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Old 2012-02-03, 09:25   Link #861
miketyson
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Originally Posted by Ypocaramel View Post
My reading of her so far is that based on the nature of her insecurities she's more likely to blame it on herself "I'm useless, I don't deserve to be loved by Amata-kun..." It would more likely if her insecurities lead Amata to do something crazy to prove his love, making her an "unintentional villian" in a sense that it is her passive acts, not active acts, that cause disaster.
Yeah, that seems a bit more likely than something that'd have her intentionally asking him to do something. The fact way she gets angry so quick plays into this, as well: her insecurity makes her angry over small things, then she thinks she's worthless so she tries to leave the area, then Amata has to step up and win her back. No wonder the other girls don't like her.
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Old 2012-02-03, 09:28   Link #862
cyberdemon
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Originally Posted by BetoJR View Post
I still think Mikono and Kagura are gonna be an item. Sooner than later, even... Perhaps, the "villainous" bit refers to this happening, and its consequences. Well, nothing but speculation, for now.
it's more likely that Kagura is going to kidnap Mikono and force the wedding in funeral clothes on her. Likely to sacrifice her for some power up only to have it interrupted and her rescued by Amata.


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Originally Posted by Ypocaramel View Post
The first part is interesting - I agree you might be onto something there. But she also saw herself looking sad and dressed in black for the wedding, so she might have some pause about that vision. But it could lead to her being more likely to "give in to fate" even if she does not do anything active to make the vision come true or love Kagura.

I can see the logic in the second part too but I can't agree with that reading of her charatcter. My reading of her so far is that based on the nature of her insecurities she's more likely to blame it on herself "I'm useless, I don't deserve to be loved by Amata-kun..." It would more likely if her insecurities lead Amata to do something crazy to prove his love, making her an "unintentional villian" in a sense that it is her passive acts, not active acts, that cause disaster.
that's kinda like what i mentioned earlier about why she would be considered villainous. Mikono seems more likely to want full on love with Amata while Neo-deava wants her to stay one step short of love. That's bound to start causing more issues within neo-deava making her out to be a bag girl type who only cares about her feeling instead of about what is best for the world. which could lead up to her being captured and used by the enemy for power which leads to the wedding in funeral clothes.
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Old 2012-02-03, 09:37   Link #863
Vena
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Originally Posted by miketyson View Post
In re: Mikono: I don't think Mikono's seen the version of Cayenne's vision where she turns into a skeleton, has she? If she hasn't, her reaction to Kagura makes a lot of sense: all else aside, Mikono's in love with the idea of destiny and fate and all that, and he's her future husband in that vision.
That was Shrade trolling Cayenne, it had nothing to do with the original vision and was Shrade manipulating Cayenne's power to force him to stop beating the shit out of Amata. Her turning into a skeleton is not a part of the genuine vision that Cayenne saw initially and that was later amplified by Aquarion.

And boy did those spoilers apparently spark a massive discussion of trying to twist and turn the meaning of わるい... outside of any context no less.
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Old 2012-02-03, 09:45   Link #864
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Originally Posted by cyberdemon View Post
Mikono seems more likely to want full on love with Amata while Neo-deava wants her to stay one step short of love. That's bound to start causing more issues within neo-deava making her out to be a bag girl type who only cares about her feeling instead of about what is best for the world. which could lead up to her being captured and used by the enemy for power which leads to the wedding in funeral clothes.
hmm... I get the feeling that Fudou has something more up his generous sleeves than what we've seen so far. I can't see him as the type who would think forcing them to stay at the end of love indefinitely - it's too much of an unstable equilibrium or non-equilibrium. Balance, ZEN, stability, sustainability ... these are all words I would associate with Fudo Gen's lessons in the original series.

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Originally Posted by miketyson View Post
Yeah, that seems a bit more likely than something that'd have her intentionally asking him to do something. The fact way she gets angry so quick plays into this, as well: her insecurity makes her angry over small things, then she thinks she's worthless so she tries to leave the area, then Amata has to step up and win her back. No wonder the other girls don't like her.
It should be noted that is the pattern we have seen in episode 3 and 5, that it is Amata that takes the lead in "getting her back." The thing is, she is rarely angry for long - or at least, both of those times, Amata knew what to do.
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Old 2012-02-03, 09:52   Link #865
cyberdemon
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Originally Posted by Vena View Post
That was Shrade trolling Cayenne, it had nothing to do with the original vision and was Shrade manipulating Cayenne's power to force him to stop beating the shit out of Amata. Her turning into a skeleton is not a part of the genuine vision that Cayenne saw initially and that was later amplified by Aquarion.

And boy did those spoilers apparently spark a massive discussion of trying to twist and turn the meaning of わるい... outside of any context no less.
seems to more more that Shrade's music is powering up their elements so cayenne is seeing more of the vision than he saw before.
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Old 2012-02-03, 09:55   Link #866
Vena
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seems to more more that Shrade's music is powering up their elements so cayenne is seeing more of the vision than he saw before.
Shrade's elemental power is to manipulate the emotions of others. Don't you think that if he was extending the scene for Cayenne, which doesn't really make sense with his abilities, the latter's reaction would have been a bit different from: "Stop messing with my head!"
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Old 2012-02-03, 09:56   Link #867
miketyson
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Originally Posted by Vena View Post
That was Shrade trolling Cayenne, it had nothing to do with the original vision and was Shrade manipulating Cayenne's power to force him to stop beating the shit out of Amata. Her turning into a skeleton is not a part of the genuine vision that Cayenne saw initially and that was later amplified by Aquarion.

And boy did those spoilers apparently spark a massive discussion of trying to twist and turn the meaning of わるい... outside of any context no less.
I took it as Schrade temporarily "boosting" Cayenne's vision-seeing ability but not actively manipulating what he saw, but we'll find out eventually.

And you're definitely right about the spoilers. In the context we have it seems like Kaji may've thought he said too much and then tried to smooth it over, but whoever supplied that initial "evil woman" translation sure did stir some stuff up.

To change subject: anyone else betting on there being a six-way super-gattai before the show's over?
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Old 2012-02-03, 09:59   Link #868
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In the same episode Shrade had demostrated being able to accurcately extend Cayenne's vision power to locate Jun in orbit. I argue "Stop messing with my head!" is ambigious - we as viewers cannot know whether Cayenne was simply pissed that Shrade made him see the vision again or if Cayenne somehow felt the vision was somehow changed.

Last time they gattaied with the earth - so naturally something has to top that this time.
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Old 2012-02-03, 10:01   Link #869
Vena
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Originally Posted by miketyson View Post
I took it as Schrade temporarily "boosting" Cayenne's vision-seeing ability but not actively manipulating what he saw, but we'll find out eventually.

And you're definitely right about the spoilers. In the context we have it seems like Kaji may've thought he said too much and then tried to smooth it over, but whoever supplied that initial "evil woman" translation sure did stir some stuff up.

To change subject: anyone else betting on there being a six-way super-gattai before the show's over?
That is not Shrade's power. He manipulates emotions, in this case he manipulated Cayenne's strongest emotions: those towards his sister. Shrade does not have the abilities of Aquarion; he's powerful but he's not so powerful as to be able to amplify the powers of others (just imagine how broken that would be, being able to control not only emotions but also the power of people's elements. He'd be more powerful than Aquarion). Best I gathered from the second scene, he directed Cayenne's emotions in the right direction, not amplifying anything.

I'm still gunning for a Kagura/Mikono/Someone vs. Amata/Someone/Someone super fight between all the reincarnations.
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Old 2012-02-03, 10:08   Link #870
mayumi
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you know the graveyard we keep seeing in evol with amata crying as alisia goes away and the place where mikono and kagura are supposed to wed? i tthink it was in the original aquarion as well. it was in the episode of the dream world.


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Old 2012-02-03, 10:08   Link #871
miketyson
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Originally Posted by Vena View Post
That is not Shrade's power. He manipulates emotions, in this case he manipulated Cayenne's strongest emotions: those towards his sister. Shrade does not have the abilities of Aquarion; he's powerful but he's not so powerful as to be able to amplify the powers of others.

I'm still gunning for a Kagura/Mikono/Someone vs. Amata/Someone/Someone super fight between all the reincarnations.
We'll find out eventually, but so far it seems like a distinction without a difference: feelings are what drive the element abilities, ergo manipulating feelings can effectively power them up or down (even if the "real" power level is the same).

So, eg, what he did to Cayenne isn't any different than if he played something romantic and sent Amata off soaring through the sky.

What I *really* want to see is Mykage and/or Schrade play someone the symphony of space (a la astrocat). The writers seem meme-savvy with that 'orz' bit so it's not an entirely futile wish.
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Old 2012-02-03, 10:13   Link #872
Vena
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Originally Posted by miketyson View Post
We'll find out eventually, but so far it seems like a distinction without a difference: feelings are what drive the element abilities, ergo manipulating feelings can effectively power them up or down (even if the "real" power level is the same).

So, eg, what he did to Cayenne isn't any different than if he played something romantic and sent Amata off soaring through the sky.
While that's certainly true, it doesn't really make Cayenne's reaction to the vision make all that much sense if he's seeing more of it. The first time he saw it (vague and non-descriptive), he was confused and uncertain, the second time, when it was amplified by Aquarion and made crystal clear, he was panicked and greatly troubled... and when Shrade trolls him, he just gets angry at Shrade? From seeing his sister die in his vision? Over protective Cayenne just gets pissy? Not to mention that Andy alludes to this being a common thing between the two of them... and this being how Shrade keeps Cayenne in check.

Given Cayenne's track record, if he sees his sister die in a vision, he'd probably lock her in a basement and stand guard 24/7.
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Old 2012-02-03, 10:21   Link #873
klare
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"I can make him fly too"

this show is still crazy, and fun too
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Old 2012-02-03, 10:24   Link #874
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Originally Posted by Ypocaramel View Post
It should be noted that is the pattern we have seen in episode 3 and 5, that it is Amata that takes the lead in "getting her back." The thing is, she is rarely angry for long - or at least, both of those times, Amata knew what to do.
You know, in any other series this wouldn't be such a big deal, but apparently in EVOL, this is a sign of evil !

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To change subject: anyone else betting on there being a six-way super-gattai before the show's over?
That scene in the OP with Crea? I counted six pilots- three girls (Zessica, Mix, Sanzaka) and three boys (Andy, Cayenne, ???)

But before we get up to that point, I'm hoping we get to see the other threesomes in action without Amata (Cause he'll be cramping their style)
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Old 2012-02-03, 10:27   Link #875
Shikijin
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And boy did those spoilers apparently spark a massive discussion of trying to twist and turn the meaning of わるい... outside of any context no less.
I actually googled the meaning of 悪女.
1) Ugly woman (which is not the case)
2) Wicked woman (not sure about this)
3) Woman who leads a man by the nose

I think the third case could be the most likely, maybe Mikono is secretly a bitch And anyway, not necessarily the villains are evil. Sure, the abduct people, but maybe they have some reason to do so and they are just self-righteous.

Then again, Kagura says she stinks, so probably Mikono is kind of rotten
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Old 2012-02-03, 10:35   Link #876
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That scene in the OP with Crea? I counted six pilots- three girls (Zessica, Mix, Sanzaka) and three boys (Andy, Cayenne, ???)
Actually.........that scene in the OP is just a recycled scene from episode 1. You know, when the M-Type first shows up to team up against kagura. Just with Crea added in the foreground.
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Old 2012-02-03, 10:40   Link #877
Chaos2Frozen
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I actually googled the meaning of 悪女.
1) Ugly woman (which is not the case)
2) Wicked woman (not sure about this)
3) Woman who leads a man by the nose
Context my friend, context... =_=

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Actually.........that scene in the OP is just a recycled scene from episode 1. You know, when the M-Type first shows up to team up against kagura. Just with Crea added in the foreground.
Doesn't mean it can't happen
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Old 2012-02-03, 10:47   Link #878
Ypocaramel
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Note also that the crosses at the funeral are the as the cross held by "Aquaria" and on the uniforms of the girls' side of DEVEA. I'm sure this has been noticed.
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Old 2012-02-03, 11:25   Link #879
mayumi
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Note also that the crosses at the funeral are the as the cross held by "Aquaria" and on the uniforms of the girls' side of DEVEA. I'm sure this has been noticed.
yes you are right. i am going to guess that the abductors are looking for silvia and but none of the girls they have abducted till now have been silvia.
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Old 2012-02-03, 13:05   Link #880
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yes you are right. i am going to guess that the abductors are looking for silvia and but none of the girls they have abducted till now have been silvia.
probably. Kagura is TOO similar to Apollo (attitude, appearance, except older) for it to be a coincidence. perhaps they cloned Apollo as a way to seek out the reincarnation of Silvia.
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