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Old 2013-01-07, 14:50   Link #261
Suzuku
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Pretty good first ep, feels a lot like a light novel SHAFT would animate to me though.
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Old 2013-01-07, 15:47   Link #262
Sheba
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I support Masuzu simply on the principle that she is a JoJoBro, therefore have won my support.
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Old 2013-01-07, 17:18   Link #263
Ceral
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Good reason for MC to accept Masuzu's proposal (blackmail) is so that he can fulfill one of his life mantras of not being mistaken for a homo.
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Old 2013-01-07, 21:38   Link #264
Shimapan
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Originally Posted by sky black swordman View Post
They sound a lot more like stalkers it they do things like that.
All the more a reason for her to make them think that she has a boyfriend now, and that any further confessions would be futile.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ceral View Post
Good reason for MC to accept Masuzu's proposal (blackmail) is so that he can fulfill one of his life mantras of not being mistaken for a homo.
That's true. Masuzu initially said that she had always thought that he was a homo - probably because he always avoids girls (except Chiwa).
Others quite possibly think just like her, so fake-dating her will make them stop to think he's gay.
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Old 2013-01-07, 21:50   Link #265
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Never heard of the show, but since it's new I think I'll check it out.
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Old 2013-01-08, 00:30   Link #266
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My impression; it seems this follows the time honored adage of the Japanese male who wants to avoid embarrassment at any cost. With a harem twist. I'll check out a few episodes.
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Old 2013-01-08, 04:23   Link #267
Coldlight
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Let the "carnage" (i.e. shuraba) begin.

Things were actually better than I expected. Eita and Masuzu's seiyuu did great. With the exception of Chiwa's voice which differed from what I wanted to hear. She didn't sound genki enough to me. I do applaud her seiyuu's effort, maybe I can get used to her voice after a while.

Anyway, despite the voice I'll still be rooting for Chiwa, as usual from when I was reading the manga adaptation of the novels. Nice to see that I'm not the only one supporting her in this thread, among the throngs of early Masuzu supporters.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aoken View Post
+ Silver Senjougahara
If they had kept the original web radio cast she would really have been Silver Senjougahara (Chiwa Saito voiced Masuzu in the web radio show).

Anyway, what's done is done and I thought Yukarin did an excellent job with Masuzu, so I can accept the change.
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Old 2013-01-08, 10:30   Link #268
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Old 2013-01-08, 11:25   Link #269
Obelisk ze Tormentor
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Hmm...blue eyes and white silky hair...

Somehow, she reminds me of this:

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Which kinda suits her character, really.
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Old 2013-01-08, 17:54   Link #270
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Originally Posted by Obelisk ze Tormentor View Post
Hmm...blue eyes and white silky hair...

Somehow, she reminds me of this:

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Which kinda suits her character, really.
Holy crap, that cracked me up. seriously =D
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Old 2013-01-08, 18:43   Link #271
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Obelisk ze Tormentor View Post
Hmm...blue eyes and white silky hair...

Somehow, she reminds me of this:

Images
Sorry; dynamic content not loaded. Reload?

Which kinda suits her character, really.
Very fitting.

In addition to what you pointed out, she is smart and devious enough to be Seto Kaiba's daughter, lol.


Pretty interesting first episode, that I checked out largely due to totoum's suggestion.

What I find most interesting is how a fair number of recent, prominent female anime characters wear these "moe masks" that hide a very different and harsher/sharper (depending on how you look at it) personality inside, and that this is the latest anime show to have a major female character like this.

Other characters like this were seen in Accel World, Chuunibyou, and Kokoro Connect.

I wonder what this trend might be pointing towards? Growing cynicism towards moe ideals best represented by, say, the K-On! girls? Maybe anime writers and mangaka and light novel writers just tried of more standard moe archetypes and hence wanting to invert them, or at least subvert them, a bit? In any event, I do find this recent trend of sly, smart, pretentious, moe mask-wearing anime girls to be intriguing.

I also like the male lead of this show, Eita. A young man with a practical life/career goal that makes him very studious and industrious. He appears to be very different from most other anime romcom male leads, with the possible exception being that he seems to have a touch of chuunibyou to himself. So far, I like him. On the whole, I like how this anime has both of its leads starting from very cynical positions towards romance, which is pretty distinct for an anime romcom.


Overall, it's looking promising so far!
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Old 2013-01-08, 19:20   Link #272
Midonin
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Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
I wonder what this trend might be pointing towards? Growing cynicism towards moe ideals best represented by, say, the K-On! girls? Maybe anime writers and mangaka and light novel writers just tried of more standard moe archetypes and hence wanting to invert them, or at least subvert them, a bit?
I bought this up in the Robotics;Notes thread too (only the attitude there was towards the intentional fantasticness of super robot shows), but why does everything have to be a cynical commentary on a trend? (Which is, in the cases most people theorize, either moe or the anime fandom). Not everything in this world is being presented through a layer of irony and commentary. Sometimes things are what they are simply because they're amusing, or they're there to add depth, but not necessarily to "call something out".
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Old 2013-01-08, 19:59   Link #273
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Originally Posted by Midonin View Post
I bought this up in the Robotics;Notes thread too (only the attitude there was towards the intentional fantasticness of super robot shows), but why does everything have to be a cynical commentary on a trend? (Which is, in the cases most people theorize, either moe or the anime fandom). Not everything in this world is being presented through a layer of irony and commentary. Sometimes things are what they are simply because they're amusing, or they're there to add depth, but not necessarily to "call something out".
I'm not sure why my suggestion bothers you so much. Many of the great works of fiction were all about subverting or deconstructing widely beloved tropes or entertainment trends.

NGE and Madoka Magica are two huge anime examples of this. The Watchmen and The Dark Knight Returns are two huge comic book examples of this.

No trope is absolutely perfect. Any trope will get tiresome if its constantly played straight in work after work after work, year after year after year. Heck, even "happy endings" in general became tiresome to many people for just this reason. Lately I get a sense that people want and appreciate happy endings more than what was the case just a few years ago. Going through some "bad ends" likely helped some people appreciate "happy endings" in a way that they didn't for a long time.

Likewise, going through some "moe mask" girls might give some people a new and/or greater appreciation for sincere moe girls, like Clannad's Nagisa and K-On's Yui.


So for this reason, and others, I'm glad that Masuzu is the way she is.
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Old 2013-01-09, 02:08   Link #274
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I tend to agree that Masuzu probably isn't borne out of deep cynicism or dissatisfaction with industry trends. Rather, I think it's just an interesting hook for a romantic comedy. It's been done before too (although of course each case has a slightly different flavour); I'm thinking like Yukino from Kare Kano (~15 years ago), or more recently Tsukasa from Amagami ("Ayatsuji-san is a wonderful person with nothing to hide"). In a lot of ways, it also isn't so different from the tsundere, yandere, or ojou-sama trends either. It's also a relatively common thing in visual novels (see the genre tag); one of my favourites was Tsubasa from Kisaragi Gold Star (a relatively well-known title, if not translated).

The idea of "she looks perfect on the outside, but is quite different once you see past the facade" has certainly been done, anyway.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
Many of the great works of fiction were all about subverting or deconstructing widely beloved tropes or entertainment trends.
I would just say that many have been interpreted to be about that... but it doesn't necessarily mean the author actually did that consciously or was really trying to express any sort of dissatisfaction. But there is a certain audience who gets really excited whenever they can interpret any show as being a deconstruction or a subversion of a trend or trope. Personally, as someone who doesn't care all that much for "uniqueness" (as long as a show contains elements I like), I don't think about it very often. I suppose there's no clear answer, because it's mostly about interpretation. I didn't see this as some sort of "counter-trend", though.
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Old 2013-01-09, 02:14   Link #275
Westlo
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Everyone wears masks, it's no surprise it has shown up in anime lately, though it's not like it hasn't happened before.
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Old 2013-01-09, 02:42   Link #276
Sheba
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Everyone wears masks, it's no surprise it has shown up in anime lately, though it's not like it hasn't happened before.
Yeap, one can remember of Asuka Langley's act that was mostly to hide her own insecurities. Rousseau himself have struggled with that, that's in the Confessions that he dropped the mask of social conventions. We all wear masks because it is a normal thing to do, when we have sides that we don't want to show in public.

I like Masuzu because she is a kind of a trickster, like Ayamine from the Muv Luv trilogy, and is a JoJoBro. The fact that she fits the white-haired kind of tall, dark and bishoujo archetype that I am fond of is a bonus.
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Old 2013-01-09, 03:40   Link #277
Anime Online
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Though the act of blackmailing Kidou isn't praiseworthy, I really have to hand it to Masuzu for her thoroughness in picking a right target and doing her homework to make him go along with her charade.

Of course, it's a little too convenient in how she got that kind of leverage to blackmail him, but I'm willing to overlook it for the sake of moving the plot along quickly. It's also too convenient how she seemed to know instinctively that Kidou has no current interest in having a relationship. It's almost as if, while Kidou is busy reading his books, she had been reading him from those sideway glances.
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Old 2013-01-09, 04:51   Link #278
larethian
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(to no one in particular) Yes yes, 'Masuzu' archetype has been done before, except that, this time round, the protag has the same value system (with regards to love) as her and they got into a fake relationship. Someone tell me how often do you get this? Is it ok to pass the 'cliche' judgment on a show based on its individual character archetypes and standalone plot elements, or look at it as a sum of its parts? Well, I leave it to each and every individual.
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Old 2013-01-09, 08:06   Link #279
DragoonKain3
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Gotta love Light Novels. Their titles really bely exactly what is going to happen, and this is no exception. So I'll show myself out... even I can't see any hope at all.
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Old 2013-01-09, 08:51   Link #280
Triple_R
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Quote:
Originally Posted by relentlessflame View Post
I tend to agree that Masuzu probably isn't borne out of deep cynicism or dissatisfaction with industry trends. Rather, I think it's just an interesting hook for a romantic comedy.
I think it could be more than that. I mean, there is a trend here between certain characters in the four anime shows that I listed, that have all aired in just the past 12 months. I don't recall seeing that many anime characters like Masuzu in previous years.

To be clear, it may not be a counter-trend, per se. Perhaps its some sort of commentary/reflection on recent trends in the real world.


Quote:
In a lot of ways, it also isn't so different from the tsundere, yandere, or ojou-sama trends either.
If anything, it's the complete opposite of the tsundere. I'm not sure how it even relates to the yandere or the ojou-sama. The yandere is simply about there being something very creepy, and possibly even dangerous, to the person with a crush on you. But the crush is real - It's just all too real.


Quote:
I would just say that many have been interpreted to be about that... but it doesn't necessarily mean the author actually did that consciously or was really trying to express any sort of dissatisfaction.
You write this like we don't have any direct access to the author. But often we do. With comic books, Allan Moore and Frank Miller have been interviewed many times about The Watchmen and The Dark Knight Returns respectively. Similarly, Anno and Urobuchi have said much about NGE and Madoka Magica respectively. Much of what is said by these men reinforces fans interpreting their works as being deconstructive or subversive in nature. For example, from Anno, we know that Rei Ayanami was intended to come across as creepy.

And what's wrong with that? What's wrong with playing around with tropes and popular character types, and picking at the weaknesses or contradictions of them? Do we really want popular tropes to be played straight all the time, forever more? I can certainly appreciate K-On now and then too, but I wouldn't want all anime girls to be like the K-On girls.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Westlo View Post
Everyone wears masks, it's no surprise it has shown up in anime lately, though it's not like it hasn't happened before.
There's a difference between showing a filtered and more ideal version of yourself (tweaked in different ways for different situations), and showing something that's a true mask. Most people are a bit different at work than they are at home or at an informal social gathering. But the difference usually isn't that big, at least in my experience. With Masuzu and certain characters from the other shows I cited, the difference is like night and day. It's huge, and it goes beyond just your standard "social mask", imo.


Quote:
Originally Posted by larethian View Post
(to no one in particular) Yes yes, 'Masuzu' archetype has been done before, except that, this time round, the protag has the same value system (with regards to love) as her and they got into a fake relationship.
True, that's rather different, as I mentioned before. And that's something I like about this - a romcom where both halves of the presumptive main pairing are very cynical towards romance. I honestly have never seen that done before. At least not in anime.
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