all the bombs though. This is a good example of how Mirai Nikki has a plot that makes sense until you think about it past a certain point.

Of course, the author has the handy crutch that whenever the characters do something that might seem irrational, it's because they're following the instructions in their diaries. So it's possible that for whatever reason, killing Yuki in the classroom would have meant certain death for the 9th (i.e. bringing a knife staying a second longer would have let Yuno kill her with said knife). Since the escape diary only tells her how to escape rather than how to kill people, she might do ridiculous things that will still allow her to escape with her life while hampering her ability to achieve her other objectives.

I call this a crutch because it gives the author a semi-plausible way to justify more or less any of the characters' actions.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jan-Poo View Post
Because it is an established fact that stories where people can identify to the mc tend to be more successfull among a young demographic. And apparently magaka believe that their average reader is as pathetic as their main characters.
One theory I hear floating around a lot is the "wish fulfillment" theory. Basically, the reader will have fun reading about a character that's like them (average and pathetic) getting all sorts of cool superpowers and a magical girlfriend.

Mirai Nikki doesn't quite follow this, though, since all the supernatural stuff that's happening to Yuki is making his life worse, not better. He's trapped rather than empowered.
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Old 2011-10-18, 18:06   Link #284
Guardian Enzo
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If characters are the same at the beginning of the series as they are in the end, that's not a very interesting development arc, is it? Patience, Grasshoppers.
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Old 2011-10-18, 18:16   Link #285
kitten320
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I don't consider myself pathetic 0_o
Like I'm not damn aweasome or something but I'm definetly not THAT bad! Even though in the past I had my bad,lame, pathetic and invisible times but I don't think that this kind of characters are very encouraging... If a loser gets powers and girl out of thin air it only makes me/you fall into wonderland and dream about something like that to happen to you too instead of getting your ass up and actually doing something to change things. If anything, this kind of characters are making me feel worse =/


Nah, she didn't stab him just because he is a main hero. That's why I hate main characters, I never care about them. The only exception in my book is Edward Elric, he was a perfect main hero who didn't get over powered, could kick some asses, get his ass kicked in return and have his lame moment without being annoying, a moment that did make you feel for him. Am mostly reffering to his first meeting with Barry the Chopper.
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Old 2011-10-18, 18:47   Link #286
zeniselv
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never readed the manga, but hell, this is turning awesome, this season turned great, but this one is really taking the lead, im not sure if go for the manga or continue with the anime...
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Old 2011-10-18, 18:53   Link #287
Shinn Kamiyra
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FlareKnight View Post
Ouch. 9th definitely took a painful route in order to survive. Not easy to rationalize that getting stabbed in the eye is actually better than the cellphone getting stabbed. Obviously the phone goes so does she, but convincing herself that the phone is like a vital organ can't be that easy.

Yuki did alright in the end. Not surprising he's having all these breakdowns. Go from living quietly and now suddenly it's all about him. Actually convincing himself to use Yuno in the beginning. Might as well since her instincts and skills are up there. Of course everyone else is damned as we saw when she ran past all those classrooms. You do something that appears to be betraying Yuki and you are dead.

Interesting diary entry that Yuno had there at the end.
Indeed, Yukkii did pretty well considering how useless he is at the moment. I'm looking forward to seeing just how much he'll grow during the course of this whole bloody affair.

@bold: You know it.

I'm a bit confused about something though. Yuno said that her "Yukiteru Diary" was only able to grasp Yukkii's future by ten minutes. What's up with this entry being almost four hours in advance?
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Old 2011-10-18, 18:56   Link #288
ThereminVox
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo View Post
If characters are the same at the beginning of the series as they are in the end, that's not a very interesting development arc, is it? Patience, Grasshoppers.
This is what I'm hoping for. For the time being, I actually find Yuki's desperate willingness to "put out" for Yuno's insane romantic delusions to be central to their deliciously screwed-up relationship dynamic. She's the only thing standing between him and slicey, shooty, stabby, explodey death. Yes, sweetie, of course we'll be together forever, now where did you say the bomb was, again?

It's his only choice right now, but it's a very dangerous game to play with a yandere's heart. There are things worse than death, and I'm sure Yuno sleeps like a baby every night while dreaming about inflicting them on her enemies.

It can't last too long, though, or he's just going to come off cowardly and unsympathetic, regardless of how understandable his actions might be. I can't wait to see what will trigger his development. Smart money is on him eventually manning up and wanting to help protect his (at least for now) allies. However, watching him so far, he seems to be more on the path to character development via snapping under the pressure, and becoming an dangerous psycho in his own right. I've seen "docile" boys like Yuki go feral with little warning if they get backed into a corner.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shinn Kamiyra View Post
I'm a bit confused about something though. Yuno said that her "Yukiteru Diary" was only able to grasp Yukkii's future by ten minutes. What's up with this entry being almost four hours in advance?
Not a manga reader, but as I understood it, her diary gives updates on him in ten minute intervals (Jesus, Yuno O_O), but we don't know how far in advance the diary entries go.
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Old 2011-10-18, 19:46   Link #289
Guardian Enzo
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When you think about it, a guy with zero self-esteem and a stalker who adores him utterly is a perfect pairing...
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Old 2011-10-18, 19:52   Link #290
Sackett
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jan-Poo View Post

You'd still wonder why her final plan didn't appear in anyone's diary since it was set. And you'd still wonder why she didn't lure Yuki and the 4th in a place completely surrounded by bombs from which they couldn't possibly escape. You'd also wonder if it was a good idea to try to kill the 4th by involving another diary holder. In the end she found herself outnumbered 3 to 1. Of course she couldn't know about Yuno, but still 2 to 1 is bad in itself.

There's also the fact that despite this being a 9th VS 4th battle, if it wasn't for Yuno and Yuki it would have been quite lopsided. the 4th didn't do anything relevant at all.
I don't think the diaries work that way.

Yuno's only shows what Yukki does or what happens to him. Things that Yuno observes with her eyes. "Yukki looks depressed" not "Yukki is planning to use me."

Yukki's only shows the things he observes around him, but not things that happen to him (because that's how he always used his diary before). So his diary wouldn't say what the 9th's plan was. It would just describe what he would see. If he'd been paying attention he'd have seen what would happen with his classmates, but Yukki seems to have not yet gotten the hang of using his diary, and didn't look ahead past the immediate entries.

The 4th's is an investigative journal, so it would show what the evidence and eyewitnesses say about what the 9th did (in the future). So it might have revealed that he was the true target not the 1st... and guess who informed us that the 9th was really after the 4th? Oh yeah... the 4th.

The 9th's diary is called the Escape diary, we don't know any more details, but we can assume it describes how she escapes. It would explain why she feels free to attack publicly and challenge the 1st and 4th at the same time. She's depending on her diary to always provide her with an escape route if it goes badly. That might extend to her preparing items such as smoke rockets and a hidden bike so as to maximize her escape possibilities.

I foresee a villain that repeatedly plans huge high risk high reward high profile attacks, and then repeatedly escaping through some method pulled out of nowhere... and it's all completely justified by her diary.

The 3rd had a Murder diary, supposedly recording his murders and his victims. So once he had the name of the 1st, he made Yukki his next target, and his diary describes how to corner and kill him.


Looking at all the diaries they have very different aspects. The 3rd was very powerful, once he has your name you're probably dead. The only reason Yukki didn't die is because of Yuno. Yuno is also a diary holder, and so the causation line went like this: 3rd plans to murder Yukki -> Yuno sees Yukki's death in her diary -> Yuno does something to prevent this -> This changes the 3rd's diary, 3rd sees Yukki has gone somewhere else etc -> 3rd plans to kill Yukki elsewhere -> Yuno sees Yukki's death in her diary -> Yuno does something to prevent this, and so on and so on until Yuno engineered a confrontation in which the 3rd dies. This may have only been possible however, because the 3rd didn't constantly check his diary.

Yukki's is also very powerful in it's breadth. Basically anything he might observe is recorded. But it's not very detailed like the 3rd. Also, it has a hole, it records nothing about himself.

Yuno's is very weak but plugs that hole in Yukki's defense. It records everything about Yukki.

The 4th also has a powerful diary, it records anything he might learn in his role as a detective investigating a crime.

The 9th dairy is well suited to a highly flamboyant villain who is constantly in need of escaping (assuming that the name is indicative of what it does).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shinn Kamiyra View Post
I'm a bit confused about something though. Yuno said that her "Yukiteru Diary" was only able to grasp Yukkii's future by ten minutes. What's up with this entry being almost four hours in advance?
It's entries are spaced 10 minutes apart, but the entries go out as far as 90 days. Said so in the first episode.

Oh and for all those saying Yuno is over hyped... HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHA! Just wait, just wait... Yuno is the ultimate Yandere. No one else is even close. The perfect balance of love and devotion and utter Ax Crazy madness.
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Last edited by Sackett; 2011-10-18 at 20:03.
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Old 2011-10-18, 20:29   Link #291
Hooves
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Still surprised that Ninth pulled out a bike from nowhere and managed to escape. Either way, this was a great episode in showing an alliance of future diary users going together (we'll see how long that goes though).
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Old 2011-10-18, 20:42   Link #292
Dark Wing
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It wasn't out of no where she buried it underground...
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Old 2011-10-18, 20:45   Link #293
Shinn Kamiyra
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sackett View Post
It's entries are spaced 10 minutes apart, but the entries go out as far as 90 days. Said so in the first episode.

Oh and for all those saying Yuno is over hyped... HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHA! Just wait, just wait... Yuno is the ultimate Yandere. No one else is even close. The perfect balance of love and devotion and utter Ax Crazy madness.
I got that much, but then why would certain entries appear minutes in advance and others, like the one Yuno just received, appear hours in advance? Are these entries so designed to appear with respect to the relevance of their owner?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hooves
Still surprised that Ninth pulled a bike from nowhere and managed to escape. Either way, this was a great episode in showing an alliance of future diary users going together (we'll see how long that goes though).
Honestly, why in the world would Yukkii team up with Fourth like this? Sure they managed some teamwork to overcome Ninth, but has he already forgotten how Fourth told him he'd lay him to waste in the first episode? And now he thinks they're going to be buddy-buddy and try to end this Survival Game where only a single person can win?

-Sigh- Really, a person can only be so gullible. Looks like Yuno's going to need to bail him out again.
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Old 2011-10-18, 20:52   Link #294
ThereminVox
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Silly question: Yuno's "Happy End" entry at the end was a bit unclear to me; is she looking at something in the relatively distant future? I noticed the date was in July, but I'm not entirely clear when "now" is. Are we to understand that this entry represents her ultimate goal? No spoilers, I'm just trying to see if I understand the implications based on what we know so far, or if I'm just misreading the scene.

Put simply: "When will 'then' be 'now'?"
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Old 2011-10-18, 20:53   Link #295
Dark Wing
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Originally Posted by Shinn Kamiyra View Post
Honestly, why in the world would Yukkii team up with Fourth like this? Sure they managed some teamwork to overcome Ninth, but has he already forgotten how Fourth told him he'd lay him to waste in the first episode? And now he thinks they're going to be buddy-buddy and try to end this Survival Game where only a single person can win?

-Sigh- Really, a person can only be so gullible. Looks like Yuno's going to need to bail him out again.
That was a mistranslation on the part of the fan subbers. he actually said in the manga "I'll protect you." or rather "I'll lay THEM all to waste"

Now if you want to talk about gullible you ain't seen nothing yet...

Quote:
Originally Posted by ThereminVox View Post
Put simply: "When will 'then' be 'now'?"
Lets the dairy is said to tell the future up to 90 days from the date it was given to it's user...so in anime right now should be some where in May
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Old 2011-10-18, 20:59   Link #296
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThereminVox View Post
Silly question: Yuno's "Happy End" entry at the end was a bit unclear to me; is she looking at something in the relatively distant future? I noticed the date was in July, but I'm not entirely clear when "now" is. Are we to understand that this entry represents her ultimate goal? No spoilers, I'm just trying to see if I understand the implications based on what we know so far, or if I'm just misreading the scene.

Put simply: "When will 'then' be 'now'?"
If it's the same as the manga, ep 2 happens on May 2nd.
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Old 2011-10-18, 21:09   Link #297
Shinn Kamiyra
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThereminVox View Post
Put simply: "When will 'then' be 'now'?"
Spoiler:


Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark Wing View Post
That was a mistranslation on the part of the fan subbers. he actually said in the manga "I'll protect you." or rather "I'll lay THEM all to waste"

Now if you want to talk about gullible you ain't seen nothing yet...
Ah, I see. Still, I can't help but wonder why Fourth would go out of his way to make a declaration like that when the others, with the exception of Yuno of course, all turned against Yukkii just as Deus has intended?

Because he's a police officer? Maybe, though I get the sinking suspicion there's more to it than that...
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Old 2011-10-18, 21:12   Link #298
creb
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Originally Posted by Shinn Kamiyra View Post
Ah, I see. Still, I can't help but wonder why Fourth would go out of his way to make a declaration like that when the others, with the exception of Yuno of course, all turned against Yukkii just as Deus has intended?

Because he's a police officer? Maybe, though I get the sinking suspicion there's more to it than that...
I would assume no one is actually taking his statement at face value. Though, I suppose, I should never underestimate the power of trust and naivete.
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Old 2011-10-18, 21:17   Link #299
Hooves
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shinn Kamiyra View Post
Ah, I see. Still, I can't help but wonder why Fourth would go out of his way to make a declaration like that when the others, with the exception of Yuno of course, all turned against Yukkii just as Deus has intended?

Because he's a police officer? Maybe, though I get the sinking suspicion there's more to it than that...
"I'll protect you." *points gun at face* *smiles*

He would have killed Yukkii if Yuno didn't jump out of the window and attacked Ninth. Or atleast that's how I see it, build the trust of some future diary users to stay in the game. Then later when there are less combatants to face off against, claim the prize for your own. Or maybe I'm just giving him bad credit when he could actually be a good person. But it's possible that he may want to end the game, which forces him to fight Yukkii and Yuno in the future?
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Old 2011-10-18, 21:22   Link #300
Shinn Kamiyra
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hooves View Post
"I'll protect you." *points gun at face* *smiles*

He would have killed Yukkii if Yuno didn't jump out of the window and attacked Ninth. Or atleast that's how I see it, build the trust of some future diary users to stay in the game. Then later when there are less combatants to face off against, claim the prize for your own. Or maybe I'm just giving him bad credit when he could actually be a good person.
That whole stunt of his with the gun didn't even make any sense. Ninth had told him to kill Yukkii, then kill himself and then she would let the hostages go, which of course was a total lie because she's a psycho terrorist; something Fourth should have been well aware of.

It might seem to make more sense if, somehow, he knew that Yuno was going to make a move and was trying to provoke her by pointing his gun at Yukkii. This is of course total guesswork, but I wouldn't put anything past these diary users.
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