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Old 2012-10-25, 14:28   Link #401
Kirarakim
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4Tran View Post
The original anime turned too much into the Usagi Show; and while Usagi is really cool, it's be nice to spread the love to the other characters as well..
I only watched random episodes of the original anime but I am reading the manga for the first time (as it is being released by Kodansha) and I could level this criticism at the manga too *shrugs*

Not sure how much more focus is on Usagi in the old anime but it doesn't seem like the rest of the cast gets enough focus in the manga to me.

But maybe this is just my bias talking because while Usagi is fine, she is the least interesting of the Sailor Senshi to me.

Also from a first time reader's perspective I don't think Sailor Moon manga is that dark. Granted I guess I wouldn't say it's for small children, but I think its perfectly appropriate for a young adult audience.
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Old 2012-10-25, 16:59   Link #402
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Originally Posted by Lota View Post
See, I don't think little kids are the target audience here. Sailor Moon is a name that is very nostalgic, it brings back a lot of memories. While children may choose to watch it or not, the main audience will be those people, who watched the show in the 90s, people who became fans over a decade ago. And there are a loooooot of people like that (myself included), guided by nostalgia and curiosity to watch this.

As for the anime itself, I too hope that they follow the manga this time. As the audience this time around will be older, they'll be able to show the darker and more mature stuff. Though the pacing was a little fast, I hope they will still follow the manga closely, because I found it rather good
Hmm, I don't quite I agree. I think their main target is to recruit the new, younger audience that are out there right now. Although many of the older, previous fans may watch for nostalgia reasons, it will be the new, younger generation that will drive the franchise forward now. Heck, I won't be jumping out there buying SM stickers or pillows like I used to but the new, younger fans will.

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Originally Posted by SkullFaerie View Post
... and ideally, they might make me actually like Mamoru, although that's maybe a bit of a stretch
SM was my first taste of anime, so I really liked Mamoru when I first watched the show but now...having gone through the likes of Luka (UraBoku), Tomoe (Kamisama Kiss), and many others...yeah, Mamoru is no longer the bishie I viewed him to be. Unless he has a complete make-over and personality change. LOL. (...dang, that just made me sound so shallow ).
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Old 2012-10-25, 17:02   Link #403
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If you mean anime only yes, but manga then is a big NO, I find Mamoru far better in the manga and his relationship with Usagi is far better than actual shoujos...
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Old 2012-10-25, 17:11   Link #404
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Although Mamoru isn't my favorite character I do like how he is a support for Usagi instead of the other way around. It's a nice twist I think on a more standard relationship.
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Old 2012-10-25, 18:47   Link #405
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Originally Posted by momobunny View Post
While I agree with this (Usagi is my favorite character but I love when the entire cast gets equal spotlight), I just find it funny since the series is Sailor Moon. It basically is The Usagi Show since it's already named after her. :P
That's probably an artifact of Sailor Moon being the first team-based Magical Girl combat show. Bishoujo Senshi Sailor Moon is only a minor change from Code Name Sailor V, so it seems like a natural progression.

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Originally Posted by Kirarakim View Post
I only watched random episodes of the original anime but I am reading the manga for the first time (as it is being released by Kodansha) and I could level this criticism at the manga too *shrugs*

Not sure how much more focus is on Usagi in the old anime but it doesn't seem like the rest of the cast gets enough focus in the manga to me.

But maybe this is just my bias talking because while Usagi is fine, she is the least interesting of the Sailor Senshi to me.
I haven't read the manga, but it gets pretty bad in the anime. It does seem like the creators were trying to find ways of making the other Senshi relevant, but it was a bit of a losing battle. They didn't know what to do with Mamoru, so they ended up putting him on a plane in Stars.

And Usagi's my favorite of the Senshi! She's quite different by the end of the anime; sadly, she's also the only one who gets to do much growing (excepting Chibiusa, but she doesn't count).
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Old 2012-10-25, 20:32   Link #406
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Originally Posted by 4Tran View Post
And Usagi's my favorite of the Senshi! She's quite different by the end of the anime; sadly, she's also the only one who gets to do much growing (excepting Chibiusa, but she doesn't count).
From what I've seen this is the exactly the same in the manga. Of course there are a few more volumes to go so this can change but I don't think there is very much focus at all on the other Senshi. And just like you said the only other one who gets a lot of attention is Chibiusa

I mean the other Senshi certainly have their moments but the focus & character development is primarily on Usagi. This is her story.

From what I've heard about anime Mamoru though the manga version is definitely an improvement. He's still a bit boring though I think

I am fine with the anime following the manga but I wouldn't mind if they expanded the other Senshi's roles just a bit (although if they did that would be filler).
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Old 2012-10-25, 21:08   Link #407
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wilfriback View Post
If you mean anime only yes, but manga then is a big NO, I find Mamoru far better in the manga and his relationship with Usagi is far better than actual shoujos...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirarakim View Post
I mean the other Senshi certainly have their moments but the focus & character development is primarily on Usagi. This is her story.

From what I've heard about anime Mamoru though the manga version is definitely an improvement. He's still a bit boring though I think

I am fine with the anime following the manga but I wouldn't mind if they expanded the other Senshi's roles just a bit (although if they did that would be filler).
Yes, manga!Mamoru is a lot better than his anime counterpart. At least in the manga, there is some development about his past and a separate life away from Usagi (sort of) but despite being the main male protagonist, I felt there was still quite a lack of development for him. (But then the same thing can be said about Usagi as well - her manga version is a lot better than her anime counterpart).

And I do agree that there is very little development of the other characters as well. The side characters from SM feels very much flat. It is sometimes hinted that there's something more to their own individual stories but it was never followed through.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirarakim View Post
Although Mamoru isn't my favorite character I do like how he is a support for Usagi instead of the other way around. It's a nice twist I think on a more standard relationship.
Yes, that is a theme that I rarely see in manga or anime. At the moment, I can't think of any other example where the male protagonist supports the female protagonist like this. I'm sure there are but I can't think of one right now.
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Old 2012-10-25, 22:15   Link #408
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wilfriback View Post
If you mean anime only yes, but manga then is a big NO, I find Mamoru far better in the manga
Yeah, me too. He's way more affectionate with her than he is in the anime. Sometimes it feels almost like he treats her like his little sister in the anime. o_o

The manga was also better in how Usagi and Mamoru's romance was executed. They began to fall BEFORE finding out each other's identities, whereas in the anime it was " I hate you! What? Omg, you were THAT person the whole time!? Now I LOVE you!"

.......I didn't really like.....that. And Chiibi FEEDS on anime romance. Totally lives for it. But it's definitely not one of the Sailormoon anime's stronger points concerning how it was brought to fruition. It felt a little forced and not genuine. Don't get me wrong-their whole past life thing together WAS very lovely and romantic. But.......the manga did a better job showing that they loved each other as normal kids instead of "because I had a crush on your OTHER identity". Princess Tutu and Kaitou St. Tail on the other hand, were great for tackling this exact issue; it bothered Ahiru and Meimi a great deal that their crushes only seemed to like their magical identities. Especially Meimi.

MamoruxUsagi wasn't ever a strong ship of mine. To be honest, I loved her with male!Seiya in Stars. Because they were teens doing normal teenager things and coming to like each other just from that. It was very cute!
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Old 2012-10-26, 06:06   Link #409
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As for the UsagixMamoru romance, I think Chiibi nailed it on the head

And I have to admit that even as a kid, I never saw the appeal of Mamoru...
Always thought he was boring and couldn't understand what Usagi could possibly see in him. I think my precise objections were that he was "embarrassing, weak and boring"- I was clearly a child with very high standards in men and a bit liberal with the harshness- what can I say?!
Now, if I watched it today, I'd probably think he was alright but unremarkable - especially when male!Seiya is so much more fun to watch. But there's nothing essentially wrong with the character, he's just not particularly interesting: which is okay, the story is about the girls, he doesn't need to stand out.

But honestly, if there was one thing this show could fix compared to the original, it should be decent focus and distribution of powers for the entire cast. In the end, not only was the story Usagi's, but so was every battle. I couldn't take the rest of the cast seriously at some point, realising they were only there to weaken whoever they were facing enough for Usagi to deliver a convenient killing blow. Some "guardians" they were


Quote:
Originally Posted by PreSage View Post
Yes, that is a theme that I rarely see in manga or anime. At the moment, I can't think of any other example where the male protagonist supports the female protagonist like this. I'm sure there are but I can't think of one right now.
but every magical girl anime (or: every shojo anime that doesn't focus on romance as it's major plot point/ every show with a predominantly female cast) does this. Look at the male cast in Wedding Peach or Mermaid Melody, Rose of Versailles, Utena (sort of), AKB0048, Kaito Jeanne, you name it.
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Old 2012-10-26, 09:38   Link #410
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Yeah, most female combat anime do that, it's mroe difficult to find ones in which the male character is not the center of some sorts of harem, tho.
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Old 2012-10-26, 09:50   Link #411
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Rose of Versailles is a great example and I actually think Andre is a great character.
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Old 2012-10-26, 10:57   Link #412
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Originally Posted by SkullFaerie View Post
but every magical girl anime (or: every shojo anime that doesn't focus on romance as it's major plot point/ every show with a predominantly female cast) does this. Look at the male cast in Wedding Peach or Mermaid Melody, Rose of Versailles, Utena (sort of), AKB0048, Kaito Jeanne, you name it.
They do in a sense but I don't see it as strongly as I do with Mamoru supporting Usagi in the SM anime. But then, Usagi did start out as one needing quite a bit of support, especially in the anime.

Hmm, I haven't seen Rose of Versailles...sounds interesting, maybe I'll take a look.
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Old 2012-10-26, 11:09   Link #413
4Tran
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I think that this version of Sailor Moon will be more balanced than the original anime. Pretty Guardian Sailor Moon has already demonstrated how it can be done.

Quote:
Originally Posted by maximilianjenus View Post
Yeah, most female combat anime do that, it's mroe difficult to find ones in which the male character is not the center of some sorts of harem, tho.
It's not that difficult - you just have to watch better shows!

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Originally Posted by PreSage View Post
Hmm, I haven't seen Rose of Versailles...sounds interesting, maybe I'll take a look.
It's really quite good; especially if you're familiar with French history. Has there been any news about the movie, or has Toei dropped the ball on that?
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Old 2012-10-26, 11:11   Link #414
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Rose of Versailles will be streaming on Viki in December (first ep is already up as a preview)

Anyways it's totally worth a watch. Great stuff!
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Old 2012-10-26, 16:53   Link #415
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SkullFaerie View Post
As for the UsagixMamoru romance, I think Chiibi nailed it on the head
Doumo

Quote:
And I have to admit that even as a kid, I never saw the appeal of Mamoru...
Always thought he was boring and couldn't understand what Usagi could possibly see in him.
He IS boring! D: Very. He's just sorta....."meh". (The rose-flinging-masked-man-thing is just so cheesy) And I normally go gaga over anime boys with black hair!

Quote:
Kaito Jeanne, you name it.
Kaitou SINDBAD.......*drool*
That's more my type of hero! He is so badass <3
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Old 2012-10-30, 07:58   Link #416
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I'm super excited i hope they show more of sailor saturn and sailor cosmos.plus i would love to see the story line just like the manga
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Old 2012-10-30, 10:47   Link #417
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For a female combat anime I don't remember there being a whole lot. In fact it was probably the single worst handled aspect of the show and I even remember finding it lackluster and questionable even as a really young kid. Typically most fights went something like Sailor Moon delivers a speech to monster, monster immediately starts attacking Senshi, they spaz out and just get knocked around a bit almost comedically and THEN Tuxedo Mask shows up, throws a rose, issues some words of encouragement and disappears after which the Senshi start an attack chain of stock footage that usually ends in some giant heart or moon shaped thing colliding with the monster.

At times it could feel so detached and formulaic that it never really felt like anybody was engaging in any real combat. Hopefully they can do something to change that with the new one and give the Senshi at least a little more edge. Actual choreagraphy for the battles against monsters would help instead of the reliance on stills of the Senshi getting beaten around and stock footage of their attacks.

The appeal of Mamoru for me is that he has one of the single most experienced and legendary anime voice actors of all time playing him in Tohru Furuya. He's extremely well rounded in pretty much every performance I've ever heard him in and always a bonus to have on a show. Other than that the character doesn't really go much of anywhere until the S season in my opinion since the first season is about him finding out who he actually is and then immediately into the start of the R season he forgets it all again and then for the rest of the Black Moon saga he's actively trying to avoid Usagi and thus rarely factors in. It's only at the start of S that their relationship actually starts to go anywhere interesting, but again it's squandered one last time in Stars where he's out of it for half of the show.

I think I recall hearing that Kuniko Ikuhara did not like Mamoru for whatever reason and didn't want to use him cause he thought he'd be a distraction so hopefully that's something that can be remedied with this version as well if they are going to use him as I don't think the character or actor himself was boring, just the manner in which he was used or rather not used. There's a lot of things that were wrong with the original that this remake could serve to remedy if I'm being honest.

Last edited by Kaioshin Sama; 2012-10-30 at 10:59.
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Old 2012-10-30, 11:12   Link #418
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Well, with nanoha and pretty cure, there is a completely different standars for battles now.
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Old 2012-10-30, 12:59   Link #419
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Originally Posted by maximilianjenus View Post
Well, with nanoha and pretty cure, there is a completely different standars for battles now.
Yeah I think the thing that most stood out to me the first time I saw a clip of a precure fight is that there was actual martial arts fighting in it, which I had never really seen in a magical girl show up to that point...then again I'd only really seen whatever had been on YTV in Canada at the time which was basically Sailor Moon and that really cut up Card Captor Sakura dub.

It's funny how Precure series and Saint Seiya Omega have about the same style of combat choreography despite one being based off an old school gar shonen fighting franchise and the other basically being cutesy little girls who suddenly morph into MMA fighters for the combat sequences. It's just so....not what you'd expect if you'd never seen or heard of it before to know already.
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Old 2012-10-30, 18:48   Link #420
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I remember a few actual fights in Sailor Moon. Juptiter vs. Tuxedo Mask for instance. A few others from time to time...usually when on of the main villains lackeys decides to do their dirty work personally (rather that just leave it to the monster of the week). Most fights still end with stock footage of Sailor Moon using one wand or another thingy. Every once in a while one of the other Scouts would take out a monster of the week without Moon, but it was rare. especialy during those times they needed whatever power it was Moon had to free the civilian whose body was beig used as the monster of the week...or to put something or other back into the civilian or "friend they had forever, but was never seen before or again after this episode" person.
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