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Old 2012-04-30, 19:38   Link #21
Arabesque
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Well then, this was hard to write without going into very spoiler specific territory, but even then
Spoiler for '' for replay to Dr. Meo":


Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
The irony, for me, is that I typically don't go for really dark shows, and yet I tend to love Gen's forays into the anime world.

I think the reason is that, like pretty much all good writers, Gen has core ideas or philosophies that inform and inspire his writing. This gives his writing a certain purposefulness and narrative momentum that makes for a very engaging and enthralling experience, in my opinion.
I think you have summed it up right there why I like his writing as well. If there is one thing Gen is really good at, is that he is really able to make me understand what has happened, how it came to that point, and how cruel it was for the characters, but not strike me as something unnecessarily cruel. That sense like everything in the story has a purpose and a reason for occurring gives it a more ''complete'' feeling, and the impression that he puts a lot of thought into his stories.

I think that's really the thing that draws me to him, not the dark part, but how it's balanced so it's not a complete crapsack world where no hope is to be found, but there it is a hard path to take to get to where you want to go.
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Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
Gen's quote on love that Arabesque provided is interesting to me. The way love is portrayed in his works is often a slightly scary, pretty obsessed, and somewhat counterproductive thing. You can tell that Gen himself is apprehensive about romantic love. It's probably good that Gen is able to portray love this way, because not all love stories end well, and sometimes it can be good to be reminded of that.
I think that it's sort of something that shows up a lot in different forms across his work as well, in Sayaka and Kariya, how their love twisted them and brought them to their ruin.

Even in Phantom of the inferno, love set a path that ultimately lead to a lead characters death, and in some case was actually used as a weapon in many cases.

I wonder if Gen ever loved someone in his life ...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Archon_Wing View Post
From what I've seen of Fate/Zero and Madoka, he seems to really have a thing for the unsung heroes.
To torture them?
Quote:
Originally Posted by TJR View Post
Of course, there's some chance that he's fooling us and has deliberately chosen to set himself apart from other storytellers. There's no doubt that Gen's reputation was built on dark, twisted writing.
I won't remove the possibility that some part of what we read about him or the thing he says might be cleaver marketing to help establish his reputation as a dark writer, but I think that a large part of it has to be truthful.

Unless he's a really, really good liar ...
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Old 2012-05-01, 02:20   Link #22
Triple_R
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One thing I'd like to bring up here - I recently read about how, of all the Fate/Zero characters, the one that Gen had the most hand in is Rider/Iskander (i.e. this is the character that is the most Gen/least Nasu).

Now Rider is a very gregarious, hearty, and generally upbeat character. Perhaps ironically, I would say that Rider does more than any other Fate/Zero character in bringing a much-needed lighthearted balancing to Fate/Zero.

And this is the guy that Gen can take credit for more than any other Fate/Zero character.

So I doubt that Gen is as depressed/dark as he's made out to be.


Honestly, I think that Archon_Wing has a point - I think that Gen likes unsung heroes. I think that at some level (perhaps even a subconscious one) Gen wants to write well-intentioned protagonists that meet a grizzly fate, but while still capturing a vague sense that maybe it was all worth it anyway.

In some ways, that's a more powerful message than showing a person who eventually triumphs over hardship and accomplishes all of his/her goals, because that clearly shows it was worth it. But if you look at what happened to the historical figure that Fate/Zero's Rider is based on (and how Rider copes with that), and if you look at what happened to Sayaka in Madoka Magica (and how Sayaka reflects on that in her actual final scene), I think that the narrative is actually saying "Maybe it'll all be worth it even if you don't fully succeed".

It's ironically a bit inspirational for a supposedly very dark writer.
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Old 2012-05-01, 02:54   Link #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
Honestly, I think that Archon_Wing has a point - I think that Gen likes unsung heroes. I think that at some level (perhaps even a subconscious one) Gen wants to write well-intentioned protagonists that meet a grizzly fate, but while still capturing a vague sense that maybe it was all worth it anyway.

In some ways, that's a more powerful message than showing a person who eventually triumphs over hardship and accomplishes all of his/her goals, because that clearly shows it was worth it. But if you look at what happened to the historical figure that Fate/Zero's Rider is based on (and how Rider copes with that), and if you look at what happened to Sayaka in Madoka Magica (and how Sayaka reflects on that in her actual final scene), I think that the narrative is actually saying "Maybe it'll all be worth it even if you don't fully succeed".

It's ironically a bit inspirational for a supposedly very dark writer.
Or just because it won't fully succeed, doesn't mean it's not worth doing.

It's really easy to have a results-oriented outlook on things. It's very hard not to. After all, history is frequently just a summary. It's easy to say, "they won, therefore they were the ones that succeeded". But behind every success are those that fell and they contributed just as much as the big names did. Sometimes even more. The greatest stories of heroism are probably the ones that were never told. It would be safe to say that we are alive and well today, thanks to the acts of someone we will never know of.

Sorta like any game of chance that involves skill, such as poker. Nothing is definite in those things, but there are definitely the better choices one can pick. It doesn't mean if you lose, you picked the wrong choice, after all.

But on the other hand, most things in life aren't definite, and picking the best choice is the greatest challenge. But we hope those choices are ours, and that people fought to make us even have the chance to make said choice even if life offers you the short end a bit too much.

If you realize that there is someone out there that you don't know that somehow helped you, and that there is someone looking out for you out there no matter where you are even if you can never return the favor, then perhaps this dying universe doesn't feel as cold and cynical for a while more.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arabesque View Post
To torture them?
Is part of it. Better to take your feelings out on fiction, as Tomino would attest.
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Old 2012-05-01, 03:23   Link #24
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Question,why is it that when people talk about Gen Urobuchi's career it seems this never happened?Was it bad and forgetable?

I know Black lagoon isn't his franchise but neither was fate and people still give him credit for fate/zero.

I havn't read it but I'd be interested in his take on the franchise.
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Old 2012-05-01, 03:29   Link #25
Sheba
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I never heard of it, dunno about others tho.
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Old 2012-05-01, 03:57   Link #26
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Haven't read it yet, though I want to. My guess is that Black Lagoon doesn't generate the same amount of hype as Nasuverse so outside Japan (and maybe even there) not many know about it.
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Old 2012-05-01, 10:44   Link #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Archon_Wing
From what I've seen of Fate/Zero and Madoka, he seems to really have a thing for the unsung heroes.

He answered my question in Sakuracon (do you hate Mami and Sayaka that much?)
Ans: characters shine the best when they are about to expire xD
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Old 2012-05-01, 11:38   Link #28
Keroko
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erneiz_hyde View Post
When I said "incomplete" I didn't mean the story, but the man himself.

There's nothing wrong with either focusing on negatives and ignoring the positives, or with focusing on positives and ignoring the negatives. But imho, true strength lies in that despite knowing everything we do would actually be futile (negatives), we struggle towards that good end nonetheless (positives). It takes even greater strength still to not lose this resolve and to last until the (more than likely) bitter end. Gen knows that much, but probably thinks such strength is impossible to come from mere humans. Thus he gave up on the idea altogether.

"everything is futile" is a highly nihilistic view. Gen ignores happiness because they're transient, an illusion in the bigger picture. That's where I disagree. Happiness is precious because it's transient, and it's sometimes worth one or several lifetimes.
Yet, Gen does acknowledge the struggle. Sure, his stories focus on the negatives, but the positives still remain. Clouded and hard to see, yes. But the 'light at the end of the tunnel' is still there.

Homura never stops her struggle, and Madoka reaches the end of the tunnel eventually. Meanwhile in Fate/Zero, despite the gloom and doom surrounding most characters (which is understandable with them all being tragic heroes) we have Iskandar boosting morale all around.

Black Lagoon as well, while certainly being about the darker aspects of human society, tends to end on a high note.
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Old 2012-05-01, 11:46   Link #29
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I never knew he took part in writing Blassreiter.

And didn't Nasu write the F/S Zero novels?
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Old 2012-05-01, 15:10   Link #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aqua Knight View Post
I never knew he took part in writing Blassreiter.

Don't think he really conciders that his work though

Quote:
(at the time of) Brassreiter I was just like a secretary summing up what Itano-san spurted out and talked about.
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Old 2012-05-02, 16:36   Link #31
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Originally Posted by Aqua Knight View Post
I never knew he took part in writing Blassreiter.

And didn't Nasu write the F/S Zero novels?
No, Nasu only wrote the Fate/Stay Night visual novel and Fate/Hollow Ataraxia.

Gen wrote the Fate/Zero novel.
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Old 2012-05-03, 12:42   Link #32
Jaden
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I really like his style. Often times, characters that are broken or insane tend to be rather droll and used as deus ex machinae, but I feel like that's a wasted opportunity. Insanity should build character instead of denying it, and Gen can really make interesting and memorable maniacs.
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Old 2012-05-25, 08:21   Link #33
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The guy's statement that he can't write happy endings anymore, even when he tries, reminds me of something Gary Larson said in A Prehistory of The Far Side: "If I tried writing Lassie, she'd get rabies and attack Timmy." He couldn't help it; it was just the way his mind worked.

Maybe it's because I majored in creative writing and all self-proclaimed writers love a Freudian excuse, but I kinda think the fact that he nearly died of a disease is the key to understanding this piece of work and his works.

I certainly wouldn't go so far as to say that happy endings contradict the laws of nature, but I would agree with his seeming belief that we need sad endings once in a while, just to remind us that no, sometimes things don't go our way, and sometimes the villains get away with it. And sometimes, as in Madoka (arguably) and in Another (I wonder what he thought of that anime), the only villains are the intangible, emotionless forces of nature.
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Old 2012-06-26, 11:35   Link #34
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And coming to Otakon...
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Old 2012-07-29, 21:13   Link #35
Kimidori
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Urobuchi Q&A from Otakon 2012

Quote:
"I started as a PC game writer, and then moved into anime, and it's become what I'm known for... but I'm only doing anime for the next two years"
not sure if i should understand this as he will not doing anime anymore after the next 2 year or he will not write anything other than anime for the next 2 year.
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Old 2012-07-29, 21:28   Link #36
Triple_R
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kimidori View Post
Urobuchi Q&A from Otakon 2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Urobuchi
"I started as a PC game writer, and then moved into anime, and it's become what I'm known for... but I'm only doing anime for the next two years"
not sure if i should understand this as he will not doing anime anymore after the next 2 year or he will not write anything other than anime for the next 2 year.
Yeah, good point. It does make a pretty big difference. I hope somebody can find out which meaning he meant.
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Old 2012-07-29, 22:34   Link #37
Ithekro
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Maybe he is presently under contract and once that ends he has other plans. Live action directing maybe? Retirement?
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Old 2012-07-30, 06:22   Link #38
MisaoFan
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Maybe he is presently under contract and once that ends he has other plans. Live action directing maybe? Retirement?
Looks like he'll be involved in Psycho-Pass's scriptwritting, based on what I've seen on 4chan rumors.
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Old 2012-07-30, 15:22   Link #39
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Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
Yeah, good point. It does make a pretty big difference. I hope somebody can find out which meaning he meant.
He wasn't saying he's doing anime for only two more years. He said he was so busy with the anime he's working on, that that will be all he's working on for two years. He said his style of writing suits anime scriptwriting/storyboarding better than it does for Visual Novels/Light Novels as well.
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Old 2012-07-30, 17:07   Link #40
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He does storyboards? Or did he imply he is going to do them?

That would certainly be interesting to see.
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