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Old 2012-06-22, 10:44   Link #1001
Dextro
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sol Falling View Post
"We should never do anything as silly as the anime industry's media franchises made for the sake of making media franchises."

Oh man. As if that wasn't the last nail in this adaptation's coffin.
I burst out laughing at that one as well. This episode was clearly the highlight of the season for those of us who actually enjoy Nisio I think. So much words!
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Old 2012-06-22, 17:18   Link #1002
ponyo
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Which manga chapters did they cover so far here.
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Old 2012-06-22, 17:45   Link #1003
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Originally Posted by ponyo View Post
Which manga chapters did they cover so far here.
Season finished with chapter 21.
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Old 2012-06-22, 21:53   Link #1004
Clarste
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Originally Posted by novalysis View Post
If the second season is 24, we would get two arcs I mean. Odds are though, it's going to be 13.
24 episodes wouldn't be enough. It'd have to end in the middle of an arc to do that, in which case I'd rather they just end at a good stopping place than make up an ending or cut stuff out.

Quote:
Originally Posted by thundrakkon View Post
The last episode was quite fun. It was a Medaka episode without Medaka. I understand that Medaka went SS3 last episode, but with the new characters introduced at the end, it looks like it really is turning into Dragonball Z. I didn't know that the school has so many Saiyans in it.
Did you miss all the stuff about Class 13? The Specials among the Specials, that Medaka is one of. Did you think she was sitting there alone in her classroom all day? Of course she has peers. Even Unzen said that she wasn't the strongest person he'd met.

...although personally I did think that Medaka sat alone in her classroom all day.
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Old 2012-06-22, 22:54   Link #1005
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sol Falling View Post
"We should never do anything as silly as the anime industry's media franchises made for the sake of making media franchises."
Yes, I thought that described this show perfectly. The whole thing was a bit too bland, the student council members were too boring, just too many antics from the perfect Medaka, and too much talking about Medaka instead of doing other things. I really wished we had gotten to know more about the people requesting help since most of them were interesting. As for antagonists, Nekomi would have been much more interesting than the Public Morals Committee. Those guys felt like they were just written into existence for the sake of having villains (how can such a powerful and prominent organization not be seen or mentioned at all beforehand?). Judging from what I've heard, the manga was on the verge of being canceled before being turned into a battle series, and if this show was faithful I can see why.

6.5/10. Not even close to being as compelling or interesting as Nisio Isin's other works.
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Old 2012-06-22, 22:59   Link #1006
Sol Falling
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clarste View Post
24 episodes wouldn't be enough. It'd have to end in the middle of an arc to do that, in which case I'd rather they just end at a good stopping place than make up an ending or cut stuff out.



Did you miss all the stuff about Class 13? The Specials among the Specials, that Medaka is one of. Did you think she was sitting there alone in her classroom all day? Of course she has peers. Even Unzen said that she wasn't the strongest person he'd met.

...although personally I did think that Medaka sat alone in her classroom all day.
Well, even if Medaka does have classmates, I think it was mentioned that actually attending school properly for Class 13 students is incredibly rare. So yeah, I think we actually can conclude that for the most part, Medaka spends her time alone during the classes.
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Seasonal enjoyment ratings:
HappinessCharge Precure 100/5 :: Stardust Crusaders 80/5 :: Mushishi S2 90/5 :: Akuma no Riddle: 15/5 :: Inugami-san to Nekoyama-san 24/5 :: GochiUsa 33/5 :: Soul Eater NOT! 18/5 :: Love Live! S2 80/5
Summer: Sailor Moon Crystal 20/5 :: Hanayamata 40/5 :: Locodol 24/5 :: Yama no Susume 32/5
God-tier yuri oneshot mangaka: Minase Ruruu
Yuri Precure otaku manga: Shinozaki-san ki wo ota shika ni
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Old 2012-06-23, 02:45   Link #1007
Sol Falling
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Quote:
Originally Posted by justsomeguy View Post
Yes, I thought that described this show perfectly. The whole thing was a bit too bland, the student council members were too boring, just too many antics from the perfect Medaka, and too much talking about Medaka instead of doing other things. I really wished we had gotten to know more about the people requesting help since most of them were interesting. As for antagonists, Nekomi would have been much more interesting than the Public Morals Committee. Those guys felt like they were just written into existence for the sake of having villains (how can such a powerful and prominent organization not be seen or mentioned at all beforehand?). Judging from what I've heard, the manga was on the verge of being canceled before being turned into a battle series, and if this show was faithful I can see why.

6.5/10. Not even close to being as compelling or interesting as Nisio Isin's other works.
Well, if you're a Nishio Ishin fan, I actually think Unzen should be the point in the story when you first become truly interested in this series. The first couple arcs of Medaka Box might come across as dull/cliche superficially (at least, they certainly did, to me), but the premises and characterization established through them do end up getting used throughout the remainder of the manga in an interesting manner.

Regarding the specific line which you quoted, the characters were commenting on creating "media franchises" (i.e. franchises which span across multiple mediums) for the sake of "creating media franchises"; the implication being for merely commercial purposes. Presumably, this stands in opposition to expanding works into other mediums after considering how or whether the original work might be genuinely suited to them. The implication is not at all that the original material (or even the adaptation, despite any circumstances) is devoid of merit; but rather that that value might well unfortunately be poorly communicated.

To put it in simpler terms: I hardly think it would be justified to interpret that Nishio is disparaging the fundamental merit of his own series. Rather, I would take that as an admission that as far as creative input went, this was a half-assed commercially-motivated adaptation.

Now to clarify some things:

As far as Unzen's Public Morals/Disciplinary Committee goes, it's not particularly prominent or powerful. The thing is, as an institution which emphasizes student autonomy, Hakoniwa Academy leaves virtually all aspects of student life up to various student committees; aside from Unzen's Disciplinary Committee there are also committees for Diet/Nutrition (i.e. domain of the cafeteria), Health/Medical (i.e. domain of the nurse's office), Library, Exercise, etc. The particular thing which made Unzen special was actually his individual designation--namely being a member of Class 13 (as mentioned), the elite of the elite within the academy (for as of yet unrevealed reasons) amongst whose ranks Medaka also numbers. As a committee alone, the rest of the Disciplinary Committee has no particularly extraordinary power or influence.

Medaka Box is as of yet the single Nishio work I've encountered which most directly addresses Nishio's constantly recurring theme of prodigies/geniuses (and particularly in the case of this series, how they relate with "normal" people). Staged in a school setting, with from the beginning an unusual emphasis on merit towards various academic/artistic/athletic sports or activities, Medaka Box addresses above all the question of the differences and distances between individuals. I don't think at all that the weakness of early Medaka Box is that Medaka is portrayed as "too perfect", or that there is a lack of focus on minor characters; rather, I think that the fault which truly lay with Nishio's introduction to this series (whether anime or manga) was that he took far too long to show that Medaka Box's exaggerated portrayal of various aspects of its characters or their abilities, rather than being included for some sort of comedy or "cool" action factor, are actually meant to meaningfully explore something serious.
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Seasonal enjoyment ratings:
HappinessCharge Precure 100/5 :: Stardust Crusaders 80/5 :: Mushishi S2 90/5 :: Akuma no Riddle: 15/5 :: Inugami-san to Nekoyama-san 24/5 :: GochiUsa 33/5 :: Soul Eater NOT! 18/5 :: Love Live! S2 80/5
Summer: Sailor Moon Crystal 20/5 :: Hanayamata 40/5 :: Locodol 24/5 :: Yama no Susume 32/5
God-tier yuri oneshot mangaka: Minase Ruruu
Yuri Precure otaku manga: Shinozaki-san ki wo ota shika ni
Awesome shoujo manga: Last Game

Last edited by Sol Falling; 2012-06-23 at 05:29.
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Old 2012-06-23, 04:00   Link #1008
Clarste
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Originally Posted by Sol Falling View Post
Well, even if Medaka does have classmates, I think it was mentioned that actually attending school properly for Class 13 students is incredibly rare. So yeah, I think we actually can conclude that for the most part, Medaka spends her time alone during the classes.
Specifically, there are only 2 people in Class 13 that attend classes, and they're in different grades. Unzen was mentioned as "the other one who attends school". I have to wonder if she has a teacher though...

Spoiler for manga:
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Old 2012-06-23, 10:37   Link #1009
klare
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eps 12 was ok, but it is just not the same with the absence of the 2 most interesting chars, Medaka and Shiranui

overall is a fine series, i feel the final arc is the best
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Old 2012-06-23, 12:42   Link #1010
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Originally Posted by Sol Falling View Post
Well, if you're a Nishio Ishin fan, I actually think Unzen should be the point in the story when you first become truly interested in this series.
No, I actually think that original premise of the student council going around helping people is a more interesting premise than generic high school battle anime #234. However, the students requesting help were themselves poorly developed, so that wasn't better at all.

Quote:
far as Unzen's Public Morals/Disciplinary Committee goes, it's not particularly prominent or powerful. The thing is, as an institution which emphasizes student autonomy, Hakoniwa Academy leaves virtually all aspects of student life up to various student committees; aside from Unzen's Disciplinary Committee there are also committees for Diet/Nutrition (i.e. domain of the cafeteria), Health/Medical (i.e. domain of the nurse's office), Library, Exercise, etc. The particular thing which made Unzen special was actually his individual designation--namely being a member of Class 13 (as mentioned), the elite of the elite within the academy (for as of yet unrevealed reasons) amongst whose ranks Medaka also numbers. As a committee alone, the rest of the Disciplinary Committee has no particularly extraordinary power or influence.
False. Considering that they enforce certain rules, and use violence to do so with impunity, they are hardly as weak as you're implying.

Quote:
Medaka Box is as of yet the single Nishio work I've encountered which most directly addresses Nishio's constantly recurring theme of prodigies/geniuses (and particularly in the case of this series, how they relate with "normal" people). Staged in a school setting, with from the beginning an unusual emphasis on merit towards various academic/artistic/athletic sports or activities, Medaka Box addresses above all the question of the differences and distances between individuals. I don't think at all that the weakness of early Medaka Box is that Medaka is portrayed as "too perfect", or that there is a lack of focus on minor characters; rather, I think that the fault which truly lay with Nishio's introduction to this series (whether anime or manga) was that he took far too long to show that Medaka Box's exaggerated portrayal of various aspects of its characters or their abilities, rather than being included for some sort of comedy or "cool" action factor, are actually meant to meaningfully explore something serious.
That premise went out the window once the battles began. If he's going to focus on the idea of special people interacting with normals, then he should put some more focus on the normal people instead of constantly introducing new characters with powers.
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Old 2012-06-23, 19:16   Link #1011
Sol Falling
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Originally Posted by justsomeguy View Post
No, I actually think that original premise of the student council going around helping people is a more interesting premise than generic high school battle anime #234. However, the students requesting help were themselves poorly developed, so that wasn't better at all.
Of course, you aren't anywhere qualified to actually make that judgement having seen nothing of the subsequent storyline. "Student council going around helping people" is itself a generic premise which has been frequently done before; what actually makes Medaka Box's treatment of it unique is a literary inquisition of those premises, including "why help people in the first place"--a question which cannot be meaningfully factored into the series without genuine conflict and opposing forces equal to Medaka.

Quote:
False. Considering that they enforce certain rules, and use violence to do so with impunity, they are hardly as weak as you're implying.
The disciplinary committee themselves are nothing special. I'll say it again, the significant aspect of Unzen is specifically his Class 13 status; the extraordinary extent of the damage/chaos he was able to instigate also comes down to that designation. The fact that the disciplinary committee are permitted to wield weapons is practically meaningless in the face of the kind of stuff that can be done by large portions of the student population. In the first place, before the disciplinary committee was even introduced, you saw delinquents wandering around the school themselves wielding weapons. Given that, again, Hakoniwa Academy is an institution emphasizing an unusual degree of student autonomy, it would be completely brainless to say that the moral enforcers of the school should be unpermitted to defend themselves.

Quote:
That premise went out the window once the battles began. If he's going to focus on the idea of special people interacting with normals, then he should put some more focus on the normal people instead of constantly introducing new characters with powers.
If Medaka was the only "special" person interacting with normal people, then you couldn't actually say that the story is about the relation between normal people and geniuses, could you? To have any meaningful development on Medaka's perspective as one who stands "above" others, she absolutely requires a foil/opposing perspective to extract alternative modes in those relationships. You talk about "constantly introducing new characters", but Unzen was the only remotely-on-Medaka's-level character introduced this season. If you accept the theme I presented as meaningful ("geniuses"/"prodigies", and how they relate with normal people) then it becomes clear throughout the season how "Medaka's" perspective is actually critically under-represented--she is a completely static character until Unzen is introduced to the story.

The fundamental advice essentially all manga readers pushed from the start of this adaptation has been "Don't judge the entire story by the content of the anime". What you have seen thus far amounts to less than 15% of the published material. I don't know why you seem so determined to push forward any sort of judgement at this point. Frankly, calling the remainder of Medaka Box a "generic battle anime" is complete tripe.
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Seasonal enjoyment ratings:
HappinessCharge Precure 100/5 :: Stardust Crusaders 80/5 :: Mushishi S2 90/5 :: Akuma no Riddle: 15/5 :: Inugami-san to Nekoyama-san 24/5 :: GochiUsa 33/5 :: Soul Eater NOT! 18/5 :: Love Live! S2 80/5
Summer: Sailor Moon Crystal 20/5 :: Hanayamata 40/5 :: Locodol 24/5 :: Yama no Susume 32/5
God-tier yuri oneshot mangaka: Minase Ruruu
Yuri Precure otaku manga: Shinozaki-san ki wo ota shika ni
Awesome shoujo manga: Last Game
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Old 2012-06-24, 01:42   Link #1012
jeroz
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Originally Posted by justsomeguy View Post
No, I actually think that original premise of the student council going around helping people is a more interesting premise than generic high school battle anime #234.
oh, it couldn't have been further away from the truth. You have seen nothing yet
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Old 2012-06-24, 03:02   Link #1013
Clarste
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Originally Posted by justsomeguy View Post
False. Considering that they enforce certain rules, and use violence to do so with impunity, they are hardly as weak as you're implying.
Think of the school as a city. The Disciplinary Committee are the police. They're citizens who have been entrusted with enforcing the rules. They don't create the rules, but are given enough power and authority to enforce them. You're completely 100% safe from Unzen as long as you follow the rules (see how he treated Shiranui). Now obviously police officers can be corrupt or abuse their power, but there are various political means to deal with that.

Honestly, the school is way weirder than you're imagining. It's like an independent nation or something. Medaka does actually have the authority to remodel the school because she's an elected official, the Health committee can actually deal with all the people who get injured by Unzen's rampages, and I would assume the Beautification committee is the one left to deal with the repairs to the building.

Edit: For reference, the school's name means "miniature garden", translated by Crunchyroll as Sandbox. The connotation that both terms share is that they're isolated worlds, cut off from unwanted influence and under the careful control of the "gardener".

Last edited by Clarste; 2012-06-24 at 03:14.
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Old 2012-06-24, 05:16   Link #1014
novalysis
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Originally Posted by Clarste View Post

Edit: For reference, the school's name means "miniature garden", translated by Crunchyroll as Sandbox. The connotation that both terms share is that they're isolated worlds, cut off from unwanted influence and under the careful control of the "gardener".
Actually, the School is literally a Sandbox Academy, in the same way Soul Gems are Souls.
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Old 2012-06-24, 05:30   Link #1015
Clarste
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I can't see how it's a literal Sandbox, given that it's not a box full of sand. Also, it took a while for me to interpret that because you're using a spoiler from a different series.
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Old 2012-06-24, 05:41   Link #1016
novalysis
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Originally Posted by Clarste View Post
I can't see how it's a literal Sandbox, given that it's not a box full of sand. Also, it took a while for me to interpret that because you're using a spoiler from a different series.
Well, I mean Sandbox in the normal usage of the term of course.
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Old 2012-06-24, 06:01   Link #1017
Clarste
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I thought that's what I said in the first place.
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Old 2012-06-24, 06:14   Link #1018
novalysis
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I thought that's what I said in the first place.
Very much, but Sandbox indeed is a very meaningful name.
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Old 2012-06-25, 11:42   Link #1019
Iby
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http://www.tv-tokyo.co.jp/program/de...206272550.html
looks like it will be some kind of special episode on the 27th June.
Maybe it would just be staff members discussing some stuff.

http://medakabox.jp/contents/hp0015/index00620000.html
yeah, right, nothing to look for here.


OK,some bonus stuff for the 1st volume:
Spoiler for here:


Hmm now that's interesting:
黒神めだかが虎居砕に語る、箱舟中学時代の過去。
球磨川禊の出会いを黒神めだかが語る西尾維新先生の描きおろしオーディオドラマを封入した新規 CM。
公式HPではオーディオドラマの一部が聴けるぞ!
All in all they're gonna include some Drama about the past of Medaka... and Kumagawa... written by Nishio.
"Medaka Box Juvenile"
Sound sample is here.

Last edited by Iby; 2012-06-26 at 04:17.
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Old 2012-06-27, 05:28   Link #1020
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Since season 2 is coming soon, anybody suggest what voice actors would suit the upcoming characters?
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