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Old 2012-05-01, 12:56   Link #1101
DragoonKain3
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@Haak
In Taku's POV, it's Haru who is doing the 'backstabbing'. He's been hunting this person for a long time, and now his friend is getting in the way?

@Randrak
Backdooring Chiyu was underhanded for sure, and one I can't understand apart from maybe Taku thinking it's a harmless thing he installed in Chiyu. But all I care about right now is HaruXTaku friendship.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skane View Post
Regardless of said person's age, gender or what have you... this crosses the line of basic decency. If the person could fight back, no matter how disadvantaged, I could give it to you that it is somewhat "fair", but this person is incapacitated.
...
That Taku would even do this shows how far he has fallen. We can sympathise with his desperation, but not his current actions. He doesn't even have revenge as a valid motivation. If say, the former Red King was the assaulter, I could grant you some leeway in that he has some "validation" in smacking KYHime up, but Taku's current action cannot, and should not be defended.
You make it sound that being beaten in Brain Burst means death. If it does, then I can understand with your sentiments. But being beaten in Brain Burst just means you have lost the game and can never play it again.

Of course, if it was Taku who staged the accident then yeah, he's taking it way too extreme. But from what was shown so far, Taku only knew about the accident after Chiyu read the post, and KYH/Haru talked about its probably because enmity from Araya that caused the accident and not Cyan Pile's fault.

So is Taku an opportunist? Yeah, but it's not as if he's killing anyone by beating KYH in Brain Burst.


Quote:
Any decent human being would attempt to defend such a person.
I personally don't see a problem with Haru's actions.
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Old 2012-05-01, 13:09   Link #1102
Randrak42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DragoonKain3 View Post
You make it sound that being beaten in Brain Burst means death. If it does, then I can understand with your sentiments. But being beaten in Brain Burst just means you have lost the game and can never play it again.

Of course, if it was Taku who staged the accident then yeah, he's taking it way too extreme. But from what was shown so far, Taku only knew about the accident after Chiyu read the post, and KYH/Haru talked about its probably because enmity from Araya that caused the accident and not Cyan Pile's fault.

So is Taku an opportunist? Yeah, but it's not as if he's killing anyone by beating KYH in Brain Burst.
Maybe or maybe not. We don't know the consequences of even accelerating while comatose. KYH's condition is very grave and serious, any sort of pressure, be it psychological or physical could tip the balance to the worst possible outcome.
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Old 2012-05-01, 13:32   Link #1103
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DragoonKain3 View Post
You make it sound that being beaten in Brain Burst means death. If it does, then I can understand with your sentiments. But being beaten in Brain Burst just means you have lost the game and can never play it again.
In Kuroyukihime's case, it could be right now. She's barely holding on, and could go into shock at any moment. Do you think forcefully having to go into battle, get beaten around (if I recall, Haru said the pain felt relatively real), and possibly killed in-game, followed by forceful deletion of a core program, wouldn't cause one to go into shock when they were teetering?
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Old 2012-05-01, 13:33   Link #1104
Haak
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Randrak42 View Post
Mind you, Taku doesn't know Haru is a Burst Linker...
Really? I figured from the smirk he gave to Haru at the end that he kinda knew, though thinking about it I guess it doesn't necessarily suggest he knew...


Quote:
Originally Posted by DragoonKain3 View Post
@Haak
In Taku's POV, it's Haru who is doing the 'backstabbing'. He's been hunting this person for a long time, and now his friend is getting in the way?
That's not backstabbing. You can't back-stab a guy by simply getting in way of someone who's spying on your other friend and taking advantage of a girl you love that's currently comatose. Haru is confronting him on the issue, not backstabbing him. If Taku considers that backstabbing then he's not being particularly reasonable.
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Old 2012-05-01, 13:36   Link #1105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DragoonKain3 View Post
You make it sound that being beaten in Brain Burst means death. If it does, then I can understand with your sentiments. But being beaten in Brain Burst just means you have lost the game and can never play it again.

Of course, if it was Taku who staged the accident then yeah, he's taking it way too extreme. But from what was shown so far, Taku only knew about the accident after Chiyu read the post, and KYH/Haru talked about its probably because enmity from Araya that caused the accident and not Cyan Pile's fault.

So is Taku an opportunist? Yeah, but it's not as if he's killing anyone by beating KYH in Brain Burst.
You don't screw around with the kind of physical trauma she's suffered. Given that her condition is not considered stable, there is in fact a chance that he would kill her by attacking her right now.
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Old 2012-05-01, 13:38   Link #1106
Haak
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We don't really know though because we were never told. It sounds reasonable but at this point and until the next episode, we can reasonably assume nothing would happen.
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Old 2012-05-01, 13:46   Link #1107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Haak View Post
It sounds reasonable but at this point and until the next episode, we can reasonably assume nothing would happen.
I don't think we can reasonably assume any such thing. We don't know, which makes both assumptions equally valid. What I do know is that you don't freaking attack a girl while she's in the hospital in critical condition.
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Old 2012-05-01, 14:13   Link #1108
Haak
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Originally Posted by Random Wanderer View Post
I don't think we can reasonably assume any such thing. We don't know, which makes both assumptions equally valid. What I do know is that you don't freaking attack a girl while she's in the hospital in critical condition.
Generally when making a claim that something will happen then the burden of proof shifts to that side. And imo, simply making sense in real life is not actual proof since then people can Fanwank a whole load of stuff (You'd be amazed at some of the relationship psychology people can come up with to justify their favourite pairing in shipping wars). It has to be mentioned in the story or at least hinted at.
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Old 2012-05-01, 14:27   Link #1109
DragoonKain3
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What's the first thing that came to Haru's mind when he learned that KYH was still connected to the network?

"Physical Full Burst consumes 99% if the points. If someone attacks her here..."

Haru is more concerned about her exiting out of the brain burst world (since she lost 99% of her points, a loss is most certainly quitting Brain Burst altogether), than he is concerned at the physical welfare of KYH.

If KYH was really in danger of dying due to burst linking, he should've asked her to be disconnected from the network instead (after all, all they're doing is monitoring her brainwaves), or at least make it stand alone. And he could make up some reason for them doing so, like saying she has a certain condition or somesuch.

But his train of thought? It's not to protect KYH from dying, but protecting her from getting to zero points. As such, I see no reason as to why to think that KYH was in danger from dying to burst linking, when Haru himself isn't worried about it.
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Old 2012-05-01, 15:41   Link #1110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DragoonKain3 View Post
What's the first thing that came to Haru's mind when he learned that KYH was still connected to the network?

"Physical Full Burst consumes 99% if the points. If someone attacks her here..."

Haru is more concerned about her exiting out of the brain burst world (since she lost 99% of her points, a loss is most certainly quitting Brain Burst altogether), than he is concerned at the physical welfare of KYH.

If KYH was really in danger of dying due to burst linking, he should've asked her to be disconnected from the network instead (after all, all they're doing is monitoring her brainwaves), or at least make it stand alone. And he could make up some reason for them doing so, like saying she has a certain condition or somesuch.

But his train of thought? It's not to protect KYH from dying, but protecting her from getting to zero points. As such, I see no reason as to why to think that KYH was in danger from dying to burst linking, when Haru himself isn't worried about it.
I gathered this much as well. His mindset was only of her being attacked since she was still connected to the network and could be challenged. The doctor said the next few hours will be critical to her condition.

It could be the way it was said or the way it was translated but i felt 2 things when Haru stated "physical Full Burst consumes 99% if the points. If someone attacks her here" That if she was attacked and defeated that she would not be there to see him accomplish what she herself feels he is capable of doing. In order to reach that ultimate level and so to speak unlock the keys to the universe she still needs to be a Brain Burster. The other feeling i got was that if she loss while in the state she was in that could put her life in danger as well. Nothing was stated about the effects of Brain Bursting while in a near comatose state. If she was challenged, would she even be able to fight or would her avatar appear lifeless.

There are several reasons that could have led to Haru's current actions and thinking. But unless we are told his inner thoughts we wont know for sure. Im very interested in what physical state a person has to be in to use Brain Burst. Even if someone is in a Coma there brain is still functioning technically. Comatose patients can hear and feel people around them that has been proven. Is KYH the same and if they are monitoring her brain waves wouldn't the system pick up unusual brain activity coming from her since im sure Brain Burster's brain waves are in an excited state when they are playing.
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Old 2012-05-01, 15:55   Link #1111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sinestra View Post
Is KYH the same and if they are monitoring her brain waves wouldn't the system pick up unusual brain activity coming from her since im sure Brain Burster's brain waves are in an excited state when they are playing.
The hospital's system probably would pick it up... for about two seconds, max. As I understand it, the time limit for the duels is 30 minutes, which in accelerated mode is actually slightly less than two seconds. If being attacked does pose a danger to her life, the hospital's response will be far too slow to do anything to save her.

Anyway, I just watched through this series today. I had no interest in this show, but I saw a blogger's preview images of Kuroyukihime looking brutally hurt and broken, wearing an oxygen mask and lying on a bloodstained hospital gurney, and I had to see who would do something like that to a girl, and then I had to watch the rest of the series to establish context.

I don't know if I'll stick with it: this series does not exactly fit my tastes, but I'll need to watch at least one more episode to make sure that Hime is all right.
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Old 2012-05-01, 16:03   Link #1112
Anh_Minh
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DragoonKain3 View Post
What's the first thing that came to Haru's mind when he learned that KYH was still connected to the network?

"Physical Full Burst consumes 99% if the points. If someone attacks her here..."

Haru is more concerned about her exiting out of the brain burst world (since she lost 99% of her points, a loss is most certainly quitting Brain Burst altogether), than he is concerned at the physical welfare of KYH.

If KYH was really in danger of dying due to burst linking, he should've asked her to be disconnected from the network instead (after all, all they're doing is monitoring her brainwaves), or at least make it stand alone. And he could make up some reason for them doing so, like saying she has a certain condition or somesuch.

But his train of thought? It's not to protect KYH from dying, but protecting her from getting to zero points. As such, I see no reason as to why to think that KYH was in danger from dying to burst linking, when Haru himself isn't worried about it.
They're kids, not doctors. He probably just didn't think of it. That goes for Taku too, BTW.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Haak View Post
That's not backstabbing. You can't back-stab a guy by simply getting in way of someone who's spying on your other friend and taking advantage of a girl you love that's currently comatose. Haru is confronting him on the issue, not backstabbing him. If Taku considers that backstabbing then he's not being particularly reasonable.
When push came to shove, Haru picked a side, and it wasn't Taku's. That's all it is, and it also means he's not very well placed to appeal to friendship.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DragoonKain3 View Post

Of course, if it was Taku who staged the accident then yeah, he's taking it way too extreme. But from what was shown so far, Taku only knew about the accident after Chiyu read the post, and KYH/Haru talked about its probably because enmity from Araya that caused the accident and not Cyan Pile's fault.
He wouldn't. If she dies, the opportunity to win points off her dies with her.
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Old 2012-05-01, 16:10   Link #1113
zeniselv
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beign in a coma most likely make it very hard/imposible to use brain burst, since from what i know it means a part of the brain dont respond, and about kuroyukihime dying, i dont think thats the case, i think haru's concer is that if she loses brain burst, she will forget about him, and that what he is trying to protect.
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Old 2012-05-01, 16:15   Link #1114
Anh_Minh
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For all we know, being in a coma means it's not possible to challenge her (even if her name is in the list, if she can't accelerate maybe the system will refuse the duel)... It could be anything, really.
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Old 2012-05-01, 16:27   Link #1115
zeniselv
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Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
For all we know, being in a coma means it's not possible to challenge her (even if her name is in the list, if she can't accelerate maybe the system will refuse the duel)... It could be anything, really.
i dont think it would refuse the duel, she either would lose by default or not be able to move tha avatar.
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Old 2012-05-01, 16:32   Link #1116
Haak
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Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
When push came to shove, Haru picked a side, and it wasn't Taku's. That's all it is, and it also means he's not very well placed to appeal to friendship.
I wouldn't really consider it act of friendship to blindly go along with your friend no matter how dickish he becomes though...

If your friend was about to punch your girlfriend in the face what would you do?
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Old 2012-05-01, 16:43   Link #1117
Anh_Minh
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If my friend and gf were in some kind of competition, I wouldn't ask him to give up "out of friendship". I might choose to side with my gf and hinder his efforts, but I wouldn't claim some kind of moral high ground over it.
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Old 2012-05-01, 16:46   Link #1118
Random Wanderer
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Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
If my friend and gf were in some kind of competition, I wouldn't ask him to give up "out of friendship". I might choose to side with my gf and hinder his efforts, but I wouldn't claim some kind of moral high ground over it.
Until just now he didn't know his friend was involved, and he'd already promised Hime all his support. After she was just put in the hospital on the verge of death saving him, do you really expect him to just stand back and let someone, anyone just attack her while she's laying there fighting for her life?
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Old 2012-05-01, 16:57   Link #1119
Sinestra
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
For all we know, being in a coma means it's not possible to challenge her (even if her name is in the list, if she can't accelerate maybe the system will refuse the duel)... It could be anything, really.
This is what im wondering. You need to accelerate to enter the duel she is in a coma so she could not accelerate to accept the dual anyway. I guess we dont know enough about how the Brain Burst program actually interacts with the brain and nervous system.
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Old 2012-05-01, 16:58   Link #1120
Haak
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Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
If my friend and gf were in some kind of competition, I wouldn't ask him to give up "out of friendship". I might choose to side with my gf and hinder his efforts, but I wouldn't claim some kind of moral high ground over
So you wouldn't stop the punch then? That's essentially all Haru has actually done so far and I wouldn't call it backstabbing nor does it mean he can't appeal for his friendship. You seem to be talking about future events which is unrelated right now.
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