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Old 2012-06-22, 03:34   Link #1421
Dengar
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But you're not enhancing anything by JUST using Ten, Ren, or Gyo. You have to -apply- them to strengthen something, which is called Hatsu.

I would go into it more, such as using Gon's future ability as an example but that would be treading into spoiler territory.
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Old 2012-06-22, 05:56   Link #1422
Clarste
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...of course you're enhancing something with Gyo and Ten. You're enhancing your eyesight or your defensive strength.
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Old 2012-06-22, 06:34   Link #1423
Squarecrow
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clarste View Post
...of course you're enhancing something with Gyo and Ten. You're enhancing your eyesight or your defensive strength.
But it isn't an Enhancer power. If it isn't Hatsu it isn't an Enhancer power, or any other category for that matter; Hatsu is the only power that has different categories.
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Old 2012-06-22, 07:05   Link #1424
j0x
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im impress with the level of production quality this remake of Hunter X Hunter is having, does that mean MadHouse is rich now to make movie like quality animation on a long TV series? i thought MadHouse is supposedly be bankrupt already or does this remake of Hunter X Hunter is making tons of cash for MadHouse?
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Old 2012-06-22, 07:44   Link #1425
whitecloud
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i guess so...they seems to be raking a lot with this adaptation from the looks of it...

@clarste hatsu of the enhancement category is increasing all base parameter like strength, agility, etc while gyo is just to alocate nen to specific area in this part eye so it can recognize nen better its not improving/enhancing eyesight while ten do not add up to actual body defensive strength its more like wearing an armor so it can resist nen, like wing said the only one that can resist nen is another nen
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Old 2012-06-22, 09:26   Link #1426
Clarste
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Originally Posted by whitecloud View Post
@clarste hatsu of the enhancement category is increasing all base parameter like strength, agility, etc while gyo is just to alocate nen to specific area in this part eye so it can recognize nen better its not improving/enhancing eyesight while ten do not add up to actual body defensive strength its more like wearing an armor so it can resist nen, like wing said the only one that can resist nen is another nen
Allocating nen to a location serves no purpose other than to Enhance. All nen-users can see aura normally by opening the nen gates in their eyes. But they can also see hidden aura by putting more nen in their eyes with Gyo. How is that not improving an existing ability? They can see aura better than they can otherwise.

And while it's true that Ten protects from pure nen "attacks" like Hisoka looking at you funny, it also protects from physical attacks Enhanced by nen. Look at Gon's first fight against the top user. The tops "hit like hammers" because they're Enhanced, and everyone thought Gon was suicidal for using Zetsu against them. Nen naturally magnifies physical abilities, and this is a function of Enhancement.

Overall, Hatsu isn't just "special moves". It's everything. I think it's sort of misleading for the series to call it one of the Four Basic Principles because it's really not (Gyo fits better as the 4th). Hatsu is, quite simply, the part of Nen that does things. If it has any effect at all, it's Hatsu. Ten uses Enhancement to Enhance the body (also prevents aging, remember), and it also uses Transformation since it involves controlling the shape of the aura. The test for what kind of Hatsu you're compatible with is to simply put your nen into a glass of water. Wing just told them to "use Ren", not "use Hatsu". He never even taught them how to "use Hatsu". Because "using Hatsu" simply isn't a thing. It's measuring what your aura does, no more and no less.

Last edited by Clarste; 2012-06-22 at 21:44.
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Old 2012-06-22, 12:37   Link #1427
whitecloud
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@ clarste Just as dengar said...because it act as a armor / cushion that's why it can resist nen based physical attack and why using zetsu at that time fighting Guido considered suicidal because it remove the cushion armor that prevent the direct attack to the body
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Old 2012-06-22, 17:55   Link #1428
ditn
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remove your spoilers please ...
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Old 2012-06-22, 19:43   Link #1429
relentlessflame
 
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I want to make it clear that it is expressly forbidden to post anything in this thread that hints, suggests, confirms, or explains anything using information that can has not yet been revealed in this anime adaptation. That means that if someone speculates on something you must not use your knowledge of the manga or any previous adaptation to correct them, even behind spoiler tags.

I deleted two obvious posts above, but I think there are others that seem to be confirming things that you could not know if you had not read the manga. I hope that people will police themselves and remove such posts (you have the edit/delete post ability for your own posts), or I would ask that people please use the Report Post button to submit these to the staff. Please expect that warnings/infractions/bans will be issued if confirmed.

People who are familiar with the source material should exercise great caution when participating in speculative discussion, because you have information that places you not in a position to be able to freely "speculate" anymore. Even confirming if someone's speculation is right or wrong is forbidden. It may indeed be better for you to just avoid this thread completely if you can't help yourself.

There have been a lot of problems with spoilers in this thread in recent days, and I trust this warning is sufficiently clear. Just because people ask a question or make a comment doesn't mean you should correct it if it's wrong.
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Old 2012-06-23, 04:10   Link #1430
Dengar
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... Somehow I knew this'd happen sooner or later. Yet I apologize.

Lets just say that basic principles aren't categorized, and hatsu are. Lets leave it at that.

Last edited by Dengar; 2012-06-23 at 04:36.
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Old 2012-06-23, 11:13   Link #1431
Guardian Enzo
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You know, H x H does have a manga thread. Seems like a worthwhile alternative to knowingly posting manga spoilers here and waiting for the mods to find out.
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Old 2012-06-23, 12:35   Link #1432
Dengar
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I'm not sure how to put this. I do come here to discuss the anime, not the manga. It's just that, when people are saying like "hurr durr Enhancement is for retards" that I feel the need to... Explain. I'm not sure how else to react.
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Old 2012-06-23, 12:52   Link #1433
leokiko
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Nobody went as far as criticize Enhancers in that manner
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Old 2012-06-23, 12:55   Link #1434
Dengar
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Ok I exaggerated a little but you know what I mean.

I'll admit I got a little carried away. Enhancement is a favorite of mine. :P

Because I always expected it to be my own affinity if I were to do water divination.

Last edited by Dengar; 2012-06-23 at 13:16.
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Old 2012-06-23, 23:23   Link #1435
frubam
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Man, that part where
Spoiler for 36:
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Old 2012-06-24, 00:09   Link #1436
kakakka
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Spoiler for Episode 36:
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Old 2012-06-24, 00:27   Link #1437
Arkeus
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Originally Posted by frubam View Post
Man, that part where
Spoiler for 36:
I still can't believe they showed this.
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Old 2012-06-24, 00:43   Link #1438
Tsukou
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clarste View Post
Allocating nen to a location serves no purpose other than to Enhance. All nen-users can see aura normally by opening the nen gates in their eyes. But they can also see hidden aura by putting more nen in their eyes with Gyo. How is that not improving an existing ability? They can see aura better than they can otherwise.

And while it's true that Ten protects from pure nen "attacks" like Hisoka looking at you funny, it also protects from physical attacks Enhanced by nen. Look at Gon's first fight against the top user. The tops "hit like hammers" because they're Enhanced, and everyone thought Gon was suicidal for using Zetsu against them. Nen naturally magnifies physical abilities, and this is a function of Enhancement.

Overall, Hatsu isn't just "special moves". It's everything. I think it's sort of misleading for the series to call it one of the Four Basic Principles because it's really not (Gyo fits better as the 4th). Hatsu is, quite simply, the part of Nen that does things. If it has any effect at all, it's Hatsu. Ten uses Enhancement to Enhance the body (also prevents aging, remember), and it also uses Transformation since it involves controlling the shape of the aura. The test for what kind of Hatsu you're compatible with is to simply put your nen into a glass of water. Wing just told them to "use Ren", not "use Hatsu". He never even taught them how to "use Hatsu". Because "using Hatsu" simply isn't a thing. It's measuring what your aura does, no more and no less.
I don't know why you think Hatsu isn't special moves. Ten, Zetsu, Ren, and Hatsu are the four governing bodies when you think about it. Ten is the natural state. Zetsu is basically reducing aura. Ren is basically increasing aura, and Hatsu is basically anything not of the other three. Gyo is merely an application of Ren, so why would it be it's own category? Yes, I could see that Gyo could be considered a Hatsu to an Enhancement, but that is literally one application for one specific type of nen-user, so if you called Gyo the 4th, it would be horribly mislabeled because it only fits one specific type, while Hatsu is the governing type for all different types of users. You can't call Gyo the 4th type for a Conjurer, because they are completely different, thus a Conjurer's special ability falls under Hatsu.

And also there's no rule saying certain abilities don't just fall under Hatsu. Because Zetsu and Ren are both applications of Ten, it should be obvious that so is Hatsu, so it's not misleading to say that Hatsu is special abilities even tho it is an extension of the others. They are the four governing principles for a reason, that doesn't mean they don't overlap. And again using Hatsu is obviously different from person to person. An enhancement using their Hatsu should be clearly different than a Manipulator. Like what would you call Castro's Doppelganger ability? It's his Hatsu.

I think people in this thread are way too focused on separating these ideas. All the ideas overlap. Gyo is an extension of Ren, but when you think about it, for an enhancement, obviously the most straightforward way to use this category is simply use Ren, in which you just enhance everything, that could easily be considered their Hatsu. That doesn't make it bad or anything, it simply means that's all there is to it. For sure maybe Gyo is someone's Hatsu, where they specifically work on it, and I think that's fine, but it'd be wrong to say it's like that for everyone, which is why they say Gyo is an extension of Ren, and not Hatsu, but like I said, that doesn't mean it can't be Hatsu.

No reason to segregate these ideas. If you just think that Hatsu basically utilizes, Ten, Zetsu, and Ren, then all the problems go away, it's really that simple, no need to get up in arms about it.


Oh, and for the episode, I didn't like the silence in the beginning of the battle. I understand it's meant to give like a feeling of awe, and breathlessness, but I think it could have been better with some kind of action music, the silence felt too forced for me, especially since I knew the line about everyone being too stunned to say anything comes right after. It just felt like way too obvious and forced. But at least, they showed one of my favorite scenes with Hisoka and that pose, and shows why he'll always be my favorite. Love the guy. And while I read someone's comment about how Enhancements are the most straightforward, so possibly easiest to deal with, at the same time you have to think in sports, technique is one thing, but technique crumbles against pure power and speed. You just need to be a little faster, a little stronger, and you can become the best in any sport. In this respect, Enhancements are also probably the most frightening.

Last edited by Tsukou; 2012-06-24 at 01:07.
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Old 2012-06-24, 02:07   Link #1439
Guardian Enzo
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"Shut up - I'm brainstorming!"

This show is just astonishingly good at the moment, firing on all cylinders and we're not even at the most beloved arcs yet. Amazing.

I sometimes look (and listen) to the Hisoka stuff and think "How in the world did Togashi get away with this in Shounen Jump"? And how did it survive being adapted into anime twice?
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Old 2012-06-24, 02:09   Link #1440
VnsFurs
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Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo View Post
"Shut up - I'm brainstorming!"

This show is just astonishingly good at the moment, firing on all cylinders and we're not even at the most beloved arcs yet. Amazing.

I sometimes look (and listen) to the Hisoka stuff and think "How in the world did Togashi get away with this in Shounen Jump"? And how did it survive being adapted into anime twice?
I have no idea but it's a wonderful thing.
The episode was fantastic.
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