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Old 2012-03-18, 05:32   Link #961
Anh_Minh
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Yeah, in the manga, they all managed to open the door in 20 days. Leorio even opened the second set of doors.
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Old 2012-03-18, 05:59   Link #962
vansonbee
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
Yeah, in the manga, they all managed to open the door in 20 days. Leorio even opened the second set of doors.
OMG, so the anime didn't take place in 20 days?

What wrong with a tiny time skip?
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Old 2012-03-18, 06:13   Link #963
Squarecrow
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As an anime first watcher to be honest that whole training thing did seem a bit weird. We weren't really told how long they were taking and in the end they couldn't even do it without all 3 of them. Seems a bit silly they would attempt to make it to the mansion when none of them could open the gate themself. They know the guard, just the freaking guard, could open 1 by himself. Killua opened 3. They should realize how strong the butlers and the rest of Killua's family must be and go train some more.

I did like it though. Gon's dedication to seeing his friend is heartwarming. Crazy, but heartwarming.
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Last edited by Squarecrow; 2012-03-18 at 11:00.
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Old 2012-03-18, 07:30   Link #964
Anh_Minh
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vansonbee View Post
OMG, so the anime didn't take place in 20 days?

What wrong with a tiny time skip?
We don't know how long it took in the anime. (BTW, in the manga, Gon's arm healed in 10 days.)
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Old 2012-03-18, 10:22   Link #965
Clarste
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A very strange choice to have them open the gate together.
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Old 2012-03-18, 10:45   Link #966
kakakka
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Originally Posted by Clarste View Post
A very strange choice to have them open the gate together.
I know, after what it seems to be half an episode dedicated on opening the gate.
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Old 2012-03-18, 11:24   Link #967
Toto y Moi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Squarecrow View Post
I did like it though. Gon's dedication to seeing his friend is heartwarming. Crazy, but heartwarming.
Yes.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Clarste View Post
A very strange choice to have them open the gate together.
Agreed, but oh well. no big deal. At least we got to see the Zoldyck grandmother's silhouette in this episode...she hasn't even appeared in the manga yet.

For those of you Hunters out there, you can now figure out the name of one of Killua's younger siblings. Try to crack the code.
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Old 2012-03-18, 11:33   Link #968
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^ Hey, what's you're opinion on Canary/Gon scene?
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Old 2012-03-18, 11:49   Link #969
Toto y Moi
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Sort of disappointed, but mostly because of Gon's face and some of the other artistry. Togashi does some really great things in the manga when he directed this scene. I loved the sequencing and the atypical art choices.



But it was still a decent episode. Canary was cute. I personally liked it better than the 1999 series' adaptation.
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Old 2012-03-18, 12:18   Link #970
leokiko
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So, again, this remake shows that this is indeed way less dark than the original. Seeing Gon with that bloodied face in the original had an great impact on me, as he got beaten down.

But regarding the adaptation of the original material, this is sticking way more to the manga. Which is very good news.
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Old 2012-03-18, 12:57   Link #971
Guardian Enzo
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Spoiler for Spoiler - maybe? Not sure.:

Last edited by Guardian Enzo; 2012-03-18 at 13:36.
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Old 2012-03-18, 13:12   Link #972
Clarste
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo View Post
Spoiler for Spoiler - maybe? Not sure.:
Not obvious at all. Not even in the manga, ever. There's like an artbook or some other side material that makes it explicit, but it's never mentioned in the series itself.

Last edited by monir; 2012-03-18 at 14:52.
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Old 2012-03-18, 13:23   Link #973
leokiko
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I read the manga and didn't know that
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Old 2012-03-18, 13:29   Link #974
ars89
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So they got past the testing gate. Liked how Killua had faith in Gon. So wee get to meet a little bit of the family this ep. Figured they would kill a servant if they went against their wishes. I'm thinking that message is a fake.
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Old 2012-03-18, 14:08   Link #975
ookamigirl
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So Gon & guys are slowly making progress... emphasis on slowly ^^"
The training house was kinda LOL
Killua's family is a bunch of psycho weirdos.
They made it in, but damn his mom is scary.
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Old 2012-03-18, 22:41   Link #976
Vena
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Small changes from the manga with the gate aside, I was really digging the music in this episode. I was half expecting Bolero to start playing somewhere in all of that training.
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Old 2012-03-18, 23:03   Link #977
Daisuki-chan
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Originally Posted by Dengar View Post
Maybe you'll be more convincing if you're less cryptic about it.

"Kite gave him more than that"?

Like what exactly? What else did he do other than spill the beans about Gon's dad. Where else did he appear other than the first 10 minutes of the original anime?
He gave Gon a certain thing, and he helped Gon in an important way, and partly in doing that he gave Gon a picture (an appealing-to-Gon picture) of what being a certain something is or can be like, and thus became a sort of role model to him, and "[spilled] the beans about Gon's dad". Those things explain a lot better why Gon cares so much about him than some flashback later will, as it'll just be akin to a retcon in impact at that point (as in "Oh yeah, here's this new guy that happened to have been important to me (Gon) all along, and we did these things earlier, see!"). I think he got a big part in the first chapter (reread Kaito's nine pages in there if you've forgotten anything and want to know what I mean, I guess) on purpose, after all. YMMV, of course.

Regarding episode 23, there was a needless, pointless set of changes (them only opening the door all together) alongside there being too much time spent on the trivial (training montages, multiple failed cooperative attempts to open the door) while too little time was spent on important things (Canary; she sure cracked fast, and I didn't like the placement for her memories, which also just felt rushed, rather than a real, meaningful response to Gon's conviction, and that's underwhelming to me, no matter what arguments others may give). Looking at censoriferous trees instead of Gon being hit wasn't fun, either (I need to keep even a reasonable portion of the dying impact alive after seeing him take little damage), and he didn't even seem that damaged from that (this will have to be "fixed" later to avoid more problems), cheapening the impact of the part with Canary via cheapening the demonstrated depth of his conviction. This is the worst episode for me in a while...
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Old 2012-03-18, 23:50   Link #978
Toto y Moi
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For those of you new to the series, was anyone else surprised when Killua made his first appearance since the end of the Hunter Exam? I remember not expecting him to have been treated in such a cruel way. He's being flogged in his family's personal torture chamber...his life must have been terrible.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Daisuki-chan View Post
Those things explain a lot better why Gon cares so much about him than some flashback later will, as it'll just be akin to a retcon in impact at that point (as in "Oh yeah, here's this new guy that happened to have been important to me (Gon) all along, and we did these things earlier, see!"). I think he got a big part in the first chapter (reread Kaito's nine pages in there if you've forgotten anything and want to know what I mean, I guess) on purpose, after all. YMMV, of course.
But the thing is--Kite is just some character added in a flashback at first. After his first appearance in the manga, he's barely ever mentioned again. Maybe in a maximum of six lines of dialogue throughout the entire series. After a brief image in chapter six, readers don't see Kite again for almost 200 chapters later. Togashi took eight years to reintroduce him into the story; he's not essential to show in the narrative yet. But of course, I think that Madhouse has already shown that they fully intend to include him in their adaptation.
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Old 2012-03-19, 01:23   Link #979
Exophase
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Wasn't really that impressed with this episode. The changes from the manga were jarring and had some subtle impacts on the plot at large.

The first cut to Killua with Milluki, Kikyo (Killua's mother), and Kalluto was added and juxtaposed some parts from the second cut (that we saw the first part of). This makes that second cut really lose impact, because Kikyo suggests that Killua is predisposed or otherwise voluntarily choosing not to see Gon, which is then cut to showing him actually imprisoned against his will. At this point we now already know he's imprisoned. In the manga Kikyo calls Milluki and tells him about the intruders after she meets them - here it begs the question of why she'd even know. There's no reason why Gotou (the head butler) would have informed her that people are trying to enter. I'm pretty sure they'd avoid bothering Zoldycks with something this as of yet inconsequential.

The lines in this scene are also heavily changed - here Killua says that he has faith in Gon's ability to enter the mansion. Ironic considering that Gon is never actually able to do it alone (unlike in the manga). In the manga, when he's told of the news he only responds with a startled but fascinated look. Milluki then threatens to have the three killed, at which point Killua says he'll kill Milluki if he does that. This is really important in showing that Killua is only willingly subjecting himself to the torture and has little regard for much of his family. Of course they can still show it, but it's going to look out of place in the next episode.

I'm not really sure what Madhouse was thinking in making it necessary for all three to open the door together. Maybe they thought having them open it individually was too much for the characters at the time, but given it was established that Killua can open 3 I don't think this was too overblown. Moreover, the point that Leorio was the strongest physically of the three was completely lost, and this is supposed to come up in the plot later. The sense of time was completely lost too, along with it the sense of urgency given that Gon and company could only stay there for 1 month due to using a temporary visa - again, this is significant to the plot a few chapters later (Kaito is also supposed to be mentioned soon, it will of course be scrapped).

Maybe Madhouse changed this to strengthen a theme of unity among the three. Call me cynical, but I think they did it to cut time, because I think that's what they do when they're rushing to a more interesting part of the story. That, and to facilitate rebalancing the episode with montage shots that are cheap to animate. The 1999 anime added a lot of buildup vs the manga, but I felt that it did a lot more to show their growth. One other thing that really bothered me in this episode was how Gon just threw his sling off and was, like that, able to push full strength to budge a really heavy door. Arms don't heal that way. Even if you heal unnaturally quickly like Gon, you would still go through a rehabilitation process, or not be so stupid as to use the arm at full strength first thing after taking off a cast, when he has absolutely no idea how it'll be since he hasn't moved it since the injury. In the manga his healing and the training is skipped over, but the timeline is still referenced (with it being known that Gon's arm at least healed four days ago). The 1999 anime added a nice touch by showing him move to lighter splints (or at least, I remember it being this way, but I don't have the anime to check)

I also appreciated how it showed Kanaria taking far more to crack in the old anime. In the manga the fight didn't last particularly longer (although they did cut a line with Kanaria yelling at Leorio and Kurapika for not helping) but it was a lot more brutal and made it clear that Gon's face was all swollen up. This too is supposed to be a plot point very soon. Here it just looks like he's closing the eye, and it's going to look awkward if they go the same route. I really liked how the 1999 anime showed Gon (as well as Kurapika and Leorio) spending so much time on Kanaria. She was supposed to be a very stoic/mechanical character and a loyal servant on the surface (that was the entire point of Gon saying she isn't Mike), who only cracks after ridiculous lengths. Here it felt like she folded pretty quickly. They also pretty needlessly made it look like Kikyo killed her (going so far as to make it look like she was using a gun), which is going to look like a total fakeout soon..

The music was decent this episode, but I felt like it didn't really fit the scenes that great. But I've felt that about all the music direction. One thing that bothered me a lot more was Milluki's voice. If you're going to cast an adult woman to play an obese early-20s male at least try not to sound like an adult woman. What's worse is that her voice was almost identical to Kikyo's, which is especially jarring when they're shown replying to each other.
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Old 2012-03-19, 02:15   Link #980
Daisuki-chan
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Toto y Moi, I'll just PM you (by the way, you still haven't made your promised PM, so I advise all to just ignore her complaints with whatever that she said she'd PM me about in a post that's now well back from the very "top" of the thread) what I think about your repetitious focus on the ostensible equivalency of literal flashbacks, no matter the narrative style or timing, but suffice it to say for observers that she was just talking past me in her last post, which focused on things I already clarified myself deeply on, and also simply assuming that her interpretations trump mine (somehow). None of these things are relevant to me, and anyone else may feel about Kaito's absence as they wish, up to and including being ecstatic about it. But my feelings are still 100% legitimate (for myself, and consequently hers are 0% legitimate for me except in cases where they overlap), and her thoughts (from her perspective) are quite pointless as a "counter" when I already explained things quite well. There's really nothing more to explain about my feelings on Kaito's placement unless someone asks me specifically what I meant about something, rather than coming from some position that I'm just wrong (about an opinion and interpretations related to it; subjective things; ridiculous!), and looking at things differently is "superior" or "objective", or anything between those two.

Last edited by Daisuki-chan; 2012-03-19 at 02:23. Reason: Grammar
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