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Old 2013-01-08, 18:48   Link #6981
Sansker
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Originally Posted by LostSome View Post
Still, it sounded like you were saying it as a fact.
And like Rising Dragon said, she must had a reason for running away...
Sure, something like a divorce could be an interesting angle.
Her mother running away with another man... Wait, it`s Nanoha ! With another person.
So... All of the Hulks have a normal family somewhere unless stated otherwise, right ?
I`m fine with that.
I will consider it as one until I am proof wrong, because I do think is nice to have someone with a normal family for a change. I mean Nanoha seems to me the only one who has both parents alive.
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Old 2013-01-09, 12:07   Link #6982
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One of the main themes in Nanoha, that you will see again and again in every iteration, is family. Nanoha herself is the baseline, with the standard mother/father/brother/sister family. But from then on, every other character is another story with regards to family. Lindy's adoption of Fate, Chrono's missing dad, Graham taking care of Hayate and her gaining the wolkies... everybody has family issues, or is specifically shown their non-standard family situation, and how they are dealing with it.

That's what Nanoha is about. And now we have the Huck's. Throughout all this, Tsuzuki is showing us many different types of family, and showing us that it doesn't matter if your family is different... it's just as fine as Nanoha's standard family.

I fully expect them to confont Isis's family and help her deal with it. There is a reason she is away from them.
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Old 2013-01-09, 15:15   Link #6983
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Winder if there's gonna be even time to attend Isis family issues with the Huck/Grendels/Hardis still stealing the show from the main characters constantly xDU

But well, jokes asie, the manga is suppossedly past half right now which, being part of the new main cast i think there should be at least some clear hints pointing at Isis issues (we have some but are rather vague). Unless Tsuzuki finds a way to itnroduce the conflict and solve it in a quick manner ...or tie it to the main plot somehow.
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Old 2013-01-09, 15:18   Link #6984
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Originally Posted by Akiyoshi View Post
Winder if there's gonna be even time to attend Isis family issues with the Huck/Grendels/Hardis still stealing the show from the main characters constantly xDU

But well, jokes asie, the manga is suppossedly past half right now which, being part of the new main cast i think there should be at least some clear hints pointing at Isis issues (we have some but are rather vague). Unless Tsuzuki finds a way to itnroduce the conflict and solve it in a quick manner ...or tie it to the main plot somehow.
It's going to take a few more xD
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Old 2013-01-09, 15:46   Link #6985
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I'm guessing whatever it is, it probably has to do with how Isis can take a divider axe to the neck, survive, and...did they show her getting medical treatment for that, actually?
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Old 2013-01-09, 15:47   Link #6986
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Well to me the only family issues that were resolve with some kind of deepness were Fate’s. At least on how she did lost her family and her world was destroyed. She just started to consider herself as a human being after the events on A’s, all dealing with the problems she had of being a clone and lost the only mother she ever knew. Not that was really well done and the segment on A’s was way too short for its own good but I think we did get a look on Fate’s conflict and new found resolution of living her own life. But the same can’t be say for the rest.

While the Wolkenritter did form a family with Hayate we never deal with Hayate’s side of the conflict or we never address in a deeper level how the others think of this new status of family. To put it simple the story was really fast there, showing how the Wolkenritter did love their master and this new life but no at much on how they really end fitting on it or how they see the others before A’s and after it. I know some of it was address on the sound stage but they could put something in the anime to help it develop if this was a theme for the series.

And StrikerS has the oddest family of all: the Nakajima. I say odd because I don’t remember Subaru and her father ever talking to each other even when Ginga get kidnapped by the Numbers. For that matter nor do I remember a single moment where Ginga and her father just share a moment as family and no as superior officer and lower rank officer (Nepotism?). Going on the same line I didn’t even notice Regius’ assistant was his daughter until I check it on Google (No seriously, nepotism? I mean first Lindy and Chrono, now this).

I never really fall from the “family” theme being all that important at least not as a clear intention from the author. Again we see little to nothing between Fate and her two kids, Vivio and Nanoha’s relationship was rather fast and Fate’s role on it is still unclear to this day, Teana is never mention as orphan and yet we don’t know anything about her family beyond she had a brother. So all of that tend to keep me away from the “Nanoha is a bout family” idea, I can see why it could be consider but to me is not that big of a deal, is almost as say Nanoha is about amazons because almost all the cast members are women.

And of course all of that leads me back to Force and Isis. On that matter… no, I don’t think her family is going to play an important role, maybe a minor, and unnecessary, add to the already huge cast because if Isis’s family were to be related to the plot then she could be Hardis’s daughter or maybe related to the creators of the AEC weapons. Keeping the line we really don’t get a lot of the HŁckebein to see how this group of people hold together, beyond being all Eclipse Drivers, and the lest I say about the Grendel family the better.
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Old 2013-01-09, 16:07   Link #6987
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I could point out that the Bureau sees no problem with family serving together (Fate under Lindy? Nepotism!). I could point out the various sound stages and manga that have the Nakajima clan having moments together (in Force even!). I could point out the sound stages and manga that highlight the feelings of the Yagami clan ( even in A's episodes!).

But the truth doesn't matter, does it?

Edit: seriously? You don't know anything about Teana's brother? And... I can't begin to address the rest, except it's clear you barely paid attention to the episodes. I suggest you watch them all again, several times.
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Old 2013-01-09, 16:16   Link #6988
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And StrikerS has the oddest family of all: the Nakajima. I say odd because I donít remember Subaru and her father ever talking to each other even when Ginga get kidnapped by the Numbers. For that matter nor do I remember a single moment where Ginga and her father just share a moment as family and no as superior officer and lower rank officer (Nepotism?). Going on the same line I didnít even notice Regiusí assistant was his daughter until I check it on Google (No seriously, nepotism? I mean first Lindy and Chrono, now this).
Hayate`s little team is what exactly ? Her family, her childhood friends and those friends`family and friends. Many are former criminals too.
Lindy and Chrono are far from the worst actually.

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the lest I say about the Grendel family the better.
And I thank you for that. I feel the same.
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Old 2013-01-09, 16:33   Link #6989
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Riot Force 6 or now SS6 is one big Hayate's Rainbow Army family.
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Old 2013-01-09, 16:40   Link #6990
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All things considered i think the family theme is decently covered on the series, The Wolkenritter and Hayate get greatly expanded on teh sound stages and the Nanoha A's manga. StrikerS was more about political stuff so family doesn't really got the same amount of focus as in past seasons but it's there, the StrikerS manga expand on the numbers (sadly the anime was very lacklusting in that regard) and we see Nanoha and Fate starting yet a new family with Vivio ...of the things i didn't liked was how Erio and Caro were utterly ignored despite heving potentially interesting backgrounds very tied to the concept of family.

Erio was ilegally cloned from a dead child and deeply cared by that kid's parents before being cruelly separated from them ...why they didn't expand on that?

Or what about Caro? the little girl was freaking exiled from her hometown while barely being councious of the reason.

I'm really surprised there isn't any fanfics going deeper on these issues (like Erio reuniting with his family or Caro being confronted with her past in a case that involves her hometown) it's pure dramatic gold xD

Instead, these two were only given sad backstories so Fate can rescue them and feel better about herself (in that sense, Scaglietti wasn't too mistaken with his Hannibal Lecture). The sad part is that both are pretty decent characters it's just that so far they're only used as satellite characters floating around Fate (or Tohma's group in FORCE).

Family is also a strong theme present in FORCE, the Huckebein family fills almost all the spots (Curren is the Team Dad and Fortis is the Team Mom of sorts xD) ...they're a bunch of a-holes, that's a given, but they're a very united group of people.

The Grendels are different, but nontheless a family, their dynamic is less the one of a nuclear family, tough (mom, dad and children) ...instead they feel more like a group of mischievous siblings taking care of each other (again it surprises me so much loyalty to a clown like Carter coming from three cool girls like Maria, Lolo and Quinn ...specially the first who seems to be the most emotional of the group).

About Tohma and the Nakajimas the theme is there but i would like the story could expand a bit better on it, what i dislike about tohma's relationship with Subaru and most of the old cast is the fact it was brought into the plot so suddenly, without any reliable background nor explanation, Tohma simply appeared into the plot and almost everyone instantly recognize him and show affection ...one must earn those things and i never saw how Tohma earned that ...that's why i find mroe interesting the new relationships he's making on the way (Curren, Veyron, Isis, Signum, etc...).

A good way to tie the Eaglet family into the plot is by making them being behind something important ...personally it would be cool if they're the ones finishing the upgrades for all the old devices ...consiodering Perfume Grab is a pretty damn awesome and effective device against EC drivers even without TSAB nor Caledfwlch techonogy backing up it's design that talks great wodners about the efficience and talent of said private security group. After the evil plans behind the AEC-Equipement gets revealed and the heroes (sans Fate) get left powerless again Isis could probably grudgingly calls back home for help.
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Old 2013-01-09, 17:13   Link #6991
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Well, the discussions about StrikerS and A’s setting we can take them to their threads and the same about point bring up there. I just wanted to say I still consider most of the family subject to be present but no really well explore or develop to make it a theme. As well as the fact most characters are female isn’t use as an excuse to expand on how women are seeing on the Mid-Childa’s society. Both are common trophies for Nanoha, families and almost an entire female cast, and yet those are more like anecdotic than really themes going for the story, or that is how I see it. Again, let’s not keep the discussion there. By the way the nepotism I made it as a joke, I do consider it weird and I don’t agree but that is far from being a serious problem and is just me nitpicking a little on an otherwise unimportant matter. About extra mangas and Sound Stage I already express why I don’t take them in to consideration so I will not repeat myself.

That being said I don’t agree with Akiyoshi on the HŁckebein family. Considering how little we know about them as people and how rather odd their relationship is address, I see no point on making them fitting spots. Not that they can’t fit them is just that I think is a bit force when the material we are given is so little. Yes, strong family presence and yet so little content to work with. The Grendel is a case of… yes, siblings but still nothing really explains their motives or why they stick together and I don’t think I want to learn more. I just don’t like them.

And I can agree on Thoma. He just falls from the sky, creates a continuity problem and they all love him. To me that reads more as “lazy” than anything else on the writing. Why bother to make the character gain love when you can put he already has it?

But the Egret family I really don’t think will play a role. They are fighters, not inventors and it will make all the more pointless the AEC weapons and the Raptors if they are being replaced by the old devices in the middle of the story. They really are trying to make the AEC weapons a thing and sending them away will be not a good move on the story. On that matter it would be better if they didn’t even exist.
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Old 2013-01-09, 17:29   Link #6992
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But the Egret family I really donít think will play a role. They are fighters, not inventors and it will make all the more pointless the AEC weapons and the Raptors if they are being replaced by the old devices in the middle of the story. They really are trying to make the AEC weapons a thing and sending them away will be not a good move on the story. On that matter it would be better if they didnít even exist.
Poffy was made by them (or by Isis, but she's a member of the Eaglets) and is so far the only devices who has mantained strong effectiveness against EC Drivers without the need of years of reserch or overly complex upgrade process. That alone is testament of how much talent that people could have to do that.

Also the AEC-unitons don't necessary need to be replaced in the middle of the plot, they could be replaced on the final climax of the story (in a climatic twist the AEC-units could be rendered useless) ...i doubt trhat will happen as well but it's not impossible and it has be done before (specially in Super Sentai, the cooler and newer mid season upgrades get destroyed before or during the final battle and the Sentai Team fight the last battle with their original powersets and equipement to a big increase in tensions as the audience is left in suspence wondering about how the heroes will gonna get out of the mess without their new cool, shinny weapons xD).
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Old 2013-01-09, 17:29   Link #6993
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Well, Vita seems to have huge doubts about Thoma and friends and even after two months, it seems those doubts are still going strong.
(What the time skip changed again besides Steed`s removal ?)
I kind of wish Thoma would go with the Hulks just so Vita can say to Nanoha`s face "I told you so !".
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Old 2013-01-09, 17:39   Link #6994
Akiyoshi
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Well, Vita seems to have huge doubts about Thoma and friends and even after two months, it seems those doubts are still going strong.
(What the time skip changed again besides Steed`s removal ?)
I kind of wish Thoma would go with the Hulks just so Vita can say to Nanoha`s face "I told you so !".
Lol, that's one of the things i like about Vita she's not so easily deceived by looks and even if Tiohma is a good guy his circunstances are still pretty shady, i think Vita is doing the correct thing by keeping a healthy sense of awareness around the boy.

I also hope to see that scene xD
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Old 2013-01-09, 17:44   Link #6995
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Quote:
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Well, Vita seems to have huge doubts about Thoma and friends and even after two months, it seems those doubts are still going strong.
(What the time skip changed again besides Steed`s removal ?)
I kind of wish Thoma would go with the Hulks just so Vita can say to Nanoha`s face "I told you so !".
Did you note Nanoha's response to that? Training someone means you know their abilities and how they fight... making you more able to take them down later. So the response to Vita's "I told you so" in your scenario, would be Nanoha sitting atop Thoma's unconscious body, smiling, with an "I told you so" of her own.
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Old 2013-01-09, 18:20   Link #6996
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lol I have to say that`s a very "heroic" scene you`re imagining here.
Well, now I know why Nanoha is never in any of the conversations about Thoma`s morality and link with the Hulks...
"I don`t care either ways, I`ll just befriend him later !"
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Old 2013-01-09, 18:47   Link #6997
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Well we could say that training and making your enemy more competent with his powers is not a good idea. I mean one thing is that you know how the guy acts and what their weakness are and another one is that you can actually take advantage of such weakness of flaws on the way the other fights. For example we all know Superman’s weakness, right? But getting some kryptonite is not easy so knowing that is pointless. Sometimes a weakness can be like that or you can’t really take advantage of your knowledge to win. Really Nanoha’s respond, while acceptable, is not going to free her from an “I told you” from Vita if things get bad.
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Old 2013-01-09, 21:22   Link #6998
Akiyoshi
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Did you note Nanoha's response to that? Training someone means you know their abilities and how they fight... making you more able to take them down later. So the response to Vita's "I told you so" in your scenario, would be Nanoha sitting atop Thoma's unconscious body, smiling, with an "I told you so" of her own.
Nanoha: "We purposely trained him wrong, as a joke."

...i cannot resist the temptation xD

But ok, goofing aside, that's kind of a double-edge strategy because Tohma (or more likely the Silver Cross) could onderstand better how to fight against Nanoha and to overcome whatever danger the AEC-units may represent to it and it's driver. Besides, i didn't get such a mean spirited intention from Nanoha's part when she was talking about Tohma's potential. Maybe she's just so delighted in her world of teaching to realize she's training a world-ending threat xDU
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Old 2013-01-09, 22:03   Link #6999
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Like I say, that goes both side and Thoma does have a superweapon: the Zero Effect
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Old 2013-01-10, 14:35   Link #7000
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Nanoha: "We purposely trained him wrong, as a joke."

...i cannot resist the temptation xD
This reminds me of Thoma`s fight against Carter.

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Maybe she's just so delighted in her world of teaching to realize she's training a world-ending threat xDU
Yeah, I`m going with that for now.
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