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Old 2012-12-31, 14:06   Link #341
james0246
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Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant View Post
Other than saying "the legends were true", I am not sure what else they would have said. In those ancient times without Internet, you would keep seeing and hearing things you never comprehended before.
It was a stupendous, amazing and legendary event that more or less amounted to the dawrfs saying 'well that happened, what's for dinner? '. The giants just showed up, did their thing and then nothing. The goblins had a greater impact on the story and they were nothing more than fodder for Bilbo to get to Gollum.
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Old 2012-12-31, 14:19   Link #342
Ithekro
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Well to be fair, the dwarves have seen a dragon before. (That and it was basically a single line out of the novel where it is hard to see if what they are seeing is real, or just figurative. They made no serious mention of it afterwards regardless, save maybe in tales. And even then....the trolls and goblins lasted longer and the dwarves and hobbit could act with them. Giants? They heed not, nor are effected by the lesser creatures of the world. Even Gandalf makes very little of comments on Giants in all versions of the wizard)

Plus...dwarves. Food first, death and worry later.
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Old 2012-12-31, 15:19   Link #343
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What's the point of going on an adventure if you never comment about how amazing or terrifying the adventure is? The giants were treated so mundane as to make them no better than a fallen branch blocking their path.
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Old 2012-12-31, 15:42   Link #344
Ithekro
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Well technically, only Bilbo is on an Adventure. The Dwarves are just heading home to retake the mountain (a quest). What happens between point A and point B means little to them if it doesn't achieve their goal (or feed them).

And Gandalf is Gandalf. He's way older that anybody and seen way more than anybody. He's technically an "angel" in terms of rank in the world.
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Old 2012-12-31, 15:43   Link #345
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Personally, I had always taken the "giant" sequence as just a really nasty mountain storm with avalanches. We were just getting a dwarven mythic explanation of it in the book (imo). Peter Jackson took it literally (as some readers did).

Actual stone giants .... errrrrrr, just doesn't seem to fit in the LOTR universe well (and it was another instance in the film of dwarves engaging in Wiley Coyote cartoon physics in surviving it). This was the early part of the story when Tolkien couldn't seem to decide whether he was writing a children's book or not.

Not that I think much of children's books that treat their readers as if anything can be pulled out of thin air for a cheap "o wow". Seriously, I love "The Hobbit" but I'm completely aware that it is a very awkward work in some ways.
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Old 2012-12-31, 17:03   Link #346
Ithekro
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The novel mostly reads like a childrens novel until I think someplace in Mirkwood, or possibly after that. There is less singing and such around that point.

I can see Jackson taking it literally due to his concept artists who go for style. Artist will make a metaphoric concept seem real, so a director, in seeing that would go "Let's do that. It would look cool and dramatic".
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Old 2012-12-31, 18:03   Link #347
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ithekro View Post
"Let's do that. It would look cool and dramatic".
I think that's the main thing. Just a big thunder storm wouldn't do much, and it wouldn't be as strong an allusion to the trouble on the snowy cliff edge from Fellowship.
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Old 2012-12-31, 18:45   Link #348
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I'm a literal person myself. If the text says "stone giants," I see 'em as stone giants. If it says "and he fell upon the towers of Thangorodrim, and they were broken in his ruin," I'm going to see Ancalagon as a dragon colossal enough to crush three mountains. It is a fantasy world after all. To intepret such things as metaphor (unless the author elsewhere says they are, but I don't remember if Tolkien did), just representing natural, realistic occurrences rather than being something truly fantastic, is so mundane and dull to my mind.

Quote:
Originally Posted by james0246 View Post
What's the point of going on an adventure if you never comment about how amazing or terrifying the adventure is?
To get their gold and home back. I don't think making comments ranks very high on their adventure to-do list

It hardly seems like a big deal though. Maybe they talked about it together at some other point; we didn't see them 24/7 after all, it's a movie. And really, what do we need to hear them say?

"So...how bout those giants?"
"Yeah, they were something."
"Sure were."
"I agree."

I don't think we really needed for them to talk about it.
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Old 2012-12-31, 18:50   Link #349
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They could whine about it...dwarves look like they can do that with ease :P
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Old 2012-12-31, 20:36   Link #350
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Just to clarify, I don't object to the giants, that was just a matter of interpretation the text. I only objected to the dwarves/hobbit's careening about far past the level that "blood and bone" could handle. Some hyperbole is mythic, etc but over and over again and it starts gonging.
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Old 2012-12-31, 22:43   Link #351
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I do agree about the over the top nature of some scenes (the escape from the Goblins just got whackier the longer it went, and the giants I think could have been just observed fighting rather than what happened), but just to throw a bit of a mind screw in the works, look at it this way... what we are seeing is what Bilbo is writing in the book and his recollection. So what we can take from this is Bilbo loves to embellish his stories to the ninth degree, and is a lying sneaking kleptomaniac. :P
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Old 2012-12-31, 22:51   Link #352
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That and Bilbo revised it a few times...as did Frodo I think.

(That and if I recall Tolkien changed it a bit to fit the Lord of the Rings, the Revised version having a passage about Gandalf sort of forcing the truth about what happened with Gollum out of Bilbo...the original version being what he told the Dwarves and possibly Frodo originally).
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Old 2013-01-02, 00:52   Link #353
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[QUOTE=ChainLegacy;4492866(called Eru in The Silmarillion),).[/QUOTE]


Eru Illuvatar

. . .yeah I read the simalrilion too. . .that is his hardest book to read out of all of them. . .
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Old 2013-04-02, 02:53   Link #354
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The Simarillion is to the history of Middle Earth what the ancient testament is to the Bible - the Genesis + everything that came until the birth and rise of an eventual savior. There are more storylines in it than in LotR, more characters, lost locations (most of the area in which things take place was destroyed by natural cataclysms before the events of LotR), etc. It's not a streamlined storyline like in the LotR saga, so it's no surprise that it's harder to read. Not to mention that by nature it's more steeped in old European (Norse, Anglo-Saxon, Germanic, etc, etc) legends than LotR ever was, so the writing style is the only things that feels quite different - the entire atmosphere is, too.


Anyway, it's not an update, but Peter Jackson did a video Q&A with fans - and it looks like there are scenes from the Desolation of Smaug (you can see Thranduil - and is that Legolas?) in it.

YouTube
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Old 2013-06-06, 02:25   Link #355
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First photo of Evangeline Lilly as elf warrior Tauriel revealed
Quote:
Before you go flipping through the book to look up the character, know this: It was created especially for The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug, to give the movie's male-dominated cast a bit of a female touch.

Needless to say, Tauriel's introduction has drawn some ire from Tolkien purists.

"I know beyond a shadow of a doubt that there are going to be people who will totally hate Tauriel, think that she shouldn't be in the movie, that it's a betrayal of Tolkien, and no matter what I do it won't be right," Lilly told Entertainment Weekly.

Still, the actress, who became famous after starring in sci-fi TV series Lost, relished her pointy-eared role.

"She's slightly reckless and totally ruthless and doesn't hesitate to kill," said Lilly.

She added that Tauriel isn't only a fierce warrior, but she also has a softer side. "She will definitely have a love story," Lilly said. "I can't give away too much about it. It's not a huge focus but it is there and it is important and it does drive Tauriel and her story and her actions."

EW
Frankly, I would have much preferred Lilly to play the new, re-imagined Lara Croft.
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Old 2013-06-06, 02:33   Link #356
Ithekro
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"Never trust an elf"
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Old 2013-06-06, 02:47   Link #357
Obelisk ze Tormentor
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Wow, this adaptation has a lot of free-time to insert a filler character into the story (like shounen series do).
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Old 2013-06-06, 03:36   Link #358
Hitenma
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Just because she doesn't appear in the book, doesn't mean she is a filler character.
Otherwise Azog and Radagast are fillers as well.
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Old 2013-06-06, 03:48   Link #359
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Originally Posted by Hitenma View Post
Just because she doesn't appear in the book, doesn't mean she is a filler character.
Otherwise Azog and Radagast are fillers as well.
What's your definition of "filler" then?
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Old 2013-06-06, 03:56   Link #360
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There were a lot of unnamed Elves in the book as well as every other race. I really don't see too much wrong with the notion. Tolkien certainly had women in combat - see the Kelts, Scandinavian, and Germanic tribes in the history he drew from for real examples.

The Mirkwood part of the story in the Hobbit is pretty sketchy as it is. Legolas *should* have been a character in that part but isn't even mentioned. He's the son of the freaking king!

An adaptation that provides some additional context could be interesting - rather like the Appendices in the LOTR provided meat for all sorts of side stories. Just for context, I first read LOTR and the Hobbit back in the mid-1970s and have re-read them a couple of dozen times since then. I've always considered the Hobbit a bit wobbly compared to LOTR and often wished Tolkien would have gone back and retro-rewritten it.

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