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Old 2012-08-20, 12:23   Link #1081
Blonto
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo View Post
I think it should be repeated that Taichi - also an athlete - was the only one who spotted something was wrong with Sawa and expressed concern for her, and all he got for it was verbal abuse.
Everyone noticed there was something wrong with her. It's kinda hard to miss when the person almost faints right in front of you. Actually, I'd say the other girls noticed it better, because Badmin-I mean Taichi only expressed concern when he saw there was something physically wrong with her and he didn't think much of it.
Speaking of which, the guys didn't seem to care much about Sawa this episode, which is fair I guess considering the girls were always kinda separated from them.

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Originally Posted by Sphire View Post
Pfft, did you guys not notice how Sawa only started laughing when Tanaka started singing? His whole line about losing and coming back, obviously resonated with her. Super Taichi, solving problems weekly in one show or another.
Yeah, that was a bit of an odd timing. Wakana's part just seemed to depress her further then all of a sudden - Taichi singing = . Maybe she found it comforting to be encouraged by a guy who's taken the opposite way of achieving his dreams. I wish they talked at least a bit because his situation is pretty much the same as hers.
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Old 2012-08-20, 13:09   Link #1082
Guardian Enzo
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I suppose it would be more accurate to say that Taichi was the only one who spotted what was wrong with her.
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Old 2012-08-20, 13:27   Link #1083
Blonto
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Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo View Post
I suppose it would be more accurate to say that Taichi was the only one who spotted what was wrong with her.
Actually Wakana asked her if she was dieting. Taichi didn't really notice anything more than a regular person would, he just commented how girls worry too much about stuff like that.
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Old 2012-08-20, 13:30   Link #1084
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What a superb episode that was !

but... everything got overshadowed by this :



obsiously had to put my yuris googles on


i love the line of sawa's dad "you're dealing with a monk ! i'll send you to hell !"
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Old 2012-08-20, 13:55   Link #1085
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What a superb episode that was !


i love the line of sawa's dad "you're dealing with a monk ! i'll send you to hell !"
Makes you wonder how he scored such a hot shounen mom :P
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Old 2012-08-20, 18:00   Link #1086
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why.... why don't I notice this awesome anime sooner???
they have lots of heavenly songs and voices.... I can't skip every singing part including opening and ending song

P.A. Works really do a great job.... I remember for being in same problem like all of casts during my last highschool year... yeah! they pictured it perfectly

every characters are dealing with complex problems (well, except Konatsu maybe)
Wakana's arc is wonderfully done....
and now Sawa's arc is also good... it'll be awesome if I see someone riding horse to go to school

please let this anime have 24 episode.... I can't believe if there are only few episodes left...
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Old 2012-08-20, 18:18   Link #1087
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Another very good episode
I agree, parents are so far all so good and caring, fathers in particular. I understand Sawa's father turnaround. I mean, looking at her daughter breaking up he broke up too, who wouldn't? He was trying to convince her, harshly, with the cold logic of facts, but when he saw her risking her life for that dream I guess he felt a bit guilty, even if he wasn't . He simply wanted to give her a chance to try. It would have worked as a better closure than what she actually got, or rather didn't get.

And the lighthearted moments were good too, the best moment has been the thumbs-up to the whole Konatsu's declaration Wakana gave to Sawa. That expressed how good she is doing getting in the (female) group. On the other hand it it was one of the hints on how they didn't really understand Sawa's issue. She was really depressed but they didn't get how much. This was put in words when Wakana told to Konatsu how probably simply saying to Sawa to come to the audition wouldn't have been enough. Really? And even before, what was that awkward Wakana's re-mark (mina?) in response to Konatsu "we all want to help you" line. Probably she was implying that the males shouldn't have been counted in, but it was to short to give it a neat meaning. Did she say that because she also thought Sawa was lovesick? Or simply out of tactfulness? The feeling I got anyways was that they don't fully get how much hurt Sawa is. And that wouldn't be bad, would be true-to-life. It happens.

Btw, that bitches even being bitches weren't completely in the wrong. If you care for something you have to apply on that thing. You have to act, not simply react.

If I have to say I didn't like how Wakana played the late mother card on Sawa. I mean, yes, Sawa has been harsh, but that wasn't the moment to say that. Even if Wakana had all the rights to say that, it was a bit unfair.

Speaking of Wein I finally start to get interested in him, abd I'm getting used to his childish attitude, that fits perfectly with Konatsu btw.
So, I'm expecting that he has the saddest story of the whole group. His brother/sister is hospitalized, probably in a coma, for a long time and that red toy is with her/him to protect her/him, as a hero, in its stead. A bit to sad to be honest. But that would fit with how downplayed he has been so far.
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Old 2012-08-20, 18:34   Link #1088
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Originally Posted by Arya View Post
If I have to say I didn't like how Wakana played the late mother card on Sawa. I mean, yes, Sawa has been harsh, but that wasn't the moment to say that. Even if Wakana had all the rights to say that, it was a bit unfair.
Wakana wanted Sawa to understand something very important: sometimes there are things that you can't change no matter what you do, and you have to accept this and move on. For Wakana, it's the fact that her mother is dead and she will never be able to sing together with her. For Sawa is the fact that her body is just not suited for being a jockey, and no matter how much she struggles this won't change.

Wakana's lesson is of acceptance. And the gentle way she delivers this simple truth to Sawa was by no means unfair IMO.
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Old 2012-08-20, 18:37   Link #1089
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Finally, Wien's episode coming up. I wonder what his story is.
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Old 2012-08-20, 19:10   Link #1090
Arya
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Originally Posted by Kazu-kun View Post
Wakana wanted Sawa to understand something very important: sometimes there are things that you can't change no matter what you do, and you have to accept this and move on. For Wakana, it's the fact that her mother is dead and she will never be able to sing together with her. For Sawa is the fact that her body is just not suited for being a jockey, and no matter how much she struggles this won't change.

Wakana's lesson is of acceptance. And the gentle way she delivers this simple truth to Sawa was by no means unfair IMO.
Well, the way she put the whole thing didn't sound like that to me. She said that if she had the chance to see her mother one more time she would give up music in a heartbeat. She was saying that she would have swap music for her mother. The analogy was between the jockey thing and music, not her mother. For that reason I said that it was out of line and unfair. Wakana was trying to explain how to put things in a wider perspective, for that reason she said to step back. But obviously even Sawa would have give up being a jockey for a parent/relative. Anyone would. And she put Sawa in a position to say nothing back.
At least that what I got.
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Old 2012-08-20, 19:29   Link #1091
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arya View Post
Well, the way she put the whole thing didn't sound like that to me. She said that if she had the chance to see her mother one more time she would give up music in a heartbeat. She was saying that she would have swap music for her mother. The analogy was between the jockey thing and music, not her mother. For that reason I said that it was out of line and unfair. Wakana was trying to explain how to put things in a wider perspective, for that reason she said to step back. But obviously even Sawa would have give up being a jockey for a parent/relative.
Personally, I felt that was much of the point of what Wakana said to Sawa, if not the whole point. Wakana was really just saying what loads of people on this thread were saying/strongly implying after Episode 7: "There's worst things in life than losing out on a youthful dream. It pales in comparison to losing a parent at a young age. So if I can get over my parental loss, Sawa, then you can certainly move on from your own loss here."

Wakana's way of putting it was much more diplomatic and subtle, of course, but this is the gist of it I think. And it's not unfair, really - It's just life. Sawa's loss is big to her, and for understandable reasons, but people deal with bigger losses than this everyday, so having a little bit of wider perspective here can't hurt.

The fact is that Sawa shouldn't let this keep her down forever. The loss is sad, but it's just not worth that sort of constant moping over it. The sooner Sawa accepts the situation the better it'll be for both her and her friends.

Granted, there's perhaps a bit more that Sawa needs to work out with this. But I think she's over the hardest part now - The emotional acceptance part.
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Old 2012-08-20, 19:33   Link #1092
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arya View Post
But obviously even Sawa would have give up being a jockey for a parent/relative. Anyone would.
But isn't that the point?

Sawa was telling her "well you have it good,you still have music" and Wakana reminded her that she had lost something even more important,so no,it wasn't all good for her.

It's not like she was looking for pity or something.She was politely telling Sawa "Shit happens.Deal with it".
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Old 2012-08-20, 19:58   Link #1093
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I find it impossible to criticize the way Wakana addressed the issue with Sawa. Sawa needed to hear it and, quite frankly, Wakana packaged in a much more diplomatic way than she might've. I think she had every right to be angry about the way Sawa was behaving, but I thought the approach she took was rather magnanimous under the circumstances.
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Old 2012-08-20, 21:52   Link #1094
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たりたり♪♪ 08 - Keyboard Cat! (of the Old West)

I think Sawa and her dad are more alike than either of them is willing to admit. In the end, neither of them are above using their skills to make sure things turn out for the best. Her dad's rather bombastic use of his monkness, and Sawa going full cowboy to make it to the audition in time, show that talent, and stubbornness, seem to run in her family. The image of a horse parked among ordinary bicycles reminds me of a gag I've seen in a few different places, many of them in completely different genres. Hilarious for such a short shot, though.

Wien to the rescue! He's always been one of my favorite characters, primarily because of the Sentai thing. Seeing how protective he was of the Ganbaraijer figures makes me curious about his backstory. The helmet thingy in the preview also played a part. That he happened to have a giant house with a mostly functional piano is a stroke of wonderful fortune. For whatever drama an episode has, it's always ended on a hopeful note or had some comedic bits to keep the mood light; I like that.
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Old 2012-08-21, 01:43   Link #1095
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Originally Posted by Arya View Post
Another very good episode

If I have to say I didn't like how Wakana played the late mother card on Sawa. I mean, yes, Sawa has been harsh, but that wasn't the moment to say that. Even if Wakana had all the rights to say that, it was a bit unfair.
I can see where you're coming from, although I still feel it was a good/positive thing to say. Not so much to tell Sawa how to behave given that losing something is part of life and so she should just automatically accept it, but moreso that life goes on no matter what. So while being depressed about something may not be bad, you shouldn't let it destroy you or everything else you've done. So for instance, Wakana is obviously still sad her mother has passed, but doesn't let that interfere with her doing other things (now at least).

Is it a bit unfair? Well yes. Especially given Wakana didn't have a time-frame to overcome her issues, whilst Sawa was being forced to overcome her's for the sake of the choir (which, if we're going by relevance, sure losing a family member is more devastating than losing a dream(arguable, but for normal terms we'll go with this), but losing a dream compared to some side choir event Sawa wasn't fully interested in anyway? Slightly unfair). It was kind of a new issue too, she's only just gotten depressed over a real dream she has being taken away, forever. As opposed to say Wakana being depressed for a while even before her arc. It's not like Wakana was giving her all for the club to begin with either.

Add to that when everyone helped Wakana, it was natural instincts to help. This time though, while they obviously wanted to help, it was still shrouded in some selfish desire to get Sawa to perform for the choir.

On the flip side though, Wakana probably knows how being depressed can really hold you back. So it was still good/sound advice to give. Wakana's kinda turned into this wise person who can dish out advice left, right and center based off her experience now. If anything, it shows how strong Sawa is that she did end up stepping back so quickly.

On a side note, I re-watched the episode again with different subs and man, some things flowed way differently. Mostly the gist of it was the same, although some contradictions did occur. But the flow of it definitely differed. I wonder how best to proceed watching...
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Old 2012-08-21, 02:50   Link #1096
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Well, now I just hope that Sawa's problem doesn't get "magically" fixed by her dad's threatening call to the riding school.
I want Sawa to understand that her body isn't built to be a jockey and that there are many other jobs that she can do with horses.
I don't want this show to fall into the standard shounen anime cliche that hard work and determination can overcome any obstacle.
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Old 2012-08-21, 04:08   Link #1097
Arya
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Personally, I felt that was much of the point of what Wakana said to Sawa, if not the whole point. Wakana was really just saying what loads of people on this thread were saying/strongly implying after Episode 7: "There's worst things in life than losing out on a youthful dream. It pales in comparison to losing a parent at a young age. So if I can get over my parental loss, Sawa, then you can certainly move on from your own loss here."

Wakana's way of putting it was much more diplomatic and subtle, of course, but this is the gist of it I think. And it's not unfair, really - It's just life. Sawa's loss is big to her, and for understandable reasons, but people deal with bigger losses than this everyday, so having a little bit of wider perspective here can't hurt.

The fact is that Sawa shouldn't let this keep her down forever. The loss is sad, but it's just not worth that sort of constant moping over it. The sooner Sawa accepts the situation the better it'll be for both her and her friends.

Granted, there's perhaps a bit more that Sawa needs to work out with this. But I think she's over the hardest part now - The emotional acceptance part.
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But isn't that the point?

Sawa was telling her "well you have it good,you still have music" and Wakana reminded her that she had lost something even more important,so no,it wasn't all good for her.

It's not like she was looking for pity or something.She was politely telling Sawa "Shit happens.Deal with it".
Sorry, probably I'm not getting it, but in general
Spoiler for not focused on the show:


But probably it depends on how these matters are handled in each country, in my country usually this kind of matters are not something kids/teenagers would speak of so when it happens it can easily eclipses every other thing.

Put in context, Sawa was depressed and her friends seemed to not care enough. They were focused on the audiction. Konatsu's gag was fine as lighthearted moment, but I guess it was not from Sawa's perspective, nor Wakana's thumbs-up in a way.
Then they dragged her at Wein house, where thanks to another not very tactful (but unwilling) move of Konatsu, Sawa was half forced to spill the beans in front of everyone. Not the best way to handle it. Wakana addressed (or not?) that it would be we awkward.
Then after some due but superfluous "forced" (<- don't know if it is the right word) phrases Wakana tried to say something right, "try to step back to see things in a different perspective". But Sawa at that point reacted in a very harsh way, wrongly, and even without thinking to Wakana's mother. She was thinking only on how different music and "being a jockey" are. Music needs only talent and application. Instead "being a Jockey" or some other sport/careers need high requirements. At that point things transcended. Wakana, as I already said, had all the right to say what she said about her connections with her late mother, so I'm not saying that was her fault at all, but that wasn't the point Sawa was trying to say. So the "late mother" card unwillingly played to close the conversation for the reasons I explained above.
In fact, iirc Sawa didn't feel any better after that confrontation. She wasn't enlightened.

Oh, and it was just happened, didn't it? Sawa wasn't dragging her issue for a long time to have to already being worried she wouldn't have overcome that.

tl:dr, ok let say that I don't see that as something Wakana meant to say with that propose, but that was forced out by Sawa's harshness. And saying that she eclipsed Sawa situation toward hers more than everything else. That fits with the overall way they handled Sawa's issue.

@Sphire: that are very good points about how different the matters are, Sawa's and Wakana's, in every aspect, from the matter itself to the context they were in, the time they had, to the way they has been handled.
And I agree Sawa was strong stepping back, looking even how a bit shallowly her issue was handled. In fact her father was enlightening for her to understand her firends. She at that moment (hearing his father at the phone) understood that even if the ways were wrong (in her perspective) his father, and her friends, really cared for her, even if it didn't seem the case, only they didn't know how to convey that properly.

Anyways, I've written too much, but I want to remark that I'm not saying anything mean of Wakana It's only a matter of perspective.
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Old 2012-08-21, 04:14   Link #1098
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Wakana's advice is sound, but her situation isn't comparable to Sawa's. Music is just a hobby to her and one she's invested in purely due to nostalgia. She couldn't understand Sawa's need to devote her life to something like that. Besides, Wakana's mother isn't coming back, but Sawa can still be a jockey.
The only thing they have in common is that they've both been depressed, that's the only basis on which Wakana can give better advice.
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Old 2012-08-21, 04:59   Link #1099
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arya View Post
Sorry, probably I'm not getting it, but in general
Spoiler for not focused on the show:
Spoiler for personnal experience:



Quote:
Originally Posted by Blonto View Post
Besides, Wakana's mother isn't coming back, but Sawa can still be a jockey
No Sawa can't,and it's not the end of the world,that's the whole point of the episode.I'm with gohan on this one if some deus ex machina happens and she gets accepted I'd have a tough time accepting it.
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Old 2012-08-21, 05:30   Link #1100
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Things have been pretty realistic so far. They lost the choir competition, badminton guy lost the badminton match and Wakana mom didn't come back to life. So she probably won't get into jockey training school.
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