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Draugur · 2013-01-06, 04:04

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Originally Posted by TheGuraGuraMan

If you want to see how she draw Takano, why don't you just look at scrrenshots/scans of Matsuribayashi ?

Sorry, you got me wrong about this. I know how she draws Takano, I just don't like this particular character design. Takano looks much more mysterious and captivating in Yutori Houjyou's Watanagashi-hen and Meakashi-hen. Suzuragi designs her rather like a witch from a fairytale, so you can easily see she's an evil character.

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And come on, the saving Satoko is clearly one of the most exciting parts of the serie (or at least in the VN and manga... Seriously it was boring in the anime), Kei is the best for this kind of thing, of course he is the main here. Plus he don't do much in Matsuribayashi, everyone had a shinning moment in the story, so what is the problem ?

Ryukishi wanted to make sure the reader likes Keiichi in Minagoroshi, by any means. So he wrote very much dialogue about how great Keiichi is. I think he just overdid it. It's rather tedious. Another thing I didn't like is the Oryou scene. When they visited Oryou, I expected a great argument between Keiichi or his friends and Oryou or Akane. But instead of convincing her rhetorically, he told her he would strangle her if she didn't support him. Twice. What is so great about that? Why did Oryou agree after being threatened like this? Even if she wanted to forgive Satoko herself, why would she want everyone to know she gave in to such a stupid threat? I know this is about not losing face, but wouldn't the best way for Oryou to decide herself that she forgives the Houjou family and not to wait until a youngster comes and threatens her? Well, maybe it's just me who doesn't understand it all, but in my own personal opinion this is my least favourite part of the story, which doesn't mean it's bad. I just don't like it as much as the others.

About shining moments: I think Keiichi is the only character who gets this kind of superstar treatment. Other characters have to kill people to get attention in Higurashi.

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In the manga adaptations, Tsumi is clearly the best, as good as the original and doesn't just copy it.

It's my favourite chapter in the anime and the novel. I'm not so sure about the manga.

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Btw I randomly got Hinamizawa bus stop. First it's in one volume, and 10 chapters. There are more easter egg chars (Irie, Takano and an adult Rena), The end is FUCKIN gory, didn't expect that at all. I really hope someone will continue it, since it's not THAT long (well.. Still 7 chapters)

I know only three chapters of Bus Stop. Is there an english release of those 10 chapters?

battle22 · 2013-01-06, 06:23

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And come on, the saving Satoko is clearly one of the most exciting parts of the serie (or at least in the VN and manga... Seriously it was boring in the anime), Kei is the best for this kind of thing, of course he is the main here. Plus he don't do much in Matsuribayashi, everyone had a shinning moment in the story, so what is the problem ?

I don't like Keiichi, :P In Arc-1-4 He was just a big asshole and in arc5-8 He magicly becomes "Badass". Nope, I never Liked Keiichi and never will . Also I also think Satoko saving arc was stretched to the point when it was Booring, Yes in the VN too .

Draugur · 2013-01-06, 06:34

I liked Keiichi best in Arc 4

No, I just think Satoshi should be the male lead character because he's very interesting while Keiichi is more like the average youthful hero, at least in Minagoroshi and Matsuribayashi. I think all the female characters are more interesting than Keiichi, who (in my humble interpretation) is something like a blank space to reflect the reader's experience with the story.

battle22 · 2013-01-06, 08:57

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I liked Keiichi best in Arc 4

Keiichi wasn't in the arc4 ...Or was this a joke? OHHH I see it

Nice one

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No, I just think Satoshi should be the male lead character because he's very interesting while Keiichi is more like the average youthful hero, at least in Minagoroshi and Matsuribayashi. I think all the female characters are more interesting than Keiichi, who (in my humble interpretation) is something like a blank space to reflect the reader's experience with the story.

Agreed!!!! You just said the same exact stuff I was thinking

TheGuraGuraMan · 2013-01-06, 11:16

"About shining moments: I think Keiichi is the only character who gets this kind of superstar treatment. Other characters have to kill people to get attention in Higurashi.
"

Don't think so. Tomitake, Irie, Akasaka, Oishi, Kasai and Hanyû had shinning moments in Matsuribayshi, same for Satoko and Mion, the rest of the club had full arcs for them.

"I don't like Keiichi, :P In Arc-1-4 He was just a big asshole and in arc5-8 He magicly becomes "Badass"."

On the other way I usually don't ike the main chars, that's not the case for Kei and Battler ;p Asshole ? When ? And remember, if he became "badass" in the 6th and 7th arcs, it's because he remembered stuff from previous worlds. He fully used his skill of talking, like Mion's lead and Satoko's traps in Matsuribayashi.

battle22 · 2013-01-06, 16:11

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On the other way I usually don't ike the main chars, that's not the case for Kei and Battler ;p Asshole ? When ? And remember, if he became "badass" in the 6th and 7th arcs, it's because he remembered stuff from previous worlds. He fully used his skill of talking, like Mion's lead and Satoko's traps in Matsuribayashi.

He was a big asshole to Mion, My Fav Char...

TheGuraGuraMan · 2013-01-08, 04:26

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Originally Posted by battle22

He was a big asshole to Mion, My Fav Char...

Oh You're exagerating, if you refer to Onikakushi it was mainly the fault of the desease, and if you're talking about the doll, he felt sorry for the whole arc because of that.

battle22 · 2013-01-08, 05:09

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Oh You're exagerating, if you refer to Onikakushi it was mainly the fault of the desease, and if you're talking about the doll, he felt sorry for the whole arc because of that.

No, I am talking about Tatarigoroshi, When the loser tried to save Satoko, He was calling Mion a bitch for having a big house and wealthy Family while he had a big house and a wealthy family too, I loved how Rena told him off in that scene. He is stupid and he exagurates everything, Did he honestly believe that a snotty 16 year old like himself would do something usefull at that kind of situation. He was not just mean to Mion, He screamed at Rika and Chie too. He calls everyone useless and he thinks he cares about Satoko the most. That is pretty selfish. He was blaming Tepeis Cameback on his friends and others. Even In Minagoroshi, it was Mions family who saved Satoko, Oryo just needed convincing..

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if you refer to Onikakushi it was mainly the fault of the desease,

No , Actually , It was a natural reaction at what might one get when something so creppy happened in the village you live.. Plus the syndrome....

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if you're talking about the doll, he felt sorry for the whole arc because of that.

That , actually was not a assholic behavior and I think he never needed to apologize for that. Mion is a girl, she was hurt, but she knew she was being selfish. But that selfish tears awaked Shion , and Shion blames the doll thing on Keiichi. Keiichi missunderstand (Anyway , I'm pretty sure you know this stuff already but XD still wrote it...)

Ithekro · 2013-01-08, 18:57

He may have a big house and wealthy family, but his family holds no sway in Hinamizawa. Mion's family does (practically owns the place). His family tries to do something, nothing will happen for Satoko. Mion's family says something, the whole town jumps in. Such is the power of traditional power in regions and families.

battle22 · 2013-01-09, 03:38

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He may have a big house and wealthy family, but his family holds no sway in Hinamizawa. Mion's family does (practically owns the place). His family tries to do something, nothing will happen for Satoko. Mion's family says something, the whole town jumps in. Such is the power of traditional power in regions and families.

Keiichi was not talking about the influence of the families in that scene, he was talking about if the house was big enough for Satoko to stay

CrimsonMoonMist · 2013-01-09, 09:31

They where all stressed out and without options at that point, I don't think it'd be fair to judge a character from that kind of scene.

battle22 · 2013-01-09, 10:03

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They where all stressed out and without options at that point, I don't think it'd be fair to judge a character from that kind of scene.

They were stressed , but only Keiichi was yelling. And this is not the only scene That I don't like him in. As I said, He thinks he cares for Satoko the most and tries to show that with yelling and blaming others for their uselessness.I think he was actually searching for someone to blame ,because he did not want to accept that he can't do anything for Satoko and let's admit it, Killing Tepei, Is not a rational solution (Altho , It was the syndrome here, so I don't blame him at that point), Before he killed Teppei, Or got the idea of killing him he was acting selfish and rude to everyone around him.

TheGuraGuraMan · 2013-01-09, 10:50

Shion was exactly the same in Minagoroshi.

battle22 · 2013-01-09, 10:56

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Shion was exactly the same in Minagoroshi.

I'm not talking about Shion here, I am talking about Keiichi Meabara and I don't care If Shion did Something similar.But fine , You want to compare . Alright.
I don't like Keiichi when he is a funny-goofy idiot too , He annoys me. But I love Shion , And there is no denying that she is just as selfish as Keiichi . But I like her more than him, Because she does not annoy me and in my Opinion She's actually pretty badass. Don't get me wrong, I never liked those scenes when She was Mean to Mion in Watanagashi and to the rest in Minagoroshi.

TheGuraGuraMan · 2013-01-10, 08:41

I think we can close the debate here, talking about Shion was a great idea in the end : You like when she's badass but not Keiichi. Those are just preferences. Kei isn't an asshole like you said,you just don't like him ;p

battle22 · 2013-01-10, 09:03

And who Said I was forcing my opinion on anybody? Keiichi is an asshole in my eyes, and he is especially bad in Tatarigoroshi, Why are you bringing Shion here, Try to justify his actions to others in tatarigoroshi and don't say he was mean because He cared about Satoko or he was in Hinamizawa Syndrome . And as for the Shion thing, did you read what I said? When She acted the same way as Kei , I disliked that.(You should know this the best, since you remember my reaction on that Manga arc you showed me...) So no, Bringing Shion and comparing her to Kei was not a good idea after all. The debate is about Keiichi and Not Shion.. and Yes you are right, I don't like Keiichi and that is what I have been trying to say all this time....Sheesh

TheGuraGuraMan · 2013-01-10, 09:37

Kei asshole : Don't like
Shion asshole : Don't like
Kei badass : Don't like
Shion badass : Like

Got what you said, I meant it like that. He may have been an asshole in this part, he's not like that everytime, nobody is perfect. Except Perfect Cell.

battle22 · 2013-01-10, 10:13

Ehh...I'm done debating about this

Draugur · 2013-01-14, 06:06

The "problem" about Keiichi is that he has a big advantage towards others. He can remember his mistakes in the past worlds and can save others from behaving the same way like Rena in Tsumihoroboshi and Shion in Minagoroshi, because he learned from his mistakes. Actually Rena tried to save him in Onikakushi, but we only see it through Keiichi's distorted eyes. Regarding this, you see Keiichi is treated differently from the others, because the educational aspect of the story is focused completely on him.

rogerpepitone · 2013-01-14, 14:54

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Originally Posted by Draugur

The "problem" about Keiichi is that he has a big advantage towards others. He can remember his mistakes in the past worlds and can save others from behaving the same way like Rena in Tsumihoroboshi and Shion in Minagoroshi, because he learned from his mistakes. Actually Rena tried to save him in Onikakushi, but we only see it through Keiichi's distorted eyes. Regarding this, you see Keiichi is treated differently from the others, because the educational aspect of the story is focused completely on him.

Keiichi only remembered past worlds once, in Tsumihoroboshi-hen. In Minagoroshi-hen, all the characters were acting to avoid past mistakes, even if they didn't explicitly remember them.

2013-01-08, 18:57	Link #2309
Ithekro Space Battleship Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Republic of California Age: 35	He may have a big house and wealthy family, but his family holds no sway in Hinamizawa. Mion's family does (practically owns the place). His family tries to do something, nothing will happen for Satoko. Mion's family says something, the whole town jumps in. Such is the power of traditional power in regions and families. __________________

2013-01-10, 09:03	Link #2316
battle22 Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Rokkenjima	And who Said I was forcing my opinion on anybody? Keiichi is an asshole in my eyes, and he is especially bad in Tatarigoroshi, Why are you bringing Shion here, Try to justify his actions to others in tatarigoroshi and don't say he was mean because He cared about Satoko or he was in Hinamizawa Syndrome . And as for the Shion thing, did you read what I said? When She acted the same way as Kei , I disliked that.(You should know this the best, since you remember my reaction on that Manga arc you showed me...) So no, Bringing Shion and comparing her to Kei was not a good idea after all. The debate is about Keiichi and Not Shion.. and Yes you are right, I don't like Keiichi and that is what I have been trying to say all this time....Sheesh __________________ Total Seacat Island A not-so-average Umineko gameboard

2013-01-10, 10:13	Link #2318
battle22 Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Rokkenjima	Ehh...I'm done debating about this __________________ Total Seacat Island A not-so-average Umineko gameboard

2013-01-06, 06:34	Link #2303
Draugur Member Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: Westfalen	I liked Keiichi best in Arc 4 No, I just think Satoshi should be the male lead character because he's very interesting while Keiichi is more like the average youthful hero, at least in Minagoroshi and Matsuribayashi. I think all the female characters are more interesting than Keiichi, who (in my humble interpretation) is something like a blank space to reflect the reader's experience with the story.

2013-01-06, 11:16	Link #2305
TheGuraGuraMan French dude Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: France	"About shining moments: I think Keiichi is the only character who gets this kind of superstar treatment. Other characters have to kill people to get attention in Higurashi. " Don't think so. Tomitake, Irie, Akasaka, Oishi, Kasai and Hanyû had shinning moments in Matsuribayshi, same for Satoko and Mion, the rest of the club had full arcs for them. "I don't like Keiichi, :P In Arc-1-4 He was just a big asshole and in arc5-8 He magicly becomes "Badass"." On the other way I usually don't ike the main chars, that's not the case for Kei and Battler ;p Asshole ? When ? And remember, if he became "badass" in the 6th and 7th arcs, it's because he remembered stuff from previous worlds. He fully used his skill of talking, like Mion's lead and Satoko's traps in Matsuribayashi.

2013-01-09, 09:31	Link #2311
CrimsonMoonMist Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2010 Age: 19	They where all stressed out and without options at that point, I don't think it'd be fair to judge a character from that kind of scene.

2013-01-09, 10:50	Link #2313
TheGuraGuraMan French dude Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: France	Shion was exactly the same in Minagoroshi.

2013-01-10, 08:41	Link #2315
TheGuraGuraMan French dude Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: France	I think we can close the debate here, talking about Shion was a great idea in the end : You like when she's badass but not Keiichi. Those are just preferences. Kei isn't an asshole like you said,you just don't like him ;p

2013-01-10, 09:37	Link #2317
TheGuraGuraMan French dude Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: France	Kei asshole : Don't like Shion asshole : Don't like Kei badass : Don't like Shion badass : Like Got what you said, I meant it like that. He may have been an asshole in this part, he's not like that everytime, nobody is perfect. Except Perfect Cell.

2013-01-14, 06:06	Link #2319
Draugur Member Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: Westfalen	The "problem" about Keiichi is that he has a big advantage towards others. He can remember his mistakes in the past worlds and can save others from behaving the same way like Rena in Tsumihoroboshi and Shion in Minagoroshi, because he learned from his mistakes. Actually Rena tried to save him in Onikakushi, but we only see it through Keiichi's distorted eyes. Regarding this, you see Keiichi is treated differently from the others, because the educational aspect of the story is focused completely on him.