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Old 2012-01-07, 04:07   Link #1
judasmartel
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Smart Hero vs Strong Villain

Smart Hero - Doesn't have to be a straight-A book-smart student in-universe, but must be at least Genre Savvy. Bonus points if he is Weak But Skilled Guile Hero.

Strong Villain - Doesn't have to be Book Dumb, in fact I would appreciate Genius Bruiser villains, but has a bad habit of relying on physical strength or Superpower Lottery instead of a Xanatos Gambit to beat the hero.

Anything like these? Because you know, I'm getting tired of Idiot Heroes nowadays, and there seems to be hate against smart people, to the point that the smarter a character is, the more likely that he is evil or at least a Jerkass.

Thanks.
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Old 2012-01-07, 08:58   Link #2
SeijiSensei
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The hero is a heroine in Nijuu Mensou no Musume, but she's certainly smart enough. The villains have some skills, too.
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Old 2012-01-07, 09:47   Link #3
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Have you tried Code Geass? It's about a smart teenager trying to destroy a strong empire.
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Old 2012-01-07, 09:58   Link #4
judasmartel
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Hm. Except that the villains are smart as well.

I specifically stated that the villain must be MORE PHYSICALLY STRONG THAN INTELLIGENT because I am tired of Idiot Heroes so I want to see a smart hero pitted against a physically strong villain.

Mortal Kombat, for example, has Shao Kahn. I want a villain like that. Physically strong yet not necessarily dumb.
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Old 2012-01-08, 19:29   Link #5
GreatTeacherKen
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The manga Jojo's Bizarre Adventure is pretty much what you want although the villains are quite smart as well as being strong. All of the protagonists (each story arc has a different protagonist and villain) are very clever and resourceful. Each story arc in the series fits the bill, and the fights tend to involve characters using their powers in clever ways.
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Old 2012-01-08, 21:26   Link #6
Niji
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Jyu Oh Sei might work. Main is smart, and has to grow strong, too. Adversaries count on strength.

Tengen Toppa Gurren Lagaan might count. The hero is smart, but also strong (not from outset, gotta let it develop some epis). The villains are strong but also a bit smart (one guy at least).

Utawarerumono I think. Though the hero turns out to be not only smart towards the end at least

Evangelion might count. The lead is not stupid, is backed up by some super smart peeps, and the villain is strong indeed. Well, the obvious villain. The other guy (not sure whether to count him good or bad, though he is on the good side. Or is he?) is smart too. Lead is a bit wimpy though hm, not really the hero type.

I dont know whether important, but kinda side chars count. If so, Madlax might work. Some on the good side are quite smart to very smart. Heroine is smart and strong. But the villains are smart too, but rely alot on strength, IIRC.
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Old 2012-01-08, 21:57   Link #7
judasmartel
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Ah, great. Good thing I have already started with TTGL. But I'm on Awesomeness Withdrawal at the moment, so it would take a while before I start watching it again.

I thought about this, the Suikoden 2 Radio Drama actually fits, as one of its baddies can actually beat sound strategies with just pure brawn.

Thanks for the suggestions, but I appreciate it if there are more of those.
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Old 2012-01-08, 22:31   Link #8
Soliloquy
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Isn't Berserk like what you described and Claymore as well? The only problem is that there are several villains in both series.

If I think about it, some shonen anime has what you are looking for like Yu Yu Hakusho, maybe Fairy Tail.

I want to ask you are you only looking for Anime or manga as well?
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Old 2012-01-09, 03:06   Link #9
judasmartel
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Anime or Manga, doesn't matter. Smart Hero vs Strong Hammy Villain.
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Old 2012-01-22, 07:10   Link #10
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Horizon on the Middle of Nowhere - It's about a extremely-perverted but smart protagonist who can makes his own political arguments before saving his abducted childhood friend.

I also recommend Death Note. It features a mental fight between smart protagonist and the evil genius detective.
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Old 2012-01-22, 10:34   Link #11
judasmartel
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Hm. I'm settling for TTGL atm. Death Note, it would be nice to read mind games for a while. It seems my intellectual side is getting rusty nowadays.

There's a reason why I liked heroes who can do so many ways with the only hammer that they have without getting too bland.

I see it's pretty tough to write a "smarter-hero-athletic-villain" story because the hero's quality depends on the quality of the villain. Therefore, if the villain isn't worth his salt, then so is the hero.

It's just that it seems like the world hates smart people so much that they can't write smart guy heroes without having them lean over the dark side a bit. It's as if being intelligent is evil.
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Old 2012-01-22, 11:48   Link #12
SeijiSensei
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Oh, come on now. I can think of a number of "smart guy heroes," Dr. Tenma in Monster being at the top of my list. (Others include the Medicine Seller in Bakeneko/Mononoke, Tamaya Seikichi in Oh! Edo Rocket, and Firo Prochainezo in Baccano! to name just a few.)

The problem is your requirement that the villain be strong but not smart. (Perhaps Ladd Russo in Baccano! qualifies?) I'd much prefer a struggle between a smart hero and a smart villain like we see in Monster.
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Old 2012-01-22, 21:18   Link #13
judasmartel
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That's really a problem, isn't it? I just felt so bad that some people associate intellect with being evil or being part of the dark side.

It's as if being smart means evil.

BTW, I don't have any problem reading mind games because the plot resolution almost always comes down to who outwits who. And when that happens, it's almost guaranteed to be awesome.
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Old 2012-01-23, 09:56   Link #14
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Sorry I don't have a suggestion, but I gotta ask; are you using tvtrope terminology (O.o)?
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Old 2012-01-24, 01:18   Link #15
judasmartel
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Sort of. It has been my sickness lately.
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Old 2012-03-02, 23:35   Link #16
judasmartel
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So, is it really so bad that smart guys are almost always portrayed as evil, lazy, jerkass, or just a plain good guy who leans to the dark side a little bit?

I mean, can't we have a smart guy who DOES NOT have to lean over the dark side to win?
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Old 2012-04-26, 00:41   Link #17
judasmartel
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Sorry to necro this thread, but is it true that Intelligence = Evil?
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Old 2012-04-29, 22:39   Link #18
kuroishinigami
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Not really, but usually intelligent = realist, and realist = a little dark even if their intent is as goos as idealist people. As for suggestion, can't think of any right now beside to aru majutsu no index, but the hero is more like street smart instead of intelligent. There's a lot of intelligent hero, but when you have smart hero, the villian are usually more smart than strong. I will recommend liar game though when you feel like reading great battle of wit.
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Old 2012-04-29, 22:43   Link #19
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To me, intelligence breeds egoism, where they think their brain is capable of saving the world and thus their words hold the most weight. Then these intelligent heroes may start doing something what he/she thinks is right but is actually wrong. I would say intelligent but evil characters are directed mostly to scientist characters in animes. Just my two cents.
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Old 2012-04-29, 23:01   Link #20
judasmartel
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Oh my bad. But oh well. At least smart guys from the good side get to be Mission Control.
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