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Old 2012-04-19, 02:23   Link #61
Chaos2Frozen
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Originally Posted by Zuul View Post
Except it isn't even love. Just a crush.

Sorry if I favor a 24000 years old love over a schoolboy crush.
Are we talking about love or a bottle of red wine here? Seeing as how the only thing that your factoring seem to be the age...
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Old 2012-04-19, 02:46   Link #62
Zuul
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Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
Are we talking about love or a bottle of red wine here? Seeing as how the only thing that your factoring seem to be the age...
What about the intensity then.

They are not in love, that's why the Aquarion has never done anything crazy so far because of them (ditto Zen).

While Appollo/Sylvia could destroy planet with their burning passion.
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Old 2012-04-19, 02:55   Link #63
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Originally Posted by Zuul View Post
What about the intensity then.

They are not in love, that's why the Aquarion has never done anything crazy so far because of them (ditto Zen).

While Appollo/Sylvia could destroy planet with their burning passion.
Well Zessica was in love but it did nothing until she finally spit it out and her feelings are only one sided. It could be because it recognizes Amata and Mikono as Apollo and Silvia though that it doesn't go berserk.

Also I wouldn't exactly call what Mikono has for Kagura as being as passionate as Apollonius and Celiane (Apollo and Silvia never really showed that much passion until the end). Kagura is definitely passionate about Mikono but she isn't.
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Old 2012-04-19, 03:06   Link #64
Zuul
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Originally Posted by cyberdemon View Post
Well Zessica was in love but it did nothing until she finally spit it out and her feelings are only one sided. It could be because it recognizes Amata and Mikono as Apollo and Silvia though that it doesn't go berserk.

Also I wouldn't exactly call what Mikono has for Kagura as being as passionate as Apollonius and Celiane (Apollo and Silvia never really showed that much passion until the end). Kagura is definitely passionate about Mikono but she isn't.
Fudo who knows all think they are not in love. So I believe him.

They are not in love.

What do you even bring Kagura into this ?

The argument is about Amata and Mikono not being in love and the fact that it is (apparently) shitting all over the AppolloxSylvia pledge of love is not going to make it better. (Especially after those flashbacks)

I want to destroy the previous Aquarion final promise, it makes me so much rootable for. No !!!

Trolling writters at their best. Probably lolzing at the rage.
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Old 2012-04-19, 03:13   Link #65
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Originally Posted by Zuul View Post
Fudo who knows all think they are not in love. So I believe him.

They are not in love.

What do you even bring Kagura into this ?

The argument is about Amata and Mikono not being in love and the fact that it is (apparently) shitting all over the AppolloxSylvia pledge of love is not going to make it better. (Especially after those flashbacks)

I want to destroy the previous Aquarion final promise, it makes me so much rootable for. No !!!

Trolling writters at their best. Probably lolzing at the rage.
Fudo has gone the extra length to keep them from going over the line. He knows full well that they could go over it with the slightest push when compared to all the others. He's not exactly getting between Mix and Andy.

Also he specifically said also the the supposedly 24000 years "lovers" arent in love. He said it was a forbidden meeting which is wierd considering that Apollo and Silvia aren't forbidden anything and are just ill fated.
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Old 2012-04-19, 03:21   Link #66
Zuul
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Fudo has gone the extra length to keep them from going over the line. He knows full well that they could go over it with the slightest push.

Also he specifically said also the the supposedly 24000 years "lovers" arent in love.
extra length ?!!! : he just dug a hole. Once.

You're speaking of KaguraxMikono first meeting ? The "not in love line" was specifically concerning Mikono and Amata though. But it's irrelevant here.

Is that so difficult for you to admit that (apparently) going against AppolloxSylvia final promise is not going to contribute to make Amata's crush on Mikono looks better.
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Old 2012-04-19, 03:33   Link #67
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Originally Posted by Zuul View Post
extra length ?!!! : he just dug a hole. Once.

You're speaking of KaguraxMikono first meeting ? The "not in love line" was specifically concerning Mikono and Amata though. But it's irrelevant here.

Is that so difficult for you to admit that (apparently) going against AppolloxSylvia final promise is not going to contribute to make Amata's crush on Mikono looks better.
Actually it was talking about kagura and mikono and the reading the were giving off. When Mikono's band went off after meeting kagura the screen changed and Fudo had a grim face saying that what Mikono had wasn;t love and that it was instead a forbidden meeting between her and Kagura.

Actually it seems more like you having trouble grasping the subtle clues that kagura may not be who everyone thinks that he is. He seemed assured to be Apollo in Amata's eyes with that view of the past but what we know points elsewhere that he's probably a fake. His memories are of a movie. hardly convincing evidence that he is apollo and is more convincing that Mikage is feeding a memory to him to make him think he's Apollo.
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Old 2012-04-19, 03:40   Link #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cyberdemon View Post
He seemed assured to be Apollo in Amata's eyes but what we know points elsewhere that he's probably a fake.
If Kagura is Apollo... It proves one thing. Amata-kun!!! Defy destiny and fate! Take Mikono and save the world!
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Old 2012-04-19, 03:48   Link #69
cyberdemon
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If Kagura is Apollo... It proves one thing. Amata-kun!!! Defy destiny and fate! Take Mikono and save the world!
I agree with you but the anime seems to be proving it "true" to the characters but is disproving to the audience watching. Even if he is Apollo, I would be just like Amata. I wouldn't simply hand over the person I love to "fate" simply because of some promise that happened 12000 years ago. I'd fight for my love just like Amata. To give up simply because of some promise no one remembers and even more unsure if she would even be happy with the other guy would just be an insult to the name of love.
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Old 2012-04-19, 03:57   Link #70
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Yup, thinking of it, Amata has a reason for every possibilities.

Amata thinking*

Hmmm, if I'm Apollo, as a man, I should keep my promise!

but

hmmm, if I'm not Apollo, then I must stop Kagura (being Apollo) in his forbidden love for Mikono (being Sylvie) and destroying the world!

Nice, fight, fight, fight!!!
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Old 2012-04-19, 04:53   Link #71
kuromitsu
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Originally Posted by Zuul View Post
While Appollo/Sylvia could destroy planet with their burning passion.
No? Not at all? That was Apollonius and Celiane. Apollo and Silvia were nowhere near as passionate until the last five minutes of the last episode.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zuul View Post
I want to destroy the previous Aquarion final promise, it makes me so much rootable for. No !!!

Trolling writters at their best. Probably lolzing at the rage.
You do realize that you're the one raging here, right? In a way it's admirable how invested you are in a pairing that you haven't even seen happening. Or is it just that you're invested in KaguraxMikono? :P

Also, I see you cleverly sidestepped my question, so I ask again: if you're so invested in the omg 12000 years love then what will you do if it turns out that Amata is the reincarnation of Apollon?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
Are we talking about love or a bottle of red wine here? Seeing as how the only thing that your factoring seem to be the age...
If it's the question of age then Touma wins by a long shot, since he had loved Apollonius way before Celiane was even in the picture. Damn you Celiane, damn you Silvia!
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Old 2012-04-19, 05:12   Link #72
Zuul
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Originally Posted by cyberdemon View Post
Actually it was talking about kagura and mikono and the reading the were giving off. When Mikono's band went off after meeting kagura the screen changed and Fudo had a grim face saying that what Mikono had wasn;t love and that it was instead a forbidden meeting between her and Kagura.
The 'It's not love' line concerned Mikono feeling, the main concern at that moment was her falling for Amata and the line really shows she didn't.
(The encounter between Kagura and Mikono also had a forbidden lover tag.)
It's not love for Kagura either. My interpretation is that Mikono's love meter turning crazy, is not due to love but intense sexual arousal. She has the hot for Kagura obviously.

Quote:
Actually it seems more like you having trouble grasping the subtle clues that kagura may not be who everyone thinks that he is. He seemed assured to be Apollo in Amata's eyes with that view of the past but what we know points elsewhere that he's probably a fake. His memories are of a movie. hardly convincing evidence that he is apollo and is more convincing that Mikage is feeding a memory to him to make him think he's Apollo.
You say I shouldn't be pissed because some very hypothetical troll with absolutelly no ground so far could be coming.

What the story tells me so far is that Kagura is Appollo and that he sees his Sylvia in Mikono, and that Mikono has tha nostalgic feeling about him (not even counting the shared flashback). Mykage (who seems) to know a lot refers their realtionship as a 12000 years old love. As for the Aquarion tag, they are forbidden lovers. It's right in my face at the moment. They would have to come with extremelly convoluted shit to nullify it all.
Meanwhile Amata has no flashback, no nostalgic feel, no nothing and could just be a pair of wings. He's not Appollo reincarnation for as far as I'm concerned.

Meanwhile Amata has absolutelly no recollection or past life feelings, or any similarities to Appollo.



So we have an anime with lovers getting quite a crap ending, the only little positive thing is their promise of meeting again in 12000 years. The long awaited sequel comes and the authors are they are not going to be together at all, for the sake of the MC's crush on a girl he isn't even in love yet or even dating (mwahhahahaha.Yup . savor your troll.)

At the moment it feels real bad.

Hopefully they are going to eventually to fix it, one way or another.
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Old 2012-04-19, 05:38   Link #73
kuromitsu
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Originally Posted by Zuul View Post
Meanwhile Amata has no flashback, no nostalgic feel, no nothing and could just be a pair of wings. He's not Appollo reincarnation for as far as I'm concerned.
sorry but LOL
Apollo had no recollection or nostalgia or even any feelings about his past life. He saw Apollonius in Aquarion and had no idea who he was, thought he was just some guy. He saw Touma and had no idea who Touma was, not even when Touma went out of his way to try and remind him. He saw Silvia and just saw Silvia even when she went on and on about how she's the reincarnation of Celiane. He had no idea what the Wings of the sun was. Apollonius' spirit had taken over his body a couple of times in Aquarion, and he had no idea what just happened. He didn't remember anything until he touched Apollonius' feather. And even after that he didn't give a flying fuck about his past life. Throughout the series his motivation was protecting his friends. Nothing about having passionate love with Silvia and fuck everything else.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zuul View Post
MC's crush on a girl he isn't even in love yet or even dating (mwahhahahaha.Yup . savor your troll.)
Putting your life on the line for someone =/= love!
Also, going on boat rides and walks together, hanging out together, eating lunch together, everyone thinking you're an item =/= dating!
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Old 2012-04-19, 05:52   Link #74
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Regardless of who the hell is who, we were shown a tragic (and touching) scene through the mugen punch. The point is, Amata showed absolutely no concern for Apollo's and Silvia's relationship, instead more concerned about 'defying fate' so that he may hook up with Mikono. My point? It's a selfish desire.

Yes, he sees Kagura as an obessed ax-crazy wolfman. But his line of thought was not "I must save the world and protect Mikono!"
It was "Oh gods I might not get the girl. BUT I MUST." (Again referring to episode 16)

Did it ever occur to him to try to try to get Kagura to their side? (Noted that he never got a good opportunity to reason with Kagura, with all the shit he puts them through whenever he shows up)
But no, he'd never even pondered why x was doing x.
The only thing on his mind was Mikono.

Triple R hit the nail on the head when he pointed out that Amata can be single minded to a fault. Few instances have ever pulled him out of Mikono mode.

His single-mindedness is his biggest flaw.

Not that I blame him. Lovestruck teens are hardly rational.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kuromitsu View Post
Also, going on boat rides and walks together, hanging out together, eating lunch together, everyone thinking you're an item =/= dating!
Actually it isn't. The couple has to acknowledge each other for it to even be considered dating.
There are plenty of relationships (Non-romantic ones) who hold hands but aren't dating you know?
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Old 2012-04-19, 06:28   Link #75
Chaos2Frozen
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Originally Posted by Zuul View Post
What about the intensity then.

They are not in love, that's why the Aquarion has never done anything crazy so far because of them (ditto Zen).

While Appollo/Sylvia could destroy planet with their burning passion.

Indeed that is very passionate, but you'll have to explain to me why a love that could hurt everybody is better than a love that has hurt nobody... (Well, at least not physically.)

As for using Aquarion as a love gauge... Lol, you do remember that the Aquarion is first and foremost a weapon to be utilized in times of an attack? I would think there is some kind of major problem if both Amata and Mikono would bring out the maximum output of their affection in the middle of a fight, let alone a real crisis


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Originally Posted by theflyingturkey View Post
The point is, Amata showed absolutely no concern for Apollo's and Silvia's relationship, instead more concerned about 'defying fate' so that he may hook up with Mikono. My point? It's a selfish desire.
Lol why ? That was 12000 years ago, do you care about somebody's relationship even 100 years ago ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by kuromitsu View Post
If it's the question of age then Touma wins by a long shot, since he had loved Apollonius way before Celiane was even in the picture. Damn you Celiane, damn you Silvia!
Erm, yeah sure... But... I'll leave the 'BL POWER!!!' in your capable hands...

Last edited by Chaos2Frozen; 2012-04-19 at 07:46.
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Old 2012-04-19, 06:32   Link #76
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Yeah, you guys are overacting way too much, in regards to the whole "defying fate" thing. Amata was shown simply wondering and thinking about it, not vowing anything, after the trip down memory lane.
It's best to wait for more development, before "raging", IMHO.
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Old 2012-04-19, 07:50   Link #77
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Lol why ? That was 12000 years ago, do you care about somebody's relationship even 100 years ago ?
Because Apollo and Silvia's love for each other is a driving plot point for the story?
If you include Apollonius and Celliene that's 24 000 years.

Last edited by theflyingturkey; 2012-04-19 at 08:07.
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Old 2012-04-19, 07:51   Link #78
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To try and move away from the pure shipping-derived character discussion, I'm curious what you think about the following two (imho, related) questions:

(1) Do you think there's *anything* Mikono could do that would change what Amata thinks of her? As in: there's stuff she could do -- and has done! -- that he'd rather she didn't, but he tends to assume she's still perfect...it's just that he doesn't fully understand her, yet. So, is there something she could do that'd leave him thinking "She's got some flaws after all..."?

(2) Do you think there's a limit to *how far* he'd go along with Mikono? EG: suppose she had had enough of Neo-Deava, just wanted to go back to her ordinary life, and asked him to quit with her. Would he go along? If not that, is there some other bridge-too-far?
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Old 2012-04-19, 08:06   Link #79
Chaos2Frozen
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Originally Posted by miketyson View Post
(1) Do you think there's *anything* Mikono could do that would change what Amata thinks of her? As in: there's stuff she could do -- and has done! -- that he'd rather she didn't, but he tends to assume she's still perfect...it's just that he doesn't fully understand her, yet. So, is there something she could do that'd leave him thinking "She's got some flaws after all..."?
Eh? Since when does he thinks she's perfect? I'm pretty sure Amata is more than familiar with her flaws and the things she can't do, otherwise he wouldn't be there to support her when she was feeling demotivated from not being able to get Andy and Mix to 'accept each other'.
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Old 2012-04-19, 08:22   Link #80
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Perfect is too strong, let me amend it by making a comparison with his mom.

Based on what we've seen, I doubt Amata's ever considered something like "You know, maybe my mom was just a bad woman (), and when she left she did it because she just didn't care?". Instead he seems to idealize his mom, and even if he's angry *at her* for abandoning him he thinks it's because of something about him (he wasn't good enough, there was something wrong with him, etc.).

I think his take on Mikono is similar: "perfect" is too strong, but when she does stuff he doesn't like he always seems to take it as "she must have a good reason for it that I can't see yet" and not "that's just one of her faults at work again". Would you agree with that revision?
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