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Old 2012-05-18, 15:23   Link #21501
ganbaru
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China cries foul after U.S. sets tariffs on solar imports
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/...84H06O20120518
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Old 2012-05-18, 15:26   Link #21502
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ganbaru View Post
China cries foul after U.S. sets tariffs on solar imports
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/...84H06O20120518
if it was done 3 yrs ago, there might still be a solyndra
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Old 2012-05-18, 15:28   Link #21503
SaintessHeart
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ganbaru View Post
China cries foul after U.S. sets tariffs on solar imports
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/...84H06O20120518
They practically monopolise the market, and they cry foul?
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Old 2012-05-18, 15:37   Link #21504
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Originally Posted by SaintessHeart View Post
They practically monopolise the market, and they cry foul?
Everybody does.
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Old 2012-05-18, 15:50   Link #21505
synaesthetic
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kokukirin View Post
...because they want to push for tougher sanctions.
"Tougher sanctions" is GOP-chickenhawk code for "bomb the fuck out of."
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Old 2012-05-18, 17:51   Link #21506
Kokukirin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xagzan View Post
Well now, that's not quite was I was getting at. It's true, Dems do oppose Repubs on many occasions, but I swear half the time, it feels like they're in a mad dash to capitulate to whatever the GOP demands on policy, agreeing to abandon any issue in hopes that some pre-emptive "compromise" will make the GOP more likely to work with them. Hint: it does not.

And it's pretty much a one way street in recent years. But if someone has some examples of Republicans foregoing pieces of their platform on numerous occasions in order to try to "appease" the opposition, I'd be very curious to see. Although this might not be the thread for it...
Republican politicians are pressured by Tea Party to not compromise on anything. Many "moderate" (read: vote with Democrats 1 out of 100 times) Republicans are unseated by Tea Party favorites. There is nothing similar on the Democrats side. It still keeps a far broader spectrum ranging from far left to centrist. There is no denying that Republicans are far less compromising when they try to work out an agreement.

But that's really democracy at work. People that vote have a bigger say. Republicans turn to far right because they know the votes come from there during the primaries. They don't compromise because they will be voted out otherwise. They are just doing what their supporters want them to do.
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Old 2012-05-18, 18:28   Link #21507
mangamuscle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kokukirin View Post
Republican politicians are pressured by Tea Party to not compromise on anything. Many "moderate" (read: vote with Democrats 1 out of 100 times) Republicans are unseated by Tea Party favorites.
Lets suppose for a minute that this fantasy about tea party candidates overtaking most of the republican candidates in all districts in the USA was true. Then neither party would compromise anything saying their political agenda accepts no traitors, creating to legislative deadlock, which would produce economical stagnation. That would be the end result, no ifs ands or buts. The ugly truth no one wants to accept is that legislative compromising creates great countries, people nowadays are so polarized with the left/right they only see in black and white (and I do not mean 256 shades of gray monochrome, I mea black and white only).

Quote:
But that's really democracy at work.
That is akin to saying having a heart attack due to colesterol clogged arteries is the circulatory system at its best >_<

Quote:
People that vote have a bigger say. Republicans turn to far right because they know the votes come from there during the primaries. They don't compromise because they will be voted out otherwise. They are just doing what their supporters want them to do.
You have no idea how washington works, the will of the people is worthless since no candidate can be elected without the financial support of corporate america (big pharma, big oil, wall street, hollywood, etc.) so in the end it does not matter what party gets elected, they will vote for what their sponsors ask while playing the "political purity" card to anyone that is watching them.
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Old 2012-05-18, 21:07   Link #21508
Kokukirin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mangamuscle View Post
Lets suppose for a minute that this fantasy about tea party candidates overtaking most of the republican candidates in all districts in the USA was true. Then neither party would compromise anything saying their political agenda accepts no traitors, creating to legislative deadlock, which would produce economical stagnation. That would be the end result, no ifs ands or buts. The ugly truth no one wants to accept is that legislative compromising creates great countries, people nowadays are so polarized with the left/right they only see in black and white (and I do not mean 256 shades of gray monochrome, I mea black and white only).
How is it a fantasy when there are news of Republican politicians who represented district X for over 20 years getting unseated by Tea Party rookie at primaries? I did not claim that most were unseated - not all Republicans come from conservative districts. But certainly they are under immense pressure to lean further and further right to save themselves. Some who used to work with Democrats do not compromise any more because of that.

The two major parties could compromise before because the moderates in them were willing to work together. But with US politics polarised so badly, the moderates have all but disappeared, especially for Republicans who have Tea Party to deal with.

Quote:
That is akin to saying having a heart attack due to colesterol clogged arteries is the circulatory system at its best >_<
No, the point is democracy is not perfect. It does not have desired effect most of the time. But the fact that it appears to fail does not mean it is not a proper democracy. The votes still count. Politicians cannot just ignore their voters.

Quote:
You have no idea how washington works, the will of the people is worthless since no candidate can be elected without the financial support of corporate america (big pharma, big oil, wall street, hollywood, etc.) so in the end it does not matter what party gets elected, they will vote for what their sponsors ask while playing the "political purity" card to anyone that is watching them.
It seems the black and white analogy you used above apply quite well on you.

Yes, big corporations have a lot of influence in politics. They make up a significant part of donations (probably a larger percentage for Republicans). It is unfortunate that in the US corporations are people and donations are freedom of speech. But more campaign funding does not automatically win you a seat. It only gives an advantage in terms of more commercials and campaigning. In the end they still have to win the votes.

Also, the extremism in Republican party cannot be accounted for by corporate influences alone. The corporations don't like political deadlock much more than you do. Their goal is more profits. A hostile and unpredictable political environment creates uncertainties, and that's bad for business. In fact, the two parties still work together quite well when corporations are benefited.

So the politicians are really doing both. They happily do what corporations want. And at the same time they try to win the support of their voters. And with the current political climate, it is not a good time for a Republican candidate to compromise. That's why you saw a deadlock during the debt ceiling drama, and smooth passage of bills that benefit corporations but do not draw much voter attention.
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Old 2012-05-18, 21:40   Link #21509
Ridwan
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Hey, Turkey, we didn't want you to join when we would have given you money, but now you would have to pay us, we've reconsidered, buddy! Buddy? Where are you going?
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Old 2012-05-19, 04:02   Link #21510
ganbaru
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Obama, Hollande agree on much - but not Afghanistan
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/...84H17Y20120518
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Old 2012-05-19, 04:43   Link #21511
sneaker
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Where did that money paying thing come from? I've read the article, and nowhere does it bring that subject up. Instead it talks about new chances as a result of Sarkozy not being re-elected.

Oh, and Turkey already receives EU money. Around 2.3 Billion Euro in 2010 for example. (Couldn't find the 2011 figures.)
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Old 2012-05-19, 08:35   Link #21512
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ganbaru View Post
Obama, Hollande agree on much - but not Afghanistan
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/...84H17Y20120518
The comment section of that article gave me some nice laughs

I really did underestimate how popular the "Obama is a socialist" idea is.
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Old 2012-05-19, 08:38   Link #21513
mangamuscle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kokukirin View Post
How is it a fantasy when there are news of Republican politicians who represented district X for over 20 years getting unseated by Tea Party rookie at primaries?
It is a fantasy to think most republicans are in danger of losing their seats, the Tea's party influence is exagerated in the media.

Quote:
Some (republicans) who used to work with Democrats do not compromise any more because of that.
The sad part is that the climate is so politicaly polarized that people are voting for legislators that will simply seat in their bench and say no to anything that does not have the conservatire seal of approval and as I said before, is in the compromise that legislatures really help their country because no political party has the correct answers for everything.

Quote:
No, the point is democracy is not perfect. It does not have desired effect most of the time. But the fact that it appears to fail does not mean it is not a proper democracy. The votes still count. Politicians cannot just ignore their voters.
When you have a political systems that agrees to disagree you then must change to a parlamentary democracy where you must have a minimum level of agreement.

Quote:
Yes, big corporations have a lot of influence in politics. They make up a significant part of donations (probably a larger percentage for Republicans). It is unfortunate that in the US corporations are people and donations are freedom of speech. But more campaign funding does not automatically win you a seat. It only gives an advantage in terms of more commercials and campaigning. In the end they still have to win the votes.
Think about for a minute, BOTH candidates MUST get corporative sponsorship to attempto to win the race, NO candidate can expect to get elected witouth corporative sponsorship. So no matter who wins, in the end corporations will have their way, the only difference will be which corporations get which legislators.

Quote:
Also, the extremism in Republican party cannot be accounted for by corporate influences alone. The corporations don't like political deadlock much more than you do.
I do not think that when main street is doing badly big corporations also suffer. In a sense what they want is for everything to stay the sameso they can continue to profit as usual, so deadlock suits them just fine. Of course, small companies (those who provide most of jobs) do suffer, but they cannot afford to buy politicians.

Quote:
it is not a good time for a Republican candidate to compromise. That's why you saw a deadlock during the debt ceiling drama, and smooth passage of bills that benefit corporations but do not draw much voter attention.
It is sad that compromise has become a taboo word when that is what legislators are supposed to do -_- People do not realize that in the end they are being manupulated, that washington is "business as usual" even tough they think legislators are doing their best by opposing anything that comes from the opposite party,
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Old 2012-05-19, 08:49   Link #21514
Ridwan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sneaker View Post
Where did that money paying thing come from? I've read the article, and nowhere does it bring that subject up. Instead it talks about new chances as a result of Sarkozy not being re-elected.

Oh, and Turkey already receives EU money. Around 2.3 Billion Euro in 2010 for example. (Couldn't find the 2011 figures.)
Ionno. Why do they only do this after the recent bailing of Greece ?

Anyway, Turkey will likely refuse, if won't be blatantly. Inspite of their pro-EU rhetorics, they really have regarded joining EU as a lost cause, and already realize that joining EU to fulfill Kemalist craving for recognition of westen-ness will mean economic drain for paying all those retirees and all that, and will just stick to the current custom union.
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Old 2012-05-19, 09:08   Link #21515
sneaker
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I kinda doubt they will refuse. But whether they will be offered the chance to join in the first place is of course questionable. Especially the eastern European nations might object, fearing they might get less money from the EU and Greece doesn't like Turkey very much anyways. It would be up to the payers like Germany to put in more money if they wanted Turkey to join. 27 nations will have to agree.

But it's true that the public opinion in Turkey is not as pro EU as it was a few years ago. Many think that the EU needs Turkey more than the other way around, though I think that is a gross overestimation of their own power. It will be interesting to see how this will develop. It could happen if France and Germany support it (the politicians, not the people, who will not be asked). Even if they currently don't (or at least Germany), that could change very quickly.
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Old 2012-05-19, 10:25   Link #21516
Ithekro
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I would point out that a fair section of the voting public don't want Congress to pass any more laws. The thing the more they do the more messed up the country will get.
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Old 2012-05-19, 14:50   Link #21517
ganbaru
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Anti-NATO activists weighed Obama HQ attack
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/...84I09K20120519
Quote:
Three protesters arrested on terrorism-related charges ahead of the NATO-summit considered targeting U.S. President Barack Obama's re-election campaign headquarters and the home of Chicago Mayor Rahm Emanuel, according to court documents released on Saturday.
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Old 2012-05-19, 18:59   Link #21518
DonQuigleone
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Any thoughts on Faecbook's IPO?

Personally, I think it's way overvalued. 100 times it's yearly earnings! I don't see how Facebook can do much more to increase it's earnings, certainly not enough to merit it's valuation.

I foresee it falling hard.
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Old 2012-05-19, 19:07   Link #21519
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Originally Posted by DonQuigleone View Post
Any thoughts on Faecbook's IPO?

Personally, I think it's way overvalued. 100 times it's yearly earnings! I don't see how Facebook can do much more to increase it's earnings, certainly not enough to merit it's valuation.

I foresee it falling hard.
it can increase its earning substantially in the long term

but i agree, in the short it will fall.
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Old 2012-05-20, 01:49   Link #21520
MrTerrorist
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Well this is a surprise.

Facebook founder Mark Zuckerberg upgrades relationship status
Facebook founder Mark Zuckerberg has ended a hectic week which saw his company valued at 106bn after a stock market flotation by getting married.


Anyway, congratulations to Mark and Priscilla.
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