AnimeSuki Forums

Enternal · 2011-10-19, 22:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sunder the Gold

I'd hoped no one else would have that thought. Or speak it.

Hahaha. Did I get on your wrong side for saying that?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tiresias

For canon to embrace that monicker instead of misusing well-established terms like Ace of Aces.

Seriously, for all these years I thought of Nanoha's title by its actual meaning, that of an Ace whose achievements in real-battle, presumably within the six years between A's and StrikerS, surpassed every other Aces in the TSAB, and not...mere Air Instructor. Oh, sure, IRL only the best flyers gets selected into aggressor squadrons, but those guys don't even get called Aces until they actually flew into a real conflict and do noteworthy feats, let alone be called Ace of Aces. By what Nanoha had accomplished before StrikerS (on-screen), she was, at best, at par with other aces, not above them.

Which makes this doubly ridiculous is that they also slapped an aggressor qualification on her ID.

Ah, forget it.

Question: Where was "The Blazing General" first mentioned? And was it mentioned in engrish too, or was it originally japanese?

Hmm... well Nanoha is already considered an ace so I don't see what's wrong with that. Not only that, she did do noteworthy things together with the others so she and the others are considered aces so I don't see what's wrong with that. So what's wrong? The only part that is wrong is Ace of Aces which should be referred to one person is actually referred to a group of them. That's it. I think the "Aggressor" and "Ace" is correct though.

Also I'm feeling like you are downplayeing her becoming a "mere" air instructor. There are two groups the normal instructors (which Vita is a part of) and the elite instructors which only the best gets into it and Nanoha is one of them. Saying she is "mere" air instructor would not be correct then would it? That division that she is it wouldn't be called "Armaments Service Supreme Air Force 'Aggressor'" for no reason at all when you compared to the other "Training Corps". Also the "Aggressor" on her card is there because the Tactical Training Corps was known as "Armaments Service Supreme Air Force 'Aggressor'".

Nagumo · 2011-10-19, 22:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tiresias

Question: Where was "The Blazing General" first mentioned? And was it mentioned in engrish too, or was it originally japanese?

Oh that title was Japanese, it was very formal. I had to struggle a bit to translate it in a more, how do you say, impressive manner.

「烈火の将」
Literally: Raging Fire or conflagration General

Or 'General of Raging Fire', 'General of the Inferno', 'The Burning General', etc etc but I thought 'The Blazing General' sounded good at first. It was her second title, I believe the first one was 'Knight of the Sword'

Tiresias · 2011-10-19, 22:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Enternal

Also I'm feeling like you are downplayeing her becoming a "mere" air instructor

Quote:

not...mere Air Instructor. Oh, sure, IRL only the best flyers gets selected into aggressor squadrons, but those guys don't even get called Aces until they actually flew into a real conflict and do noteworthy feats, let alone be called Ace of Aces.

Ahem.

The "mere" was because being an aggressor, while undoubtedly awesome, pales in comparison to being an Ace of Aces in its real meaning (instead of how Tsuzuki used it here) aka 'he/she who kicked the most ass in amongst a group of asskickers, in real operations instad of just calculated trainings in controlled environments'. And no, Nanoha didn't kick the most ass, considering that pre-StrikerS her only wins (friendly tournaments didn't count) were against Fate, a bunch of drones (which the Wolkenritters also did), aaaand...I can't think of any other. IIRC all her fights against the Wolkies before the become friends ended in draws, except the first one which ended in a loss.

Is being an aggressor awesome? Oh yes. But nothing compared to being an Ace of Aces which, the original meaning, means that she's vanquished more enemies that Signum, Vita, Chrono, Fate, and others.

Note that this if I use Ace of Aces by its original meaning.

If I use Tsuzuki's perversion of the term here, then I give up. Yes, she's an Ace of Aces. And apparently, there's lots of them, which means there's gonna have to be an Ace of Aces of Aces to highlight the best of them, only this time that that title is given to the best in the training ground, not of the warzone.

Nagumo · 2011-10-19, 22:59

In other words... different levels of awesome.
Aggressor = Awesome
Ace of Aces = Awesomest
Ace of Ace of Aces = Hartmann... damn Nazi

ZeroXSEED · 2011-10-19, 22:59

^ So the REAL problem is Tsudzuki using WRONG terminology here...

Enternal · 2011-10-19, 23:05

Lol! Yes the problem is with Tsuzuki using the wrong terminology. He should have come up with something like... I don't know Ace of the Top Elites or something that tells that Nanoha is the best among the elite instructors... or whatever.

Well at least the "Three Aces" have no issues. Still does not change the fact that Nanoha is still pretty damn awesome right? Not only that, RIOT 6 kicks soo much ass. You have powerhouses such as Nanoha, Vita, Signum, and Fate. Nukers like Hayate. Supporters like Shamal and Zafira (and in the past... Yuuno). And the front attackers which are pretty darn good as well.

"Ace of Ace of Aces = Hartman" LOL!

Hmm... Ace of Aces of Ace of Aces of Ace of Aces of Ace of Aces -> God Mode

Koveras Alvane · 2011-10-20, 00:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nagumo

Or 'General of Raging Fire', 'General of the Inferno', 'The Burning General', etc etc but I thought 'The Blazing General' sounded good at first. It was her second title, I believe the first one was 'Knight of the Sword'

I was under the impression that Knight of the Sword was her title before Hayate reprogrammed the Book and Blazing General was the one she gave her afterwards.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Enternal

Hmm... Ace of Aces of Ace of Aces of Ace of Aces of Ace of Aces -> Mobius 1

Fix'd it for ya.

Old_Iron · 2011-10-20, 16:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Koveras Alvane

I was under the impression that Knight of the Sword was her title before Hayate reprogrammed the Book and Blazing General was the one she gave her afterwards.

I think she had both titles from the start. Knight of the Sword for her abilities as a swordswoman and General of Fire for her flame element magic...

Quote:

Hmm... Ace of Aces of Ace of Aces of Ace of Aces of Ace of Aces -> Mobius 1

Cipher might like to test that theory, but then the world would explode and we'd all be sunk.

Sunder the Gold · 2011-10-20, 16:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Old_Iron

I think she had both titles from the start. Knight of the Sword for her abilities as a swordswoman and General of Fire for her flame element magic...

I figure that all of their titles save Wolkenritter were from their previous human lives.

Or heck, perhaps even that, if they originally served a master of the unaltered Tome of the Night Sky.

Akiyoshi · 2011-10-20, 16:16

I wonder exactly why the Wolkenritter became the Guardians of the Book. If Vita's monologue in ViVid Ch. Especial EX is te be believed, the Wolkenritter already served the book even before gotten tranformed into the Book of Darkness.

Old_Iron · 2011-10-20, 16:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akiyoshi

I wonder exactly why the Wolkenritter became the Guardians of the Book. If Vita's monologue in ViVid Ch. Especial EX is te be believed, the Wolkenritter already served the book even before gotten tranformed into the Book of Darkness.

I theorize that they volunteered to be part of a special mission that involved becoming guardians of the book. Maybe during the twilight days of Ancient Belka and the book was going to be a last ditch weapon or means of protecting Belkan culture.

It might be interesting if Vita wasn't one of the original guardians, but rather a family member who was (brother, sister, father, etc), wound up being killed at the last moment or otherwise unable to complete their duty and she took over for them.

Akiyoshi · 2011-10-20, 16:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Old_Iron

I theorize that they volunteered to be part of a special mission that involved becoming guardians of the book. Maybe during the twilight days of Ancient Belka and the book was going to be a last ditch weapon or means of protecting Belkan culture.

The thing is that apparently the Book wasn't intended to be a superweapon in first place but only a very efficient magical toma able to storage knowledge and spells through the reading of linker cores. According with canon, it was when some guy messed up with the Book and corrupted the defense program when the "Yami no Sho" emerge.

Zero Hurricane · 2011-10-20, 18:05

So may be people who messing with the book probably think that they are tools that casually played, before they finally met with Hayate that he regarded as her own family.

Akiyoshi · 2011-10-20, 18:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zero Hurricane

So may be people who messing with the book probably think that they are tools that casually played, before they finally met with Hayate that he regarded as her own family.

According to Vita they meet nice masters before but none of them was able to avoid the book's destiny, but considering the nature of her narrations those nice masters probably trated them like valuable servants or praised allies at best, apparently Hayate is their youngest master and also the first to take them as her own family.

ZeroIchiNi · 2011-10-20, 18:18

I thought that they think that the Book was always corrupted since their existence.

So far I can only think of 3 things that are the possibility of the Wolkenritter's nature.

1. They were humans absorbed directly into the book almost like what happened to Fate near the end of A's.

2. They were Materials like the clones of the Aces in the PSP games. Speculation: the reason how they were made is because the book already absorb their linker core and give life to them.

or

3. They were just made out of the blue like Reinforce Zwei.

I like leaning towards the second one.

Enternal · 2011-10-20, 18:43

No I don't think the book was always corrupted. It became corrupted due to tampering by other mages.

The Wolkenritter themselves however are not clear. Even they themselves are not sure of their own existence as they don't really remember it.

Sunder the Gold · 2011-10-20, 20:00

The book was certainly not always corrupted. Yuuno flat out explains that it used to be a completely different sort of Device called the Tome of the Night Sky.

Rising Dragon · 2011-10-20, 21:23

Specifically, Vita refers to a "First Master" in a favorable way, so I'm pretty certain the Tome wasn't always a weapon of mass destruction.

ZeroIchiNi · 2011-10-20, 21:37

Sorry. I think I word it wrong.

I meant to say that the Wolkenritters thinks that the Book was corrupted before even they existed / became became guardian of the book.

^^ I hope this is clearer

LostSome · 2011-10-21, 01:28

I think we see Rein with the Book looking at some warships in the prologue of Force.
Making me guess it was used as a weapon during the war.
But Force never gave an answer... Still can, I guess.

2011-10-19, 22:59	Link #3764
Nagumo Random Translator Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: New Brunswick	In other words... different levels of awesome. Aggressor = Awesome Ace of Aces = Awesomest Ace of Ace of Aces = Hartmann... damn Nazi __________________ I do not like Kansai-ben, but I do like Hayate-chan! Also, Canadian here, not actually Japanese. Last edited by Nagumo; 2011-10-19 at 23:11.

2011-10-19, 22:59	Link #3765
ZeroXSEED I am no one Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Inside your head	^ So the REAL problem is Tsudzuki using WRONG terminology here... __________________

2011-10-19, 23:05	Link #3766
Enternal Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2005	Lol! Yes the problem is with Tsuzuki using the wrong terminology. He should have come up with something like... I don't know Ace of the Top Elites or something that tells that Nanoha is the best among the elite instructors... or whatever. Well at least the "Three Aces" have no issues. Still does not change the fact that Nanoha is still pretty damn awesome right? Not only that, RIOT 6 kicks soo much ass. You have powerhouses such as Nanoha, Vita, Signum, and Fate. Nukers like Hayate. Supporters like Shamal and Zafira (and in the past... Yuuno). And the front attackers which are pretty darn good as well. "Ace of Ace of Aces = Hartman" LOL! Hmm... Ace of Aces of Ace of Aces of Ace of Aces of Ace of Aces -> God Mode __________________ Falcom Collections - A Wallpaper Archives of Trails in the Sky, Ys, and Other Games by Falcom Last edited by Enternal; 2011-10-19 at 23:19.

2011-10-20, 16:16	Link #3770
Akiyoshi The Flame Crussader Join Date: Aug 2009	I wonder exactly why the Wolkenritter became the Guardians of the Book. If Vita's monologue in ViVid Ch. Especial EX is te be believed, the Wolkenritter already served the book even before gotten tranformed into the Book of Darkness. __________________ May 29 2010-2019 ...9 years ago, the day after never would be the same ~The ASFB~

2011-10-20, 18:05	Link #3773
Zero Hurricane I'm here for the reason.. Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Surabaya, East Java, Indonesia Age: 31	So may be people who messing with the book probably think that they are tools that casually played, before they finally met with Hayate that he regarded as her own family. __________________ "Use of deadly force is authorized"

2011-10-20, 18:18	Link #3775
ZeroIchiNi Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008	I thought that they think that the Book was always corrupted since their existence. So far I can only think of 3 things that are the possibility of the Wolkenritter's nature. 1. They were humans absorbed directly into the book almost like what happened to Fate near the end of A's. 2. They were Materials like the clones of the Aces in the PSP games. Speculation: the reason how they were made is because the book already absorb their linker core and give life to them. or 3. They were just made out of the blue like Reinforce Zwei. I like leaning towards the second one.

2011-10-20, 18:43	Link #3776
Enternal Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2005	No I don't think the book was always corrupted. It became corrupted due to tampering by other mages. The Wolkenritter themselves however are not clear. Even they themselves are not sure of their own existence as they don't really remember it. __________________ Falcom Collections - A Wallpaper Archives of Trails in the Sky, Ys, and Other Games by Falcom

2011-10-20, 20:00	Link #3777
Sunder the Gold Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2011	The book was certainly not always corrupted. Yuuno flat out explains that it used to be a completely different sort of Device called the Tome of the Night Sky.

2011-10-20, 21:23	Link #3778
Rising Dragon Goat Herder Author Join Date: Jun 2008 Age: 36	Specifically, Vita refers to a "First Master" in a favorable way, so I'm pretty certain the Tome wasn't always a weapon of mass destruction. __________________

2011-10-20, 21:37	Link #3779
ZeroIchiNi Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008	Sorry. I think I word it wrong. I meant to say that the Wolkenritters thinks that the Book was corrupted before even they existed / became became guardian of the book. ^^ I hope this is clearer

2011-10-21, 01:28	Link #3780
LostSome Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Canada	I think we see Rein with the Book looking at some warships in the prologue of Force. Making me guess it was used as a weapon during the war. But Force never gave an answer... Still can, I guess. __________________ Nyohohohoho ! It`s the law of the universe that only wizards die as virgins. You can`t let yourself die as a virgin, right ? -Old geezer.