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View Poll Results: Hyouka - Episode 5 Rating
Perfect 10 32 40.51%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 20 25.32%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 14 17.72%
7 out of 10 : Good 10 12.66%
6 out of 10 : Average 2 2.53%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 1 1.27%
4 out of 10 : Poor 0 0%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 0 0%
Voters: 79. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2012-05-22, 11:57   Link #61
alarmadadna hadi
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Now I am a little fuzzy but can someone explain to me why Chitanda cried at her uncle's reply (and what was it exactly). I get the "I scream" part but I can't link the two together.
I believe he told her it means to be strong, otherwise a day will come when she won't even be able to scream as she will be alive outwardly, but dead inside. I imagine a grim and serious response from her beloved uncle would be understandably traumatic for her.
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Old 2012-05-22, 12:19   Link #62
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I have to agree with what a lot of people are saying on this thread: That was an excellent ending for a strong opening arc.

The characters are solid, this latest mystery was very good, and the visuals are superb. So when you add that all up it makes for a very high quality anime show.

The Hyouka = Ice Cream = "I Scream" pun message was pretty clever. The English pun alone is a bit lame, as Houtarou pointed out, but when you factor in how it was conveyed through a Japanese term and to other Japanese people, it makes for a nice little mystery and a neat way for Eru's Uncle to send a troubling message through time.

I will give KyoAni credit with Hyouka - It's now clear to me that this title is very well-suited to their strengths. Hyouka's characters/mysteries and KyoAni's overall visual style share an important strength - The ability to take something normal or just a little unusual and make it seem very dramatic and "larger than life". In this way, amongst a couple others, Hyouka is a good fit for KyoAni.

I echo what a few people said about Houtarou - It's good to see him already shifting a bit out of his "Gray" approach and hinting at a desire for a more "Rose-Colored" approach. I think a mistake that anime often makes with male leads that are designed to develop into more well-rounded and/or likable characters over time is that they're too slow in going about it, causing many viewers to lose patience with the male lead (and in some cases, no longer care once he does develop into a more well-rounded and/or likable character). So it's great to see Hyouka avoid this common pitfall.


I have one more point, and it borrows off of what Reckoner wrote in his review, so I'm quoting it here.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Reckoner View Post
I'm not really much for either of the girls in this show because one is just a grump while the other is just a spaz.
I'm assuming that you're calling Mayaka "a grump" since that description couldn't possibly fit Eru.

If so, I don't think she's a grump in general... but she is one to Houtarou. She constantly gives the guy a hard time, so I can see why somebody would think that she's just a grump. But her interactions with Eru seem friendly enough, and she doesn't seem to have any major issues with Satoshi. But yeah, she's really rough on Houtarou.

So much so that I think there has to be something more to it than her just not liking his "Gray" attitude. I'm inclined to think that she's holding a grudge against him for something specific. My current idea is that she once had a crush on him, but due to his "Gray" attitude he never picked up on her hints and he inadvertently spurned her advances ("Go play baseball with you on the weekend? Are you crazy? That doesn't conserve energy!" ), leaving her feeling very resentful towards him.

That's just pure speculation, of course - I haven't read the novels.
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Old 2012-05-22, 13:10   Link #63
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Triple_R But Mayaka has feelings for Satoshi. I also wonder why she's resentful towards Houtarou. Does she see him as a love rival or something?
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Old 2012-05-22, 13:18   Link #64
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Originally Posted by Lilith View Post
But Mayaka has feelings for Satoshi. I also wonder why she's resentful towards Houtarou. Does she see him as a love rival or something?
From the very start I saw Ibara as one of those slightly stubborn types who narks on Houtarou because she can. She isn't especially mean to him, and oftentimes she's even easygoing and complimentary to a fault. Personally, I think they've got a good history but nothing romantic. Well, unless she's THAT good at hiding it. xD
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Old 2012-05-22, 15:19   Link #65
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Well I called her a grump because yes, she is pretty rough with Houtarou. Furthermore, if we are led to believe she really does like Satoshi and not him, it's not her simply being tsundere. Maybe he really did do something to spurn her for some reason, who knows at this point, but I just thought that right now this sort of interaction isn't terribly entertaining to me.

I called Eru a spaz because she keeps jumping around in a really excited fashion with "I am interested!" Which is why she's the driving force of the show of course, but again, I don't find her interactions terribly entertaining as this comes off to me as an inferior alteration to Haruhi, and to some degree Houtarou is also an inferior alteration to Kyon.

In a sense this really is similar to the dynamics of Haruhi, but to me that anime is funnier, and more interesting because of the scope its plot (sci-fi related stuff). These latest episodes helped to differentiate itself a bit from Haruhi, which is good, but it must continue to do so else it will always be in its shadow.

I still would have preferred that KyoAni make more Haruhi, but alas .
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Old 2012-05-22, 16:04   Link #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reckoner View Post
Well I called her a grump because yes, she is pretty rough with Houtarou. Furthermore, if we are led to believe she really does like Satoshi and not him, it's not her simply being tsundere. Maybe he really did do something to spurn her for some reason, who knows at this point, but I just thought that right now this sort of interaction isn't terribly entertaining to me.

I called Eru a spaz because she keeps jumping around in a really excited fashion with "I am interested!" Which is why she's the driving force of the show of course, but again, I don't find her interactions terribly entertaining as this comes off to me as an inferior alteration to Haruhi, and to some degree Houtarou is also an inferior alteration to Kyon.

In a sense this really is similar to the dynamics of Haruhi, but to me that anime is funnier, and more interesting because of the scope its plot (sci-fi related stuff). These latest episodes helped to differentiate itself a bit from Haruhi, which is good, but it must continue to do so else it will always be in its shadow.

I still would have preferred that KyoAni make more Haruhi, but alas .
Actually yeah, those are some very good points. I may be in the minority here, but I find Ibara a more interesting character as opposed to Chitanda at the moment. To me it feels like the series played all of her cards early on, and now the only truly memorable thing about her is those damned glittery purple eyes.

Ibara and Houtarou on the other hand...I want to see what's going on between these two. Either way, next week's episode title is already pretty exciting, so I'm anticipating something great.
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Old 2012-05-22, 17:46   Link #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alarmadadna hadi View Post
I believe he told her it means to be strong, otherwise a day will come when she won't even be able to scream as she will be alive outwardly, but dead inside. I imagine a grim and serious response from her beloved uncle would be understandably traumatic for her.
Ahh, yes, now I get it. Slipped by me on the first watch.
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Old 2012-05-22, 20:06   Link #68
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Ibara sure is cute. Loved her little interactions with Satoshi. Crashing into him and elbowing him, .
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Old 2012-05-22, 23:02   Link #69
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The past two episodes really have been fantastic. Hoping they can keep this quality level up.
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Old 2012-05-23, 01:18   Link #70
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I always just read Mayaka's harsher treatment of Houtarou as jealousy. Satoshi spends a lot of time with Houtarou and seems to be really focused on him. While in comparison he ignores the fact that Mayaka has feelings for him. So not all that surprised about some resentment being directed at Houtarou though it's not his fault.
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Old 2012-05-23, 16:20   Link #71
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Originally Posted by FlareKnight View Post
I always just read Mayaka's harsher treatment of Houtarou as jealousy. Satoshi spends a lot of time with Houtarou and seems to be really focused on him. While in comparison he ignores the fact that Mayaka has feelings for him. So not all that surprised about some resentment being directed at Houtarou though it's not his fault.
But she speaks in a manner like "Oh, Houtarou's good for nothing, y'know?" and stuff like that, so I think there is something behind it all. No doubt that your explanation plays a part, but there's probably more to it.

Overall, I still don't think she's a grumpy character compared to characters from other series. She just feels like a tip into the negative scale, but overall a very bright and fun character. Look at how cheery she is with Chitanda; I can't call someone like that a grump.
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Old 2012-05-23, 16:29   Link #72
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Finally I can say that I've truly enjoied an episode of this serie. The mistery of the Chitanda uncle is now clear and a bit less "happy". Almost everything of this first arc is esplained, also the name Hyouka. It's quite difficult to follow for a non japanese why Hyouka = I - scream as far a I know the first kanji of Hyouka is the same of for "ice", but there are a lot of word based clue and trick in this anime. Maybe, the mail to Houtarou sister could be the link to the new arc, and a key of the whole story. This episode rise my hopes for a more enjoyable continuation ( at last enjoyable for me ^^)
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Old 2012-05-23, 17:32   Link #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lilith View Post
Triple_R But Mayaka has feelings for Satoshi. I also wonder why she's resentful towards Houtarou. Does she see him as a love rival or something?
Well, that's certainly an amusing way of thinking about it. It would be pretty funny if Mayaka considered Houtarou a love rival for Satoshi, lol.


I guess I just can't shake the feeling that there's more to Mayaka's bitterness towards Houtarou than what meets the eye. I suppose it could simply be all-around jealousy (including jealousy of Houtarou's intelligence, at least when it comes to solving mysteries very shrewdly and efficiently).

Still, I have to admit I'd rather it be something other than that. Something that could potentially be resolved (jealousy often isn't). Mayaka's bitterness towards Houtarou is interesting (in what it might point to), but I agree with Reckoner that it's not much fun to watch. It's already getting just a touch tiresome to me. I'm not even a huge Houtarou fan, and I find myself thinking 'Come on, Mayaka, cut the poor guy some slack already'.

I like Mayaka's character in general, and I like her character design, so I'd rather not come to view her as "a grump" myself.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Reckoner View Post
I called Eru a spaz because she keeps jumping around in a really excited fashion with "I am interested!" Which is why she's the driving force of the show of course, but again, I don't find her interactions terribly entertaining as this comes off to me as an inferior alteration to Haruhi, and to some degree Houtarou is also an inferior alteration to Kyon.

In a sense this really is similar to the dynamics of Haruhi, but to me that anime is funnier, and more interesting because of the scope its plot (sci-fi related stuff). These latest episodes helped to differentiate itself a bit from Haruhi, which is good, but it must continue to do so else it will always be in its shadow.

I still would have preferred that KyoAni make more Haruhi, but alas .
There's nothing I'd rather see KyoAni do than more Haruhi. And I do see what you're saying about "inferior alterations" (although Haruhi and Eru are different enough from each other that I don't directly compare them a lot in my own mind; Houtarou and Kyon are a lot alike though, imo).

But I think Hyouka is well-made enough, and has good enough content, that it deserves a fair try. Which means I take it on its own merits, and try to not think too much about "What could have been" in its place (as hard as that can be, of course).


Besides, it could be a lot worse. I genuinely like Hyouka a lot - more than I did Nichijou. So, from my vantage point, Hyouka is at least a step or two up from where KyoAni was a year ago this time.
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Old 2012-05-23, 19:35   Link #74
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I find it interesting that some of you feel Mayaka's contribution to the show "tiresome." I'm the opposite. While I'm still not sure about her role in the story, I think she rounded up the group quite nicely. If not for her, Houtarou will only get continuous praise and may be able to gross over some of his explanations. GMT mentioned in character thread that she is a skeptical foil for Houtarou at the moment.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
So much so that I think there has to be something more to it than her just not liking his "Gray" attitude. I'm inclined to think that she's holding a grudge against him for something specific. My current idea is that she once had a crush on him, but due to his "Gray" attitude he never picked up on her hints and he inadvertently spurned her advances ("Go play baseball with you on the weekend? Are you crazy? That doesn't conserve energy!" ), leaving her feeling very resentful towards him.
Interesting theory. Maybe it's just short of that. Something like, one time in their childhood, a usual flag-triggering event occurred (bullied, scary dog, asking for a favor, etc.) and Houtarou flat-out rejected the idea of even help her out. So instead of a romance flag he turned it into a hate flag instead.
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Old 2012-05-23, 21:00   Link #75
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I think Mayaka is annoyed by Houtarou for the same reason that some viewers are annoyed by him. She doesn't like his attitude about work. She herself works hard. She takes initiative. See how quickly she volunteered to help the teacher put away the books in the library. What she demands of herself, she expects of others. She expects people not to be late for appointments. (I think that might be a running gag throughout the whole series.)

Near the end of the episode, she is shown to have taken the initiative in laying out the pages for the anthology. She has designated Houtarou to write the main article. When he complains that it's too much work, Eru volunteers to help. Mayaka immediately stops her, saying that this should be Houtarou's contribution.

I think Mayaka equates industriousness with virtue. When she sees Houtarou apparently solving problems without too much effort, this confounds her value system, so she calls him weird. Also, keep in mind that of the four main characters, these two seem to have known each other the longest. They've known each other since grade school. So she's had a long time to build up resentment about what she sees as his slacker attitude. I'm not sure there's any deeper, hidden secret to this. Hyouka seems to be a show that presents the mysteries of everyday occurrences as having reasonable and not fantastic explanations, so until shown otherwise, I'm going to go with that.

Long term, I think we'll see that Mayaka's role is that of the manager and the enforcer. She'll make sure that each member does what he/she needs to do in order to get things done.

Last edited by Upscaled; 2012-05-23 at 21:16. Reason: added last paragraph.
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Old 2012-05-23, 21:26   Link #76
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Upscaled View Post
I think Mayaka is annoyed by Houtarou for the same reason that some viewers are annoyed by him. She doesn't like his attitude about work. She herself works hard. She takes initiative. See how quickly she volunteered to help the teacher put away the books in the library. What she demands of herself, she expects of others. She expects people not to be late for appointments. (I think that might be a running gag throughout the whole series.)

Near the end of the episode, she is shown to have taken the initiative in laying out the pages for the anthology. She has designated Houtarou to write the main article. When he complains that it's too much work, Eru volunteers to help. Mayaka immediately stops her, saying that this should be Houtarou's contribution.

I think Mayaka equates industriousness with virtue. When she sees Houtarou apparently solving problems without too much effort, this confounds her value system, so she calls him weird. Also, keep in mind that of the four main characters, these two seem to have known each other the longest. They've known each other since grade school. So she's had a long time to build up resentment about what she sees as his slacker attitude. I'm not sure there's any deeper, hidden secret to this. Hyouka seems to be a show that presents the mysteries of everyday occurrences as having reasonable and not fantastic explanations, so until shown otherwise, I'm going to go with that.

Long term, I think we'll see that Mayaka's role is that of the manager and the enforcer. She'll make sure that each member does what he/she needs to do in order to get things done.
That's quite a logical and plausible option. I'm still kind of hoping there's a little something more as well though, since it certainly would allow for some great characterization.
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Old 2012-05-24, 00:45   Link #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Upscaled View Post
*sniped*
Very good point indeed. Though I still find it a little too weak for the amount of resentment we see from her so far. Also, Houtarou is not a high-achiever by any standard. So while his lack of effort can rubbed her the wrong way, it's not like he has any result to be in conflict with the amount of effort he put in either. That shouldn't annoy her too much, not to the extend we see anyway, in my opinion.

In any case, this and Satoshi's "shocking pink" way of life are two things that will be very interesting when they get explored.
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Old 2012-05-24, 04:47   Link #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Upscaled View Post
I think Mayaka is annoyed by Houtarou for the same reason that some viewers are annoyed by him. She doesn't like his attitude about work. She herself works hard. She takes initiative. See how quickly she volunteered to help the teacher put away the books in the library. What she demands of herself, she expects of others. She expects people not to be late for appointments. (I think that might be a running gag throughout the whole series.)

Near the end of the episode, she is shown to have taken the initiative in laying out the pages for the anthology. She has designated Houtarou to write the main article. When he complains that it's too much work, Eru volunteers to help. Mayaka immediately stops her, saying that this should be Houtarou's contribution.

I think Mayaka equates industriousness with virtue. When she sees Houtarou apparently solving problems without too much effort, this confounds her value system, so she calls him weird. Also, keep in mind that of the four main characters, these two seem to have known each other the longest. They've known each other since grade school. So she's had a long time to build up resentment about what she sees as his slacker attitude. I'm not sure there's any deeper, hidden secret to this. Hyouka seems to be a show that presents the mysteries of everyday occurrences as having reasonable and not fantastic explanations, so until shown otherwise, I'm going to go with that.

Long term, I think we'll see that Mayaka's role is that of the manager and the enforcer. She'll make sure that each member does what he/she needs to do in order to get things done.
Nice point (like all the others have already pointed out)

Whenever I think of it, though, Mayaka calling Oreki wierd is actually more than that. I think the reason Mayaka is saying Oreki is wierd because he's lazy and supposed to be lazy... or dumb... but for some reason is as smart as hell. It's an implicit proclamation that Oreki wastes his brainpower.(a bit different from comfounding her value system, perhaps) She herself proclaimed that she's irritated (my intrep.) that Oreki can solve mysteries better than her because, being industrious, she doesn't want to lose... especially to someone like Oreki.
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Old 2012-05-24, 12:16   Link #79
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Lots of good points about Mayaka's surprising harshness toward Houtarou. I think she feels that his negativity and indolence draw Satoshi away from her, monopolizing his time. But I also think (hope) that we will see some flashback to a past incident that explains her jaundiced eye more clearly.

But the main thing for me is how totally bowled over I am by Kayano Ai's work as Mayaka's seiyuu. She won a "new seiyuu" award last year, and she could win a "best supporting seiyuu" award for this, in my opinion. She just conveys a personality so vividly. Kayano Ai (click to enlarge):



She's 24 and came to seiyuu work late. She first worked as a "relaxation therapist" in a spa. She used to come home from work late at night and watch anime, and was captivated by ARIA and began using her savings to pay for seiyuu school. Some of her previous roles are Milia in Last Exile Fam, Inori in Guilty Crown, and Menma in AnoHana. More info.
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Old 2012-05-25, 02:54   Link #80
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Episode 5:

Quote:
Originally Posted by rulfo View Post
Thanks for the link. Its always nice to know that the Japanese cartoon you watch makes allusions to 60s dystopian literature. There was that the niece of time thingy at the end of every episode as well. I'd imagine that not a lot of popular light novel authors today in Japan read literary classics, so this is a nice surprise.

- I liked that they didn't overdo Eru's crying at the end of the episode. She wasn't bawling nor inarticulate nor nose-running, which may had made the whole scene too dramatic.

- The scene at the end when Houtarou was talking to Eru on the way home was beautiful, especially that shot when Houtarou looked up at the sky. The dialogue between the two was believable and realistic in that both Eru and Houtarou concluded that they don't really know what they want to say at the end of all this. It was just a shared experience between the two and no words can aptly describe what they went through these past few episodes.

- I'll also agree that its really difficult to really appreciate parts of the mystery and how its visually presented without having an adequate knowledge of Japanese or at least Chinese. But this is a Japanese author writing for a Japanese audience, so I'll bet even a lot of the Japanese don't have all the Kanji wordplays figured out, so you guys weren't alone.

- Reading the synopsis on the website, it looks like the next two episodes are short mystery stories. So I guess the volume two arc will start from episode 8 onwards.
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