AnimeSuki Forums

Register Forum Rules FAQ Members List Social Groups Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   AnimeSuki Forum > General > General Chat

Notices

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old 2012-10-04, 03:44   Link #941
Vexx
Obey the Darkly Cute ...
*Author
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: On the whole, I'd rather be in Kyoto ...
Age: 56
You're leaving out quite a few analyses that say Obama let Romney make all those false assertions on the opening night and every one of them is going to come back to haunt Romney in later debates (especially the ones where Romney raced to the center, contradicting things he told his "far right base").

Do I think that was a good tactic? Not necessarily. In debate, it isn't a good idea to let false or unsupported assertions go unchallenged.

So I give Obama a C- for debate technique, but I'll give Romney an F for the number of outright falsehoods. Not my opinion - but the opinion of a pile of independent fact checkers. He even repeated already debunked falsehoods. So it goes.
Vexx is offline  
Old 2012-10-04, 04:17   Link #942
Ithekro
Space Battleship
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Republic of California
Age: 36
I seem to recall in Simcity 2000, you'd pretty much run out of fund early on while the infrustrucre was incomplete. You'd have a fuctional city, but not truely a good one. A typical tactic was to raise the taxes really high for two years. A lot of people would leave, but the debt would go away and you could finish the infrustucture. After that you would lower the tax rates to minimum to break even and the people and businesses would flood back in. After they settled a little you would raise taxes a few precent until you notice people leaving again, then lower it by a percent or two and maintain that income for most of the rest of the game, as you would gain enough income to expand the city every year, ot replace things that needed replacing without too much of a wait...even it disasters (usually...unless whatever it was wiped out a huge area of your city, that you would have a multiyear problem. Especially with electrical coverage and replacing the vital services (police, fire, and medical) and whatever roadways were lost.

While the country probably wouldn't survive that, since there really isn't someplace we can move to, more income either while stopping spending, or increased income while using that income to rebuild the crumbling parts of the infrustructure, might work out. If the debt can be paid that the taxes lowered again so people can function...then raise taxes back up to provide a reserve for other incidents, or expansion when needed...rather that "oh lets use this extra money to fund this potentially useless program that will score us money but not really do anything for the country."
__________________
Dessler Soto, Banzai!
Ithekro is offline  
Old 2012-10-04, 05:46   Link #943
Vallen Chaos Valiant
Logician and Romantic
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Within my mind
Age: 33
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
You're leaving out quite a few analyses that say Obama let Romney make all those false assertions on the opening night and every one of them is going to come back to haunt Romney in later debates (especially the ones where Romney raced to the center, contradicting things he told his "far right base").

Do I think that was a good tactic? Not necessarily. In debate, it isn't a good idea to let false or unsupported assertions go unchallenged.

So I give Obama a C- for debate technique, but I'll give Romney an F for the number of outright falsehoods. Not my opinion - but the opinion of a pile of independent fact checkers. He even repeated already debunked falsehoods. So it goes.
Romney essentially kept Obama off balance by renouncing every one of his previously held views.

I guess the GOP don't mind, because they would see him change back tomorrow.
__________________
Vallen Chaos Valiant is offline  
Old 2012-10-04, 05:58   Link #944
GDB
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Age: 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
Audits to see how effective programs are and elimination for those that don't accomplish their mission.
As an auditor... that wouldn't accomplish much unless the level of fraud occurring was ridiculous. The amount of money going into some of these programs (Medicare and Military, especially) would inflate the tolerable misstatement to the point that millions, tens of millions, or possibly billions of dollars per account within the program would have to be wrong before it would be considered a material misstatement.
GDB is online now  
Old 2012-10-04, 06:10   Link #945
Solace
(ノಠ益ಠ)ノ彡┻━┻
*Moderator
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
That was pretty much my take on things as well. My guess is that Obama was preparing for the "I'm going to be firmly planted in the extreme right", and miscalculated on how far Romney would flip back. It's not that Obama didn't have good points (indeed people noted frequently both sides dumped figures like no tomorrow), but there was no real press to emphasize his differences from Romney. His strategy team probably figured Romney would do that for him, as he had been doing for months.

Still, the whole "winner/loser" thing is silly. The while thing was a train wreck in slow motion. The moderator was terrible, both sides couldn't give a single straight answer, facts were distorted and lies were repeated constantly.....ugh. Romney got a victory for being better than expected? That's a new low in debates.

Let's be perfectly honest here. It doesn't really matter what you believe politically, this election cycle has put front and center the joke that is modern politics.

So, this guy gets my vote:

__________________
Solace is offline  
Old 2012-10-04, 07:36   Link #946
DonQuigleone
Knight Errant
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Dublin, Ireland
Age: 25
Romney did come off better. But to be honest, I have no idea what he stands on.

I'd say we'll see a better performance from Obama next time, now that he knows what he's dealing with.

Anyway, Obama is probably weakest on domestic issues. It was always going to be difficult for things to go his way in this debate.
DonQuigleone is offline  
Old 2012-10-04, 08:07   Link #947
willx
Nyaaan~~
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Age: 30
Hm, I'm curious whether candidates have outright accused each other of lying during a debate before yet? I'd be amused to see that..
willx is offline  
Old 2012-10-04, 08:08   Link #948
Sumeragi
Banned
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Dai Korai Teikoku
That would not look "presidential".
Sumeragi is offline  
Old 2012-10-04, 08:13   Link #949
DonQuigleone
Knight Errant
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Dublin, Ireland
Age: 25
Well, Reagan said "There you go again"
DonQuigleone is offline  
Old 2012-10-04, 08:19   Link #950
Mr. DJ
Schwing!
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Central Texas
Age: 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
Greta Van Susteren is one of their somewhat more independent journalists and I'll actually credit her with the title "journalist" instead of "stupid moron"
certain individuals have a level headedness to them...but the overall company? BAH!
Mr. DJ is offline  
Old 2012-10-04, 08:21   Link #951
Sumeragi
Banned
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Dai Korai Teikoku
Quote:
Originally Posted by DonQuigleone View Post
Well, Reagan said "There you go again"
Which is different from saying "You're lying". What Reagan did was making us of Carter's mistake to show Carter's problem. Outright accusing the other of lying is more like a counterattack that has a high potential of failure and backlash.
Sumeragi is offline  
Old 2012-10-04, 08:27   Link #952
Xagzan
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Let the fact checking begin

http://factcheck.org/2012/10/dubious...-declarations/

It was fun to hear the ol' death panels myth resurrected, if draped in a different garb.
Xagzan is offline  
Old 2012-10-04, 08:41   Link #953
DonQuigleone
Knight Errant
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Dublin, Ireland
Age: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sumeragi View Post
Which is different from saying "You're lying". What Reagan did was making us of Carter's mistake to show Carter's problem. Outright accusing the other of lying is more like a counterattack that has a high potential of failure and backlash.
Well,h he didn't say "you lied", but the gist was the same.

Though it's problematic to debate facts in a debate format. Debates based on what is factual, and what isn't, rapidly become tedious.
DonQuigleone is offline  
Old 2012-10-04, 08:43   Link #954
Sumeragi
Banned
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Dai Korai Teikoku
You can disregard the gist, since how you say things is about as important as the content in broadcasted debates. Think of it as the difference between judo and karate: You can either use the opponent's force against that opponent and thus avoid getting damages, or you go for a hit and potentially get backlash.
Sumeragi is offline  
Old 2012-10-04, 09:00   Link #955
Shay
Monarch Programmer
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Liverpool
Age: 32
Come on America - give the guy another term. It takes time to clean up such a mess.
__________________
Current Anime - Attack on Titan
Current Manga - Naruto
Current Book - Waiting for War of the Roses
Current Album - Vessel by Twenty One Pilots
Shay is offline  
Old 2012-10-04, 09:04   Link #956
Ridwan
Got A Bad Desire
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: قلوب المؤمنين
Here's some gem quote I got from another place which I find highly irrefutable :

Spoiler for Presidential debates are....:
__________________
Ridwan is offline  
Old 2012-10-04, 09:10   Link #957
Paranoid Android
Underweight Food Hoarder
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Kitch-Water and T.O., Canada
Age: 23
Send a message via MSN to Paranoid Android
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shay View Post
Come on America - give the guy another term. It takes time to clean up such a mess.
Or for us pessimists, vote the one that's going to ruin the nation slower.
Paranoid Android is offline  
Old 2012-10-04, 09:25   Link #958
Dr. Casey
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Tennessee
Age: 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aegir View Post
Here's some gem quote I got from another place which I find highly irrefutable :

Spoiler for Presidential debates are....:
Your avatar is extremely distracting. >_>
Dr. Casey is offline  
Old 2012-10-04, 09:27   Link #959
DonQuigleone
Knight Errant
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Dublin, Ireland
Age: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr. Casey View Post
Your avatar is extremely distracting. >_>
Bouncey, Bouncey, Bouncey, Bouncey....
DonQuigleone is offline  
Old 2012-10-04, 10:07   Link #960
Kaioshin Sama
Banned
 
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Neither Here nor There
Age: 29
Send a message via MSN to Kaioshin Sama
Man the democrats seem to be trying really hard to give the election back to Romney now and it almost seems like the race has become one towards becoming the most milquetoast and deceptive candidate one can possibly be. Then again these televised presidential debates have become something of a sham (the redneck patriot centerpiece behind the candidates on the stage, the talking down to viewers and each other). They've basically turned it into a form of night time entertainment and yet it's something that people should be taking seriously. I just can't help but look at the U.S these days and go "wow you guys are so done". The candidates are terrible and liars, the electorate doesn't know jack shit about what's really going on and is just going to vote for whoever says the nicest sounding things, the news is concerned with petty partisanship rather than getting the facts out there and seems to be outright trying to manipulate the election so that the perception is that it's as close as possible so that viewers still tune in and don't think it's a done deal and they don't need to watch the news anymore to keep up with the race, it's almost like it's a game at this point. Like a high school student council election. At this rate no matter who wins this election it's still going to be bad, it's just a matter of levels you're looking to control at this point. Do you want things to stay exactly the same or more than likely get worse under Romney. Does the country sink together in the short term, or does one side stay afloat off the backs of the already unfortunate and then sink a few years later anyway. Those are really the options now. Meanwhile China must be in their absolute glory watching this unfold.

Before this debate I'd have said that Obama is a decent candidate, now honestly I kind of think they both pretty much suck and don't want to talk about or deal with the facts and that a vote for Obama is basically just not a vote for Romney at this point. Brutal!
Kaioshin Sama is offline  
Closed Thread

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:11.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
We use Silk.