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Old 2012-11-20, 05:18   Link #1241
kuromitsu
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shmaster View Post
I was wondering, if the K anime has marketed itself as "K - Who Killed Tatara". Would we have much less complaint?
I have to say the preview were somewhat misleading, thus drawing in the wrong fanbase initially. Who would have thought the anime is going to be a mystery show?
I don't know. What I thought the preview promised me: lots of eye candy, pretty boys (some of them in uniforms, yay!), pretty girls, some nicely animated action, nice music. There was nothing about the plot. If people watched them and decided that the show would be a dumb action anime, that was their problem, not the promos misleading them. (Kind of how people seem to have decided that K would be full of boobs and other fanservice for guys, never mind the few:lots ratio of pretty girls and very pretty boys, and freaked out when they realized that omg female viewers may get some fanservice, too... )

Quote:
Originally Posted by shmaster View Post
On the other hand, I am not too sure about what is the purpose of the anime in the entire project. Is it going to tie up all the loose threads from the other works? (the novels are pretty inconclusive and the events occurred prior to the anime) Or is it a over-glorified commercial to boost the sales of other works? (as in the, the main branch of the project really hasn't been revealed yet)
I'm not quite sure about this question... what else would be the purpose of the anime than presenting a story and leading the K franchise? Of course the novels are inconclusive, they're not supposed to be the "main dish," just oneshots. And novels aside, the rest of the "other works" are a manga series mainly about some side characters, and a one-shot about the backstory one of the anime's main characters.

I mean, it's not like K is the only anime to have non-anime spin-offs for some extra income information, we've seen this franchise setup a million times...
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Old 2012-11-20, 08:27   Link #1242
Cosmic Eagle
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Originally Posted by Becquerel View Post
I thought that it was just an illusion because after summoning his Sword of Damocles "Shiro" dissolved into a storm of rose petals, which is Neko's illusion trademark. I thought that this cemented the fact that it was illusion or was Shiro real and she just magicked him out of there?
Perhaps but when you see how the plot has been quite solid so far in plugging any loopholes....can't discount the possibility.

And if she just got him out, the Damocles could still be his.


As for the uniform...well I think if he was a hired killer, the uniform could be a disguise of sorts

Quote:
Originally Posted by shmaster View Post

On the other hand, I am not too sure about what is the purpose of the anime in the entire project. Is it going to tie up all the loose threads from the other works? (the novels are pretty inconclusive and the events occurred prior to the anime) Or is it a over-glorified commercial to boost the sales of other works? (as in the, the main branch of the project really hasn't been revealed yet)
I wouldn't mind if it turns out to be a game centered work or something actually...

I'm most worried now that the show ends up like Angel Beats....very good but with too little time to really shine.
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Old 2012-11-20, 23:47   Link #1243
shmaster
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kuromitsu View Post
I'm not quite sure about this question... what else would be the purpose of the anime than presenting a story and leading the K franchise? Of course the novels are inconclusive, they're not supposed to be the "main dish," just oneshots. And novels aside, the rest of the "other works" are a manga series mainly about some side characters, and a one-shot about the backstory one of the anime's main characters.
I am asking this because... the anime doesn't feel like the main dish either, nor it has any sign to conclude any of the lose end from the novels.
Instead, the conflict presented in the anime feels narrowed, and episode 7 further narrows it into a Shiro trio vs. Weissman structure.
Instead of being something encompassing, it felt like just "another work" telling a specific side of the story.
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Old 2012-11-21, 00:29   Link #1244
Marcus H.
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Instead of being something encompassing, it felt like just "another work" telling a specific side of the story.
That's exactly it. You have to experience all of the stories to fully grasp the entire universe of K.
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Old 2012-11-21, 01:34   Link #1245
Obelisk ze Tormentor
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Originally Posted by Marcus H. View Post
You have to experience all of the stories to fully grasp the entire universe of K.
Well, if what you said is true, then K is not a good standalone anime. Heck, even Gundam series doesn’t require you to check other media beside the series itself to “fully grasp its universe”. You don’t have to immerse yourself in Gundam novels, Gundam mangas, Gundam video games, Gundam model kits, etc to fully understand how things work in its universe.
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Old 2012-11-21, 09:03   Link #1246
Marcus H.
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That's not the point of the Gundam franchise anyway. Each story in a Gundam anime has been given their ample time to explore the universe, especially the older Gundam series that have the advantage of not suffering from the Cour Syndrome. However, K, as an anime series that has been produced at a time when cours dictate the length of a story, would naturally suffer from this. Even more so since they may have consumed more money in art and animation quality than the budget of a typical one-cour series.

Besides, we already have seen a similar approach in Angel Beats!, although Heaven's Door is the only canon source of the story aside from the anime series itself.

That reminds me, why are you asking a thirteen-episode series to fully explore a universe like it was supposed to be two cours long? Honestly, that's just gonna be a "Rushed as heck" or a "What? That's it?" situation, the former of which happened in Angel Beats!. At least they decided to focus on one story for the viewers to chew on.
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Old 2012-11-21, 09:17   Link #1247
cheshire
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Oh, pleaaazze. The only thing K has in common with Baccano is the huge amount of characters. Baccano was actually self-aware (Carol, anyone?) with a lot of chaotic, deranged violence in it. I like K and all, but, just, no.
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Old 2012-11-21, 09:27   Link #1248
Obelisk ze Tormentor
Black Steel Knight
 
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcus H. View Post
That reminds me, why are you asking a thirteen-episode series to fully explore a universe like it was supposed to be two cours long? Honestly, that's just gonna be a "Rushed as heck" or a "What? That's it?" situation, the former of which happened in Angel Beats!. At least they decided to focus on one story for the viewers to chew on.
I’m not “asking for it”. My comments are derived from simple logic (from your statement) that if an anime series require you to follow other media to “fully grasp its universe” then it’s not a really good standalone anime regardless of any excuses.

It’s not like I hate this anime and came to this thread only to bash it. In fact, I really enjoy the latest 2-3 episodes. But it doesn’t prevent me from feeling that K lack something in its storytelling/execution. I can’t really point it out. You may refer to my previous posts.
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Old 2012-11-21, 13:36   Link #1249
kuromitsu
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Obelisk ze Tormentor View Post
Well, if what you said is true, then K is not a good standalone anime. Heck, even Gundam series doesn’t require you to check other media beside the series itself to “fully grasp its universe”. You don’t have to immerse yourself in Gundam novels, Gundam mangas, Gundam video games, Gundam model kits, etc to fully understand how things work in its universe.
"Gundam"? Try to watch a random UC Gundam series without all the background info supplied by previous series - something like, ah, 0080? you'll have no idea why is there a war going on and between whom and what's up with those mecha. (And as for non-UC shows, wasn't it Gundam Wing whose entire epilogue was told in novel form?)

Novelizations, companion manga and other supplementary material are pretty common for original anime series (as few as there are). It doesn't mean the anime can't stand on its own, it means there's more merchandise for fans who want to spend more money know more about the world.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Obelisk ze Tormentor View Post
I’m not “asking for it”. My comments are derived from simple logic (from your statement) that if an anime series require you to follow other media to “fully grasp its universe” then it’s not a really good standalone anime regardless of any excuses.
So like, Star Wars is not a good standalone work (the movie or the triology or the whatever you call it when eps I-III are included as well)? I mean, to fully grasp its universe you need to be intimately familiar with the Extended Universe...

Also, what excuses? Anime run on very limited time. A one-cour series has to tell its entire story in cca. 4,5 hrs, that's ridiculously little time. If the writers want a decently complex story instead of focusing exclusively on the characters, they can't afford spouting exposition all the time and making the viewer familiar with even the smallest details about the world the story takes place in, or the background of mob characters, etc. So an anime series will supply enough information to make its story work, and if the fan response is decent, they'll release supplementary stuff. That's it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Obelisk ze Tormentor View Post
It’s not like I hate this anime and came to this thread only to bash it. In fact, I really enjoy the latest 2-3 episodes. But it doesn’t prevent me from feeling that K lack something in its storytelling/execution. I can’t really point it out. You may refer to my previous posts.
I don't agree - but even if you do feel that way, it's definitely not because K is telling all the important info in the novels and the manga.

Last edited by kuromitsu; 2012-11-21 at 17:14.
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Old 2012-11-21, 18:09   Link #1250
Obelisk ze Tormentor
Black Steel Knight
 
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kuromitsu View Post
"Gundam"? Try to watch a random UC Gundam series without all the background info supplied by previous series - something like, ah, 0080? you'll have no idea why is there a war going on and between whom and what's up with those mecha. (And as for non-UC shows, wasn't it Gundam Wing whose entire epilogue was told in novel form?)
And your point is? Those are still within the realm of anime, not novel, not game, not manga etc. Read my post again. I said Gundam series doesn’t require you to follow other media for you to fully grasp its universe (only anime). Gundam Wing anime and Gundam Wing novel aren’t exactly canon to each other. Even if it is, the ending of the anime series works well as it is. The epilogue is a nice addition but not required.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kuromitsu View Post
Novelizations, companion manga and other supplementary material are pretty common for original anime series (as few as there are). It doesn't mean the anime can't stand on its own, it means there's more merchandise for fans who want to spend more money know more about the world.
Read my post again, I’m not finding fault in merchandising or supplementary materials. The word “supplementary” already explain itself that it’s only an addition and not requirement. My previous post is a reaction to Marcus H’s statement who basically said “watching K anime only is not enough to fully grasp its universe”, not to K anime itself.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kuromitsu View Post
So like, Star Wars is not a good standalone work (the movie or the triology or the whatever you call it when eps I-III are included as well)? I mean, to fully grasp its universe you need to be intimately familiar with the Extended Universe...
The original Star Wars (New Hope now) is originally meant for one movie. Two more movies (Empire & Jedi) then “complete the trilogy”. So yeah, that one works as a standalone movie. You don’t need to follow Star Wars comics, novels, games, etc to fully grasp what you need to know regarding the original movie trilogy. Heck, you don’t even need the Prequel Trilogy if that can make my point clearer.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kuromitsu View Post
Also, what excuses?
Once again, Marcus H’s statement is the excuse.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kuromitsu View Post
I don't agree - but even if you do feel that way, it's definitely not because K is telling all the important info in the novels and the manga.
I never said “K is telling all the important info in the novels and the manga”. When did I ever said that? Read my posts again. It's a reaction toward Marcus H’s statement.
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Last edited by Obelisk ze Tormentor; 2012-11-21 at 18:26.
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Old 2012-11-21, 18:21   Link #1251
Dengar
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To be fair, I myself am not experience any "WTF is going on here?" things. And I have NOT been reading any side material.
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Old 2012-11-21, 18:30   Link #1252
Obelisk ze Tormentor
Black Steel Knight
 
 
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To be fair, I myself am not experience any "WTF is going on here?" things. And I have NOT been reading any side material.
And that is fine. Like I said, my previous posts is a reaction toward Marcus' statement, not K anime itself. I also enjoy the anime despite not knowing certain things .
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Old 2012-11-21, 19:10   Link #1253
Marcus H.
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...And my post is also just a reaction to your statement that includes this phrase: "Instead of being something encompassing..."

For a moment, I assumed that you wanted a thirteen-episode series to handle everything that is on all K canon sources. That's... kinda impossible, don't you think?
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Old 2012-11-21, 19:15   Link #1254
Obelisk ze Tormentor
Black Steel Knight
 
 
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Originally Posted by Marcus H. View Post
...And my post is also just a reaction to your statement that includes this phrase: "Instead of being something encompassing..."

For a moment, I assumed that you wanted a thirteen-episode series to handle everything that is on all K canon sources. That's... kinda impossible, don't you think?
Umm...That's not my statement . It's shmaster's
Quote:
Originally Posted by shmaster View Post
Instead of being something encompassing, it felt like just "another work" telling a specific side of the story.
Please check the source that you quoted. It's even still on the same page -_-.
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Old 2012-11-21, 19:31   Link #1255
Marcus H.
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Oh, wait, lol.

Anyway... () if it's the production team's decision to split the story into different media to make the flow of the story in the anime series go smoothly, then let them do so. It might not be the best decision, but it sometimes cannot be helped. We can't say that a series is bad as a standalone series if it was never designed by the production team as one. (By analogy, you can't say that a single filter can work as good as a complete filtration machine.)

Oh, and you can't disregard those "excuses" (i.e. cour constraints) because sometimes, it dictates budget allocation and scheduling times [the same reason why BRS in Noitamina got eight episodes just to fit that darned Thermae Romae]. The best story can be crippled by the production team, and there's nothing that the writers of the story can do about it but to play by the rules.
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Old 2012-11-21, 19:40   Link #1256
Obelisk ze Tormentor
Black Steel Knight
 
 
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Originally Posted by Marcus H. View Post
Oh, wait, lol.

Anyway... () if it's the production team's decision to split the story into different media to make the flow of the story in the anime series go smoothly, then let them do so. It might not be the best decision, but it sometimes cannot be helped. We can't say that a series is bad as a standalone series if it was never designed by the production team as one. (By analogy, you can't say that a single filter can work as good as a complete filtration machine.)

Oh, and you can't disregard those "excuses" (i.e. cour constraints) because sometimes, it dictates budget allocation and scheduling times [the same reason why BRS in Noitamina got eight episodes just to fit that darned Thermae Romae]. The best story can be crippled by the production team, and there's nothing that the writers of the story can do about it but to play by the rules.
Just to be clear. When I said “it’s not really a good standalone anime”, it doesn’t mean that it’s “not a good anime”. Many /Hack series are not good standalone anime (since you required to play the games, read the novels etc) but they’re still solid anime. And when I said “excuses”, it’s not always in a negative light. There are justifiable technical “excuses” like you mentioned.
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Old 2012-11-21, 22:41   Link #1257
OPN
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Read the reds and kuroh side story and i kinda understand a bit more now . Im still hoping this is actually a split cour anime and a second season will air in spring or summer but that seems pretty doubtful now.
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Old 2012-11-22, 05:35   Link #1258
Dengar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Obelisk ze Tormentor View Post
Just to be clear. When I said “it’s not really a good standalone anime”, it doesn’t mean that it’s “not a good anime”. Many /Hack series are not good standalone anime (since you required to play the games, read the novels etc) but they’re still solid anime. And when I said “excuses”, it’s not always in a negative light. There are justifiable technical “excuses” like you mentioned.
I like how you mention .hack because at least with //SIGN, I didn't get that at all.

And the games stand on their own regardless since they are at the core of the experience.


That said, I still don't quite follow you people because I understand things just fine without having read any side material.
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Old 2012-11-22, 11:58   Link #1259
kazzuya13
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There are still so many question that isn't answered and it's already more than half over.
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Old 2012-11-22, 11:59   Link #1260
orion
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Originally Posted by Dengar View Post
I like how you mention .hack because at least with //SIGN, I didn't get that at all.

And the games stand on their own regardless since they are at the core of the experience.


That said, I still don't quite follow you people because I understand things just fine without having read any side material.
For dothack anime, I was referring to the wikia for the background info.
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