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Old 2012-04-26, 03:32   Link #1001
Moe Connection
Basileus Basileōn
 
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PCheshire View Post
she's the most useless one there
I so f@#king agree. She even brings in trouble.Even though they said she's a good tactician, most of the time, they won due to individual initiative and simple team work. And most of the time, Claire just lets her emotions guide her actions, which leads to all kinds of stupid stunts.
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Old 2012-04-26, 04:16   Link #1002
dragon1412
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Originally Posted by darthfanta View Post
I so f@#king agree. She even brings in trouble.Even though they said she's a good tactician, most of the time, they won due to individual initiative and simple team work. And most of the time, Claire just lets her emotions guide her actions, which leads to all kinds of stupid stunts.
Its not most of the time, is all of the time, i dont even remember a single one of Claire fight that she actually use reason but rather going like a suicide maniac without caring for anything - justified with her being bully when she was young arent enough to cut it because if she was truly want to prove herself, she would rather do anything, ploting to win rather than charged in like a boar. Im not saying that she have to had a cool head to deal with anything, but her way of dealing with her problem is way too much like a child throwing a tantrum, even when she want power, she dont have any concrete way of doing it and just want to have a stronger spirit, compare to Kamito went through an insane time of trainning to reach that level(i.e: without spirit, hes plenty strong), Claire is more like a child say she want something without even knowing what is it.
But it seem that STnBD isnt going in ZnT and HnA direction , i still remeber the time when i first read this novel. After vol 1, a strong feeling of "Tsundere again, annoying one too" surge inside me but as the story goes by, she getting less and less focus and the story keep getting better.
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Old 2012-04-26, 05:04   Link #1003
Sylphic
KI NI NARIMASU!
 
 
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Ok here is the equivalent portion in Japanese.

カミトにはツンツンした態度をとっている彼女だが、その気になれば、名門民族の令嬢らしい振る舞いをするこ ともできる。頭の回転も早く、「カラミティ・クイーン」の妹として迫害されてきたせいか、したたかさもそな えているため、交渉には適任というわけだ。

In front of Kamito, she's always tsun tsun, but if she really feels like it, she can act like the noble she really is. She thinks quickly and is also very determined, perhaps due to being ostracized as the sister of the Calamity Queen. So, she is likely the most suited to negotiation.

Reading this, it sounds like Claire is great at negotiation, but not really. The actual important line here is the one that comes immediately before this section.

そんな二人に比べると、クレアはそつなくこなしてくれそうだ。

Compared to those two, Claire looks much more likely to be able to do it.

Claire is the most suited to negotiation, between Ellis, Rinslet, and Claire. This by no means means that Claire is actually good. She's just better than the other two because they are terrible.

I'm also a native Chinese speaker, but simplified characters are a little difficult for me to read. However, it seems like the Chinese passage and the Japanese passage are different in a subtle but important way.


虽然面对神人时总是一副盛气凌人的态度,不过要是有那个想法的话,表现得像一个名门大小姐也是 可以的。头脑 运转的速度很快,大概是因为身为<灾祸的精灵姬>的妹妹而受到迫害的缘故吧,也有圆滑的一面, 无疑很适合担 任交涉人选。

したたかさもそなえているため is translated to 也有圆滑的一面 in Chinese. This is CLEARLY a miss translation.

The Japanese reads literally "is equipped with determination". The Chinese reads "possesses a side of craftiness".

Excuse me, but, craftiness and determination are totally different. Furthermore, the Chinese passage makes no sense. She is anything BUT crafty. She is determined to the point of stupidity and confrontational.

无疑很适合担 任交涉人选 = without a doubt she is she is a excellent choice to negotiation with the enemy team.

交渉には適任というわけだ = it stands to reason that she is the best choice for negotiation.

The difference between the Chinese and the Japanese is that the Chinese implies that she is an absolute best choice with 无疑 = without a doubt.

The problem with this translation is that というわけ and 无疑 are not equivalents. 无疑 = without a doubt implying that Claire is an ABSOLUTE suitable candidate. というわけ = it stands to reason implying that WITHIN the group Claire is the most suitable candidate.

I apologize if I sound like an ass. I don't mean any offense darkfanta. I just want to set the record straight because people are unfairly criticizing the author for being inconsistent, when it really is the translation that is inconsistent. It's because of things like these that I stopped reading Chinese light novels and went and learned the source language. I'm no Japanese pro (well, I am trying to become a professional translator). However, I'm fairly confident when I say that the Chinese translations always seem accurate on first glance, but they break down entirely when you start actually relying on them to infer things. It's always almost as if the Japanese -> Chinese translator either is completely blind to subtext or he/she is just not that competent with Japanese to begin with.
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Last edited by Sylphic; 2012-04-26 at 07:07.
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Old 2012-04-26, 05:10   Link #1004
Impassive Harlequin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dragon1412 View Post
Its not most of the time, is all of the time, i dont even remember a single one of Claire fight that she actually use reason but rather going like a suicide maniac without caring for anything - justified with her being bully when she was young arent enough to cut it because if she was truly want to prove herself, she would rather do anything, ploting to win rather than charged in like a boar. Im not saying that she have to had a cool head to deal with anything, but her way of dealing with her problem is way too much like a child throwing a tantrum, even when she want power, she dont have any concrete way of doing it and just want to have a stronger spirit, compare to Kamito went through an insane time of trainning to reach that level(i.e: without spirit, hes plenty strong), Claire is more like a child say she want something without even knowing what is it.
But it seem that STnBD isnt going in ZnT and HnA direction , i still remeber the time when i first read this novel. After vol 1, a strong feeling of "Tsundere again, annoying one too" surge inside me but as the story goes by, she getting less and less focus and the story keep getting better.
Ah, so Claire's that bad.... well ever since Louise in Znt i've pretty much crossed any high level tsundere off the list so i'm fine with it

I wasn't expecting that the team wasn't any good though, but i'm guessing that its more of an issue on team work and role placement

First time i found a harem story where the guy's the carrier while the girls are the load...
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Old 2012-04-26, 05:11   Link #1005
Endscape
The Mage of Four Hearts
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Originally Posted by Impassive Harlequin View Post
Ah, so Claire's that bad, well ever since Louise in Znt, i've pretty much crossed any high level tsundere off the list

I wasn't expecting that the team wasn't any good though, but i'm guessing that its more of an issue on team work and role placement

First time i found a harem story where the guy's the carrier while the girls are the load...
I actually liked Louise more or less. I wonder if Claire really is as bad as everyone here says she is, though?
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Old 2012-04-26, 05:20   Link #1006
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Well her tsundere personality does bug you a lot in the first volume. But she gets less annoying as the volume goes.
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Old 2012-04-26, 05:23   Link #1007
Endscape
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Originally Posted by n0m@n View Post
Well her tsundere personality does bug you a lot in the first volume. But she gets less annoying as the volume goes.
I'll believe you then.
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Old 2012-04-26, 05:23   Link #1008
Sylphic
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Well her tsundere personality does bug you a lot in the first volume. But she gets less annoying as the volume goes.
That's because she shows up less :P. All the other girls cutting in on her time alone with Kamito where is the most tsun.
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Old 2012-04-26, 06:42   Link #1009
sandhy88
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Her role in later volume much like 'Boke' in comedian duo.

She always show up late when someone seduce Kamito and angry. Obviously the one that took her wrath is Kamito.

If you want the useless character, no one much useless than Carol.

When tea time, Bake a cake, Cooking, Cleaning, Laundry, all was Rinslet doing.

Because Rinslet always do it from chilhood, she now expert much Kamito surprise.

Rinslet also expert for survival in the forest and gathering ingredient.

Her role in team as a CHEF
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Old 2012-04-26, 06:47   Link #1010
Soji
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I'm glad to heard that we see less Claire. or and become less annoying. But to think that Kamito no at his top shape still so strong. Then again make sense why he was a his top 4 year ago and why still so strong.
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Old 2012-04-26, 06:47   Link #1011
n0m@n
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Ummmm........
Whats wrong with the guy called willieB......?
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Old 2012-04-26, 06:48   Link #1012
dragon1412
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Originally Posted by Sylphic View Post
That's because she shows up less :P. All the other girls cutting in on her time alone with Kamito where is the most tsun.
well but she actually do get less annoying( Ok, i'll admit that the change arent that much and mostly because she have less screen time).
Concerning matter of translation, my japanese teacher once said that japanese was using kanji which come from chinese and with the katakana and hiragana, chinese have an ancient tone than japanese and modern chinese have differ more than the current japanese thus the meaning sometimes vary a little when translate, well i dont know chinese so i cant exacly confirm but that what my teacher said to one of the guys using chinese board to learn kanji in my class(i hate kanji, btw)
@n0m@n: he is trying to get the xbox
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Old 2012-04-26, 06:51   Link #1013
Soji
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n0m@n @ Let's just say it's spam . Just don't mind the link..still i'm sure the mod will not happy about that.

dragon1412 @ Even a little it's already something good. Really in the first vol i don't know how many time I think *who she think she is* or something like this.
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Old 2012-04-26, 06:51   Link #1014
sandhy88
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Oh! about Kamito recover his skill, he said that he already more than half as strong as 3 years ago. So, about 60 - 80%.
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Old 2012-04-26, 06:58   Link #1015
Moe Connection
Basileus Basileōn
 
 
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Originally Posted by n0m@n View Post
Well her tsundere personality does bug you a lot in the first volume. But she gets less annoying as the volume goes.
That's becomes less important later on. Her interaction with Kamito declines significantly after the second volume.Unlike Aria or Louise, she becomes just one of the many girls, not THE main heroine. But she's still annoying.She still believes that Kamito is still her contract spirit.
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Old 2012-04-26, 07:12   Link #1016
Impassive Harlequin
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Originally Posted by sandhy88 View Post
Oh! about Kamito recover his skill, he said that he already more than half as strong as 3 years ago. So, about 60 - 80%.
Wait, his present strength is still only half of what it used to be? He must be insanely strong back then..... and Greyworth is supposed to be even more powerful....

I remember that someone said that it was volume 5 that showed his relationship with Restia, does that also cover some fights he had in the past?
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Old 2012-04-26, 07:18   Link #1017
Moe Connection
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Originally Posted by Impassive Harlequin View Post
Wait, his present strength is still only half of what it used to be? He must be insanely strong back then..... and Greyworth is supposed to be even more powerful....

I remember that someone said that it was volume 5 that showed his relationship with Restia, does that also cover some fights he had in the past?
No, they only mention his lifestyle in the past, but not the fights. The only fight they touch upon from the past was the 'battle' between Versalia and Ren Ashbell.
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Old 2012-04-26, 07:24   Link #1018
Impassive Harlequin
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Originally Posted by darthfanta View Post
No, they only mention his lifestyle in the past, but not the fights. The only fight they touch upon from the past was the 'battle' between Versalia and Ren Ashbell.
I see, i was hoping to see exactly how powerful he really was back then and also a few of his techniques and his battle style.... the 16 hit technique he did reminded of Kirito's dual sword skill strarburst stream, i honestly hope he does eventually dual wield
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Old 2012-04-26, 09:41   Link #1019
CNine
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decided to work on a little translation. Previously, I only gave a brief summary of the library scene.

Spoiler for "Library" Scene:
maybe this is the scene where ALL Gremory girl read and watch Ise porn collection.
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Old 2012-04-26, 09:45   Link #1020
Soji
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Originally Posted by Impassive Harlequin View Post
I see, i was hoping to see exactly how powerful he really was back then and also a few of his techniques and his battle style.... the 16 hit technique he did reminded of Kirito's dual sword skill strarburst stream, i honestly hope he does eventually dual wield
Honestly i more curios about his lifestyle hoping we find more about him and Restia. I mean she is more or less one of the key factor for kamito and why he become more human after the whole training there.

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maybe this is the scene where ALL Gremory girl read and watch Ise porn collection.
You sure don't have post in the wrong topic
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