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Old 2011-10-27, 14:50   Link #21
Obelisk ze Tormentor
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Originally Posted by Cherry_Lover View Post
It's just common sense, really.
The question that arise is, will other 'normal' master in Zero (Kiritsugu obviously aside) use/allowed such tactics like threatening families of other masters?

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Originally Posted by Cherry_Lover View Post
Plus, I doubt he wants Rin around in case she tries to get involved....
That'd be real funny if she really tries interfere to protect his dad. Heck, I want to see her bossing Gilgamesh around.
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Old 2011-10-27, 21:19   Link #22
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It would be a painful twist if Kiritsugu kills Rin's mom.

Speaking of, Rin has to meet her dad at some point again to get the magic crest, right?
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Old 2011-10-28, 01:44   Link #23
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I was under the impression the magic crest was transferred at birth, but I could be wrong
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Old 2011-10-28, 06:23   Link #24
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No actually, a certain ritual has to be done, which is also how they replaced Rin's "mana link" () from Ero method into little crest (dolphin!) one.
If I remember correctly, Shirou once complained in the game that Kiritsugu didn't even bother giving him the Emiya magic crest.

That being said, it is extremely unlikely someone would give their magic crest to anyone not blood related to them, due to the origin and purpose of the crest.
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Old 2011-10-28, 06:32   Link #25
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I don't think it was Shirou who complained about that, but rather Rin who seemed shocked that a magus father wouldn't pass his crest down.
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Old 2011-10-28, 09:31   Link #26
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Indeed, IIRC Shirou was actually glad to have a father that chose to be a caring father rather than an inevitably cold magus father.
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Old 2011-10-28, 10:00   Link #27
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Ah indeed, I mixed up, for some reason, I thought it was Shirou who was dumbfounded by the use of reinforcement instead of "standard magecraft".
Reflects quite well how long I didn't read that.
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Old 2011-10-28, 10:09   Link #28
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One of my biggest fears is that Kiritsugu will end up killing Kariya simply due to unfortunate circumstances, when they actually could've helped each other. It's not based on anything but it would be so like Urobuchi Gen to do something like that...
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Old 2011-10-28, 11:17   Link #29
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One of my biggest fears is that Kiritsugu will end up killing Kariya simply due to unfortunate circumstances, when they actually could've helped each other. It's not based on anything but it would be so like Urobuchi Gen to do something like that...
I can't see Kiritsugu helping Kariya under any circumstances, really. From what Kotomine said about him in F/SN, Kiritsugu was an adept of F/SN Archer's philosophy of killing hundreds to save thousands and abandoning those who can't be saved any more to save those who still can. Kariya is the very definition of a person who can't be saved any more, since he's literally got an expiration date now, plus he's keeping a destructive force like Berserker around, so I really don't see Kiritsugu thinking twice about killing him, even if he learned Kariya's doing it to save an unfortunate and innocent little girl. And unfortunate as that may be, it does indeed sound right up Urobuchi's alley.
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Old 2011-10-28, 12:13   Link #30
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Yeah but I can also see Kirutsugu having second thoughts when he starts considering Ilya and how easily the roles can be reversed.
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Old 2011-10-28, 13:57   Link #31
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One of my biggest fears is that Kiritsugu will end up killing Kariya simply due to unfortunate circumstances, when they actually could've helped each other. It's not based on anything but it would be so like Urobuchi Gen to do something like that...
I'm afraid for what Kiritsugu is going to do. Going on what was said in the VN and that it's Urobuchi writing it all... this is going to be heavy stuff.
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Old 2011-10-28, 18:09   Link #32
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It would be a painful twist if Kiritsugu kills Rin's mom.

Speaking of, Rin has to meet her dad at some point again to get the magic crest, right?
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I was under the impression the magic crest was transferred at birth, but I could be wrong
The transfer of a crest is a long process that takes much of the heir's young life, apparently. And it is possible to extract the crest of a dead magus. That's what the Association does to the targets of their sealing designations.

I might be wrong on that second count, but I do somewhat recall that. Otherwise it would make no sense for the Association to want the bodies of dead magi to preserve their "research".
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Old 2011-10-28, 18:33   Link #33
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So Tokiomi has to live long enough to give Rin the crest? Or are my facts wrong? Rin has the family crest, right?
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Old 2011-10-28, 18:40   Link #34
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So Tokiomi has to live long enough to give Rin the crest? Or are my facts wrong? Rin has the family crest, right?
As hoarfrost said, engraving a Magic crest on a magus takes quite a long time, normally several years. In the case where the lineage of mages is less than 500 years old, the mage has to use special medicines to ensure that their body doesn't reject the crest.

And to answer your question, Rin is just a beginner, she doesn't have the crest yet, and transferral from a dead mage is possible.
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Old 2011-10-28, 19:41   Link #35
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I meant get's the crest, I forgot we are talking in Zero's timeline. But the crest can be transferred after the is dead, so that answers my question. Thanks.
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Old 2011-10-29, 21:36   Link #36
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F/SN Berserker > F/Z Berserker

Heracles is the second strongest Servant after Gilgamesh. Sad that they shoved him into Berserker class... Imagine if he was Archer or Saber, able to use Nine Lives... *salivates*
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Old 2011-10-29, 23:34   Link #37
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F/SN Berserker > F/Z Berserker

Heracles is the second strongest Servant after Gilgamesh. Sad that they shoved him into Berserker class... Imagine if he was Archer or Saber, able to use Nine Lives... *salivates*
Except if this berserker grabs your noble phantasm it becomes his. At that point its over (with exception to those with multiple ones), imagine him stealing heracles noble phantasm? Dunno how he'd do it but could be a possiblity.

And btw heracles was strong, bet very very slow, our archer class in FSN did circles around him and took a few lives =). And lets not forget that the stronger the noble phantasm the more lives it can take in 1 hit =).

IMO F/Z berserker > F/SN berserker I could see him grabbin that huge cleaver and making that his own too haha.
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Old 2011-10-29, 23:52   Link #38
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Except if this berserker grabs your noble phantasm it becomes his. At that point its over (with exception to those with multiple ones), imagine him stealing heracles noble phantasm? Dunno how he'd do it but could be a possiblity.

And btw heracles was strong, bet very very slow, our archer class in FSN did circles around him and took a few lives =). And lets not forget that the stronger the noble phantasm the more lives it can take in 1 hit =).

IMO F/Z berserker > F/SN berserker I could see him grabbin that huge cleaver and making that his own too haha.
CGzerker can only grab Noble Phantasms not being wielded like the ones Gilgamesh carelessly tosses. That's why Rider's chariot noble phantasm doesn't magically become Berserker's when he got stomped.

Also, Heracles was actually in-game as fast as Saber was (and faster when Mad Enhanced activated instead of just sanity removed). The anime was a rather poor representation. Remember, Heracles has the stats to be any class except Caster. This means he could even be a Lancer which is, by definition, the fastest class.

Besides, that rock sword isn't a noble phantasm. Heracles just swings it ultra hard.
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Old 2011-10-30, 00:04   Link #39
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Originally Posted by Lumir View Post
Except if this berserker grabs your noble phantasm it becomes his. At that point its over (with exception to those with multiple ones), imagine him stealing heracles noble phantasm? Dunno how he'd do it but could be a possiblity.

And btw heracles was strong, bet very very slow, our archer class in FSN did circles around him and took a few lives =). And lets not forget that the stronger the noble phantasm the more lives it can take in 1 hit =).

IMO F/Z berserker > F/SN berserker I could see him grabbin that huge cleaver and making that his own too haha.
You forgot that Herakles cannot even be physically injured by Noble Phantasms or attacks BELOW A-Rank.

Sure, Zero Berserker can turn anything into a Noble Phantasm, but we can surmise from the fact that Lancer can cut said Pole Phantasm is that they're not A-rank NPs.

Zero Berserker does seem to be far more skillful in weapon arts compared to Herakles, but having skill is useless when it won't be able to even injure him, much less kill him 10 times.
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Old 2011-10-30, 00:09   Link #40
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Incredible episode. That Berserker. That angry Gil. That Broskander. That noble Lancer. That crazy caster. That budget. That action. That everything...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lumir View Post
Except if this berserker grabs your noble phantasm it becomes his. At that point its over (with exception to those with multiple ones), imagine him stealing heracles noble phantasm? Dunno how he'd do it but could be a possiblity.

And btw heracles was strong, bet very very slow, our archer class in FSN did circles around him and took a few lives =). And lets not forget that the stronger the noble phantasm the more lives it can take in 1 hit =).

IMO F/Z berserker > F/SN berserker I could see him grabbin that huge cleaver and making that his own too haha.
Uh. FSN Berserker was faster than fsn archer. The one thing you CANT call FSN berserker is slow. He is probably faster than zero berserker as well.
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