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Old 2012-09-11, 05:51   Link #2221
Alhazad2003
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ShiroiRyu View Post
So it's the end of Zero ?
That was good the one shot. XD
Not quite, it's the end of Kazuha's story, but F: ZERO continues on. The next part shows the origins of one Arnett McMillan. Big difference from her Pandora days, in more ways than one. ^^;;
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Old 2012-09-11, 06:48   Link #2222
~Yami~
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eeehhh??? they only show us one Kazuha's battle???
I want to see her more....
is it really the end of her arc?
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Old 2012-09-12, 02:57   Link #2223
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too bad, we only see a little of Kazuha story

---------------------

about the main series:

some idea pop up in my brain, thinking:
1.Valkrye stronger as Pandora with battery support
2.Valkrye intend to surpass Pandora
3.Valkrye can't stay too far from the battery
4.Almost all in team 13 have Kazuha's stigma in their body
...............

could it be that the Valkrye need Kazuya to surpass Pandoras because he will become 'mobile battery' for them?
Kazuya's stigmata is the most compatible with his sister's after all, and due to Gengo disapproval of Kazuya and member of El Bridgett family relationship, Ouka also sent to be 'replacement' of Kazuya partner (both in Battle and life)

let's hope this team 13 discord, didn't lead to guro scene Eva-01 show us, where each team 13 member, try to absorb (eat) the others Stigmata to gain more compatibility with Kazuya and reunite all Heroic Stigma in one body, and turn into 'super Valkrye'
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Old 2012-09-20, 20:09   Link #2224
ShiroiRyu
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alhazad2003 View Post
Not quite, it's the end of Kazuha's story, but F: ZERO continues on. The next part shows the origins of one Arnett McMillan. Big difference from her Pandora days, in more ways than one. ^^;;
So it's more than 1 volume ?
Good, good, good.
Anyways, 106-107 out !
We are at what chapter in raw ?
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Old 2012-09-20, 20:11   Link #2225
Mura
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Spoiler for ch. 106-107:
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Old 2012-09-20, 21:56   Link #2226
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Attia deserved it. it doesn't even matter that Arnett is pissed. she couldn't handle Ticy, who is a shadow of Chiffon. The gap between Arnett and Charles is like the gap between Chiffon and the rest of the power 5.

sigh. Manga seems dull without Chiffon.
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Old 2012-09-21, 01:34   Link #2227
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Spoiler for c106-107:
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Old 2012-09-21, 01:42   Link #2228
Kleeyook
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Originally Posted by MrTerrorist View Post
Spoiler for c106-107:
Attila never changes as well, probably along with the rest of Elizabeth's clique besides Arnette. She deserves it.

The two sides are both assholes, so who's to blame? I can't sympathize with the victim if it's an asshole victim who asks for it. They both are so disillusioned thinking they are right and the rest are wrong.

BTW, why so much respect for Elizabeth when it's another girl who died saving Alasca base at that time, the death that might be avoided if Elizabeth asks for other pandoras' cooperation instead of starting everything on her own.
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Old 2012-09-21, 04:55   Link #2229
Alhazad2003
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Originally Posted by germanturkey View Post
Attia deserved it. it doesn't even matter that Arnett is pissed. she couldn't handle Ticy, who is a shadow of Chiffon. The gap between Arnett and Charles is like the gap between Chiffon and the rest of the power 5.

sigh. Manga seems dull without Chiffon.
The gap between Charles and Elizabeth was just as wide and she still lost. And as we've seen in the latest chapters, she's learned nothing from her defeat. And as the old saying goes, those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it. And I'd say it'd be poetic justice if Arnett defeated the arrogant midget and solidified her place as Elizabeth's successor. Oh yes, payback is coming, Charles Bonaparte, prepare to meet your Waterloo yet again.
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Old 2012-09-21, 05:24   Link #2230
~Yami~
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Attia is truly the only member I hate in Elizabeth's team...
but for this, she deserved my respect...

Charles lost her cool... that's why she did a horrible thing to her...
I just can't imagine it's really happening... I thought someone will actually stop her when she's doing that to Attia
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Old 2012-09-21, 05:51   Link #2231
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so much rage for a ball of meat
PANDORA regenerative ability (contributed by STIGMA) will restore it anyway.

And who's said this manga dull without Chiffon?
she's already trashed to the dust bin anyway, why don't let it go?
I don't quite understand human affinity to their past yet....still trying to dechiper it
Besides, she's just side character to begin with, which due to her popularity among fans receive a spin off (1st chronicle), unlike Kazuha that absolutely need her past revealed to understand main series more (zero)

just like Sid (Ice Age 2) says: "Sometimes you must let go of the past so you can have the future"

oh! about the series spinoff name, I got this feeling that the author want to name Kazuha as "First" (both because her story importance and starter of High End Skill) and Chiffon's as "2nd Chronicle" but then he late to realize the importance difference and already published Chiffon as "First Chronicle" and decide to rename Kazuha's back story as "Zero" since it's impossible to make her story as "2nd" to a clone backstory
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Old 2012-09-21, 14:00   Link #2232
Kleeyook
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Originally Posted by Alhazad2003 View Post
The gap between Charles and Elizabeth was just as wide and she still lost. And as we've seen in the latest chapters, she's learned nothing from her defeat. And as the old saying goes, those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it. And I'd say it'd be poetic justice if Arnett defeated the arrogant midget and solidified her place as Elizabeth's successor. Oh yes, payback is coming, Charles Bonaparte, prepare to meet your Waterloo yet again.
What!? You talk like a French-hater.

Elizabeth did win against Charles, at the cost of her limiter being blinded.

Well, I suppose if sacrificing her own limiter won't be much of a hassle in order to defeat someone superior than her like Charles then she truly won, ruthlessly...

If they fought one on one without interference, Elizabeth wouldn't win.

Also, I can hardly care about injury of a pandora when they can recover from half-dead over a few nights. I don't give a shit anymore after the loud-mouth pandora (Jessica or Rebecca? I can't remember) survived losing half of her body...

AT least Attila wasn't killed. Her limiter wasn't harmed...
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Old 2012-09-21, 16:08   Link #2233
germanturkey
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Originally Posted by Alhazad2003 View Post
The gap between Charles and Elizabeth was just as wide and she still lost. And as we've seen in the latest chapters, she's learned nothing from her defeat. And as the old saying goes, those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it. And I'd say it'd be poetic justice if Arnett defeated the arrogant midget and solidified her place as Elizabeth's successor. Oh yes, payback is coming, Charles Bonaparte, prepare to meet your Waterloo yet again.
its called plot shield. if arnett succeeds elizabeth in that way, then they would have gone nowhere, because the elizabeth they want to be like doesn't exist any more.
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Old 2012-09-21, 17:21   Link #2234
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The power deflation is just stupid. One of the '5 strongest' my ass. Got beaten up by Elizabeth through power of heart (one of the most stupid BS excuses for plot inconsistencies), got all worked up and had to put in so much effort in defeating a no name nobody, and now all indicators point to her about to get smacked by another nobody (in terms of power level). Seriously?
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Old 2012-09-22, 03:17   Link #2235
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Originally Posted by Kleeyook View Post
Attila never changes as well, probably along with the rest of Elizabeth's clique besides Arnette. She deserves it.

The two sides are both assholes, so who's to blame? I can't sympathize with the victim if it's an asshole victim who asks for it. They both are so disillusioned thinking they are right and the rest are wrong.

BTW, why so much respect for Elizabeth when it's another girl who died saving Alaska base at that time, the death that might be avoided if Elizabeth asks for other pandoras' cooperation instead of starting everything on her own.
Because Elizabeth was gathering evidence of Chevalier's crimes, went through proper channels with a proper protest, and was horribly tortured, and her family was horribly slandered to the point of destruction just to attempt a coverup.

BTW, she DID ask for backup, from Chiffon, and Chiffon sold her out.

Not only was Elizabeth's skill far less than Charles, Elizabeth was fighting with horrible nerve damage. As for Charles, we hate her because not just what she did to Attia, but because her "just follow orders" mindset leads to Dachau and Auschwitz. She's just too damn arrogant, and Chavalier worshipping to understand that.

"Their crimes would have been exposed anyway." Really? When they doctor evidence, torture witnesses with electro-shock to the point of permanent brain and nerve damage, AND slander the witness' family to the point of bankruptcy to defend their criminal activity will just magically "be exposed anyway?" HOW MANY NOVAS did Charles want Chevalier and that crazy doctor lady to make? Perhaps she wanted everything to blow up in a major city?

It wouldn't surprise me, she was thrown in the ghetto and abused, she might just have a grudge against "rich people" except for the "Chevalier god" that she worships. Even when his guilt is unavoidable, she still worships him as someone who can "do no wrong."

She's the one who is not worthy to be a pandora.
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Old 2012-09-22, 03:40   Link #2236
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Azure-Priest View Post
Because Elizabeth was gathering evidence of Chevalier's crimes, went through proper channels with a proper protest, and was horribly tortured, and her family was horribly slandered to the point of destruction just to attempt a coverup.

BTW, she DID ask for backup, from Chiffon, and Chiffon sold her out.

Not only was Elizabeth's skill far less than Charles, Elizabeth was fighting with horrible nerve damage. As for Charles, we hate her because not just what she did to Attia, but because her "just follow orders" mindset leads to Dachau and Auschwitz. She's just too damn arrogant, and Chavalier worshipping to understand that.

"Their crimes would have been exposed anyway." Really? When they doctor evidence, torture witnesses with electro-shock to the point of permanent brain and nerve damage, AND slander the witness' family to the point of bankruptcy to defend their criminal activity will just magically "be exposed anyway?" HOW MANY NOVAS did Charles want Chevalier and that crazy doctor lady to make? Perhaps she wanted everything to blow up in a major city?

It wouldn't surprise me, she was thrown in the ghetto and abused, she might just have a grudge against "rich people" except for the "Chevalier god" that she worships. Even when his guilt is unavoidable, she still worships him as someone who can "do no wrong."

She's the one who is not worthy to be a pandora.
well said *thumb up*

but strangely she's still chosen to be one of team 13, may be Gengo have something?
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Old 2012-09-22, 04:24   Link #2237
Kleeyook
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Originally Posted by Azure-Priest View Post
Because Elizabeth was gathering evidence of Chevalier's crimes, went through proper channels with a proper protest, and was horribly tortured, and her family was horribly slandered to the point of destruction just to attempt a coverup.

BTW, she DID ask for backup, from Chiffon, and Chiffon sold her out.

Not only was Elizabeth's skill far less than Charles, Elizabeth was fighting with horrible nerve damage. As for Charles, we hate her because not just what she did to Attia, but because her "just follow orders" mindset leads to Dachau and Auschwitz. She's just too damn arrogant, and Chavalier worshipping to understand that.

"Their crimes would have been exposed anyway." Really? When they doctor evidence, torture witnesses with electro-shock to the point of permanent brain and nerve damage, AND slander the witness' family to the point of bankruptcy to defend their criminal activity will just magically "be exposed anyway?" HOW MANY NOVAS did Charles want Chevalier and that crazy doctor lady to make? Perhaps she wanted everything to blow up in a major city?

It wouldn't surprise me, she was thrown in the ghetto and abused, she might just have a grudge against "rich people" except for the "Chevalier god" that she worships. Even when his guilt is unavoidable, she still worships him as someone who can "do no wrong."

She's the one who is not worthy to be a pandora.
Chiffon sold her out? Damn, I didn't notice when I read that arc. I thought she and her family got caught and met their fate because her attempt is too obvious for the villain to notice, and the chevalier are a bunch of jerks who don't give a shit in crushing someone who obviously try to expose their dirty activities.

I agree Charles is a bitch. But don't you think that Elizabeth's group is one such thing as well during the previous arcs? Overzealous girls who ignore the wrongdoing of their own clique but don't tolerate someone fighting them back. Satellizer might be a delinquent in their eyes, but most pandoras who pick a fight with her are in the wrong, yet they don't give a shit. It's double-standard, you know.

BTW, it's so normal that soldiers can't disobey their superior officers' command no matter how ridiculous it is, they have chance of going to court martial, their family going to correction or concentration camp. The same apply to shady organization created to monitor their own people like KGB or now CIA. The depressing world when you can't trust anyone. Hell,in Poland, the teachers (mostly Nazi or Commie subordinates) taught and encouraged the children in school to spy on their family's activity...

What Elizabeth did is honorable, since if she didn't start exposing the wrongdoing, it might never come to light, and the shits the crazy female doctor and chevalier did might result in something worse.

Still, Elizabeth and her clique (actually, it's mostly that bitch Attila) was harassing Satellizer for their own ego. Why would you care if the bitch got what she deserve, from another bitch?
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Old 2012-09-22, 06:32   Link #2238
liquidmetal
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I'm finding it terribly hard to emphasize with any of the characters at the moment.

Quite happy though to see Attia get what she deserved though from earlier parts of the manga.

As Kleeyook says there is a lot of double standards now just because newer characters have been introduced that are more powerful than the existing ones.
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Old 2012-09-22, 13:55   Link #2239
Alhazad2003
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Originally Posted by Kleeyook View Post
What!? You talk like a French-hater.

Elizabeth did win against Charles, at the cost of her limiter being blinded.

Well, I suppose if sacrificing her own limiter won't be much of a hassle in order to defeat someone superior than her like Charles then she truly won, ruthlessly...

If they fought one on one without interference, Elizabeth wouldn't win.

Also, I can hardly care about injury of a pandora when they can recover from half-dead over a few nights. I don't give a shit anymore after the loud-mouth pandora (Jessica or Rebecca? I can't remember) survived losing half of her body...

AT least Attila wasn't killed. Her limiter wasn't harmed...
Who said I was hating? I simply can't stand Charles, for reasons already stated.

And, sacrificing her own Limiter? Andre chose to push himself beyond his limits, he would've rather lose his eyesight than lose Elizabeth. No one told him to do it. And he's the one who told Elizabeth to keep fighting after she was initially felled. If not for him, she would've given up and probably been killed. Would that really have been better?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Seitsuki View Post
The power deflation is just stupid. One of the '5 strongest' my ass. Got beaten up by Elizabeth through power of heart (one of the most stupid BS excuses for plot inconsistencies), got all worked up and had to put in so much effort in defeating a no name nobody, and now all indicators point to her about to get smacked by another nobody (in terms of power level). Seriously?
I'm sorry if you find it so disappointing, though if you're expecting the strongest one to always win, I feel you're going to be disappointed further. It was more a case of Charles' arrogance than Elizabeth's persistence which led to her defeat. Elizabeth would've given up, yet Andre pressed her to fight on. And the rest is history.

And just because Charles clearly got hurt against Attia doesn't mean she struggled. It just shows how much Attia has improved, the same person who couldn't overcome the Novafied Pandoras during the tenth clash, in Pandora Mode no less.

As for her getting beaten by another "nobody," it goes back to the old saying: those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Azure-Priest View Post
Because Elizabeth was gathering evidence of Chevalier's crimes, went through proper channels with a proper protest, and was horribly tortured, and her family was horribly slandered to the point of destruction just to attempt a coverup.

BTW, she DID ask for backup, from Chiffon, and Chiffon sold her out.

Not only was Elizabeth's skill far less than Charles, Elizabeth was fighting with horrible nerve damage. As for Charles, we hate her because not just what she did to Attia, but because her "just follow orders" mindset leads to Dachau and Auschwitz. She's just too damn arrogant, and Chavalier worshipping to understand that.

"Their crimes would have been exposed anyway." Really? When they doctor evidence, torture witnesses with electro-shock to the point of permanent brain and nerve damage, AND slander the witness' family to the point of bankruptcy to defend their criminal activity will just magically "be exposed anyway?" HOW MANY NOVAS did Charles want Chevalier and that crazy doctor lady to make? Perhaps she wanted everything to blow up in a major city?

It wouldn't surprise me, she was thrown in the ghetto and abused, she might just have a grudge against "rich people" except for the "Chevalier god" that she worships. Even when his guilt is unavoidable, she still worships him as someone who can "do no wrong."

She's the one who is not worthy to be a pandora.
Right on!
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Old 2012-09-22, 14:43   Link #2240
Kleeyook
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^^ I think that if Charles just murdered Elizabeth right away then she wouldn't lose...

Well, I give up arguing about Andre and Elizabeth vs Charles. You're right after all. Elizabeth became determine and never gave up to fight Charles because of Andre.

But hey, Attila's personality is still as annoying as hell. Charles never learns, so does Attila. Attila's conversation with her own clique shows that she's shallow in regard to the situation with Team 13. Does she want Team 13 to come pay respect to their clique and hang out with other pandoras when they have their own training program organized by the higher ups?

I also thinks that Tricy is going overboard too. Chiffon ignores Satellizer's action because it's not her who start the fight, yet Tricy seems to antagonize Satellizer after Chiffon's gone simply because previously Satellizer broke many school rules, which was started by other pandoras who became bitches against her. But well, nothing happens yet.

And now trouble will start because everyone is jerk. Team 13 will be pitted against an entire school because of Charles and Attila's action. Yeah, Attila is at fault too. Remember that Charles also felt bad and trouble to face Attila who was in Elizabeth's clique so she tried to avoid her to avoid more trouble, yet Attila started acting almighty saying that Charles is a bitch who looks down and doesn't want to associate with other students (I think Attila said like team 13 as a whole is a bitch). You can't expect someone who's quite a sociopath to do well answering to Attila. Then Charles just lost her already loose self-restrain. Charles probably insulted Elizabeth mainly because she didn't teach her underlings well enough since Charles started talking about Elizabeth and insulting her right after Attila annoyed the hell out of her...

It shouldn't become this long of an argument. My whole point about this development is, Attila asks for it and she deserves what she asks for. She provoke a mad dog, of course she'd be bitten and possibly torn apart. Charles is a bitch, but Attila is too. Don't you remember that Attila lured Rana to fight against Satellizer with her lies, brought 2 more stronger pandoras in her team to beat Satellizer and Rana when they are both injured, and got away safely (probably a few scold from Elizabeth, but Elizabeth also antagonized Satellizer at that time). You really forgive her for that?

Now I hope Satellizer's asshole siscon younger brother will be the next one who got utterly crushed by another villain... Don't you think that let asshole teaching another asshole a harsh lesson is quite convenient because you wouldn't dirty your own hands for revenge, and the assholes got what they deserve?
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