AnimeSuki Forums

Register Forum Rules FAQ Members List Social Groups Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   AnimeSuki Forum > Anime Related Topics > Manga & Light Novels

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 2012-08-06, 06:30   Link #2601
zzhk
Summary Machine
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
By authority I mean the actual author or authoring organization. Besides, retcon is about the authoring entity contradicting their previous work.

The oldest written source of a myth is still an interpretation of some earlier oral source, and hence cannot be taken as the will of the original author.

As a fictional series, you can complain about the author taking liberties with the actual recorded myths, but talking about canonicity of fiction is just plain silly.
__________________
zzhk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-08-06, 06:41   Link #2602
Moe Connection
Basileus Basileōn
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by zzhk View Post
By authority I mean the actual author or authoring organization. Besides, retcon is about the authoring entity contradicting their previous work.

The oldest written source of a myth is still an interpretation of some earlier oral source, and hence cannot be taken as the will of the original author.

As a fictional series, you can complain about the author taking liberties with the actual recorded myths, but talking about canonicity of fiction is just plain silly.
An interpretation, artistic liberties, fan-fiction or whatever you call it. It does not change that the author is basing his tale on what we know is the earliest/actual recorded myths ,and he is deliberately altering them in an official literature.Therefore ,he is retconing the original story, which simply meant changing established information in a story. As for talking about the 'canonicity of fiction is just plain silly', you obviously have not met star wars fans--they'd kill you for saying that.Although ,I do agree.
__________________
Moe Connection is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-08-06, 06:50   Link #2603
zzhk
Summary Machine
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
I should be more specific, the canonicity of a separate fictional work is a non-issue. It's not like Campione's author intends people to take his story as the canonical continuation of the original myths.

His series is just a separate work of fiction inspired by myths in the real world.

Anyway, there's no real argument here, I just think darthfanta's use of the term "retcon" is just too broad for the taste of some of us in this thread.
__________________
zzhk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-08-06, 08:37   Link #2604
Kleeyook
Yandere maniax
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Somewhere close to Valhalla
Age: 24
Well, I don't mind about the alteration of some myths in this series.

I seriously doubt how the tale of something that used to happen ten of thousands years ago are recorded. There's no script or syllables available during that time. The tale can only be passed down generation after generation by oral.

However, I'd be mad if the Japanese thinking it's cool to change the gender of historical figures in series like Ikki Tousen, Oda Nobuna and Samurai Girls so they can masturbate. In fact, I am mad right now.

I wonder how those departed people would feel seeing they appear in modern media like that, despite having their portrait drawing and painting readily available for people to see.

Take a look at the moe Nobuna and the actual portrait, it's like another world. Even if it's a paradox world, having that will kill my mood.

BTW, I thought Arthurian Legend was a tale.
Kleeyook is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-08-06, 09:54   Link #2605
bludvein
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Do you all think Godou will manage to pick up another authority before his eventual fight with the Last King, or just keep improving the powers he already has?
bludvein is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-08-06, 10:11   Link #2606
Azure-Priest
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by bludvein View Post
Do you all think Godou will manage to pick up another authority before his eventual fight with the Last King, or just keep improving the powers he already has?
He's already "picked up" the Kunasagi sword, but he is not eager to "pick up" new authorities until he master his existing 10. He finds them troublesome enough as it is.
Azure-Priest is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-08-06, 10:18   Link #2607
Moe Connection
Basileus Basileōn
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by bludvein View Post
Do you all think Godou will manage to pick up another authority before his eventual fight with the Last King, or just keep improving the powers he already has?

I am pretty sure he would not pick up a new authority. For one, he's already stated that he's not interested in becoming more powerful. Unless a god's clearly asking for it,he'd just beat a god and tell him to GTFO like his duel with Athena--that is if he actually wins. Also, as mentioned by a certain manga series(guess which one), the main character should not really have too many powers, and throughout the series, the author is obviously intent on following this practice, even though Godou killed several--each time making up an excuse of why he didn't get one. And about him mastering his existing ten--there's no evidence to proof that he hasn't already done so for the ten volumes after the two prequels. It's heavily hinted from the other campiones' authorities that the restrictions on the Persian Warlord would stay in place, there's no way to break them unless you use a certain unique method in volume ten which most probably could not be used again. The guys' had their authorities much longer than Godou, but the restrictions on their authorities pretty much remain the same.
__________________

Last edited by Moe Connection; 2012-08-06 at 19:30.
Moe Connection is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-08-06, 10:31   Link #2608
Richocet
Lover of Purity
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Then how come
Spoiler:
__________________
Richocet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-08-06, 10:37   Link #2609
bludvein
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Well in vol4chap 6 Erica speculates about the reason Godou got so many powers when he killed Verethragna. Perhaps the closer Godou gets in personality to Verethragna(the one in the myth, not the heretic version) the less restrictions he will have? Or was his "compatibility" decided at the moment of death and can't change?

Spoiler for ..:
bludvein is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-08-06, 11:26   Link #2610
Miraluka
18 forever
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Age: 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by darthfanta View Post
I am pretty sure he would not pick up a new authority. For one, he's already stated that he's not interested in becoming more powerful. Unless a god's clearly asking for it,he'd just beat a god and tell him to GTFO like his duel with Athena--that is if he actually wins.
Melqart.
The god really wants to fight Godou and their fight has yet to meet a conclusión and Melqart won't accept the kind of ending with Godou telling him to go off like that the god is a warrior it would hurt his pride if the end of a fair match doesn't meet a proper ending.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bludvein View Post
Well in vol4chap 6 Erica speculates about the reason Godou got so many powers when he killed Verethragna. Perhaps the closer Godou gets in personality to Verethragna(the one in the myth, not the heretic version) the less restrictions he will have? Or was his "compatibility" decided at the moment of death and can't change?

Spoiler for ..:
Checking CN translations, the way of talking Godou had with others reminds me of Heretic Verethragna, not the one without memories.
__________________
Love songs for the genuinely cunning.
Miraluka is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-08-06, 11:37   Link #2611
whsie
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Seattle and Houston... sleeping in a car.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Azure-Priest View Post
He's already "picked up" the Kunasagi sword, but he is not eager to "pick up" new authorities until he master his existing 10. He finds them troublesome enough as it is.
Restrictions aside, Godou has already mastered the usage of the 10 abilities by the end of volume 6 (where the current translations are heading to).

It's because his current abilities weren't enough that the Kunasagi sword (for Godou) was introduced in volume 7.
whsie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-08-06, 12:50   Link #2612
Nekoppi
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by darthfanta View Post
It is retconning. By saying that their stories were false, which they did every time they retcon things in D.C., the author is already retconning by altering the established facts. In which tale did you hear that Siegfried, King Arthur and Lancelot were gods?The author specifically, whenever he chose a hero as a god in this series, actually alter their tales to link them to an existing god or somehow establish that they were gods all along--something which wasn't actually acknowledge by authors. I am just saying that since these characters are heroes, not gods in the real world, then yes, heroes are also featured in this series.
The author's treatment of Siegfried, Arthur, and Lancelot hasn't been translated yet, so I can't comment on that. However, you were also complaining about Perseus? Well, let us see...

First, the author never claimed that he was treated as a god in his original myths. Rather, just that his myth is based on other gods, or myths of other gods were based on him. Now, I checked him up on wikipedia (I'm not all too familiar with what myth lead to the creation of what myth), and according to it, the founding myths of the twelve Olympians were based on Perseus's legends. In this series, that tends to be a sufficient connection for some link to be established between the two. That isn't retconning, just universe mechanics.

Second, Perseus IS half-god. Maybe the author just considers 50% god to be enough god to be a god? That is more or less an arbitrary divide right there.

EDIT: Actually, never mind. Just realized that the based on the spoilers posted in this thread, the author does indeed "retcon" the Arthurian legends. And kinda blatanly says so in the story (the whole part about the legend being a LIE fabricated to try to bring back the true king [slayer], but failed because it got changed too much from reality). So yeah, kinda hard to argue that he doesn't change the story of Arthurian legend, when he has an ex-god come out and say "yeah, we rewrote all that junk"
Nekoppi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-08-06, 13:53   Link #2613
Wargumm1i
Jinchuuriki
 
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Does Godou slay any other gods except Verethragna?
__________________
Wargumm1i is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-08-06, 14:20   Link #2614
Athena
The Power of One
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Earth
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wargumm1i View Post
Does Godou slay any other gods except Verethragna?
Define slay. "Beat up" or "Take the powers of"?
__________________
Athena is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-08-06, 15:28   Link #2615
aigomorla
100% Tsun... 0% Dere
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wargumm1i View Post
Does Godou slay any other gods except Verethragna?
he doesnt slay anyone except the first god from what translations have progressed.

All the other gods he fought, he only beat the crap out of.
Not kill.

If anything Doni cleans up for him once, but Doni didnt upsurp that god's authority.
aigomorla is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-08-06, 19:23   Link #2616
Moe Connection
Basileus Basileōn
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wargumm1i View Post
Does Godou slay any other gods except Verethragna?
He does, but he didn't get their power either because he ganged up on them
Spoiler for volume seven:
or because they haven't fully become heretic gods yet
Spoiler for volume ten:
.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richocet View Post
Then how come
Spoiler:
The whole reason why he went berserk was because he was under
Spoiler for volume ten:
__________________
Moe Connection is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-08-06, 19:42   Link #2617
Richocet
Lover of Purity
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
So you're saying
Spoiler:
__________________
Richocet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-08-06, 19:44   Link #2618
Moe Connection
Basileus Basileōn
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richocet View Post
So you're saying
Spoiler:
Yes, I said it a number of times, that's how the berserk fiasco came along.
__________________
Moe Connection is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-08-06, 19:58   Link #2619
willx
Nyaaan~~
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Age: 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by darthfanta View Post
Yes, I said it a number of times, that's how the berserk fiasco came along.
Actually, reading from Vol 6, it's implied that Erica believes Godou is imposing the restrictions upon himself based on his personality. The likely scenario is that he becomes more and more accepting of his powers and becomes able to use them slightly more freely..

I'm wondering in Vol 6 how the Kusanagi sword transferred him to the Netherworld when he didn't have it on him, nor was it in the Netherworld waiting for him..
willx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-08-06, 20:00   Link #2620
Richocet
Lover of Purity
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by darthfanta View Post
Yes, I said it a number of times, that's how the berserk fiasco came along.
So
Spoiler:


^And that is what I was thinking as well, that his personality and the constant way he keeps lying to himself about his base instincts of competitiveness are the reason why he does have restrictions imposed
__________________
Richocet is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
action, campione, ecchi, godslayer, harem, light novel, myth, romance, sd bunko, shounen, supernatural, time travel

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:15.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
We use Silk.