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View Poll Results: Fate/Zero - Episode 13 Rating
Perfect 10 49 39.20%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 31 24.80%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 26 20.80%
7 out of 10 : Good 13 10.40%
6 out of 10 : Average 6 4.80%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 0 0%
4 out of 10 : Poor 0 0%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 0 0%
Voters: 125. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2011-12-29, 16:09   Link #181
DragoZERO
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Originally Posted by Rethice View Post
What are you basing that on?

Her hand is like that because she lost to Lancer, fair and square.

She is not the strongest servant, never has been. She just has "Main Character" powers.

I never said she was the strongest. I based it on the info about the Excalibur Noble Phantasm. But we really can't get into here since it's F/SN material, so we'll put this on hold until she uses it.
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Old 2011-12-29, 16:11   Link #182
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Originally Posted by Thess View Post
Spoiler for Saber vs Gil:
Spoiler for re:
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Old 2011-12-29, 16:47   Link #183
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Originally Posted by Kallen4life View Post
Spoiler for re:
Spoiler for Gil in general:
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Old 2011-12-29, 16:52   Link #184
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Any Servant can beat any Servant under the right circumstance but if measure by pure strength, Serious Gil is the strongest of them all.
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Old 2011-12-29, 17:07   Link #185
Thess
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Originally Posted by Xellos-_^ View Post
Any Servant can beat any Servant under the right circumstance but if measure by pure strength, Serious Gil is the strongest of them all.
From Zero and Stay Night, sure, but we don't know yet about Extra or Apocrypha.
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Old 2011-12-29, 18:56   Link #186
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Quote:
Originally Posted by giorno View Post
Excalibur is an A++ anti-fortress NP, that's what he's basing that on.
That's all well and good, looking at the stats from the FS/N game. According to the those, Saber is also meant to be charismatic, with a B. I find her to be the most bland character in the series, F/SN included. If Shirou wasn't so stupid to the point of being easily declarable as literally mentally handicapped I probably would have disliked her even more, but instead they both flounder in incompetence together - and that's just cute. With nothing more than "Main Character armour" (To quote Thess) to protect them...
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Old 2011-12-29, 21:02   Link #187
Thess
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Originally Posted by Rethice View Post
That's all well and good, looking at the stats from the FS/N game. According to the those, Saber is also meant to be charismatic, with a B. I find her to be the most bland character in the series, F/SN included. If Shirou wasn't so stupid to the point of being easily declarable as literally mentally handicapped I probably would have disliked her even more, but instead they both flounder in incompetence together - and that's just cute. With nothing more than "Main Character armour" (To quote Thess) to protect them...
Well, didn't she rank first in the Newtype Poll last time? She's also the most popular character in the franchise in Japan. So she's hardly unpopular and has her moe charm? I like Arthuria, but I prefer Nero over her.
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Old 2011-12-29, 22:25   Link #188
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Originally Posted by Haak View Post
I can't believe the pacing of KnK was compared favourable to Fate Zero. The pacing of KnK is freaking atrocious! Well each film had decent pacing (except for the first film) but as an entire series...
Movie vs TV... I also hated it, but nonetheless given the medium it bound to happen. Anyway, I was judging the pacing of each movie, and the way the main plot was presented through flashbacks and subplots, not the space between the movies.

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It's not the pacing that makes the dialogue the problem. It's simply a matter of perspective. Some guys simply want a little less conversation and a little more action. Imo I think they wouldn't have a problem with the dialogue if they were as invested in the characters as we are to begin with. I can't be entirely sure but it wouldn't surprise me if all those that consider the dialogue excessive haven't played the game or aren't type moon fans. So it's only natural really.
I agree, but that's why shows like Horizon, Naruto, and so on are popular, despite the quality of the dialogue and independent of pacing.

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Originally Posted by Haak View Post
When i first read Uryuu, I found him pretty generic too but deRais being obsessed with Saber kinda put a good spin on it and I actually found their psychobabble this episode kind of interesting (in a messed up kind a way). Plus there was a certain "musical instrument" scene in the LN that I'm actually glad got censored...
Uryuu is a train-wreck in the character presentation and development departments. For deRais, when he enters philosophy mode is very interesting, but his obsession with Saber/d'Arc does not work for me, reminds me of cheap H-VNs

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Originally Posted by Haak View Post
I'm going to officially consider it the "KnK Fairytale moment" of Fate/Zero.
In Rakkyou the fairytale was essential for the protagonist's development as well as gave a tone of information about the setting (only surpassed by the Soren chapter/movie). Of course both were not in the spotlight of the movie, yet when considering the work as a whole... necessary.

On the other hand, Rin's little adventure, did not offer anything to the grail war, which is the main storyline of F/Z
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Old 2011-12-30, 04:03   Link #189
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Originally Posted by Thess View Post
Well, didn't she rank first in the Newtype Poll last time? She's also the most popular character in the franchise in Japan. So she's hardly unpopular and has her moe charm? I like Arthuria, but I prefer Nero over her.
I suppose that makes sense if King Arthur was an idol icon and the British were squeeling fanboy Otaku.

Jokes aside, I get your meaning, but I'd still hardly call that charisma, as Rei-type danderes are also quite popular... And that leaves much to be desired in the way of charisma or in any way leadership.
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Old 2011-12-30, 04:32   Link #190
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Originally Posted by Rethice View Post
That's all well and good, looking at the stats from the FS/N game.
heh, it's not like Excalibur's rank changes between FSN and Zero, you know...

...and i don't quite understand your point about her charisma....what does that have to do with excalibur being one of the most powerful NPs?(in fact, it's pretty much the most powerful offensive NP after Ea, not counting apocrypha...)
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Old 2011-12-30, 05:53   Link #191
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Originally Posted by giorno View Post
heh, it's not like Excalibur's rank changes between FSN and Zero, you know...

...and i don't quite understand your point about her charisma....what does that have to do with excalibur being one of the most powerful NPs?(in fact, it's pretty much the most powerful offensive NP after Ea, not counting apocrypha...)
The point that manual book stats mean nothing, if we never actually see it proven in the the show itself. It's about as pointless as shaking your angry fist at a bully that just kicked the shit out of you saying "I would have beaten you in a battle of wits were the field right for it, chum!"

And yes, I've played FS/N, and my opinion still stands - but lets stop using FS/N material for the sake of this discussion, it's against the forum rules in the first place.
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Old 2011-12-30, 05:58   Link #192
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The point that manual book stats mean nothing, if we never actually see it proven in the the show itself.
I think we can safely use the stats as a reference for speculation in the very least (Just not in this thread).

Just because one personally doesn't agree with a stat doesn't mean it can't or won't happen. Take Gilgamesh for example: He has an A+ rank in Charisma but even though I think he has no charisma and think he's just an asshat, I'm not going to say he can't command an army. The show has already taken care to mention Saber has all the strongest stats, that Gilagemsh's Independant Action is causing Tokiomi a pain in the ass and Saber can ride vehicles, so it's not as if it completely disregards stats.

I think it would be more approprioriate to say the stats are given facts unless proven otherwise.
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Old 2011-12-30, 12:53   Link #193
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Originally Posted by Goddess Madoka View Post
I'd rate this episode 11/10, but unfortunately, there's no option for that.

Well, the whole build-up followed by the zooming into Saber's eye (+ Epic music from Yuki Kajiura) = My god.

Then, the episode previews... FINALLY, ANIMATED PREVIEWS.
Uh, basically, ufotable is the King of Cliffhangers for me. (DAT F-15 JET. DAT EA. DAT FIGHT. DAT DAT DAT DAT DAT~)

EXTRA: Episode 11 of Fate/zero will be re-aired, uncut! Cheers~!
Sorry guys, for the late response. The episode will be re-aired on the 2nd or 3rd of January on TokyoMX. Do tell, and do spread the love.
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Old 2011-12-30, 18:34   Link #194
giorno
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Originally Posted by Rethice View Post
The point that manual book stats mean nothing, if we never actually see it proven in the the show itself.
uhm, what the hell? this has to be the stupidest thing i've read about FSN in a while...

also, it's not manual books stats when they're there in the freaking game...

Quote:
And yes, I've played FS/N, and my opinion still stands - but lets stop using FS/N material for the sake of this discussion, it's against the forum rules in the first place.
nobody's using FSN material, Excalibur's rank is A++, its power is exactly the same no matter who's saber's master or what kind of fame she may get, NP's ranks and powers are fixed
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Old 2011-12-30, 20:36   Link #195
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nobody's using FSN material, Excalibur's rank is A++, its power is exactly the same no matter who's saber's master or what kind of fame she may get, NP's ranks and powers are fixed
Saber's Excalibur is powerful, but it's because it's so powerful (but not as much as Ea. IIRC, Excalibur can be measured in 200 vs Ea's... 4000 of max output both.) that is a weakness.

Even with its sheer power, the great disadvantage is that she misses, she's probably screwed (unlike say, Lancer with Gae Bolg who can use it more rounds).

The Master matters because, if you remember FSN, using it once almost left Saber emptied and nearly disappeared against Rider. Under Rin, during the final battle (before she struck a deal with Shirou), she could only use it twice. She can't go around and spam Excalibur like Gilgamesh does in in his sword rain with Gate of Babylon.
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Old 2011-12-30, 23:07   Link #196
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What a cruel cliffhanger or as Ryunosuke would say:

"Is this....are they.....even human?!"

Pretty funny coming from him.
yeah! never expect he will say something like that
anyway, his concept about God is totally interesting

Alexander is so wise... aww... great compliment... Waver need some motivational comment from his servant

and the cliffhanger is so
how can they leave it just like that???!!!!
looking forward for the teamwork... and I think Kariya will enter the scene as well

3 months waiting
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Old 2011-12-31, 03:04   Link #197
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If it's unofficial, then Iskander should or must be the mascot character for Fate zero.

Appearances are deceiving, and the case applies for Iskander because he wasn't just a formidable leader and fearsome warrior, but his moments with Waver are memorable because he imparts his own voices of experience; an insight of the things he did and wanted to try.

Spoiler:


I do realize that Waver sounded too whiny and pushy about feeling an underdog compared to Iskander, and as the guy unable to get his voice louder than anyone else in the classroom. That's because Waver reminds me of me, pretty much insecure and not assertive about myself, the choices I make, and what & where to take my life from here.

Iskander has his way to share his personal lessons, and the message is as simple: don't fret at being insignificant, because in this great sea that we called life each of our timespans are nothing but little lights flickering every day to light off at the end.
What matters most is to live that life to the fullest ahead than anyone else so as to taste the merry flavor of having lived a life in which we did all the things we liked once having reached our final destination.

Spoiler:


And, for regards to the to be concluded climax of this arc yet to settle, I can only say this:
Rider, Saber, and Lancer joining in a brief alliance and working together to stop Caster inside his Cthulu-like nightmare manifestation is an epic sight to be remembered in the annals of the Holy Grail history.
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Old 2011-12-31, 03:21   Link #198
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If it's unofficial, then Iskander should or must be the mascot character for Fate zero.
What makes you think that?



Quote:
Originally Posted by Guido View Post
Rider, Saber, and Lancer joining in a brief alliance and working together to stop Caster inside his Cthulu-like nightmare manifestation is an epic sight to be remembered in the annals of the Holy Grail history.
Rider got what he wanted, didn't he? Saber and Lancer didn't realize it, since they care caught in the moment.
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Old 2011-12-31, 04:23   Link #199
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Also, apparently there's another implication from this battle if I read one of Saber's recollection from FSN correctly.

There's no way "that" thing could've be there if not for "that" to happen, and if that's true, it would be interesting what happens to "that person", and I'm interested to see if it's true or not.
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Old 2011-12-31, 07:02   Link #200
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Originally Posted by Thess View Post
Saber's Excalibur is powerful, but it's because it's so powerful (but not as much as Ea. IIRC, Excalibur can be measured in 200 vs Ea's... 4000 of max output both.) that is a weakness.
yes, that's absolutely true, but that has nothing to do with the current discussion

Quote:
Even with its sheer power, the great disadvantage is that she misses, she's probably screwed (unlike say, Lancer with Gae Bolg who can use it more rounds).
it's anti-fortress, which means it has a stupefyingly large area of effect, and being a laser beam, it travels at, duh, the speed of light...

but besides that, yes you're right again, and again, nobody's discussing that...

Quote:
The Master matters because, if you remember FSN, using it once almost left Saber emptied and nearly disappeared against Rider. Under Rin, during the final battle (before she struck a deal with Shirou), she could only use it twice. She can't go around and spam Excalibur like Gilgamesh does in in his sword rain with Gate of Babylon.
you misunderstood my point: the point is that excalibur's power is fixed, it's the same no matter how good saber's master is or what kind of fame bonus she may get. Shirou's saber's excalibur is just as powerful as alter's. Of course, the difference is that shirou's saber can barely use it at all(and in one bad end against 'zerker, she manages to fire a crappy low-output version which doesn't even slow him down), while alter spams it like there's no tomorrow. But excalibur's power's the same...
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