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Old 2012-10-15, 01:54   Link #921
Graveyard Duck
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ogon_bat View Post
“A society that will trade a little liberty for a little order will lose both, and deserve neither”. Thomas Jefferson quotes
I have to wonder about the credibility of one who misquotes Ben Franklin and attributes it to Thomas Jefferson. The quote was actually "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."

The ah... essential qualifiers are highlighted in bold.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaoru Chujo View Post
It's a big problem to kill people based on what they might do rather than what they have actually done.
It is not a problem at all: The authority to kill people based on what they might do is an essential respect that society must pay to the brave men and women who dedicate their lives to protecting us.

Let's look at a hypothetical scenario: A police officer on patrol spots a car that is weaving erratically. He turns on his lights and siren and follows the car. The car stops on the side of a street, upon which a person (the suspect) exits the car and starts to run away at top speed. The police exits his car and gives chase. After five minutes of running, the police corners the suspect in a dead end. The police pulls out his gun and aims it at the suspect. The police orders, in a clear and loud voice, for the man to put his hands in the air and turn around. The man turns around, but instead of putting his hands in the air, he reaches into his coat.

At this point, many jurisdictions will allow the police officer to open fire on the assumption that the suspect will extract a deadly weapon. At this point, the suspect has certainly done nothing that would earn him a capital sentence or life imprisonment in most jurisdictions.

Let's continue the hypothetical. Suppose the police does not shoot immediately. The suspect then pulls from his coat a pistol.

At this point, the vast majority of jurisdictions will allow the police officer to open fire on the assumption that the suspect will shoot the police officer. At this point, the suspect has certainly not shot the police officer yet, nor has he done anything to earn him a capital sentence or life imprisonment in most jurisdictions.

It is commonly accepted for police officers to use lethal force based on what a suspect might do, so long as the circumstances give those impending actions a high probability of occurring. If Psycho-Pass can accurately add to the assessment of such impending actions, I see no reason not to use it in determining whether the police officers are allowed to use lethal force.

Frankly, I am shocked at the number of people in this topic who appear unable to accept the idea that the safety of our police officers is more important than the safety of people who are about to commit violent crimes.
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Old 2012-10-15, 02:21   Link #922
whitecloud
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just for kicks....if a person like urobuchi gen, dio brando from jojo, or just try to think any other character you want to try...what would their reading be...

just think about it....

would it warrant paralyzer or go straight to lethal mode...

my guess...

Akane..: oh who's that...let's see his CC
(reading Dio Brando that is passing them on the street) or (reading urobuchi gen sitting in the bench at the public park)
Dominator : CC reading 9000, safety unlocked, Lethal mode initiated - aim carefully
Akane : no way...this must be wrong...shinya?
Shinya : eh..it's right..i dont think we need to wait for sybil judgement on this...SHOOT him !!

P.S : oh yeah...some nice pic...what do you think..similar.. yes? (got that from forum next door)

Last edited by whitecloud; 2012-10-15 at 02:42.
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Old 2012-10-15, 02:57   Link #923
Tenchi Ryu
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Graveyard Duck View Post
Frankly, I am shocked at the number of people in this topic who appear unable to accept the idea that the safety of our police officers is more important than the safety of people who are about to commit violent crimes.
Not even just the police, but other people in general. That one person can cause damage to multiple people, so its a lot more efficient to take that one threat out instead of creating more threats. This is the decision the computer guns come to.
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Old 2012-10-15, 03:36   Link #924
whitecloud
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Another add on...NOW im absolutely certain that Akane is Yuni after she grown up changing her name and getting job as a police leaving the mafia world....



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Old 2012-10-15, 07:39   Link #925
Cosmic Eagle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Graveyard Duck View Post


It is not a problem at all: The authority to kill people based on what they might do is an essential respect that society must pay to the brave men and women who dedicate their lives to protecting us.

Let's look at a hypothetical scenario: A police officer on patrol spots a car that is weaving erratically. He turns on his lights and siren and follows the car. The car stops on the side of a street, upon which a person (the suspect) exits the car and starts to run away at top speed. The police exits his car and gives chase. After five minutes of running, the police corners the suspect in a dead end. The police pulls out his gun and aims it at the suspect. The police orders, in a clear and loud voice, for the man to put his hands in the air and turn around. The man turns around, but instead of putting his hands in the air, he reaches into his coat.

At this point, many jurisdictions will allow the police officer to open fire on the assumption that the suspect will extract a deadly weapon. At this point, the suspect has certainly done nothing that would earn him a capital sentence or life imprisonment in most jurisdictions.

Let's continue the hypothetical. Suppose the police does not shoot immediately. The suspect then pulls from his coat a pistol.

At this point, the vast majority of jurisdictions will allow the police officer to open fire on the assumption that the suspect will shoot the police officer. At this point, the suspect has certainly not shot the police officer yet, nor has he done anything to earn him a capital sentence or life imprisonment in most jurisdictions.

It is commonly accepted for police officers to use lethal force based on what a suspect might do, so long as the circumstances give those impending actions a high probability of occurring. If Psycho-Pass can accurately add to the assessment of such impending actions, I see no reason not to use it in determining whether the police officers are allowed to use lethal force.

Frankly, I am shocked at the number of people in this topic who appear unable to accept the idea that the safety of our police officers is more important than the safety of people who are about to commit violent crimes.
That is not the point....

No one would doubt the right of a military or law enforcement personnel to defend him or herself. But was that the issue here?

Which proper officer would instead of allowing the victim to calm down, proceed to level a weapon and said victim and proceed to pull the trigger?

That is a foolish aggravation of the situation....self defence everyone has a right to, but avoiding harming unnecessarily....That's why this system is screwed up. It doesn't allow that. It's either that or the enforcers just plain suck.
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Old 2012-10-15, 07:54   Link #926
halibonga
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first ep was impressive, nothing less from something written by urobuchi gen
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Old 2012-10-15, 08:22   Link #927
mechalord
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Hot darn... is this a good budget, gritty scifi anime?

How long has it been?

This has potential...to very badass.
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Old 2012-10-15, 08:25   Link #928
MartianMage
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cosmic Eagle View Post
That is not the point....

No one would doubt the right of a military or law enforcement personnel to defend him or herself. But was that the issue here?

Which proper officer would instead of allowing the victim to calm down, proceed to level a weapon and said victim and proceed to pull the trigger?

That is a foolish aggravation of the situation....self defence everyone has a right to, but avoiding harming unnecessarily....That's why this system is screwed up. It doesn't allow that. It's either that or the enforcers just plain suck.
The victim has a psycho pass of latent criminal... and as Masaoka said "that's why paralyzer exists" he was going to paralyze the victim and take her into custody for treatment based on the psycho pass.
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Kyubey: Perhaps the same could be said of all religions.
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Old 2012-10-15, 08:40   Link #929
mechalord
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Psycho-Pass... it's a pun...Psychopath.


Society has grouped criminality with mental illness. Criminals and the mentally ill are disposed of, forcefully medicated, and killed for the "good of the public."

The victim was traumatized by her rape and torture and the system that gauges mental health deemed her too mentally unstable to remain alive.


I like this sort of scifi. Sane people do insane things to criminals and mentally ill in the name of maintaining peace and order (sanity).
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Old 2012-10-15, 08:45   Link #930
Cosmic Eagle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MartianMage View Post
The victim has a psycho pass of latent criminal... and as Masaoka said "that's why paralyzer exists" he was going to paralyze the victim and take her into custody for treatment based on the psycho pass.
That's the issue at any rate...Whether the system does more harm than good. Not officers' rights to defend themselves


When it comes down to question of self-defence from the POV of the person being threatened it's rather clear cut.
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Old 2012-10-15, 09:00   Link #931
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MartianMage View Post
The victim has a psycho pass of latent criminal... and as Masaoka said "that's why paralyzer exists" he was going to paralyze the victim and take her into custody for treatment based on the psycho pass.
Even admitting that she needs to be brought in there's ways to arrest someone (who at that point is weaponless) that don't involve paralyzing that person.
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Old 2012-10-15, 09:00   Link #932
Marcus H.
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Quote:
I like this sort of scifi. Sane people do insane things to criminals and mentally ill in the name of maintaining peace and order (sanity).
But they are the psychopaths.
Cue suicides among the main cast.
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Old 2012-10-15, 09:14   Link #933
MartianMage
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Quote:
Originally Posted by totoum View Post
Even admitting that she needs to be brought in there's ways to arrest someone (who at that point is weaponless) that don't involve paralyzing that person.
Just following procedures for latent criminals. If the victim didn't have a latent criminal reading I doubt Masaoka would even be taking precautionary measures.
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Homura: Die monster! You don't belong in this world!
Kyubey: It was not by my hand that I am once again given flesh. I was called here by humans who wish to pay me tribute.
Homura: Tribute? You steal girls's souls, and make them your slaves!
Kyubey: Perhaps the same could be said of all religions.
Homura: Your words are as empty as your soul! Lolis ill-needs a savior such as you!
Kyubey: What is a loli? A miserable little pile of moe! But enough talk...have at you!
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Old 2012-10-15, 10:05   Link #934
mangamuscle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TinyRedLeaf View Post
That's an idealistic aphorism with very little practical use in daily reality, and I don't believe Jefferson was an advocate for anarchy. Just the mere act of living together as a society requires the surrendering of some individual liberties. It's not a question of whether or not to give up some freedoms, but rather a question of how much to give up.
TBT I don't really know if you are serious or just a troll.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Graveyard Duck View Post
I have to wonder about the credibility of one who misquotes Ben Franklin and attributes it to Thomas Jefferson. The quote was actually "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
It was jefferson (who modifieed the quote in different speeches), do your homework.
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Old 2012-10-15, 10:25   Link #935
totoum
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MartianMage View Post
Just following procedures for latent criminals. If the victim didn't have a latent criminal reading I doubt Masaoka would even be taking precautionary measures.
But that's the thing,if it is the procedure (not 100% sure of that btw) then my issue with it is that I don't think being a latent criminal is enough to warrant being paralyzed on the spot with no questions asked.

Take the rapist,when he was detected with a high CC,a team wasn't sent right away,he was offered the choice to receive treatment,it's only when he refused that a team was sent.
With what you're saying the woman wouldn't even be given that choice,she'd be brought in by force right away.
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Old 2012-10-15, 11:24   Link #936
MartianMage
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Quote:
Originally Posted by totoum View Post
But that's the thing,if it is the procedure (not 100% sure of that btw) then my issue with it is that I don't think being a latent criminal is enough to warrant being paralyzed on the spot with no questions asked.

Take the rapist,when he was detected with a high CC,a team wasn't sent right away,he was offered the choice to receive treatment,it's only when he refused that a team was sent.
With what you're saying the woman wouldn't even be given that choice,she'd be brought in by force right away.
Probably because she has a PP of 162. Ginoza states that the criminal is "far enough gone that we don't need to wait for Sibyl Judgement" at PP of 126.

Just some notes I have...
Spoiler for notes:

yes I have nothing to do today :P
__________________
Homura: Die monster! You don't belong in this world!
Kyubey: It was not by my hand that I am once again given flesh. I was called here by humans who wish to pay me tribute.
Homura: Tribute? You steal girls's souls, and make them your slaves!
Kyubey: Perhaps the same could be said of all religions.
Homura: Your words are as empty as your soul! Lolis ill-needs a savior such as you!
Kyubey: What is a loli? A miserable little pile of moe! But enough talk...have at you!

Last edited by MartianMage; 2012-10-15 at 14:24.
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Old 2012-10-15, 11:36   Link #937
Scarletknive
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whitecloud View Post
just for kicks....if a person like urobuchi gen, dio brando from jojo, or just try to think any other character you want to try...what would their reading be...

just think about it....

would it warrant paralyzer or go straight to lethal mode...

my guess...

Akane..: oh who's that...let's see his CC
(reading Dio Brando that is passing them on the street) or (reading urobuchi gen sitting in the bench at the public park)
Dominator : CC reading 9000, safety unlocked, Lethal mode initiated - aim carefully
Akane : no way...this must be wrong...shinya?
Shinya : eh..it's right..i dont think we need to wait for sybil judgement on this...SHOOT him !!

P.S : oh yeah...some nice pic...what do you think..similar.. yes? (got that from forum next door)
Spoiler for Size:


Gen was only writing stories... He can't be a murderer unless he REALLY kill someone, or murderous intent.(He just loves to write dark or SOL stories... and Fate series.)

How about what if he sees Kenshiro from HnK? What will the Dominator think?
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Old 2012-10-15, 12:01   Link #938
bastek66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whitecloud View Post
Another add on...NOW im absolutely certain that Akane is Yuni after she grown up changing her name and getting job as a police leaving the mafia world....



Welp. She should be fired.
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Old 2012-10-15, 12:12   Link #939
Kaioshin Sama
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I wonder if it's really necessary for the lethal setting to make the target explode violently all over the place and make a massive mess to clean up. Wouldn't it just be easier to have it deliver some sort of shock to the nervous system that causes brain death?
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Old 2012-10-15, 12:21   Link #940
MartianMage
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Cause it won't be complete without the gore!
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Homura: Die monster! You don't belong in this world!
Kyubey: It was not by my hand that I am once again given flesh. I was called here by humans who wish to pay me tribute.
Homura: Tribute? You steal girls's souls, and make them your slaves!
Kyubey: Perhaps the same could be said of all religions.
Homura: Your words are as empty as your soul! Lolis ill-needs a savior such as you!
Kyubey: What is a loli? A miserable little pile of moe! But enough talk...have at you!
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