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Old 2013-01-01, 20:00   Link #2121
Tempest35
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Ah hah...so the plot thickens... Thanks for the extra tidbits.

So in this case, we should be collectively cursing fate for Hanekawa's sake that she's in this perdicament. That does suck so much for Hanekawa then... She pretty much was getting him all ready for another girl to take the fruits of her labor.

And as for Nadeko... I don't feel as bad for her as I do for Hanekawa, not by a long shot. Sure she's moe n all but the girl's creepy when she gets obsessive. If I recall correctly,
Spoiler for Just in Case:
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Old 2013-01-01, 23:03   Link #2122
Shadow5YA
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Actually, seeing the events of Neko Black makes me feel that Koyomi gave up on Tsubasa long before Hitagi entered the picture and confessed.

The entire ordeal with Tsubasa acting like a Stockholm syndrome victim and defending her father hitting her along with Black Hanekawa being as violent as she was pretty much ruined his image of her as this strong, attractive, and pretty much perfect angel who saved him in more ways than one during Kizu.

It is a shame, because I do enjoy their chemistry together, but it feels like all that chemistry and feelings they had were weighed down by her family issues to the point where Koyomi couldn't see anything but her baggage.
Karen and Tsukihi did mention love to be simple, and Tsubasa's family and Black Hanekawa just made things complicated for Koyomi.
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Old 2013-01-02, 00:41   Link #2123
Tempest35
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Egh, I can accept that as a reason for Araragi backing off from Hanekawa in that sense. But it's not like Senjougahara's issues weren't any lighter than Hanekawa's either. And wasn't it at the end of Bake that Baka-ragi actually realized that Hanekawa really did like him like 'that'? He is still obviously attracted to both of them, it's just Gahara-san sunk her claws in and took off with him.

*sigh*

Fuko da...
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Old 2013-01-02, 00:46   Link #2124
Marcus H.
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^ Well, Hitagi is more active when it comes to her feelings, so Tsubasa has lost twice as much.
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Old 2013-01-02, 07:46   Link #2125
Shikijin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tempest35 View Post
So in this case, we should be collectively cursing fate for Hanekawa's sake that she's in this perdicament. That does suck so much for Hanekawa then... She pretty much was getting him all ready for another girl to take the fruits of her labor.
Senjougahara was very lucky in her timing. She happened to meet Araragi right after the events in Neko Black disrupted momentarily the relation between him and Hanekawa.
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And as for Nadeko... I don't feel as bad for her as I do for Hanekawa, not by a long shot. Sure she's moe n all but the girl's creepy when she gets obsessive.
Nadeko's efforts were more comical than anything. Her obsessiveness only makes her clumsiness stand out.
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Actually, seeing the events of Neko Black makes me feel that Koyomi gave up on Tsubasa long before Hitagi entered the picture and confessed.

The entire ordeal with Tsubasa acting like a Stockholm syndrome victim and defending her father hitting her along with Black Hanekawa being as violent as she was pretty much ruined his image of her as this strong, attractive, and pretty much perfect angel who saved him in more ways than one during Kizu.
I don't think this is the case. Even Hitagi had sides of hers Araragi didn't particularly like, but eventually he grew to accept all of her, so the same could have been true even for Hanekawa.
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Old 2013-01-02, 08:58   Link #2126
Shadow5YA
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I don't think this is the case. Even Hitagi had sides of hers Araragi didn't particularly like, but eventually he grew to accept all of her, so the same could have been true even for Hanekawa.
All that says is that they're compatible, and I know that they're compatible. Everyone did, including the characters in the series. It was mentioned at one point that he was expected to be with her instead of Hitagi when he broke the news. Hell, I wanted them to be together after reading Kizu.

The problem is that despite everything she did to pull Araragi closer to her, like getting him to be the Vice Rep under her, she negated all of that during Golden Week.

When she acted like a Stockholm syndrome victim and defended her father hitting her AND forbid Araragi from telling anyone about it, that was essentially her saying "don't help me".
Knowing Koyomi's personality, that is refusing what he stands for.
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Old 2013-01-02, 09:25   Link #2127
Marcus H.
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Question!

I'm a bit interested about how oddities work now that Meme gives new insight on the concept.
To what extent does an oddity change if exposed to human influences? Shinobu and - if I am right - Black Hanekawa and Rainy Devil, are the only cases wherein oddities change form. Is it possible for other oddities to go to similar changes or it's the type of oddity that allows the change?
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Old 2013-01-02, 13:34   Link #2128
Shikijin
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Originally Posted by Marcus H. View Post
I'm a bit interested about how oddities work now that Meme gives new insight on the concept.
To what extent does an oddity change if exposed to human influences? Shinobu and - if I am right - Black Hanekawa and Rainy Devil, are the only cases wherein oddities change form. Is it possible for other oddities to go to similar changes or it's the type of oddity that allows the change?
It was not meant to be a physical change, more like an influence on personality. I think the concept is first brought out in Tsukihi Phoenix; it was one of the reasons why Kagenui let Tsukihi be, because Araragi was a positive influence on her.
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Old 2013-01-03, 11:33   Link #2129
omimon
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Watching Kuro animated really brings alive how inhuman Hanekawa is. Loving how the story explores the fact that perfection is actually something that's monstrous.

At the same time I love how Nisio brings a counter balance to Hanakawa's character with Nadeko. One is selfless to the point that is monstrous and the other is selfish to the point that is monstrous.
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Old 2013-01-03, 14:41   Link #2130
Vallen Chaos Valiant
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Originally Posted by Marcus H. View Post
Question!

I'm a bit interested about how oddities work now that Meme gives new insight on the concept.
To what extent does an oddity change if exposed to human influences? Shinobu and - if I am right - Black Hanekawa and Rainy Devil, are the only cases wherein oddities change form. Is it possible for other oddities to go to similar changes or it's the type of oddity that allows the change?
The suggestion seems to be that belief bends reality. And that since humans are the main source of belief, humans created most of the oddities. However that doesn't mean the oddities aren't real; just because they were dreamed up by the frightened humans of ancient times, doesn't mean they are smoke and mirrors. The monsters ARE real. However, the rules still apply that human belief can warp them still.

That's why Shinobu became childish; only three people know her current existence, and the main person thinks of her as a kid. So she became part-kid.

To put it simply, the supernatural exists because people believed in them. Similar arguments are used in stories where deities try to enforce worship in order to sustain themselves.

Talk about deities, Shinobu was once offered the position of being treated like a god. Since we know she is actually the most powerful entity on Earth, that isn't a strange offer.
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Old 2013-01-03, 16:03   Link #2131
zeando
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i'm currently reading nekomonogatari white
didn't expected the thing hanekawa admired of araragi was the "integrity" (or stability, it's better worded)
the medlesome cat has a blog?

reading it from hanekawa's point of view is surely very interesting (also the cat narrating for some time)

the dumbness of black hanekawa is spectacular xD she's really the missing parts of hanekawa :3

Last edited by zeando; 2013-01-03 at 19:17.
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Old 2013-01-03, 23:11   Link #2132
omimon
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Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant View Post
Since we know she is actually the most powerful entity on Earth, that isn't a strange offer.
False. We know that Kurayami is the destroyer of ALL rule-breakers.
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Old 2013-01-04, 02:52   Link #2133
Masuzu
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^ I'd rather not bring Kurayami into the picture, are we even sure 'what' 'it' 'is'?
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Old 2013-01-04, 11:18   Link #2134
BaKaBaKaOtaKu
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Originally Posted by Shikijin View Post
It needs to be said that Hitagi appears to be kinky in the sac, and she is hinted to be bisexual. She also admitted being a fathercon.
I need an enlightenment because my yuri fanboy heart is excited about this. Care to share which scenes hinted this? Thanks.
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Old 2013-01-04, 11:41   Link #2135
Shikijin
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I need an enlightenment because my yuri fanboy heart is excited about this. Care to share which scenes hinted this? Thanks.
The first hint was shown right in the date episode (Bake 12):

"Simply speaking, losing you now would be as if I had lost half of myself. That is why I would like you to wait just a little while."

"Just a little while--"

"Yes, until next week would be good."

"That's it!?"

"So be content with Kanbaru's body until then."

"You just said something incredible!"

"I will use that time to rehabilitate with Kanbaru too, of course."

"That means that Kanbaru will get everything she wants! Only her wishes will be perfectly fulfilled!"

"Well, next week would be too early--eventually I definitely will be able to deal with it, so please just wait a little bit. That's why at this point, this starry sky is the last of the possessions that I can offer you. ...When I was a child I came here with my mother and father."


Later on the target became Hanekawa instead of Kanbaru. You will see that in Neko White.
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Old 2013-01-04, 14:06   Link #2136
zeando
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just finished reading neko white,
i'm so yearning for it to get animated now :3

hanekawa's decision was for the best, being a single entity is always better than being fragmented, but i can't avoid being sad about "losing" white hanekawa, i really liked that side of her (lately even a bit black) (her normalization during the whole novel was in itself a bit annoying for me)

thinking about it, she never actually "stopped looking" at the unpleasant things, she was just using different eyes, from the point of view of a single side of her(white) she was looking away, but her as a whole never stopped looking
in the end even deciding to become one was all cause white's regret

Last edited by zeando; 2013-01-04 at 14:34.
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Old 2013-01-04, 17:38   Link #2137
Shadow5YA
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Can somebody remind me the story about Shinobu's helmet again? If she didn't like Araragi petting her on the head, why did she take it off in Nise?
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Old 2013-01-04, 21:21   Link #2138
Mura
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So I wanted to start reading Neko White on BT. I see parts 1-27 but then it jumps to 52. Does 52 still continue from where 27 left off on? The number jump just confused me.
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Old 2013-01-04, 22:10   Link #2139
Romanticide
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@Shadow5YA: She thought it was lame, iirc, and decided to not wear it anymore.

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So I wanted to start reading Neko White on BT. I see parts 1-27 but then it jumps to 52. Does 52 still continue from where 27 left off on? The number jump just confused me.
the jumps are Black Hanekawa's parts.
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Old 2013-01-04, 22:14   Link #2140
Mura
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@Shadow5YA: She thought it was lame, iirc, and decided to not wear it anymore.



the jumps are Black Hanekawa's parts.
Ah okay, so I have nothing to worry about then. Thanks.
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