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Old 2012-04-28, 10:26   Link #81
SaintessHeart
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PzIVf3 View Post
I love those guys for getting serious.



This is the chance for the Philippine to buy some airforce
http://www.ksl.com/?nid=148&sid=10551978
Are you kidding me? That thing looks more like a super-sized missile gunboat or LST from the picture! They are fighting frigates and GMDs here - how can you send a SUPPORT craft against an anti-ship destroyer?
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Old 2012-04-28, 10:43   Link #82
LeoXiao
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SaintessHeart View Post
Are you kidding me? That thing looks more like a super-sized missile gunboat or LST from the picture! They are fighting frigates and GMDs here - how can you send a SUPPORT craft against an anti-ship destroyer?
lol not to mention all the submarines they're up against.
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Old 2012-04-28, 10:53   Link #83
SaintessHeart
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lol not to mention all the submarines they're up against.
All they have to do is to send all the Jiangsu class frigates in the SSF against the Filipinos - enough ammunition to waste the entire navy.

Seriously, if they wanted to pit against the Chinese, they should have a defense pact with Vietnam, Malaysia, Indonesia, Singapore and Brunei, then buy more offense craft - even cheap missile gunboats with sonar tows and depth charge launchers will force China to reinforce the SSF and thus resulting in US reinforcements (provided that GOP still holds a good portion, close to 50%, of the Congress - they love war).

The size of the ships DOESN'T mean it will scare China, it is the amount of damage the ships can do to their navy.
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When three puppygirls named after pastries are on top of each other, it is called Eclair a'la menthe et Biscotti aux fraises avec beaucoup de Ricotta sur le dessus.
Most of all, you have to be disciplined and you have to save, even if you hate our current financial system. Because if you don't save, then you're guaranteed to end up with nothing.
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Old 2012-04-28, 12:04   Link #84
JokerD
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Maybe they can take a leaf from Iranian tactics and try fast cheap and lots of armed motor boat that can swarm larger boats.

The thing I seem to note about China maritime confrontations is that they are pretty aggressive, while the other side would be careful not to provoke and turn things into international incidents, the chinese vessels, from civilian (fishing etc) to military do not seem to have such concerns.

1 thing you do not want to do is to get into a arms race with China, unless you are sure you can out spend them to get better hardware (not likely)
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Old 2012-04-28, 12:11   Link #85
Ithekro
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It would depend on if the boats would function weill in the South China Sea. The Persian Gulf is a much more confined.
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Old 2012-04-28, 17:30   Link #86
PzIVf3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SaintessHeart View Post
Are you kidding me? That thing looks more like a super-sized missile gunboat or LST from the picture! They are fighting frigates and GMDs here - how can you send a SUPPORT craft against an anti-ship destroyer?
Dont worry Japan will give destroyer class to Phil. next year. Its desperate they need for a high speed naval class to match the intruder moaning around inside the territory like a playground.

http://www.interaksyon.com/article/3...s---dfa---FLEC

Last edited by PzIVf3; 2012-04-28 at 18:06.
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Old 2012-04-28, 17:47   Link #87
Sumeragi
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Originally Posted by LeoXiao View Post
lol not to mention all the submarines they're up against.
Which are looking to the east. PRC can't spare that much naval forces without being pushed around by Japan and ROK.
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Old 2012-04-28, 18:08   Link #88
LeoXiao
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Which are looking to the east. PRC can't spare that much naval forces without being pushed around by Japan and ROK.
China has 60 submarines. They can easily spare a few to make sort work of whatever the Southeasterners put to sea.

Plus if they are looking east what is the base on Hainan doing?
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Old 2012-04-28, 18:14   Link #89
Tom Bombadil
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Originally Posted by LeoXiao View Post
China has 60 submarines. They can easily spare a few to make sort work of whatever the Southeasterners put to sea.

Plus if they are looking east what is the base on Hainan doing?
Like guarding a certain province called Guangdong where a huge portion of the GDP are generated?
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Old 2012-04-28, 18:16   Link #90
Sumeragi
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Those 60 submarines include leaky SSKs that are useless against the Japanese and Korean subs and anti-sub fleet. PRC needs at least 2/3 of their entire navy concentrated in the East just to balance the two neighbors on conventional grounds.
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Old 2012-04-28, 18:24   Link #91
LeoXiao
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So if this Southeastasian problem does become a military incident, would Japan and the RoK be willing to risk a confrontation with the PLAN (even though the latter is pretty crappy), or would they stay out of it? Personally I don't really think that China diverting some SSKs to fight in the south would make much of a difference in the judgments of the Koreans and Japanese.
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Old 2012-04-28, 18:31   Link #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LeoXiao View Post
So if this Southeastasian problem does become a military incident, would Japan and the RoK be willing to risk a confrontation with the PLAN (even though the latter is pretty crappy), or would they stay out of it? Personally I don't really think that China diverting some SSKs to fight in the south would make much of a difference in the judgments of the Koreans and Japanese.
not without major US backing. And if the US steps into militarily with China it is WW3.
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Old 2012-04-28, 18:32   Link #93
Sumeragi
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Both countries are on relatively high alert because of DPRK (as usual) and the Sino-Russian live ammo exercise in the Yellow Sea that just ended. It's PRC that can't divert their resources, not the judgement of the two countries. Basically, PRC isn't in the position to move their subs without risking problems in the Yellow Sea (DPRK stuff) or the Socotra Rock situation (compounded by the new naval base being developed in Jeju, which would challenge PRC's power in the East China Sea).
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Old 2012-04-29, 01:32   Link #94
DonQuigleone
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Is there a Pacific/South East Asian equivalent of NATO? With China being the rising power, and it's neighbours being dependent on each other and the USA for defense against it, it would seem to be a good idea....
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Old 2012-04-29, 01:37   Link #95
SaintessHeart
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sumeragi View Post
Both countries are on relatively high alert because of DPRK (as usual) and the Sino-Russian live ammo exercise in the Yellow Sea that just ended. It's PRC that can't divert their resources, not the judgement of the two countries. Basically, PRC isn't in the position to move their subs without risking problems in the Yellow Sea (DPRK stuff) or the Socotra Rock situation (compounded by the new naval base being developed in Jeju, which would challenge PRC's power in the East China Sea).
I hazard-guess that Russia would meet the Yanks first even if the US was sailing up from Guadalcanal. Their expeditionary force have to past through the area near the Kuril Islands if they are going to engage the Chinese, and the Russians might engage or stall them enough for the fast assault craft (Frigates and Subs mostly) to threaten SEA.

The Chinese Navy in the area might be temporarily thinned to support the South. And we don't know how much long-range dispensable assets the Chinese have (missiles) to be able to put the 7th Fleet on temporary hold in the NorPac area.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JokerD View Post
Maybe they can take a leaf from Iranian tactics and try fast cheap and lots of armed motor boat that can swarm larger boats.

The thing I seem to note about China maritime confrontations is that they are pretty aggressive, while the other side would be careful not to provoke and turn things into international incidents, the chinese vessels, from civilian (fishing etc) to military do not seem to have such concerns.

1 thing you do not want to do is to get into a arms race with China, unless you are sure you can out spend them to get better hardware (not likely)
Naval capability, IMO, works like a scissors-paper-stone thing, in a manner of brown>green>blue cyclic style. China is still in green-water navy stage, transitioning into blue, so while small missile boats might make them laugh, it still can cause some serious damage for them to think twice before assaulting SEA.

And China is thinking of subverting us to their side. If they really send the Varyag through here to Changi naval base, count on the Malaysians to start reinforcing their SOF-QRF camp in Johor - we will be overrun by Special Forces instead of regular army troops.

LKY's speech about extra US forces in our area is to keep the other Muslim states from invading us due to our majority Chinese population AND friendly ties with China. The tie-ins with Zhejiang-SUTD and the CCC are to appease China from sending a threatening-scale military exchange here, alongside many other things (if you know what I mean). Wish China would just respect this area as a mostly NAL group of island-nations, so what if we are militarily friendly with the Yanks? Threatening us with the fact that "Singapore needs China more than China needs Singapore" is going to make everything worse.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DonQuigleone View Post
Is there a Pacific/South East Asian equivalent of NATO? With China being the rising power, and it's neighbours being dependent on each other and the USA for defense against it, it would seem to be a good idea.
5-PDA. And that only consist of Singapore and Malaysia as Asian countries and the 2 Southeast Commonwealth states (ANZAC) alongside the UK..
__________________

When three puppygirls named after pastries are on top of each other, it is called Eclair a'la menthe et Biscotti aux fraises avec beaucoup de Ricotta sur le dessus.
Most of all, you have to be disciplined and you have to save, even if you hate our current financial system. Because if you don't save, then you're guaranteed to end up with nothing.
SaintessHeart is online now  
Old 2012-04-29, 01:39   Link #96
Sumeragi
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The Southeast Asia Treaty Organization became extinct in 1977.



Quote:
Originally Posted by SaintessHeart View Post
I hazard-guess that Russia would meet the Yanks first even if the US was sailing up from Guadalcanal. Their expeditionary force have to past through the area near the Kuril Islands if they are going to engage the Chinese, and the Russians might engage or stall them enough for the fast assault craft (Frigates and Subs mostly) to threaten SEA.

The Chinese Navy in the area might be temporarily thinned to support the South. And we don't know how much long-range dispensable assets the Chinese have (missiles) to be able to put the 7th Fleet on temporary hold in the NorPac area.
Wait what? Not getting the situation you're talking about.

There are already enough troops and ships in Guam and the Northern Mariana for the US to support SEA.
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Old 2012-04-29, 01:42   Link #97
SaintessHeart
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Originally Posted by Sumeragi View Post
Nope. The Southeast Asia Treaty Organization became extinct in 1977.
My dear, you forgot about the ADIC.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sumeragi View Post
Wait what? Not getting the situation you're talking about.

There are already enough troops and ships in Guam and the Northern Mariana for the US to support SEA.
Really? I thought they only have a force in the area of Guam oriented towards defence.
__________________

When three puppygirls named after pastries are on top of each other, it is called Eclair a'la menthe et Biscotti aux fraises avec beaucoup de Ricotta sur le dessus.
Most of all, you have to be disciplined and you have to save, even if you hate our current financial system. Because if you don't save, then you're guaranteed to end up with nothing.
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Old 2012-04-29, 02:07   Link #98
Seitsuki
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Why has all the talk diverted to how best to beat us up? ;_; we haven't done anything wrong. yet
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Old 2012-04-29, 02:14   Link #99
SaintessHeart
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Why is all the talk about how best to beat us up? ;_; we haven't done anything wrong. yet
It is abit of China attempting to make SEA their uke because it perceives them to be US's bitch, and SEA is being defensive by asking their Big Bro (US) for help. Meanwhile there is a small ibternal animosity towards the Chinese in the area as other races perceive them to be pro-China, ad the Chinese population is being split into 3 camps : the Chinese brought up here who hate China FT, China FT who think that the Chinese here are Yankee dogs and/or unChinese, and a mix from both camps who wish that the other 2 would just disappear as they just want to live in peace.
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When three puppygirls named after pastries are on top of each other, it is called Eclair a'la menthe et Biscotti aux fraises avec beaucoup de Ricotta sur le dessus.
Most of all, you have to be disciplined and you have to save, even if you hate our current financial system. Because if you don't save, then you're guaranteed to end up with nothing.
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Old 2012-04-29, 02:15   Link #100
NoemiChan
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Its funny how China reacts overwhelmingly of the Phil-American military exercises while they practice missile launching with Russia as if its just normal. Yeah its normal....
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