AnimeSuki Forums

Register Forum Rules FAQ Members List Social Groups Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   AnimeSuki Forum > Anime Discussion > Older Series > Shin Sekai Yori

Notices

View Poll Results: Shin Sekai Yori - Episode 9 Rating
Perfect 10 14 25.45%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 17 30.91%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 20 36.36%
7 out of 10 : Good 2 3.64%
6 out of 10 : Average 1 1.82%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 0 0%
4 out of 10 : Poor 0 0%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 1 1.82%
Voters: 55. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 2012-11-24, 11:26   Link #41
mayumi
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
aren't you guys taking these pairing things too seriously? they are 14 nothing is going to be decided when you are that old.

I am really looking forward to next episode. this one was very good.
mayumi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-11-24, 12:40   Link #42
Kejsarina
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Sweden
What if the scene at the Pinewood village was the result from Shun's resistant towards the whole society. They could have asked his parent or the elder of Pinewood Village to apprehend Shun and he might have fought back and run? Or it could have been the genetic deformed cretures that do the deed since human could not harm other human. Shun perhaps was too powerfull for those non-powered to be tackled with so they have to send out the " cats"

I think the relationship between Saki and Maria, Satoru and Shun are real. Since they were programmed to be in the same sex relationship at their age so they´d look for comfort from something that is available, everyone else is doing it. Mamoru on the other hand didn't and as Saki asked him in the other ep of him following around Maria who has already someone instead of looking elsewhere for the other ( like most other people).

The Karma Demon story was just the ideology that the elders of the society drummed it to the kids' mind. To prevent the renegrades like Shun. Even if he might be fallen but there would still be the possibility for him to take the other way out instead of wrecking the havoc in the " ordered" society if he still possess some " reason" ( From the elders' pov perhaps)

Lots of might and perhaps, lots of guessing.

The qulity minght be waning but I am still very much happy that they produced this kind of anime.
Kejsarina is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-11-24, 13:01   Link #43
Orin GA
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
what the hell is going on with the feet of those cats.
Orin GA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-11-24, 15:16   Link #44
ThereminVox
Guess what time it is?
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada
Age: 29
Tremendous, tremendous episode. When Shin Sekai Yori is on its game, it is by far the best thing going.

I've got a really bad feeling about that queerat who appeared just long enough to be noted as they approached Pinewood. It almost has to be related to what happened there.

The unspoken rules of what can and cannot be spoken of aloud was finally addressed in the dinner scene, and it was really satisfying. So many things revealed that you just knew had to be the case about how tightly controlled things really are. I liked the imagery of Saki, covered in the muck of reality being unable to bear the sanitized, Ethics Committee-approved small talk. Saki's father, for his part, gave her absolutely nothing to go on, but it still felt as though he was sticking his neck way out there for her sake, just by acknowledging that anything was happening at all.

We're starting to get a better understanding of how people can just disappear, and nobody mentions them again.

I greatly respect that they didn't overplay or linger too long on the horror of Maria's silhouette at the window. It was a fantastic scare, and by moving along immediately, it left me unsettled and off-balance in a really effective way.

It may be worth re-watching the lessons from the first few episodes to see what the parables tell us about the karma demons, and how they're portrayed. The story of the herb-gatherer in particular stands out to me as an example of what extreme lengths children are taught they are expected to go to in order to keep "fiends" from ever reaching the village.
ThereminVox is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-11-24, 15:19   Link #45
Warm Mist
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
People, people, the Karma demon is most probably a genetic disease. The minoshiro called it by its scientific name in ep. 4: Hashimoto-Appelbaum syndrome.

Whether they're just using the term "karma demon" historically incorrectly in the anime's time, or Shun actually is suffering from a grave case of H-A syndrome, remains to be seen.
Warm Mist is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-11-24, 15:50   Link #46
Malkuth
Banned
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: London
Age: 34
Send a message via MSN to Malkuth Send a message via Skype™ to Malkuth
Quote:
Originally Posted by Warm Mist View Post
People, people, the Karma demon is most probably a genetic disease. The minoshiro called it by its scientific name in ep. 4: Hashimoto-Appelbaum syndrome.

Whether they're just using the term "karma demon" historically incorrectly in the anime's time, or Shun actually is suffering from a grave case of H-A syndrome, remains to be seen.
I didn't get that impression from the anime, the way they presented both the legend and the pseudo-scientific explanation, it sounded more like the result of pride, overconfidence, and the reaction of their society to that attitude
Malkuth is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-11-24, 16:25   Link #47
Witheirate
Member
 
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Wichita
I got the aura of Shun will turn into an Evil after watching this episode. Hopefully that is not the case.
__________________
Witheirate is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-11-24, 16:31   Link #48
Kazu-kun
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Malkuth View Post
it sounded more like the result of pride, overconfidence, and the reaction of their society to that attitude
That's probably just what the elders wanted the children to believe, but it's clear what's happening with Shun is something beyond his control and has nothing to do with his attitude and such.

Now that I think about it, maybe there had been previous incidents of the Hashimoto-Appelbaum syndrome in Shun family, and that's why Shun asked the library about the karma demos. If it's true this is a genetic disorder now everything makes perfect sense.
__________________
http://forums.animesuki.com/images/as.icon/signaturepics/sigpic39230_3.gif
Kazu-kun is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-11-24, 17:15   Link #49
kuromitsu
我、勝てり!
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Quote:
Originally Posted by Orin GA View Post
what the hell is going on with the feet of those cats.
They're adorable, aren't they! It's like they're wearing tiny heels.
kuromitsu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-11-24, 19:24   Link #50
Warm Mist
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Malkuth View Post
I didn't get that impression from the anime, the way they presented both the legend and the pseudo-scientific explanation, it sounded more like the result of pride, overconfidence, and the reaction of their society to that attitude
In that case the writing for the anime is utter shit, since Shun showed literally none of those traits, and it was never implied either; while, on the other hand, the Karma demon phenomena as an actual, documented disease has been explicitly established. The minoshiro says these cases occurred in "ancient society" (which is ~2011) already, and it's doubtful that people of our time would employ a strictly medical naming convention to refer to something that is merely a perception. Where's the sense in calling someone that's just prideful and overconfident a "Hashimoto-Appelbaum case"?

It's been heavily implied that something very serious occurs to persons who transform into either a fiend or a karma demon. Something that can't just be the result of an attitude they had in their life. The series aims for scientifically plausible explanations, not mythological ones, so whatever it is that happens when someone goes full karma demon, it's not magic. The only thing that's left is a physiological/physical disease, and it being genetic sounds very probable to me, since there seems to be no external cause that could make someone contract those syndromes in SSY's society.
Warm Mist is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-11-24, 19:25   Link #51
Vanish
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Age: 22
Send a message via Skype™ to Vanish
Oh God, the cliffhanger! This became very thrilling. Why can't I have my happy end already? This is not good for my mind. How about Saki saves Shun from becoming a karma demon and they both get together. Then later Maria takes note of Mamoru's feelings and they also get together. Satoru can play sadist with Rei for all I care. So then somehow they are able to overcome all the hurdles they face, unite the different colonies and help the society move into a better direction. And at the end Yoshimi miraculously returns to Saki's household and they all lived happily ever after. No? You don't like that? Me neither, just show us the next episode already!
Vanish is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-11-24, 19:26   Link #52
CJ_Walker
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Los Angeles, California
Age: 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
There's every indication that simply breaking minor rules (like, you know, not cheating at sports ) gets you the death penalty in this world. So I don't think it would take all that much to get labeled a "karma demon" by the people who oversee this village.

So just because the village overseers are saying that Shun has gone "to the dark side" doesn't mean he actually has.
Oh right! I forgot about that, ok now its making more sense, It could be that because of the safety measures of the fillage, they have actually forced the karma demon thing on shun although they didnt really mean to. . .kinda like a reverse placebo, effect.

so its not that shun just suddenly turned evil, but more the societty's pushing against him instead ofhelping him combined with all the crap the vilage elders do normally + the info dump slug could have made shun break(although the smart thing would have been to just lay low untill he was an adult, and become part of the ethics committee, find out the truth, and try to change things from there blahblahSpinzakblablahblah

It still seems weird, but thinking about what the village does to their children for 1)not having enouh cantus talent(feeding that little girl to the cats) 2)cheating at the werid game(even though the teacher should have just disqualified the cheaters instead of...killing them #whathefu*kshowsomemoderationpleaseassholes etc. . .it makes sense, that the village.society itself creates the karma demons, and they pretty much have to develop the means to contain it. . .

Also now that I think about it, that's probably what the author is saying as a theme for the stuff that happened in the old civilazation too, that because the societies were oppressive then, that the pk people were created, and started killing people etc etc end of the world yadda yadda.

So I guess that's what Shun's purpose is in the story. . .which is kinda sad cause I like that guy. . .but damn, this is turning into some crazy horror/social commentary stuff here.
CJ_Walker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-11-24, 19:34   Link #53
Triple_R
Center Attraction
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
Age: 33
Send a message via AIM to Triple_R
Quote:
Originally Posted by GenjiChan View Post
But I don't think Saki has the same feelings as Maria has for her. It is so obvious that Saki has both eyes for Shun during the previous episode.

Yes, we could say they are a pair but not that romantic enough since one party ain't providing the same share of the feeling as the other provides.
Here is how I think Saki and Maria view one another:

Saki: Maria is my best friend. We make love together sometimes since that's what teenaged best friends are supposed to do in our world. And it helps that Maria is obviously beautiful, so I find the experience pleasant. Maria is one of the most important people in my life. I care about her a lot, and I generally trust her. Nobody stirs me like Shun does, though. My feelings for him run deeper than my feelings for anybody else.

Maria: Saki is my most precious lover. She has also been my best friend as long as I can remember. I love spending time with her, and we're inseparable at school. I love all of our exciting and stirring encounters with one another. Saki is a very cute and adorable girl. I have complete trust in her. Saki is the most important person in my life.


So, yeah, Maria's feelings for Saki run deeper than Saki's feelings for Maria. I doubt they'd be lesbian lovers if they were growing up as classmates in modern Japan. However, I get the sense that, Shun notwithstanding, Saki is content in her relationship with Maria. If there was no Shun, Saki would be entirely happy with Maria as her girlfriend. As is, though, Saki knows who's first in her heart...



Quote:
Originally Posted by mayumi View Post
aren't you guys taking these pairing things too seriously? they are 14 nothing is going to be decided when you are that old.
The pairings are important in what they say about the characters, and in what they say about the world of Shin Sekai Yori.

Do I think they'll last into adulthood? Probably not, but I don't think that makes them any less noteworthy to discuss.
__________________
Triple_R is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-11-24, 19:39   Link #54
Dawnstorm
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Austria
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kazu-kun View Post
That's probably just what the elders wanted the children to believe, but it's clear what's happening with Shun is something beyond his control and has nothing to do with his attitude and such.
The story is certainly social control, but what if the syndomes (there were two, weren't there?) were not genetic but mental disorders?

You've seen the destruction Satoru could wreak. Now imagine you use your powers so much that they become second nature. Then imagine you lash out when angry... A single slip could be desastrous.

Then imagine a very smart boy discovers secrecy but not the secret, and he can't talk about it for fear of prosecution. From episode one, I had the impression that Shun was controlling his expressions much more than any of the others. This may easily lead to stress (estrangement from society, fear of letting the mask slip, etc.) and maybe to paranoid symptoms. Then imagine he gains even more knowledge and has done something forbidden. Even more stress.

I think the eye in the egg is a reflection of Shun feeling watched. The stress is taking over, catching up. Shun is becoming mentally exhausted and losing control. That could easily be what people refer to as "Karma demons".

What the story about "pride" etc. is warning you away from is, I think, overuse of your powers and use of your powers for selfish motives. If you get used to your powers to the extent that they might become reflexive? A single strong emotion, anger, say, or fear, could have very bad consequences.

If social control slips, you get removed, because estrangement makes you more dangerous. Literally.

Also, it's possible that children with weak or no powers get removed because they might awaken to them or get stronger later in life, when you're less impressionable. Someone who awakens to the power during puberty, for example, might be ticking time bomb.

Or I'm overthinking things.

***

Another I thing I found interesting in this episode is the talk about elictricity. Interesting. The setting keeps expanding.
Dawnstorm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-11-24, 19:41   Link #55
NoemiChan
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Philippines
Age: 26
Send a message via Yahoo to NoemiChan Send a message via Skype™ to NoemiChan
Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
Saki: Maria is my best friend. We make love together sometimes since that's what teenaged best friends are supposed do in our world. And it helps that Maria is obviously beautiful, so I find the experience pleasant. Maria is one of the most important people in my life. I care about her a lot, and I generally trust her. Nobody stirs me like Shun does, though. My feelings for him run deeper than my feelings for anybody else.
You made Saki more of a pervert.

I say:

Saki: Maria is my "partner-lover". That is how it supposed to be. She's my best friend and I'm comfortable when doing stuffs with her as dictated by society.

But Shun is different from Maria. I always want to see him whether close or far. My heart is throbbing whenever he is around. Yes, i know he is supposed to be Satoru's "partner-lover" but why am I feeling uneasy with them together. What does Shun has that Maria don't. What makes him special than everyone else in my eyes. Now that he broke up with Satoru.... am I supposed to be happy? Shun (holds necklace) where are you Shun?
NoemiChan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-11-24, 19:43   Link #56
CJ_Walker
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Los Angeles, California
Age: 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThereminVox View Post
The unspoken rules of what can and cannot be spoken of aloud was finally addressed in the dinner scene, and it was really satisfying. So many things revealed that you just knew had to be the case about how tightly controlled things really are. I liked the imagery of Saki, covered in the muck of reality being unable to bear the sanitized, Ethics Committee-approved small talk.


Saki's father, for his part, gave her absolutely nothing to go on, but it still felt as though he was sticking his neck way out there for her sake, just by acknowledging that anything was happening at all.
This is what pissed me off about saki this episode! her father was sticking his neck out for her, and all she could do was disrepect her parents like that, I mean FFS all the crap she went thorugh with the info dumping slug arc, the "disappearing" kids, her motthers' anguish, and all she can think about is rushing to find shun??? wtf, does she think she can take on all the top cantus users or something? does she think she's gonna take on the goblin army, the whatever cats, and the deadly lions and shit??? It's like she just wants to rush in and get killed, and her parents as well since her father put his neck out there for her (If I were him I wouldnt have said anything, and not fuel the fire.) shes supposed to be clever and shit so why does she act like the stupid red shirt character in a horror movie?!? grrr! and that whol she's 14 thing is not a good excuse, especially since women develop mentally faster than boys do, so really she should know better
CJ_Walker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-11-24, 19:45   Link #57
kuromitsu
我、勝てり!
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Guys........

The library critter made it pretty clear that both akki and gouma are scientifically described and studied mental disorders. It's like people in our past thinking someone is suffering the wrath of [insert deity] that they insulted, when they're actually being afflicted by some sort of illness or mental disorder. The disorders passed into legends and folklore, resulting in all the talk about demons and cautionary tales - and there's a reason for all this.

Obviously these disorders a bit fantasy due to the psychokinesis powers and messing around with human genome/mental development, but there's no ~magic~ involved.
kuromitsu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-11-24, 19:47   Link #58
CJ_Walker
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Los Angeles, California
Age: 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dawnstorm View Post
The story is certainly social control, but what if the syndomes (there were two, weren't there?) were not genetic but mental disorders?

You've seen the destruction Satoru could wreak. Now imagine you use your powers so much that they become second nature. Then imagine you lash out when angry... A single slip could be desastrous.

Then imagine a very smart boy discovers secrecy but not the secret, and he can't talk about it for fear of prosecution. From episode one, I had the impression that Shun was controlling his expressions much more than any of the others. This may easily lead to stress (estrangement from society, fear of letting the mask slip, etc.) and maybe to paranoid symptoms. Then imagine he gains even more knowledge and has done something forbidden. Even more stress.

I think the eye in the egg is a reflection of Shun feeling watched. The stress is taking over, catching up. Shun is becoming mentally exhausted and losing control. That could easily be what people refer to as "Karma demons".

What the story about "pride" etc. is warning you away from is, I think, overuse of your powers and use of your powers for selfish motives. If you get used to your powers to the extent that they might become reflexive? A single strong emotion, anger, say, or fear, could have very bad consequences.

If social control slips, you get removed, because estrangement makes you more dangerous. Literally.

Also, it's possible that children with weak or no powers get removed because they might awaken to them or get stronger later in life, when you're less impressionable. Someone who awakens to the power during puberty, for example, might be ticking time bomb.

Or I'm overthinking things.

***

Another I thing I found interesting in this episode is the talk about elictricity. Interesting. The setting keeps expanding.
That actrually makes a lot of sense. thanks for that.
CJ_Walker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-11-24, 19:57   Link #59
Triple_R
Center Attraction
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
Age: 33
Send a message via AIM to Triple_R
Quote:
Originally Posted by GenjiChan View Post
You made Saki more of a pervert.
Well... during the Saki/Maria love scene of Episode 8, I never got the impression that Saki was just "going through the motions", so to speak. And there was one scene where Saki made the first move for a kiss, not Maria. So I think that Saki finds it... pleasant. Your "comfortable" probably describes it just as well though.

Saki is content and generally happy with Maria. But Saki wants Shun, and wants nothing more than to be with him. For Saki, it's like a lowkey romance vs. Romeo and Juliet. The difference in degree is massive.

Edit: Anyway, I don't find any of this perverted. It's just normal romantic passion. "Perverted" would be if Saki had erotic pictures of Maria all over her bedroom wall. So no, I don't think that Saki is perverted.


Quote:

But Shun is different from Maria. I always want to see him whether close or far. My heart is throbbing whenever he is around. Yes, i know he is supposed to be Satoru's "partner-lover" but why am I feeling uneasy with them together. What does Shun has that Maria don't. What makes him special than everyone else in my eyes. Now that he broke up with Satoru.... am I supposed to be happy? Shun (holds necklace) where are you Shun?
Very well-done. Good writing!


Quote:
Originally Posted by CJ_Walker View Post
This is what pissed me off about saki this episode! her father was sticking his neck out for her, and all she could do was disrepect her parents like that,
Saki's father impressed me in this episode. He did indeed stick his neck out for her, and shot straight with her when he knew that it would be wrong to try to keep her in the dark.

That being said... Saki is a teenage girl. Who do you think means more to your average teenage girl in the heat of the moment: Their father, or the guy that they're madly in love with?

So I'm willing to cut Saki some slack here. She blew up a bit at her parents not out of any disrespect or lack of love for them, but out of deep, passionate concern for Shun.
__________________
Triple_R is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2012-11-24, 20:01   Link #60
Kazu-kun
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dawnstorm View Post
The story is certainly social control, but what if the syndomes (there were two, weren't there?) were not genetic but mental disorders?
Many mental diseases have genetic causes. And again, the fact that he was so interested about the subject since he was a kid leads me believe he already suspected that it was that sort of disease and that he was at risk of being afflicted with it.
__________________
http://forums.animesuki.com/images/as.icon/signaturepics/sigpic39230_3.gif
Kazu-kun is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:59.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
We use Silk.