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Old 2012-12-26, 05:46   Link #4781
Mahou
ダメ人 - 人間失格
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Insane View Post
In my opinion, flawed/mental weakling protagonist is necessary to maintain the suspension of disbelief -- not as to why girls are interested in him in the first place (though that is usually addressed to some degree, but doesn't honestly matter too much), but why the "harem" status quo can be maintained for so long. If the guy is good looking and he knows it, and has no hesitation at all about the situation he's in, then he would just be a womanizer, and having a harem lead who actually sleeps around is not (usually) part of the fantasy. So the lead has to have some sort of justifiable inferiority complex (or plain inferiority) or some strong sense of morality that counters the situation he's in. So the option are
a) he can't be particularly smart
b) he can't be particularly handsome
c) he has to be dense about the feelings of the women around him
d) he has to be fixated on "true love" (either as an unreachable person or as a general concept), or... so on. Something so that he isn't taking advantage of the women who love him, or deliberately messing with their feelings.
You can combine two options in one character, though. For example: Make the character smart and acceptably handsome, but dense or uninterested in love. It would still keep the effect of "who'll wake his interested in the opposite gender/love" while also not rubbing his density in the reader's face at each possible opportunity (that's the main annoyance with dense MCs for me - to be reminded of them being dense at every time). Nor would it make the MC some jerkass like Kento who knows how to sleep his way through the girls
No need for a physical powerhouse MC when violence isn't a theme of the manga (except if used for stupid drama-fail reasons).

In Visual Novels in contrast, you have MCs who - let's say - are completely useless in school and know basically nothing. This can be even more annoying than a romantically-dense MC because the comedy fails to be funny for me and even the other characters are more annoyed than find it "funny". Combined with the character trait of being full of energy and the /facepalm is as good as complete.
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Old 2013-01-02, 19:12   Link #4782
Kusa-San
I'll end it before April.
 
 
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OMG, this last chapter, OMG, it's soo cliché, I can't stop laughing
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Old 2013-01-02, 20:18   Link #4783
SoloPanda
Not A Loli-con....
 
 
Join Date: May 2011
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I went and read Molester Man, and then I read this. It's amazing the contrast between an amazing Romcom with mediocre art and this with it's good art and well it's story. But then again I can complain all I like even though I've come back 155 times :/
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Old 2013-01-02, 20:24   Link #4784
Diveman
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that scene where Seiji enters from the windows, geez it felt so cliché. It seriously felt like a comedy act.
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Old 2013-01-03, 00:11   Link #4785
Xion Valkyrie
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoloPanda View Post
I went and read Molester Man, and then I read this. It's amazing the contrast between an amazing Romcom with mediocre art and this with it's good art and well it's story. But then again I can complain all I like even though I've come back 155 times :/
Molestor man can't last 155 chapters though =P To stretch something out like this you basically either have to make it a slice of life where nothing happens for long periods of time (Pastel) or have induced drama every so often.

Anyways, I can't believe the mangaka worked 'Good Ending' into the dialogue. SOOO CHEESY.
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Old 2013-01-03, 00:37   Link #4786
vansonbee
❤Ichigo 100%❤
 
 
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^ True, its very difficult to compare a long series to a short one.

Hmm, yes the good ending was cheesy, I'm wondering if its the translator trolling us.
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Old 2013-01-03, 02:58   Link #4787
Master Chibi
.: A bad doggy :.
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
One more chapter and I'm not going to give a flying shit.

I'm going to start making videos reviewing anime and manga and this is going to be the first one I start off with. I'll have to re-read it to really realize why I'm so disenchanted with it at this point.
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Old 2013-01-03, 04:18   Link #4788
Master Chibi
.: A bad doggy :.
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoloPanda View Post
I went and read Molester Man, and then I read this. It's amazing the contrast between an amazing Romcom with mediocre art and this with it's good art and well it's story. But then again I can complain all I like even though I've come back 155 times :/
Jesus fuck I went and read Molester Man on a whim and it honestly makes Good Ending look like a joke. Seriously. Thank you for even mentioning the series, I'm soo glad I decided to give it a try.
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Old 2013-01-03, 07:18   Link #4789
SoloPanda
Not A Loli-con....
 
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Master Chibi View Post
Jesus fuck I went and read Molester Man on a whim and it honestly makes Good Ending look like a joke. Seriously. Thank you for even mentioning the series, I'm soo glad I decided to give it a try.
I felt the same way after reading it. Honestly I was unsure in the beginning about the art but then It drew me in and after i was done, I had this big grin while thinking, "That was a good story."

Back to GE is this the second to last chapter? I just want to see how all of this unfitting puzzle gets forcibly mashed together Then I can come back here and complain about it and move on to the next story... honestly I really need to be more open minded.
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Old 2013-01-03, 07:25   Link #4790
Waven
Itadaki-nyaaa !!
 
 
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Ugh this really was cheesy but then again the series was very cliche from the very start, if you didn't realize this by chapter 5 you're either not very experienced with the genre or not very perceptive.

about Molester Man: As Xion Valkyrie said 156 chapters can be hardly compared to 21. Additionally, you guys are not regarding the whole package. Molester Man's art is more like a draft than a real refined work to the point I was wondering, with the amount of dialogue it has, why it wasn't made into a novel or LN to begin with. Why choose the graphical medium manga?

Also, correct me if I'm wrong but someone who claims to be past giving a damn about the series is not exactly one you would expect to reread the whole series to write a review.
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Old 2013-01-03, 07:33   Link #4791
Lexxus
No you don't
 
 
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Age: 25
Nah. They're just mad how things went with their heroine
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Old 2013-01-03, 07:39   Link #4792
SoloPanda
Not A Loli-con....
 
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Somewhere in the 11th dimension
Quote:
Originally Posted by Waven View Post
Ugh this really was cheesy but then again the series was very cliche from the very start, if you didn't realize this by chapter 5 you're either not very experienced with the genre or not very perceptive.

about Molester Man: As Xion Valkyrie said 156 chapters can be hardly compared to 21. Additionally, you guys are not regarding the whole package. Molester Man's art is more like a draft than a real refined work to the point I was wondering, with the amount of dialogue it has, why it wasn't made into a novel or LN to begin with. Why choose the graphical medium manga?

Also, correct me if I'm wrong but someone who claims to be past giving a damn about the series is not exactly one you would expect to reread the whole series to write a review.
That sounds perfectly reasonable from a logical stand point, but you're forgetting that we are Otaku here... I my self reread all of Prince of Tennis and Freezing just to find the parts I hated most about those two manga's (I know alot of people like them but I just really don't like them ) Reading manga's and giving my opinion or raging or talking about how great they are is half the fun for me, so i can see why Master Chibi would do it.
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Old 2013-01-03, 07:40   Link #4793
Waven
Itadaki-nyaaa !!
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lexxus View Post
Nah. They're just mad how things went with their heroine
Yea, I don't get how people will always root for the obvious underdog and then be resentful when it "turns out" she's losing "after all". There must be some incentive to emotionally invest in a losing game that I don't comprehend.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoloPanda View Post
That sounds perfectly reasonable from a logical stand point, but you're forgetting that we are Otaku here... I my self reread all of Prince of Tennis and Freezing just to find the parts I hated most about those two manga's (I know alot of people like them but I just really don't like them ) Reading manga's and giving my opinion or raging or talking about how great they are is half the fun for me, so i can see why Master Chibi would do it.
Call me a nitpicker but then that means he still does give a shit. It's just that he loves to hate, which I know for a fact he does quite regularly
Either way, shits will be given.
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Old 2013-01-03, 12:16   Link #4794
konart
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I chuckled at the naming for the last two chapters:
"Dearest"
"Everlasting..."

All we need for the really good ending - is a guilty crown
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Old 2013-01-03, 12:50   Link #4795
Diamond English
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Join Date: Jan 2013
Wasn't he knocking off another lass a few chapters ago and crying his eyes out when he dumped her.Wow, kids move quickly these days.
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Old 2013-01-03, 14:58   Link #4796
KLGChaos
The Shermain
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: NY
Age: 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by Waven View Post
Ugh this really was cheesy but then again the series was very cliche from the very start, if you didn't realize this by chapter 5 you're either not very experienced with the genre or not very perceptive.

about Molester Man: As Xion Valkyrie said 156 chapters can be hardly compared to 21. Additionally, you guys are not regarding the whole package. Molester Man's art is more like a draft than a real refined work to the point I was wondering, with the amount of dialogue it has, why it wasn't made into a novel or LN to begin with. Why choose the graphical medium manga?

Also, correct me if I'm wrong but someone who claims to be past giving a damn about the series is not exactly one you would expect to reread the whole series to write a review.
Molester Man was a 2ch story, like Train Man was, so it was originally a written work. Densha Otoko also has a manga version, so I'm not surprised that this got one also. Densha Otoko was about 6 chapters longer (and by the mangaka of Regatta and Hoshi no Furu Machi).

I honestly enjoy Shounen Romance Dramas that are shorter like above two. When they drag out, they start dumbing things down and having the characters turn into complete idiots just to get some more chapters (look at KNIM or Pastel-- two mangas that should have ended a LONG time ago). When they're shorter, the character development usually takes precedence, when they're longer, character development usually gives out in favor of forcing more drama in (or doing nothing at all like Pastel-- either way isn't really good) and things tend to become less and less realistic as time goes on, while mistakes are completely brushed under the carpet to force the main pairing together.

Everyone has their own preferences, of course, but if a romantic drama goes past 30 chapters, I probably won't read it, unless it's a seinen slice of life series, too, where character development takes precedence over melodrama.

To me, GE started out as something great. A cool, sexy heroine, a main character that developed really well within the first 30 chapters or so. Then everything backpedaled and the characters ended up becoming plot devices to develop the drama instead of the drama being a plot device to develop the characters. Imo, it completely jumped the shark during the "rape me or I dump you" chapter. That's when it started it's downward turn-- sort of like how the Tokyo arc did the same for KNIM in many people's minds.
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Old 2013-01-03, 15:07   Link #4797
Xion Valkyrie
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Waven View Post
Yea, I don't get how people will always root for the obvious underdog and then be resentful when it "turns out" she's losing "after all". There must be some incentive to emotionally invest in a losing game that I don't comprehend.
Nishino won in Ichigo 100%, so the possibilities are there!

Quote:
Originally Posted by KLGChaos View Post

To me, GE started out as something great. A cool, sexy heroine, a main character that developed really well within the first 30 chapters or so. Then everything backpedaled and the characters ended up becoming plot devices to develop the drama instead of the drama being a plot device to develop the characters. Imo, it completely jumped the shark during the "rape me or I dump you" chapter. That's when it started it's downward turn-- sort of like how the Tokyo arc did the same for KNIM in many people's minds.
It was also really funny in the first couple of chapters. Then it just became DRAMA DRAMA DRAMA.
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Old 2013-01-03, 15:35   Link #4798
Kusa-San
I'll end it before April.
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by Waven View Post
Yea, I don't get how people will always root for the obvious underdog and then be resentful when it "turns out" she's losing "after all". There must be some incentive to emotionally invest in a losing game that I don't comprehend.
.
Maybe because people like to have more interesting stories with less cliché in it ?

And yes, in Ichigo 100% it was the case. Btw, the ending in Ichigo 100% is much better when it comes to the writing.
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Old 2013-01-03, 15:50   Link #4799
Lexxus
No you don't
 
 
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Age: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xion Valkyrie View Post
Nishino won in Ichigo 100%, so the possibilities are there!
I don't really see Nishino as an underdog. I agree maybe during their middle school but not after that(But hey, that's just me). She's always on the lead against Aya. I also think the only reason Aya was on discussion was because of the "First Girl" trope. I think Kawashita hadn't given Aya that much chance as compare to Nishino IMO(unless I forgot something). Maybe she did but the final girl was already decided.

Anyway, I'm glad that we are left with 1 chapter to wrap this up. At least, I can finally end this.
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Old 2013-01-03, 16:09   Link #4800
Somnus
Kissing the sky
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Canada
Quote:
Originally Posted by KLGChaos View Post
Molester Man was a 2ch story, like Train Man was, so it was originally a written work. Densha Otoko also has a manga version, so I'm not surprised that this got one also. Densha Otoko was about 6 chapters longer (and by the mangaka of Regatta and Hoshi no Furu Machi).

I honestly enjoy Shounen Romance Dramas that are shorter like above two. When they drag out, they start dumbing things down and having the characters turn into complete idiots just to get some more chapters (look at KNIM or Pastel-- two mangas that should have ended a LONG time ago). When they're shorter, the character development usually takes precedence, when they're longer, character development usually gives out in favor of forcing more drama in (or doing nothing at all like Pastel-- either way isn't really good) and things tend to become less and less realistic as time goes on, while mistakes are completely brushed under the carpet to force the main pairing together.

Everyone has their own preferences, of course, but if a romantic drama goes past 30 chapters, I probably won't read it, unless it's a seinen slice of life series, too, where character development takes precedence over melodrama.

To me, GE started out as something great. A cool, sexy heroine, a main character that developed really well within the first 30 chapters or so. Then everything backpedaled and the characters ended up becoming plot devices to develop the drama instead of the drama being a plot device to develop the characters. Imo, it completely jumped the shark during the "rape me or I dump you" chapter. That's when it started it's downward turn-- sort of like how the Tokyo arc did the same for KNIM in many people's minds.
Well said, I couldn't agree more. Honestly, the most interesting part of this thread are the Molester Man shout outs (I can't praise that manga enough).

The worst part about this parent "arc", is that it could've been put at the very beginning and you wouldn't have felt like you missed a thing. I say this because I skipped a huge chunk-- got curious when I'd heard Utsumi did something useful (ie. Shou)-- and read random chapters between then and now when I was bored.

Yuki was wondering what the Old Utsumi would think of the new one? He wouldn't know the difference, he didn't develop at all. Oh wait, he lost his virginity...does that count?
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