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Old 2013-01-08, 18:40   Link #3561
leukrota
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sumeragi View Post
Define evil. To Academy City, everything is okay if it is for SCIENCE unless there are wide notice of it by the masses.
Not for everyone on the board of directors, some are very concerned for the student's well being and not just for being test subjects.

That said, all the directors are aware that the main purpose of AC is research, and that the students are the subjects for most of the research projects. So it's more about going around how it is all handled.
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Old 2013-01-08, 21:07   Link #3562
Ilidsor
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About the anime being canon, I consider the basic plot outlines to be canon but obviously some of the details can't be. For instance Kongou saved Misaka from the Kihara in one of the last few episodes iirc before she actually transferred to Tokiwadai. And well everything Kongou did in that anime but that was the only one that was plot relevant iirc.
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Old 2013-01-08, 22:04   Link #3563
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Well that version of accelerator already to much things make specifically to deal with him. And he have counters for most of them if his power was still up 100% of the time I guess even capacity down would be useless
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Old 2013-01-08, 22:14   Link #3564
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^ good point, after all, CD just tampered with the espers' brain using waves ... it's not like it's some super powerful esper powers that requires the use of dangerous drugs to be unleashed effectively.
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Old 2013-01-08, 23:33   Link #3565
noobita
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Originally Posted by tsunade666 View Post
Academy City isn't incompetent. If you have a director that can know every bit of information happening in the city. If it happens it means Aleister allows it or he didn't care. Everything is being monitored by the director and thus everything thing is known or being controlled by the Director. I don't think that is a sign of being incompetent if it has that tight of security.

Mikoto is a celebrity and you don't kill a celebrity unless you want mass panic.
You just solidified the reason why I think AC is incompetent. They have the resources yet they do nothing to stop Mikoto. Sure it can be forgiven if Mikoto only did it for one time, but this is no a joking matter anymore if she is enjoying doing this for second time, third time and so on.

You don't need 11 directors/chairmans work as a team to kill Mikoto. If they are serious, only one director is needed. You say that killing Mikoto will cause panic? They can always cover her death by either replacing a clone of Mikoto or kill Mikoto's entire family, and forge a fake information such as Mikoto and her family are now migrate to Russia or Africa for whatever reason.

I don't know what you guys think about this, but if a guinea pig starting become annoyance or threat to the organization, get rid of her is the best choice.

Ok, even if they don't want to kill her, but at least give her a warning or blackmail her or even better, recruit her into dark side. Those AC directors are pro when it comes to blackmails. They know Mikoto's parent and friends look-like.

Unless Mikoto is actually the favorite plaything of up-side narcissistic dude in the tube, I really see no reason why Mikoto still can roaming free in the center of city of devils lurk and do whatever she wants.
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Old 2013-01-08, 23:43   Link #3566
Chaos2Frozen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by noobita View Post
You just solidified the reason why I think AC is incompetent. They have the resources yet they do nothing to stop Mikoto. Sure it can be forgiven if Mikoto only did it for one time, but this is no a joking matter anymore if she is enjoying doing this for second time, third time and so on.
Why do you think that Mikoto was doing any serious damage to them?

Three experiments/cases? So what? They're still making tons of money and weapons even without them.

If it was so easy to rattle their cages then Accelerator wouldn't have such a problem.

Quote:
Originally Posted by noobita View Post
You don't need 11 directors/chairmans work as a team to kill Mikoto. If they are serious, only one director is needed. You say that killing Mikoto will cause panic? They can always cover her death by either replacing a clone of Mikoto or kill Mikoto's entire family, and forge a fake information such as Mikoto and her family are now migrate to Russia or Africa for whatever reason.
Clearly you're not thinking it through; none of the clones are a perfect match, and any of her close friend could tell immediately.

A popular Level 5 suddenly transferring overseas? That's a terrible lie. In the first place Espers have to go through strict channels to leave the city so if there isn't any 'paper trail', people would get suspicious.


And since you didn't read the side story novels, all I can say without spoiling is that don't underestimate Misaka's father.


Quote:
Originally Posted by noobita View Post
I don't know what you guys think about this, but if a guinea pig starting become annoyance or threat to the organization, get rid of her is the best choice.
Again, why do you think she is a threat?

None of the things she did has ever affected them in any significant way.

Again, the problem is you seem to think all the bad guys are working for the same person, which is not true. Factions have their own agenda and they tend to not work with each other.

Quote:
Originally Posted by noobita View Post
Ok, even if they don't want to kill her, but at least give her a warning or blackmail her or even better, recruit her into dark side. Those AC directors are pro when it comes to blackmails. They know Mikoto's parent and friends look-like.
Didn't they try to hold her mom and Uiharu hostage? Didn't work out so well now did it.
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Old 2013-01-09, 00:03   Link #3567
noobita
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Quote:
Why do you think that Mikoto was doing any serious damage to them?

Three experiments/cases? So what? They're still making tons of money and weapons even without three little experiments.
Serious damage or not, I don't know but it is annoying. Would you let someone to ruin your day over and over?

Quote:
Clearly you're not thinking it through; none of the clones are a perfect match, and any of her close friend could tell immediately.

A popular Level 5 suddenly transferring overseas? That's a terrible lie. In the first place Espers have to go through strict channels to leave the city so if there isn't any 'paper trail', people would get suspicious.

And since you didn't read the side story novels, all I can say without spoiling is that don't underestimate Misaka's father.
Really? Most of the people mistook sister as Misaka. Even if her clone is incompetent as hell, they can convinced the people with the power of media. Plus as for her friends, brainwash or manipulate their memories or kill them too? AC have the resources to cover everything on the spot. If they can cover the death of 7k++ sisters death, why would you think AC cannot cover for one person and her family death?

Again, transfer to oversea isn't that far-fetched. This is AC. They can forge or create "paper trail" or stories whatever they want. As for Misaka's father, do you think his word actually meant something to the up-side down guy in the tube? Do you really think the up-side down guy in tube take serious of his threat?

Quote:
Again, why do you think she is a threat?

None of the things she did has ever affected them in any significant way.

Again, the problem is you seem to think all the bad guys are working for the same person, which is not true. Factions have their own agenda and they tend to not work with each other.

Why is she is threat? How about this? Everything starts from small?

Again, you seems don't get it? YOU DON'T NEED ENTIRE FACTIONS TO KILL ONE GIRL. Since this is like third time you are repeating this, I guess you are sincerely believed that one faction cannot kill Mikoto and the one faction need others to work together to get rid of Mikoto?

Quote:
Didn't they try to hold her mom and Uiharu hostage? Didn't work out so well now did it.
How about kill them for real? How about taking them as hostages everyday and forever? One should know you are incompetent when Misaka took lightly of your warning and decide to make a visit to your base.

Seriously, what is your stand in this matter? AC is not incompetent or Misaka is simply too good for them to deal with it or AC is competent, but they choose to let Mikoto running rampage because they can?
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Old 2013-01-09, 00:22   Link #3568
Chaos2Frozen
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Noobita, I'm going to summarize what the misunderstanding is:

The dark side of Academy City is headed by the Board of Directors- You can think of them as a major crime syndicate. But at the same time there are all these other little gangs that may or may not work for them, and some of them have their own agenda that could clash with the major crime syndicate.

Yes, Academy City have all of these resources at their disposal, but like 90% of them are controlled by the major crime syndicate, while only a hand full are in possession of the smaller gangs.

Everything that Mikoto has been doing up until now has been cleaning out all the little gangs that don't fit into the major crime syndicate's grand design, and that's why I keep saying that the Directors don't have any reason to do anything about Mikoto or that some factions aren't enough. You think she has been a thorn at the Directors side but if anything she has been helping them clean up their streets by taking out all these stray factions.
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Old 2013-01-09, 00:38   Link #3569
Marcus H.
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Why do you want Mikoto killed, noobita?
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Old 2013-01-09, 00:48   Link #3570
tsunade666
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^I don't think that noobita want Mikoto dead. I think he initially meant it that the academy city dark side seem incompetent to silence a little girl which I understand from my point of view. I also feel lacking in that part for Kamachi. Kamachi can take it into another level of being darker but he isn't doing it and he is letting his main characters scratch free specially his poster girl Mikoto.

Quote:
Originally Posted by noobita View Post
Unless Mikoto is actually the favorite plaything of up-side narcissistic dude in the tube, I really see no reason why Mikoto still can roaming free in the center of city of devils lurk and do whatever she wants.
The only reason why Mikoto and some level 5 are being left alone is because they are INSIGNIFICANT TO THE PLAN

Like I said. Aleister knew what's happening in his city and something like a pebble in the road is insignificant to him even if it can prick you if you step on it but still overall its insignificant to his eyes. Something like that are better left alone.

and really the darkness that Mikoto is current seeing is just like an opening of the cave. She hasn't even enter or see the middle of it but just a glimpse of it. The only ones I'm sure who knew how dark it is among the current level 5 is Accelerator, Kakine and Mugino and those 3 have black background in the organization.

Lets leave Mikoto alone and as far as irritating it can get. No one kills the poster girl.
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Old 2013-01-09, 00:51   Link #3571
Marcus H.
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^ That's the point, I think. No one kills the poster girl. But I know enough about the light novels to come up with an alternate view of the Toaru Universe where in Mikoto Misaka is dead.
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Old 2013-01-09, 00:53   Link #3572
Chaos2Frozen
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You do realized that could be said for ANY other story and their protagonist ?

I'm trying to give a proper logical explanation that doesn't blindly point towards favorite character and all that nonsense.

And while Mikoto is not as experienced as Accelerator, she certainly isn't that green anymore either so knock it off with the downplaying.
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Old 2013-01-09, 01:03   Link #3573
Phibrizzo
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Not all the board of directors are that evil (I think 2 of them are rather nice), also there is her father... I mean he has a direct line to Aliester... so while Aliester isn't above killing her if needed I don't think make more enemies is on his list of priorities and her father doesn't seems to be as harmless
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Old 2013-01-09, 01:07   Link #3574
Marcus H.
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I really would like to engage in deeper discussion about this "why isn't Academy City getting rid of Mikoto after what she has done?", but I feel that this question is approaching the level of the "Frodo Plot Hole" meme. In short, I feel like being trolled.

And besides, a deeper explanation would require information from the light novels, which is more or less not allowed in the manga thread.

But to heck with it!

Quote:
The only reason why Mikoto and some level 5 are being left alone is because they are INSIGNIFICANT TO THE PLAN
I disagree. She is the third most important person to the plan, that's why she's ranked third.
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Old 2013-01-09, 01:09   Link #3575
Chaos2Frozen
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I really would like to engage in deeper discussion about this "why isn't Academy City getting rid of Mikoto after what she has done?", but I feel that this question is approaching the level of the "Frodo Plot Hole" meme. In short, I feel like being trolled.

And besides, a deeper explanation would require information from the light novels, which is more or less not allowed in the manga thread.
Look it's not that difficult, in everything that we have seen from the Anime and manga, what has Mikoto done that had seriously affected the board of directors?

The closest was the Sister's Arc and that still went according to plan.
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Old 2013-01-09, 01:12   Link #3576
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^ IIRC, none, actually.

Spoiler for Light Novels, Volume 15:
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Old 2013-01-09, 01:17   Link #3577
Flere821
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I disagree. She is the third most important person to the plan, that's why she's ranked third.
For the official plan to SYSTEM, anyway. Except we know Aleister have dozens of plans, and his public one isn't one of his main ones (like creating Artificial Heaven and Angels like Hyouka, leading to simultaneously blowing out the brains of every ability-user that isn't one of his espers with it). Beyond Mikoto's importance as the #3 Level 5, she's insignificant to the big picture. Big fish in small pond. It's not "plot armour that protects author's main character", but instead "ahaha, pathetic worm struggle all you want, for in the end all your efforts achieve nothing in the grand scale of things". Mikoto is so far below the radar that for all her power none of the shakers and movers of the world (for non-LN factions to avoid spoilers, eg Roman Catholic Church, Necessarius, Aleister and his trusted lackeys, etc) can be bothered to kill her. It's not that they can't, but Mikoto is really just that meaningless.

tl;dr Railgun manga is just a sideshow, the aforementioned 'small pond'. Main LNs is where all the pros hang out.
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Old 2013-01-09, 01:25   Link #3578
Chaos2Frozen
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To the [Plan] maybe, but Mikoto serves as a decent Hero of Justice- She certain did a good enough job stopping Kiyama, Awaki and Telestina from messing with their city.

Why spend money when you can have free labor covering for you?
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Old 2013-01-09, 03:23   Link #3579
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About the poster girl argument, Mikoto is kind of a poster girl for AC. Being apparently the sole sane level 5, she is used for public image (and public demonstrations, which a clone cannot imitate)

But I guess the main point is that her actions don't mess anything important for AC. Like C2F said, her major "rebellion" was during the "level 6" project and in the end she (and Touma) just accelerated Aleister's plan.

Hell, her using her abilities here and there is probably useful for data gathering. Just in the last Ralgun chapter, she seems to be playing right into Gensei's plan... and even if she manages to screw it, Gensei will probably end up saying: "It's all fine, we got the data"
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Old 2013-01-09, 05:48   Link #3580
noobita
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Originally Posted by Marcus H. View Post
Why do you want Mikoto killed, noobita?
I didn't want her to be killed. I just simply using her as example for what she was doing in the recent chapters. Just as Tsunade666 said...it is kinda funny to see a little girl roaming free and doing whatever she wants, especially in the city of evil lives without getting heavy punishment.

If this is a real world, she should have been captured and throw into the prison for sabotaging or get flamed by evil organization now, whether she is significant or not to the grand plans.
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