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View Poll Results: Macross Frontier - Episode 25 Rating
Perfect 10 133 39.82%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 81 24.25%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 32 9.58%
7 out of 10 : Good 27 8.08%
6 out of 10 : Average 11 3.29%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 10 2.99%
4 out of 10 : Poor 4 1.20%
3 out of 10 : Bad 3 0.90%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 1 0.30%
1 out of 10 : Painful 32 9.58%
Voters: 334. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2012-09-11, 01:56   Link #1781
magnuskn
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Join Date: Jul 2006
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Sure, sure. It'll be fun stomping Ranka fans into paste once again.
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Old 2012-09-11, 03:03   Link #1782
Yu Ominae
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The shipping wars is probably why I'm glad that I'm neutral and open and why I don't watch Macross much.

Although the temptation comes in at some points, I'm glad to fight them over and forget they exist.
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Old 2012-09-11, 07:05   Link #1783
BetoJR
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Oh, God... I think I'll sit this one out, myself.
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Old 2012-09-11, 07:09   Link #1784
LoveMeKags
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Join Date: Feb 2011
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Age: 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by cheesie View Post
Heh.

The Alto/Sheryl scene was a homage scene to Do You Remember Love, in reference to Hikaru's salute to his love, Misa.

People had posted a thorough step-by-step process of why it's impossible for Alto to have saluted Ranka as well, but the pictures had expired back in 2008 and I'd rather not pick it up.

It raised a big hoo-ha at the time it aired, but basically, both the English and Japanese speaking fandoms have come to the agreement that the salute was definitely for Sheryl.

Hm, I think I may have started something else here. At least it was on-topic.
The salute was to both girls because he was between both of them and stared ahead, not at one directly, then saluted to both.

Quote:
Originally Posted by magnuskn View Post
You have this obsession with telling us that the government would imprison and torture Ranka, if her connection to the Vajra were known. That is factually not what happened in the series when it became known just a few episodes later.

She was in government care after her abduction for quite a while. She could have told them at any time what happened.
Given that the government was also unaware of the full connection between Ranka and the Vajra because of Grace's deception, my point is still valid. They only knew what they were told, point blank. And had she told them the whole truth, there could be dire consequences. The government is not gonna tread lightly on a girl just because she seems innocent. In this case, since she has connections to the enemy that is trying to kill them in a stronger since than they'd anticipated, they would've used her as a tool three times harder than before and possibly even threatened her. If you need any proof of that, take Luca's case in the second movie as an example.

Quote:
LOL.

Just LOL.

Please google what "argument" means. It's not "wild fantasy".
It is fact. Why do you think so many artists are pissed off at their labeling companies?

Quote:
So, I guess that was a love declaration by Michael, too, since he made the actual heart?
It wasn't his design though. Alto appeared to be the only person who knew of the design and the others were just filled in. Once the design was complete, he shot through the heart. They had it all set up. Plus, it doesn't help your argument that Alto is shown staring at Ranka only after the heart. For all she knew by that ending reaction, Alto had declared his love for her.

Quote:
And, sorry, not buying that argument at all that she only wanted her song to for Alto but she still totally cared about Frontier.
The character's exact quote was "my songs are for Alto." She said nothing about not caring for Frontier. Don't put words into her mouth to justify your argument.

Quote:
Yeah, I am a bit facetious about Michael, although not by much. Michael died because Ranka could not get it together to control the Vajra. Full point. That she actually did manage to get herself together shortly after his death is not helping her position any.
LOL.

Just simply LOL.

So when he was stabbed by a Vajra and being sucked into space, she was supposed to jump into the void with no protection or gear to assist her and rescue him as Alto tried to? Honestly, you just ruined the whole point of your argument given that a) she was in shock from earlier and b) there was no manner of song that would've magically saved Michael from space.

Quote:
I am not blaming Ranka for unwittingly unleashing the Vajra larvaes on Frontier. She couldn't have known that they were there, she couldn't have known the exact effect her emotions would have on them.
Another LOL.

Yes; you did:
Quote:
- Episode 20: Ranka flips her shit about Sheryl and Alto having a moment and nearly destroys Frontier by exciting the swarms of Vajra larvaes which had hidden themselves in the sublevels. Can't control her negative emotions to calm the Vajra, can't work up any show of friendship when her best friend gets severely hurt right before her eyes, gets Michael ( and thousands of other people ) killed.
And ironically, it was already revealed in episode 14 that her negative or positive emotions affected the Vajra. The fact is: she didn't know it. After that episode's end, she didn't attach anything to it because it seemed unimportant. This is a give and take situation in which the taking of a life showed her the importance of her role. Don't patronize a character for learning as they go along. Put yourself in their shoes and realize that a viewer can never see or feel what a character does because they are not there.

Quote:
But I do blame her for not being able to compose herself enough fast enough to stop all that bloodshed. Her whole breakdown over Alto is ridiculous in the first place. Just one episode prior she was still commiting herself to protecting Frontier but in the same episode ( if you include the end of ep 18 ) that she comes to terms with her feelings for Alto she becomes so damned obsessed that she has a full fledged freak-out? Sorry, but that doesn't fly with me.
It was already quit clear that she had feelings for Alto and they'd developed into love. It was also quite clear that she cared enough to give him space and time to himself, unlike a certain other idol who shall remain nameless. However, she is also simply a girl who becomes overwhelmed by everything going on, and so fast too, and losing the support of people she can talk to, given that a) she never gets to speak with Ozma again after episode 17, b) she can't visit Nanase even at school due to her bodyguards, and c) she can't go to school as a typical teenager anymore nor spend time with friends. Her support group and the people she can talk to about important matters are all but yanked from her side. So in that respect, who would she speak to about Alto? It certainly wouldn't be Grace. She already knew by this point that Brera was trying to push her away from Alto, and for reasons she couldn't understand at the time. She wouldn't speak to Sheryl about it because the two of them hadn't been in the same room since episode 17. So by the end of the day, seeing the two of them on the roof after holding her head high for three gruesome episodes, she finally reaches a meltdown of emotions. She tried being strong that whole time. I give her credit for being able to be so independent for three whole episodes.

Quote:
And, hey, if she wanted Alto to come with her, maybe she should have told him something more effective than "I want to bring Ai-kun back to his friends". If she thought that there would be no chance that Alto would come with her, why have the meeting in the first place?
Again: LOL.

But seriously, have you actually watched the scene in which Ai-kun shows up? As soon as he appears, Alto flips out. He wasn't going to listen to her past that point. That was what she realized. And so, she left him. If he would not listen to her, why waste time? She had a mission to fulfill. It isn't her fault that Alto had to become emo in that moment. Don't blame her for him pitching an absolute fit and pointing a gun at his friend, who by the way also witnessed Michael's death. After all, if he'd listened, he probably would've understood. But he decided that he couldn't trust even her at that moment, and that was the downfall of the situation that ultimately led to a large misunderstanding until the end of the series. It isn't all her fault. It is partially his fault too.

Quote:
Come on, you Ranka people. Please pick an argument and stick with it. Either Ranka is a child, in which case her having a romance with Alto is highly inappropiate but she cannot be blamed for making tons of incredibly bad decisions. Or she is adult enough to have a romance but should also be treated as someone who has to take responsibility for her actions. You can't have her innocent and pure as the driven snow in regards to all of her misdeeds and an active competitor for romantic attention who should be treated seriously in that regard.
I am speaking of in her past, in her memories, she was only a kid then. Boy did you take that the wrong way. I never once stated in that sentence that Ranka's present self was a child.

Quote:
And you miss my point entirely. By her own perception ( and that of many others, but that's viewer stuff ) Ranka had lost Alto to Sheryl. Which is why I said that she wanted to put distance between themselves.
That is untrue for a) she didn't know how to face him and b) she didn't know how to admit her feelings in words.
I think you're mixing Ranka with Sheryl here. After all, Sheryl was the one who initially thought that Alto had chosen Ranka, and that continued long into the later episodes, although she'd never admit it verbally. I have evidence of this in the heart from episode 19, where Sheryl is shown being upset, believing in that little "performance" as you call it. For her character, that showed that both girls got the absolute wrong impression. So it is the man here who is literally juggling two hearts and he's oblivious. So it isn't like this is all one person's fault. It is a large miscommunication between the three.

Quote:
That has nothing to do with the fact that she left Frontier in a horrible situation, one which to Rankas best knowledge it had no way of getting out of.
Ranka had no idea of also knowing that Frontier would be even dire without her. For all she knew, leaving would mean Frontier would be spared, since the Vajra were after her. It is simple math there, my friend.

Quote:
Sorry, but I don't have to walk back from just simply stating the obvious truth. Look up your latest post just above and tell me that you don't do exactly what I told you do. You have a tendendy to take single sentences and write multiple paragraph answers to those, which makes it incredibly tiring to have a running argument with you, because responding in detail to those paragraphs produces huge post-monsters.
I don't care to answer to that but try to be civil. What you wrote was a personal attack. We are told to remain civil. I am attempt to do so. If I cross a line somewhere, feel free to tell me too, but I am trying to remain civil. I only ask you do the same.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozuma-Rii View Post
Interesting...
Hey, kags-sempai! wanna help here?
I'm sorry to say but each continuation of Macross is a salute to the original SDFM or DYRL. They are alternative universes of the original that take place years into the future. Each one has something to characterize the original series. For instance, Sheryl and Ranka both have attitudes and similar characteristics of Lynn Minmei; Michael is designed physically to be similar to Basara, and Klan Klang is a salute to Millia, just as Catherine is a remodel of Misa Hayase.
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Last edited by LoveMeKags; 2012-09-11 at 07:49.
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Old 2012-09-11, 07:14   Link #1785
BetoJR
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Age: 37
Oh God... What's this, I don't even...
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Old 2012-09-11, 07:58   Link #1786
Ozuma-Rii
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Join Date: Sep 2012
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Ok, Kags-sempai...
I was gonna ask whether you were going to help the Aruran side of the war then you went "DYRL is..."
Never mind though...
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Old 2012-09-11, 09:57   Link #1787
CrowKenobi
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Okay, this is the final reminder: please use the real estate that Tak has generously donated for the upcoming (pointless) discussion. To make sure that happens, I'm going to close this thread and state that if I find any of the (pointless) discussion anywhere else in this forum, I'll see to it that it gets removed.

Thank you.
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