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View Poll Results: Psycho-Pass - Episode 9 Rating
Perfect 10 18 33.33%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 20 37.04%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 12 22.22%
7 out of 10 : Good 3 5.56%
6 out of 10 : Average 1 1.85%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 0 0%
4 out of 10 : Poor 0 0%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 0 0%
Voters: 54. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2012-12-07, 11:06   Link #41
Kirarakim
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Originally Posted by ogon_bat View Post
For those thinking the bone pipe is creepy, think about it for a second, it is no different from having the head of your kills handing on he wall, it is a trophy, nothing more, nothing less.
I am not a fan of hunting animals for sport either.

But this brings back images of some of the things the Nazis did. It's plenty creepy.
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Old 2012-12-07, 11:15   Link #42
Roger Rambo
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Originally Posted by ogon_bat View Post
I do not think there is such think as using thought patterns to communicate, we have this thing called language we use to communicate with other humans, whether his brain controls meaty muscles or mechanical ones to create syllables (or type words at the keyboard) does not change the fact that he must choose words and build sentences before translating them into sounds/letters.
Yes, but in order for these thought patterns to be communicated through his bionics, he needs to transmit them through a computer. A computer which hypothetically could receive input of slurred speech, and output coherent speech. It wouldn't be that outline for technology in this universe, since they have holo AI that can have legible conservation with people.
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Old 2012-12-07, 11:18   Link #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ogon_bat View Post

p.s.

For those thinking the bone pipe is creepy, think about it for a second, it is no different from having the head of your kills handing on he wall, it is a trophy, nothing more, nothing less.
That's probably pretty close to how Makishima himself views it, yes.

That being said, most people find it "creepy" because the idea of doing that to another human body just turns most people's stomachs (myself included, I'll admit, though seeing it in animated format takes much of the visceral impact of it away).

Still, there is a rich poetic irony here. Remember that those are not the bones of some innocent girl...
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Old 2012-12-07, 11:31   Link #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ogon_bat View Post
I do not think there is such think as using thought patterns to communicate, we have this thing called language we use to communicate with other humans, whether his brain controls meaty muscles or mechanical ones to create syllables (or type words at the keyboard) does not change the fact that he must choose words and build sentences before translating them into sounds/letters.
Language is merely thought patterns given form

Quote:
Still, there is a rich poetic irony here. Remember that those are not the bones of some innocent girl...
Makes no difference though. Trophy is a trophy in the end regardless of who or what it came from. Innocent or not doesn't change the quarry's fate.
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Old 2012-12-07, 11:48   Link #45
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Makes no difference though. Trophy is a trophy in the end regardless of who or what it came from. Innocent or not doesn't change the quarry's fate.
If a colorful serial killer killed The Joker, you wouldn't see irony (and perhaps even poetic justice) in that?

I have to admit, knowing that Oryo's own fate was no less dehumanizing than that of her own victims had a touch of poetic justice to me. While human bone pipes are indeed creepy, in this particular instance what I feel more is "poetic justice".
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Old 2012-12-07, 11:57   Link #46
mangamuscle
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But this brings back images of some of the things the Nazis did. It's plenty creepy.
I am not fond of hunting (I think it is a sport for men with small dicks, unless you really need it for feeding yourself and your family) since with modern technology it is a no brainer, the prey never had a chance. Now, kill a tiger with your own hands, now that I would call something to boast about.

But about the Nazi thing, humans killing humans and using the corpse as some kind of trophy is nothing new, is not about "technology is stealing our humanity", if anything technology only enhances it (even if it is ugly to look at).

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Originally Posted by Roger Rambo View Post
A computer which hypothetically could receive input of slurred speech, and output coherent speech.
Slurry speech is the least of the problems to someone how has a brain that has deteriorated. They have inability to think straight, they are unable to communicate or their speech are incoherent rambles.

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Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
That's probably pretty close to how Makishima himself views it, yes.
Which means my hue is as cloudy as his

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Originally Posted by Cosmic Eagle View Post
Language is merely thought patterns given form
and how well we can translate ideas and desires into words or other forms of expressions is the essence of a brilliance, which is the opposite of an eroded mind.
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Old 2012-12-07, 13:10   Link #47
ookamigirl
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The interview with that cyborg guy was interesting.
His view of humanity's future progress was unique.
Well, it's no wonder he's a psycho as well.
Makishima sure has an interesting teacher.
Looks like they're not gonna quit killing either.
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Old 2012-12-07, 13:16   Link #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
If a colorful serial killer killed The Joker, you wouldn't see irony (and perhaps even poetic justice) in that?

I have to admit, knowing that Oryo's own fate was no less dehumanizing than that of her own victims had a touch of poetic justice to me. While human bone pipes are indeed creepy, in this particular instance what I feel more is "poetic justice".
More like funny than ironic but that's beside the point....it's more like dead is dead and you're getting crapped upon by whatever killed you anyway so well all notions of "poetic justice" is kind of moot besides that fact


Quote:
and how well we can translate ideas and desires into words or other forms of expressions is the essence of a brilliance, which is the opposite of an eroded mind.
Which does not have any bearing on your original point of there being no such thing as communicating via thought patterns alone.

Determiner of brilliance or eloquence does not equal determiner of "impossible to communicate"

Language means your mind must work to use it true, but the aim is to get your intent across. Thought patterns alone suffice for that purpose if that purpose is the sole goal.
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Old 2012-12-07, 13:39   Link #49
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Originally Posted by ogon_bat View Post
For those thinking the bone pipe is creepy, think about it for a second, it is no different from having the head of your kills handing on he wall, it is a trophy, nothing more, nothing less.
As someone who is slightly disturbed by those animal heads, I don't find that argument reassuring at all.
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Old 2012-12-07, 14:06   Link #50
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More like funny than ironic but that's beside the point....it's more like dead is dead and you're getting crapped upon by whatever killed you anyway so well all notions of "poetic justice" is kind of moot besides that fact
I really don't agree with this. Frankly, I think your view here is too narrow and simplistic.

Especially when evaluating fiction. I'm sure the irony of Oryo's death and subsequent mutilation is not lost on Gen.
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Old 2012-12-07, 14:14   Link #51
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Teleological determinism of any kind is something to be expected from virtually every show with futuristic setting. Doesn't make it less amusing nonetheless.
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Old 2012-12-07, 14:26   Link #52
mangamuscle
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Thought patterns alone suffice for that purpose if that purpose is the sole goal.
Do you think in "thought patterns" by any chance? Of course not, you think in a language. At least for me that it is obvious since I speak proficiently two languages and as I write this I am thinking in english (which is not my native language). What you call "thought patterns" are desires and other primitive ideas that take form when the human brain translates them into words, but before that they are not complete by any means. Even hand signs, pictures and other similar medium are forms of language, not merely "thought patterns".

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As someone who is slightly disturbed by those animal heads, I don't find that argument reassuring at all.
They are disturbing in a sense, but many thinks are disturbing if you think about their essence. All of us eat rotting corpses every day (yes,even vegetarians). I sleep on a bed with a wooden platform (and the door to my house is also made of wood, the rest is made out of stone), which is also a corpse. You might rationalize that trees and humans are vastly different, but we share a lot of dna, we breath air, drink water and required nutrients on a daily basis.
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Old 2012-12-07, 15:29   Link #53
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Originally Posted by ogon_bat View Post
They are disturbing in a sense, but many thinks are disturbing if you think about their essence. All of us eat rotting corpses every day (yes,even vegetarians). I sleep on a bed with a wooden platform (and the door to my house is also made of wood, the rest is made out of stone), which is also a corpse. You might rationalize that trees and humans are vastly different, but we share a lot of dna, we breath air, drink water and required nutrients on a daily basis.
I am sorry to say but I don't see the similarity to what that hunter guy does to the normal everyday things you are referring to.

I know there is a lot of cruelty in the human world but to put what this guy does on a natural level seems a bit odd.

And of course people can rationalize and say the girl deserved it because what she did was sick too but what happens when he goes after Kogami or Akane?
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Old 2012-12-07, 16:59   Link #54
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That's a bit extreme, but I think in line with Mr Cyborg's talk about human too dependant on technology.

It's not exactly a good example, but we used to memorize telephone contact numbers but now we have our phones to do all the recording and memorizing for us. Will there be a day where we even need devices to recall people face? Hmm...scary thoughts
Both are extrapolation of the ancient argument that writing makes people's memories atrophy by giving us external aids.

In this case, however, I find the extrapolation unbelievable. Facial recognition is an instinctive ability that exists in infants, presumably having evolved over millions of years. By contrast, numbers is a human invention and quite non-standard over different isolated groups. The show is asking to much to believe in that. (It's also rather poor narration to leave this information in a magazine somewhere with not even a hint in the show proper)
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Old 2012-12-07, 17:00   Link #55
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Do you think in "thought patterns" by any chance? Of course not, you think in a language. At least for me that it is obvious since I speak proficiently two languages and as I write this I am thinking in english (which is not my native language). What you call "thought patterns" are desires and other primitive ideas that take form when the human brain translates them into words, but before that they are not complete by any means. Even hand signs, pictures and other similar medium are forms of language, not merely "thought patterns".
While a lot of thoughts are framed in words, it's not that rare to have ideas you can't quite put into words. Heck, simple example: you can remember a face a lot better than you can describe it using only words.
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Old 2012-12-07, 17:03   Link #56
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NO awesome death this episode...
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Old 2012-12-07, 18:57   Link #57
mangamuscle
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I am sorry to say but I don't see the similarity to what that hunter guy does to the normal everyday things you are referring to.
That is to be expected, you (as most people) are desensitized and see eating other living being as normal. Have you ever killed your own food? Since it comes in nice little packages is easy to be detached about the fact that was once a living being. If you have at least once killed your food once you must still remember the feeling of anguish of killing an animal (specially if it was looking back at you). If you have can no longer remember at all what what you felt that the first time, well, somebody has to be a cook/butcher. btw, I am not a vegetarian nor trying to convince anyone of becoming one, I simply accept the truth about the fact that corpses are not something we do not experience in our everyday life.

Quote:
I know there is a lot of cruelty in the human world but to put what this guy does on a natural level seems a bit odd.
If you ever have the chance visit a factory that processes livestock and tell me if you really thought that process can be called "natural". The only difference is that modern society shuns (most of the time) upon the idea of killing thy neighbor, we forget there was a time our ancestors did it quite often (for modern standards). The roman coliseum is a prime example. Wars and professional american football is a modern example.

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While a lot of thoughts are framed in words, it's not that rare to have ideas you can't quite put into words. Heck, simple example: you can remember a face a lot better than you can describe it using only words.
A face (or an animal or a building) is something you have already seen, ideas and therefore language are more conceptual in nature. I mean, you know when I talk about 14 km/h, justice, even blue but those are human concepts which can only be represented but do not exist by themselves in real life. In essence if you can't translate an idea into words I think a computer can extract from your brain a novel (or even a sentence) since it is not there. An image (either real or imagined) probably can be extracted into a file.
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Old 2012-12-07, 19:03   Link #58
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LOL. You are right, that's definitely very weird
No, it's not. The majority of the school still doesn't know that Rikako was the culprit, and even less people know that Makishima was connected to the incident. No one at the school had any particular reason to pay special attention to Makishima.
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Old 2012-12-07, 19:18   Link #59
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Good episode, I felt during the interview segment with the full body cyborg there definitely seemed something off about him, a bit 'uncanny valley' there, did anyone else get that?

During Akane and Kogami's outing, I thought "That house looks familiar. I'm sure some famous architect had a house just like that one."
Turns out it looks very much like Frank Lloyd Wright's Fallingwater.
But before then, did you spot all the tents down by the river? I wonder if the Sibyl system extends that far?

The whole 'hunter' thing reminds me very much of the old film "The Most Dangerous Game".
Re. Cyborg-san: THOSE FREAKING SOULLESS EYES!!! And that smile! Did anyone else think of evil dead Orville Redenbacher?
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Old 2012-12-07, 19:24   Link #60
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"To fight 'darkness' (be it criminality and/or the most damaged of psyches) you yourself must learn about darkness. Kogami's swamp analogy was very good at explaining the dangers inherent in this, and how not everybody is up to it."

Welp, you remember Nietzsche's quote earlier in the show about staring into the abyss for too long. That seems to be one of the main philosophies in this series.
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