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View Poll Results: Nisemonogatari - Episode 08 Rating
Perfect 10 165 75.34%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 22 10.05%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 10 4.57%
7 out of 10 : Good 3 1.37%
6 out of 10 : Average 4 1.83%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 3 1.37%
4 out of 10 : Poor 3 1.37%
3 out of 10 : Bad 2 0.91%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 1 0.46%
1 out of 10 : Painful 6 2.74%
Voters: 219. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2012-02-26, 01:41   Link #121
Sol Falling
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaioshin Sama View Post
I think it's just cause it's an anticipated scene and it's apparently uncut. Really not hard to predict a deluge of 10's considering this show doesn't really attract a very critical crowd for the most part. Haven't seen a thread like this in a while though to be honest, but just in general I never really pay attention to ratings that aren't by people I know don't just hand them out like they're business cards.

Anyway I saw it cause I was curious and being me and all that entails I obviously don't see what all the fuss is about. It's a fanservice scene in a show with more than a few of them, it's executed as a fanservice scene, and that's really all I have to will say about it. Maybe if I wasn't so used to modern anime being filled with weird and incestuous (is it fair to say sexually deviant or will that get me in trouble? ), but yeah not exactly leaping out of my seat and ready to praise the show for this.

Unlike most people who seem stunned speechless there's actually plenty I could say about this episode and that scene in particular and it didn't really make me go WTF anymore than anything else this franchise has thrown at me during the times I've tried to entertain it, but I don't feel like getting in trouble even though I probably already am so I'll say no more.
I've made an exception in making this the first Nisemonogatari episode I've voted on myself. That vote being a 10. You should probably understand that what so many viewers/posters here are celebrating is moreso the spectacle of the event--the opportunity to be moved together and moved powerfully by a portrayal so outrageous/extraordinary it's rarely seen.

I have to give SHAFT kudos for this. While I had been spoiled forever ago about this, and while I had every expectation that it would be adapted with competency, I could not have expected that the scene would receive the dedication of an entire episode. The intensity and purity with which SHAFT brought out this exchange between Koyomi and Karen is something sure to cause eruptions across the audience and in the viewers minds. As far as I'm concerned, widespread, collective events like these which bring the viewers together are the meaning of entertainment, and I will eagerly look forward to seeing the explosive reactions to this episode translate into sales and profit.


Of course, in the end I do still also want to place the events of this episode into context as part of the greater narrative of this series. The Bakemonogatari series might occasionally divert into fanservice, but it does not mindlessly do so, at the cost of the integrity of its characters; and neither is the purpose of the narrative primarily to be a vehicle for these diversions into fanservice. There are questions of characterization we can raise from this scene, some of which I know were explicitly detailed in the light novel scripts, which certainly have the potential to enrich our understanding of the preceding events and featured characters as well as glean insight into the future.

The principle characterization questions I'm presently looking at are:

- How did Koyomi decide to engage in this toothbrush game with Karen-chan? We are (fleetingly) made to understand that the original concept/proposal arose from Kanbaru, who is either Araragi's teacher or student in the art of pervertedness. When did this idea get passed onto Koyomi, and what was the trigger for him deciding to make Karen the subject of it?
- What was the origin of Karen's curiosity towards Kanbaru, and what is her true intention in interacting with her? In particular we are suggested two possible motives for Karen's incursion upon her Nii-chan: one, to flirt with him, in her new improvised style of dress borrowed from the wardrobe of Tsukihi; and two, to put forth this genuine request to be introduced to Kanbaru Suruga. I want to know to what extent each of these objectives motivated Karen's entreaties towards Koyomi at the beginning.
- As an offshoot of the above topic, it seems to me that Karen is by present away and fully comfortable with an attraction/romantic love within herself towards Koyomi. I feel it is probably safe to say that this first awoke with Koyomi's unexplained kiss back during the Wreathe-Flame Bee incident, and that it crystallized in the aftermath of her role in the story when Koyomi said he'd take care of things. However, what I am curious to know is about any nuances in relationship Karen had towards Koyomi even before that kissing incident, as well as, at this present moment, Karen's actual thoughts towards her own feelings (i.e., now that she and Koyomi have gotten this close, does she actually intend to go anywhere with it).
- Finally, I am also interested in Koyomi's relationship with Hitagi herself. We already had him explicitly bring up a comparison with Tsubasa as an ideal "specimen"; how does Araragi understand his own attraction towards and indulgence in it towards Karen in light of his relationship with Hitagi? I myself don't particularly feel like Araragi has cheated, at least within the context of the boundaries which were set for him (i.e. playing around is okay, but don't fall in love), but I wonder what Koyomi is thinking/has rationalized about these events from his own perspective.

edit:

I just wanted to add, that Tsukihi's opening was indeed extremely wonderful and has jumped straight up my list to stand by Renai Circulation as one of this series' best openings.
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Old 2012-02-26, 01:42   Link #122
Nihokon
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Instant 10/10 because of dat toothbrushing scene.
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Old 2012-02-26, 01:55   Link #123
Hiro Hayase
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10/1o from me. The opening theme song is stuck in my head... Gahhh! The Monogatari series are truly an excellent form of art, especially in the anime. That toothbrushing scene...I felt embarrassed just watching it lol, but I actually wanted Shinobu to interfere instead of the smaller little sister. Or at least say something to Araragi while he's in ecstasy while toothbrushing his bigger little sister.
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Old 2012-02-26, 02:02   Link #124
risingstar3110
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Loved the new opening and bgm! But the toothbrush scene made me quite uncomfortable. I did laugh a little, sort of forced though... Maybe because I'm a girl? XD;; Then again incestuous hints in any anime has never been my thing.
Just like guys probably feel very uncomfortable seeing a guy moaning when getting toothbrush-ed. I expect you are not gonna feel the same as us. But trust me, it's not the incestuous hint which turned you off. If you are born as a guy, you would have screamed "Fabulous" at the screen. It's just guys' thing


For all complaint and such, we all have to admit that in the sense of erotic material, this episode is by miles better than anything pornographic industry dream to produce. The using of incestuous suggest and dominance play, while maintain fairly innocent (not too much sexual arousing), is simply erotic and satisfied to watch. It's an erotic masterpiece in itself, and i guess the poll this episode shows that...

Away from that screen, considering the way Karen and Koyomi interacted with each other, it's simply amazing for me that they did not cross the line(seems very close this episode through, before Tsukihi intruded). And i say that having a really close imouto myself. They are simply way too close being siblings that the line between family members and incestuous partners were too thin to cross. But then it's just fiction, so anything is possible

I don't understand why Koyomi be hesitant to introduce Karen to Kanbaru through. Because while Kanbaru is a closet pervert, and love dirty joke (and a lesbian or bisexual on top of that). It's not like she plays around with girls (despite her popular) and impose her perverseness onto others. I think Kanbaru was in fact a really worthy friend to have, who can act mature when being serious, and probably can be entrusted when comparing to the two other alternatives: Hitagi (simply can't be friendly enough) and Tsubasa (too manipulative). She showed great care toward Nadeko and Shinobu also

PS: Tsukihi's OP is in content for the best OP of this Monogataries series
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Old 2012-02-26, 02:10   Link #125
Kaioshin Sama
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Originally Posted by risingstar3110 View Post

For all complaint and such, we all have to admit that in the sense of erotic material, this episode is by miles better than anything pornographic industry dream to produce.s
This just seems like a rather dubious achievement to me.

Quote:
I've made an exception in making this the first Nisemonogatari episode I've voted on myself. That vote being a 10. You should probably understand that what so many viewers/posters here are celebrating is moreso the spectacle of the event--the opportunity to be moved together and moved powerfully by a portrayal so outrageous/extraordinary it's rarely seen.
Really? Cause on this forum it seems like it happens every month or so. But in other words what you are saying is that the ratings are completely meaningless from any sort of critical standpoint, which is basically what I had been trying to point out since my very first post. We've ultimately come to the same conclusion albeit through different perspectives, which means this conversation has been pretty interesting in my estimation....but I'm not sure the mods will agree since yet again a post I've made has turned into a chain of them. I'll probably opt to duck out of this current tangent now. Anybody who wants to continue just shoot me a PM or VM and I'll be more than happy to chat.

Last edited by Kaioshin Sama; 2012-02-26 at 02:21.
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Old 2012-02-26, 02:21   Link #126
Aragaki
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Originally Posted by risingstar3110 View Post
Just like guys probably feel very uncomfortable seeing a guy moaning when getting toothbrush-ed. I expect you are not gonna feel the same as us. But trust me, it's not the incestuous hint which turned you off. If you are born as a guy, you would have screamed "Fabulous" at the screen. It's just guys' thing
True, if it was any other character I still would have felt uncomfortable with the scene. Except maybe Hitagi. But that's my bias showing. XD
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Old 2012-02-26, 02:30   Link #127
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Toothbrush scene aside, there are a lot to look forward next week.
What caught my attention in the new OP is Tsukihi sitting inside Koyomi's mouth. Is this some kind of foreshadowing?
Karen called Kanbaru Sensei, I wonder why she's so desperate to become her student. I'm curious as to what she want to learn for her.
Tsukihi going for the kill just because she finds her older brother and sister getting intimate? I sense a strong brocon vibes from her. She needs to learn how to share.
Nisiosin should consider writting book title "999 Creative Ways of Kinky Foreplay 100% Guarantee to Make Your Sex Life More Colorful" to advice couples who are tired of dull ways of having Sex. I would definitely buy that.
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Old 2012-02-26, 02:34   Link #128
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Yea, so like this show is about the growth of characters after going past their ordeals and so they'd change their lives for the better. Karen, being typically a tomboy, decides to try something else in order to surprise araragi, and we wonder how the events of the previous arc have influenced her, and so they engage in some rather interesting teasing.

And that's where the episode went into the shitter. Karen's kinda hot in some angles, but talk about looking into a gag for so long. I've never seen a scene where a phallic object was shoved into an attractive girl's mouth for so long that was so boring to the point where I was like meh, you guys can stop now.

Just really bleh humor and stretching a funny thing for a long time a good episode doesn't make. And of course Shaft fanservice is hit and miss. They're not exactly known for their nice animation and art ya know.

It also confirms to me that Shinbo or maybe who's writing is a foot fetishist. That's pretty cool and all and gets a +2. 3/10
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Old 2012-02-26, 02:46   Link #129
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As my title says, I am the designated facepalmer. And what is today's count for this episode? 5 facepalms and 2 facedesks...

For the love of god someone please call Chris Hansen!

Though for what its worth, Tsukihi may kill them both for this, AND SHE SHOULD.

1/10
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Old 2012-02-26, 02:52   Link #130
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The first time I didn't care (didn't even remember!) even though there isn't a single scene of Hitagi in this episode
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Old 2012-02-26, 03:05   Link #131
teja208
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I'm not into fanservice, but I'm impress with how this show manages to have such interesting characters and dynamics than other shows. Comparing Koyomi with other male lead for example, he gets into kinky situations like these because he knows how to be a pervert at the right moment. Average harem leads are mostly insensitive to girls' feelings and says all the wrong things at the wrong moments which result in them getting Megaton Punch or something similar. Koyomi on the other hand, can actually hold proper conversation with girls because he said all the right things. He is more understanding than many other harem leads.

Last edited by Klashikari; 2012-02-26 at 04:28. Reason: unecessary tidbit
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Old 2012-02-26, 03:12   Link #132
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lmao what the hell did i just watch. This almost makes me want to question life itself. Dat toothbrush scene I will not be able to get that out of my head for while. Damn you Shinbou/Shaft.lol.
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Last edited by Chase; 2012-02-26 at 03:34.
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Old 2012-02-26, 03:13   Link #133
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Shinbo~san !!! You are doing it right !!!
Arrrrgggghhhh...

Catchy OP...
That toothbrush scene...

Instant 10 points from me...


Now where is my lil sister when i need her?? Oh wait, i dont have one...
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Old 2012-02-26, 03:42   Link #134
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This has got to be the most terrible episode of anime I've seen in 2012.

Nisio is prone to some over indulgence at times, especially concerning the monogatari franchise, but he is more like a linear function compared to the exponential function that is Shinbo when it comes to indulgence. What a pretentious fuck he can be at times, I swear.

This is why I'll never call Shinbo a great director and he'll always be hit or miss. He gets an opportunity to unleash himself and overwhelm the entire story and you be damn sure he'll take it. Who cares if the pacing is like watching paint dry, we have to admire him for being such a genius right?

Everything from the music to the camera work just screamed "LOOK AT ME." Sorry, but if you want my attention, don't scream it in my face. This was the most unnatural interaction of characters you'll ever see. They stopped functioning as people, they were just devices for the obscene. Yeah Shinbo, you sure got my attention, but there is a difference between postive and negative attention you know? You seem like someone who goes hysterical at the dinner table ffs.

Sorry, this man is not being clever.

As a side note I'll never understand the imouto fetish. It's not exhilarating, it's just stupid. I'm not really even that offended, I just fail to see how this is supposed to be a turn on. Brothers and sisters don't interact like this, nor is it desirable. Trying to sell this sort of pandering bull shit is laughable at best. Using Araragi's sisters for fetish fuel was a poor choice by Nisio. I can tolerate pandering to a degree, but not these laughable kinds of it.

The episode in general was just not very good even minus the tooth brush scene. This is supposedly the start of the second story and where did we even get? Oh yes, it took an entire fucking 20+ minutes to deliver the idea that Karen wants to see Kanbaru because she admires her. WOW. Are we serious? Practically 0 interesting/relevant character development this episode (Sorry sis/bro-con relations are boring and stupid), and absolutely no plot. This episode might as well have not existed.

Nisemonogatari's killer is its pacing. Bake always engaged in some indulgence at times, but the structure of the arcs always made sure they hurried it along and we got to the more meaty aspects of characterization. There was just a certain conciseness to it that lended itself to being more easily digestible. This is just plain choppy and disorganized.

This episode is garbage. I have lost hope in this season. 1/10
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Old 2012-02-26, 03:55   Link #135
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This is supposedly the start of the second story and where did we even get? Oh yes, it took an entire fucking 20+ minutes to deliver the idea that Karen wants to see Kanbaru because she admires her. WOW. Are we serious?
Haha you should read Andrew C's review of Nise 2, the end for this part of the story made him so mad he....

Quote:
I was so god damn angry I stopped reading for two days.
He pretty much ripped Nise 2 into pieces...

Quote:
Nisemonogatari 2: The Problem with Nisioisin

I was so happy to see these characters in action again that I cheerily overlooked a few niggling problems in the first Nisemonogatari. The second volume beats you in the face with them till you simply can't ignore them, and start making mental lists of all Nisioisin's greatest failings as a writer, virtually all of which are on display here. The only thing he doesn't do is explain the deductive process exhaustively.
And from than on it's spoiler territory... but it's consensus that this is the worst novel of the series and for the most part Kizu is the best, so it can only get better from this point on for people watching it as you are.
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Old 2012-02-26, 03:59   Link #136
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This episode is garbage. I have lost hope in this season. 1/10
I think this about summarizes the episode:

Kimochi Warui
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Old 2012-02-26, 04:07   Link #137
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This time I can't rate this episode. 50/50, I say... but it's like taking a huge drag from a bong and getting hit damn hard.

Oh, right now a lot of people are reading this thread. Wow.

*still reeling from disbelief*
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Old 2012-02-26, 04:26   Link #138
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Well, for a truly different perspective, I neither loved nor hated this episode.

I just found it kind of pointless and silly. But hey, nice to see that SHAFT now has incredible degrees of budget to burn, lol. There's not a toothpaste or toothbrush company around that wouldn't love to use this episode's toothbrush to promote their wares.

I might have more to write later, but I'll leave it at this for now.
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Old 2012-02-26, 04:28   Link #139
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is this the point of this series ? ... if so i should get out now... why not just watch / make hentai / porn

I am definitely not the target audience for this

Last edited by Klashikari; 2012-02-26 at 04:42. Reason: Unecessary comment removed
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Old 2012-02-26, 04:28   Link #140
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I think a paraphrasis from Black Hanekawa would state it better:

"If people grow accustomed with Art that's the end for Art. Art must be believed in, feared, dreaded, shunned, revered, honored, disliked, detested, prayed to -- that's why Art can exist"
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