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Old 2012-11-10, 10:51   Link #41
arekwibowo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eater of All View Post
As an aside, I saw "authors sometimes give their characters happy endings," then I thought of Urobutcher and I 'd.
Gurobuchi, huh? What i can recall from Fate/Zero and Madoka Magica series, all that guy can do is providing gruesome ending for the characters which is very facepalming for me (Kinda remember when i watched a guro scene in Fate/Zero DVD alone in my room and my big sis confiscated it afterwards).
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Old 2012-11-10, 11:05   Link #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arekwibowo View Post
Gurobuchi, huh? What i can recall from Fate/Zero and Madoka Magica series, all that guy can do is providing gruesome ending for the characters which is very facepalming for me (Kinda remember when i watched a guro scene in Fate/Zero DVD alone in my room and my big sis confiscated it afterwards).
Pay close attention to your Onee-chan. She might actually like it and secretly watching that DVD alone .
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Old 2012-11-10, 11:51   Link #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arekwibowo View Post
even "Bleach" manga was forced to make abrupt ending with its quite forced last arc (Why it didn't just end already when Aizen was defeated and Soul Society clearly won?)
Yeah, nice comment dude (kid?). I have to agree with you. I enjoyed Bleach, and honestly i think it should have ended with Aizen, and i loved the fact he possible lost his powers forever, and if it stopped there i would have given mad props that the main character didnít end up in a place that was were people would have liked him to be, but a place that was very plausible.

It goes back to the concept of telling a story, in the end people want closure, i think telling a story too long you get people who get bored and just want it to end. I can understand, thatís why i think the best story tellers are those who donít get caught up in loving the characterís they create, to the point they are not willing to sacrifice them, but those who see the big picture.
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Old 2012-11-13, 03:31   Link #44
aohige
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Originally Posted by arekwibowo View Post
How many of you that are still reading "Hajime no Ippo" or "Kochikame" up until now? The phrase "Never ending series" for those series suddenly popped out in my head for some reason. If it's the super popular manga like "One Piece" or "Naruto" then it's okay to get dragged until god knows when the authors want it. Still i feel quite uncomfortable as those two series also have no visible ending (Can someone explain to me when and where "the treasure" in One Piece is? Nobody, right?), even "Bleach" manga was forced to make abrupt ending with its quite forced last arc (Why it didn't just end already when Aizen was defeated and Soul Society clearly won?).
Kochikame doesn't belong in this mix at all, it's not that kind of comic.

It is not a story driven comic, it's a slice-of-today-story comic.
It's like Simpsons. Or Newspaper comics that deals with a single theme of the day.
There's no "dragging out stories", it's simply a comedy strip about "theme of the day".

And it uses current events and topics as its theme, and pokes fun at it.
New law passed in Japan to prevent bicycles on pedestrian walkways? Ok, let's have a story about modern bicycles!
Just like say... South Park or aforementioned Simpsons.
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Last edited by aohige; 2012-11-13 at 05:36.
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Old 2012-11-13, 19:54   Link #45
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I hope this isn't considered "off-topic", but on the flipside there seems to be something seeping in nowadays where a single cour of 12-ish episodes has become the norm, and the duo-cour 24-ish series are taking the sidelines.

Don't get me wrong, there are TONS of single cour series that achieve everything they need to in that time, but I feel as if sometimes they need to have it a bit longer. Guess it depends on content available and popularity overall, but it's just a note.

Basically, don't exactly like TOO long myself, but sometimes things are TOO short. A good median is nice, depending on the series.
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Old 2012-11-13, 22:37   Link #46
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^ I think the "Curse of the Cours" syndrome is more about the budget given to a series than the actual intention of the studio to schedule as series as 1- or 2-cours.
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Old 2012-11-13, 23:25   Link #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by backbone View Post
It goes back to the concept of telling a story, in the end people want closure, i think telling a story too long you get people who get bored and just want it to end. I can understand, that’s why i think the best story tellers are those who don’t get caught up in loving the character’s they create, to the point they are not willing to sacrifice them, but those who see the big picture.
Let me put your statement with one single phrase "A story isn't called a story until it has ending".

Last edited by Insane; 2012-11-14 at 01:18.
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Old 2012-11-13, 23:54   Link #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Insane View Post
Let me put your statement with one single phrase "A story isn't called a story until it has ending".
Exactly. That's why I dropped a lot of long running anime beyond 24 episodes. They are too long that you realized that your child is already beside you watching it... when you were just in college when you started watching it...

Last edited by NoemiChan; 2012-11-14 at 03:49.
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Old 2012-11-14, 01:28   Link #49
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Originally Posted by papermario13689 View Post
Basically, don't exactly like TOO long myself, but sometimes things are TOO short. A good median is nice, depending on the series.
Yep yep. In my opinion, it doesn't really matter whether a series will be incredible long or super short, and i don't really mind about long stories as long as they only take the time necessary to tell their story, and stop when everything has been told, not dragging it to hell instead. Take "Puella Madoka magica" as example. I don't think that its story could be told in merely 1 cour, rather it would have just ruined its entirety. And look, that anime was so awesome that it's still on my top watchlist.

Basically, all shows need to know when to stop, but it's very inevitable that there're many shows that know when to go on.
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Old 2012-11-14, 06:29   Link #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GenjiChan View Post
Exactly. That's why I dropped a lot of long running anime beyond 24 episodes. They are too long that you realized that your child is already beside you watching it... when you were just in college when you started watching it...
That still doesn't save you from the "no ending" issue. There are a lot of one cour anime that don't have a proper closure, due to the fact that they are adaptions of ongoing manga or light novels. Elfen Lied, Horou Musuko and Narutaru for example.

On the other side there are anime that are very long and yet have a proper ending, like Death Note, Monster, Legend of Galactic Heroes, and a lot of anime of the past when 40-50 episodes was the norm.
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Old 2012-11-14, 07:24   Link #51
Westlo
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Originally Posted by Xellos-_^ View Post
i wonder if anyone ever to dare the author of Conan.

How much money does he needs to make before he ends Conan?
Might be him, more than likely it's also Shogakukan who want to keep Conan going because it's the best selling manga title from their Sunday magazine. Silver Spoon (FMA mangaka's next work) and Magi seem to finally be two hits that might approach its sales for that mag though... While Sunday is in 3rd place behind Jump and Magazine and they have no other big hits Conan will continue period... Shogakukan seem to have turned a corner with those two works and seem to have up to another 8 anime projects in work, though even if they all become hits I doubt Conan stops lol.
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Old 2012-11-16, 19:16   Link #52
NinjaRealist
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Originally Posted by arekwibowo View Post
I was not created this thread for the purpose of discrediting nor dishonoring the story writers, so please pardon my rudeness first.

Apparently something is bugging me all this time, particularly when i'm reading several manga from who-knows-when they were first published (perhaps long before i was born in this world. I'm still an elementary schooler btw). That is, why i couldn't see any visible ending for those series? Take "Ah! My Goddess" for example. Why for heaven's sake it didn't end when Keiichi and Beldandy relationship had been established already and keep being dragged on for too long? Why it didn't end when it should have? Or let me ask you people here. How many of you that are still reading "Hajime no Ippo" or "Kochikame" up until now? The phrase "Never ending series" for those series suddenly popped out in my head for some reason. If it's the super popular manga like "One Piece" or "Naruto" then it's okay to get dragged until god knows when the authors want it. Still i feel quite uncomfortable as those two series also have no visible ending (Can someone explain to me when and where "the treasure" in One Piece is? Nobody, right?), even "Bleach" manga was forced to make abrupt ending with its quite forced last arc (Why it didn't just end already when Aizen was defeated and Soul Society clearly won?).

It's OK if the issue lies on the hard die fanbase who would do whatever it takes to maintain their favorite series to keep being serialized. But, is it just that? There're so many fresh and new ideas out there, so why still stuck on the old ones? Take Light Novels for example that are very blossoming in recent years in japan. They're very variable with a bunch of new ideas, not just stuck on the old, cliche ones (And they always end when they should have, that is).

Kinda reminds me of an old man's wise phrase : "All good stories must come to and end"

Pardon my bad english since i'm still a child and english isn't my native language.
Before my actual post, I've noticed that Skip Beat is a shoujo manga pushing 200 chapters. Is it any good or does it suffer from a classic case of too long?

Anyway, TS:

In most cases I agree with you. I think Bleach, Naruto, Kenichi (this one could have been great if it was way shorter), Gintama, Kimi no Iru machi, Hayate no Gotoku, and Fairy Tail are all way too long and too repetitive (not that I've actually finished any of these). There are a lot of shounen manga like this and with very few exceptions they all become unreadable at some point.

The most notable manga that I would consider as exceptions to this rule are TWGOK and One Piece.

One Piece obviously suffers from some of the same issues as a lot of shounen fighters but one of the main failings that One Piece avoids, IMO, is the artificial feeling that the MC is the center of the universe and the most powerful being ever. I really love how the series is full of so many villains and factions that are constantly battling each other far more so that they fight the Strawhats, and you are usually unsure of who the Strawhats will fight next. It really gives you the feeling that the series takes place in a real universe not some narrow, shallow, universe that seems irrationally fixated upon the MC. Still following after 688 chapters and don't care if it goes for 688 chapters more.

TWGOK to me is just brilliant in so many ways. In my opinion, it might be the cleverest harem comedy ever written. The author is always changing things up when they start to get boring and Keima is one of the most interesting Harem MCs ever. It's 209 chapters in and I still look forward to it every week.

To a lesser extent:

Cage of Eden is another one that I still follow, because, although it has been dragging on for a while now, the essential mystery of this manga and the rare moments that are terrifying, have kept me on the hook.

To a much, much lesser extet:

Nurarihyon no Mago is a very flawed manga, but for a lot of reasons, I think this is much better than a lot of long running shounen manga, which are more popular. The art is surprisingly good but what I find most compelling about the series is how scary it can be, something that Bleach and Naruto ever do for me. It's probably good that it's ending but I think this deserved 400+ chapters more than Bleach.

D. Gray-Man I guess I'm mostly still reading this one because I know it will end soon but it was still a lot better than Bleach.
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Old 2012-11-22, 22:51   Link #53
creb
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I'm one of those weird individuals that never think a fictional story can drag on for too long. If I had my way, no fictional story I've watched/read would ever end.

It pains me at the lack of huge epics these days, as everything seems to be packaged in disposable bites, whether it be books or shows. I'd go off on an old-man tangent relating to attention spans, but I'll restrain myself.

Real life "stories" dragging on too long? Oh, hell yes. But, fictional ones? Nope!
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Old 2012-11-23, 15:14   Link #54
Blaat
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Originally Posted by NinjaRealist View Post
The most notable manga that I would consider as exceptions to this rule are TWGOK and One Piece.
I honestly think TWGOK dragged out the moment the main character had to recheck all the previous girls and I stopped reading there. I also think One Piece dragged out not in a "it should have ended a long time ago" kind of way but more like "the story should be a lot further along". The problem with One Piece is that the majority of its arcs have dragged out and this is slowly snowballing.
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Old 2012-11-24, 01:21   Link #55
Fuyuno
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Wait, no Sazae-san?

It started in late 1960's and still running today.
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Old 2012-11-24, 01:23   Link #56
NoemiChan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jan-Poo View Post
That still doesn't save you from the "no ending" issue. There are a lot of one cour anime that don't have a proper closure, due to the fact that they are adaptions of ongoing manga or light novels. Elfen Lied, Horou Musuko and Narutaru for example.

On the other side there are anime that are very long and yet have a proper ending, like Death Note, Monster, Legend of Galactic Heroes, and a lot of anime of the past when 40-50 episodes was the norm.
Well, guess it all applies to all animes which has a "ongoing manga/novel".
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Old 2012-11-24, 03:14   Link #57
Insane
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jan-Poo View Post
That still doesn't save you from the "no ending" issue. There are a lot of one cour anime that don't have a proper closure, due to the fact that they are adaptions of ongoing manga or light novels. Elfen Lied, Horou Musuko and Narutaru for example.

On the other side there are anime that are very long and yet have a proper ending, like Death Note, Monster, Legend of Galactic Heroes, and a lot of anime of the past when 40-50 episodes was the norm.
Yeah, most animes have been getting short in recent years, and if I'm noticing the trend correctly, most new anime seasons are adapted in order to fit into thirteen episodes, or at least into the season.

Regarding those old-school animes, the reason why they had so many episodes probably because they had started before this whole "fit animes into a season" thing began, which is why they can go on for so long.
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Old 2012-11-25, 16:33   Link #58
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Bleach should've died the minute Aizen was defeated.
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Old 2012-11-26, 21:39   Link #59
Insane
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Bleach should've died the minute Aizen was defeated.
Unfortunately, the hardcore fanbase would not let that happen at that time
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Old 2012-11-28, 01:26   Link #60
aohige
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Originally Posted by Fuyuno View Post
Wait, no Sazae-san?

It started in late 1960's and still running today.
Because Sazae-san, much like Kochikame I explained earlier in this thread, doesn't belog in this topic.

Sazae-san is a sit-com, not a story driven manga/anime.
It's like saying Cheers is dragging out, or Seinfield. Or Married with Children.
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