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Old 2012-11-19, 20:00   Link #11181
Wolfenstein
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaisos Erranon View Post
When was this said? Hell, it's basically outright stated in the first chapter of the current arc that All Fiction is the reason no one remembers middle school.
Really? Well, let me check that. It seems I completely missed it.

And as for that, wouldn't All-Fiction not work on Medaka due to MC status, plus the fact she has All-Fiction herself? It technically failed to erase her memories of Shiranui, though the description was rather vague.
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Old 2012-11-19, 21:47   Link #11182
Kaisos Erranon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfenstein View Post
And as for that, wouldn't All-Fiction not work on Medaka due to MC status, plus the fact she has All-Fiction herself? It technically failed to erase her memories of Shiranui, though the description was rather vague.
Medaka has never been immune to Skills just because she can use them.
It was explained in Chapter 159 that, as All Fiction has weakened, Medaka and Zenkichi, due to their emotional connections to Shiranui, can remember her, and it's suggested in the same chapter that All Fiction may in fact have always had that limitation: Kumagawa says something cryptic about Maguro remembering Ajimu, and we've already seen it fail to erase Raff Raffelsia, to Kumagawa's surprise (at the time).
Also, before anyone claims that Maguro isn't even mentioned in 159, check the raws, the translators missed something.
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Old 2012-11-19, 23:05   Link #11183
DawnEmperor
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Originally Posted by Wolfenstein View Post

On another note, what is it you guys's want explained most about middle-school?

Personally, Kumagawa talked as if he, Zenkichi and Anshin'-san were friends or something. Even Anshin'-san said something wierd in the same fashion. I'd really like to know what the fuck they were talking about.

Oh, and that whole Akune/Ajimu deal as well.
It always seemed like Zenkichi was a bit isolated from the rest of the characters due to being fixtated on Medaka. When Anshin was reminiscing about Zenkichi, she seemed to only remember his training to defeat Medaka(then again, it was the arc right before). Yes, he has some interactions with them(animosity with Akune, fear of Kumagawa), but that's still mainly in relation to their connection to Medaka.

I hope to be proven wrong though, maybe he had some other things to do(there's been constant comments that they drifted apart at some point).
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Old 2012-11-20, 01:00   Link #11184
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What you're saying makes sense, Sol. What with that whole Maguro thing, If I could read raws, so I'll just take your word for it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DawnEmperor
It always seemed like Zenkichi was a bit isolated from the rest of the characters due to being fixtated on Medaka. When Anshin was reminiscing about Zenkichi, she seemed to only remember his training to defeat Medaka(then again, it was the arc right before). Yes, he has some interactions with them(animosity with Akune, fear of Kumagawa), but that's still mainly in relation to their connection to Medaka.

I hope to be proven wrong though, maybe he had some other things to do(there's been constant comments that they drifted apart at some point).
Recall what was specifically stated about such a time?

That Medaka and Zenkichi drifted apart from each other during middle-school.

That in mind, remember when Kumagawa talked about the three of them meeting again in conversation after his homicide + suicide?

Spoiler:


Or this strange scene:

Spoiler:


I can feel a backstory to this, passes off the impression that they used to talk to each other or something, maybe it explains why Zenkichi's dream is also the middle-school classroom where he and Kumagawa meet Ajimu.

Spoiler:
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Old 2012-11-20, 02:01   Link #11185
Kaisos Erranon
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I completely forgot that Ajimu used to act like that. I'm betting it's retconned out by now, though.
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Old 2012-11-20, 11:23   Link #11186
Wolfenstein
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Originally Posted by Kaisos Erranon View Post
I completely forgot that Ajimu used to act like that. I'm betting it's retconned out by now, though.
Probably. I mean, it's not like I really expect that to be followed upon. I just hope that it will. A fool's hope, I guess.

But, c'mon Nishio. In the JBW, when Zenkichi dies(again), he goes to the same classroom to meet Ajimu(well, this time Momozono sealed him, though) just like when he dies the first time. Exactly like all the times Kumagawa dies.

There's story to be explored here, bro!

P.S:

Kaisos, I remebered that on page 513, you posted some screenshots of pictures that happened right after Zenkichi became President, but they seem to not be appearing now. Do you have any other source that you could post so I could see them?
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Old 2012-11-20, 13:46   Link #11187
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If I'm not mistaken, wasn't Ajimu pissed when Zenkichi was killed and sealed? Plus I do agree, the way she acts around those two seemed to indicate that there must have been something more than what was shown...would be cool if this was explored (though Zen haters would be spitting fire if it happened).
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Old 2012-11-20, 14:32   Link #11188
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@Wolfenstein I can't see those images, mind just telling me which chapters?

And in a sense, it seems like Ajimu's classroom has been retconned/changed to just being some sort of general limbo/purgatory for everyone, with Ajimu being almost a God in the Medaka verse.

Last edited by DawnEmperor; 2012-11-20 at 14:54.
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Old 2012-11-20, 15:21   Link #11189
Wolfenstein
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Originally Posted by DawnEmperor View Post
Wolfenstein I can't see those images, mind just telling me which chapters?
First picture: Chapter 81, page 19.

Second picture: Chapter 93, page 12.

Third picture: Chapter 71, page 12.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DawnEmperor View Post
And in a sense, it seems like Ajimu's classroom has been retconned/changed to just being some sort of general limbo/purgatory for everyone, with Ajimu being almost a God in the Medaka verse.
When has anyone but Zenkichi and Kumagawa appeared there after they die? In-fact, on the third picture, Ajimu has some pretty cryptic dialogue about being inside Kumagawa's heart, and that was a simillar predicament to Zenkichi's classroom.

The only time anyone else appeared there was when Ajimu forcefully sent Emukae there, it's a different case from Kumagawa and Zenkichi, who every time they die, they seem to meet Ajimu.
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Old 2012-11-20, 15:28   Link #11190
Kaisos Erranon
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Has anyone else other than Zenkichi and Kumagawa died for long enough (while being important enough) that it would be worth showing them meeting Ajimu?
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Old 2012-11-20, 15:32   Link #11191
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The only way to explain an importance to Ajimu, and so having that wierd sequence, is by having some kind of connection to her, Lol. Whether it be in your past or in your present. And the first time we see Ajimu is when Zenkichi dies. Which implies a past connection to her. Which is further implied by the two pages I posted.

I'm sure there might've been other characters that could potentially receive the same treatment(no way to know), but Dawn was making a huge generalization with "everyone". That said, there's no way to tell if people like Maguro, Akune or Medaka would receive the same treatment, but if they did(at the same point in time and state of mind Zenkichi was in), it's beause of their past connections to her during middle-school, which was my point.

For another thought, Kumagawa was sure he'd be able to talk to both of them after dying.
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Old 2012-11-20, 16:06   Link #11192
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This sounds like a plot for a future arc to me!
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Old 2012-11-20, 16:10   Link #11193
Kaisos Erranon
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Originally Posted by orangejuicetang View Post
This sounds like a plot for a future arc to me!
But Ajimu is dead.
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Old 2012-11-20, 16:15   Link #11194
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But Ajimu is dead.
That means nothing.
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Old 2012-11-20, 16:15   Link #11195
orangejuicetang
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So was Tsurubami Fukurou

This here be Medaka Box
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Old 2012-11-20, 16:19   Link #11196
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I'd love for Ajimu to return, actually.

I kinda hated the way Ajimu died so anti-climaticaly. Seemed to have little repercussion to the series as a whole.

Even though I loved her departure with Kumagawa.
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Old 2012-11-20, 16:22   Link #11197
Kaisos Erranon
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Originally Posted by orangejuicetang View Post
So was Tsurubami Fukurou
Yeah, but not only was he not killed by Iihiko, but he might not have been dead at all in the first place, except metaphorically.
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Originally Posted by Wolfenstein View Post
Seemed to have little repercussion to the series as a whole.
Which I agree with, however. It is rather suspicious, especially given her vast network of Terminals.
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Old 2012-11-21, 00:40   Link #11198
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I don't think there's any particular connection between Ajimu and Zenkichi, no more than Ajimu and Medaka anyway. Clearly there's a huge untold story of the conflict in middle school between Medaka's faction and Kumagawa's student council (which includes Akune and Ajimu), but for the same reason it's hardly a mystery why everyone involved would know each other. Ajimu's "you've finally made up" makes perfect sense in the context that they were enemies in middle school. Which we've already known since forever.

Ajimu did attach herself to Zenkichi in particular during the Election arc, but that was all just part of her plan to manipulate him into beating Medaka, just another of her impossibilities. I don't think it really matters who he was other than that he was Normal and close to Medaka. Certainly no indication of being particularly close in the past.

I guess I'm kind of rambling and repeating myself, but my general thought about the whole thing is that there's a story to tell there, but in the end it doesn't really matter. It's not important to the plot, nor is it a big secret. They've made similar allusions to Medaka's first election (the one where she got 98%), where it's implied it was this huge deal with all the Chairmen, Hinokage, Shiranui running around in the background, Zenkichi attracting votes... However, since we already know the result, the journey isn't really necessary. If anything, it'd be a side story, like Good Loser Kumagawa. Heck, that's exactly what the novels are consistently doing.
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Old 2012-11-21, 02:25   Link #11199
Kaisos Erranon
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Originally Posted by Clarste View Post
*snip*
Actually, I think that the middle school stuff IS important, if only because they keep alluding back to it in increasingly cryptic ways.
Also, the simple fact that Medaka and Zenkichi have no memory of the incident involving Ajimu's sealing would suggest that there's more to the story than we're being told.
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Old 2012-11-21, 11:37   Link #11200
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Originally Posted by Wolfenstein View Post
The only way to explain an importance to Ajimu, and so having that wierd sequence, is by having some kind of connection to her, Lol. Whether it be in your past or in your present. And the first time we see Ajimu is when Zenkichi dies. Which implies a past connection to her. Which is further implied by the two pages I posted.

I'm sure there might've been other characters that could potentially receive the same treatment(no way to know), but Dawn was making a huge generalization with "everyone". That said, there's no way to tell if people like Maguro, Akune or Medaka would receive the same treatment, but if they did(at the same point in time and state of mind Zenkichi was in), it's beause of their past connections to her during middle-school, which was my point.

For another thought, Kumagawa was sure he'd be able to talk to both of them after dying.
Hey, we're all just speculating here. Anyway, if Ajimu has someone in her classroom, in means she has a special connection with them from middle school? Until we get some more info, I'm not gonna put too much stock into it. As one of the above posters has stated, I can't really see that they're special in a particularly exclusive sense(except perhaps Kumagawa).
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