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Old 2013-01-19, 19:26   Link #23001
Chaos2Frozen
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Join Date: Nov 2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leukrota View Post
As if anything said so far about this issue has solid bases. What else can we do with so little input?
I'll put it this way:

“I am only up here because my friends forced me, but why would anyone be interested in some old woman who refuses to even come over here?”


If you did not know that she was at a certain high school one chapter ago, would you have come to the conclusion that she dragged Seria into this contest base on her above statement?
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Old 2013-01-19, 19:31   Link #23002
leukrota
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
I'll put it this way:

“I am only up here because my friends forced me, but why would anyone be interested in some old woman who refuses to even come over here?”


If you did not know that she was at a certain high school one chapter ago, would you have come to the conclusion that she dragged Seria into this contest base on her above statement?
But she was at a certain high school one chapter ago, you cannot choose to ignore that out of convenience. Discard the very little information there is and you won't have enough for any conclusion. (well, not that there is enough as it is)
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Old 2013-01-19, 19:42   Link #23003
Chaos2Frozen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leukrota View Post
But she was at a certain high school one chapter ago, you cannot choose to ignore that out of convenience. Discard the very little information there is and you won't have enough for any conclusion. (well, not that there is enough as it is)
The problem is there's nothing to link those two together, you're trying to look for a connection that isn't supported by the narrative yet and its affecting your judgement.

Use the evidence to determine the conclusion, don't decide on the conclusion and then build the evidence around it.
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Old 2013-01-19, 19:47   Link #23004
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
I'll put it this way:

I am only up here because my friends forced me, but why would anyone be interested in some old woman who refuses to even come over here?


If you did not know that she was at a certain high school one chapter ago, would you have come to the conclusion that she dragged Seria into this contest base on her above statement?
Actually, in her case friends most likely refers to her clique, and I doubt any of them could 'force' her to participate in a beauty contest. She does seem to be rather nonchalant in her use of her ability.
This is based from the few scenes in the railgun manga, so whether this is true or not is up to question.
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Old 2013-01-19, 19:57   Link #23005
leukrota
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
The problem is there's nothing to link those two together, you're trying to look for a connection that isn't supported by the narrative yet and its affecting your judgement.

Use the evidence to determine the conclusion, don't decide on the conclusion and then build the evidence around it.
Touchy about any opinion different than yours aren't you?

And you look like an idiot talking about evidence when you don't have any either.

Tst, here I thought we were having a fun dispute but you had to go with personal attacks. Suit yourself.
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Old 2013-01-19, 19:58   Link #23006
Chaos2Frozen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Awrya View Post
Actually, in her case friends most likely refers to her clique, and I doubt any of them could 'force' her to participate in a beauty contest. She does seem to be rather nonchalant in her use of her ability.
This is based from the few scenes in the railgun manga, so whether this is true or not is up to question.
'Force' in this sense refers to the subtle art of peer pressure.

Not something as obvious as "if you don't do this, you're not our friend!".

No, most likely it would be "Misaki-sama is so pretty! Did you join the swimsuit contest? No?! Ehhhh!BBut why? If it's you, the first place winner would be decided long before it even starts! That's such a shame... won't you reconsider please?"

Now repeat that over ten girls for god knows how long.
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Old 2013-01-19, 20:02   Link #23007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leukrota View Post
Touchy about any opinion different than yours aren't you?

And you look like an idiot talking about evidence when you don't have any either.

Tst, here I thought we were having a fun dispute but you had to go with personal attacks. Suit yourself.
I have one quote, that's an evidence.

And how was that a personal attack? Did I insult you? Did l call you names? Did I make fun of you?
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Old 2013-01-19, 20:07   Link #23008
moridin84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
The problem is there's nothing to link those two together, you're trying to look for a connection that isn't supported by the narrative yet and its affecting your judgement.

Use the evidence to determine the conclusion, don't decide on the conclusion and then build the evidence around it.
Eh?

- According to Mikoto, Shokuhou was at a certain high school.
- Kumokawa Seria attends a certain high school.
- The next scene Shokuhou is in involves a beauty contest and Kumokawa Seria.
- The last scene Kumokawa was in she mentioned two things. That she didn't want to go to the beauty content and Shokuhou Misaki.

It's certainly circumstantial but it's a reasonable theory as to why Shokuhou was at a certain high school.
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Old 2013-01-19, 20:12   Link #23009
Chaos2Frozen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moridin84 View Post
Eh?

- According to Mikoto, Shokuhou was at a certain high school.
- Kumokawa Seria attends a certain high school.
- The next time Shokuhou is mentioned she is in a beauty contest with Kumokawa Seria.
- The last scene Kumokawa was in she mentioned two things. That she didn't want to go to the beauty content and Shokuhou Misaki.

It's certainly circumstantial but it's a reasonable theory as to why Shokuhou was at a certain high school.
Except the dialogue doesn't support it.

Again, does it sound like something someone would say after going through the trouble of dragging someone else?

Look, if later Misaki came out and say that she dragged Seria to this then I'll have nothing to say, but what we have right now is a narrative that contradicts that.
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Old 2013-01-19, 20:16   Link #23010
Cosmic Eagle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
I'll consider it if it's brought up again.
Certainly hope Kamachi does so....If Aleister has been experimenting on Touma ever since he noticed him and Misaki is quite deeply involved in the Darkness, then there is much potential in that route. Her and Seria need to appear more really



Anyway.....reading the spam of A Certain High School above makes me think that, the day Kamachi reveals the name of Touma's high school....is the day the concluding arc begins
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Old 2013-01-19, 20:19   Link #23011
leukrota
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
I have one quote, that's an evidence.
A dialogue quote quite suject to interpretation, that's not evidence. It's not as if the characters never lied.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
And how was that a personal attack? Did I insult you? Did l call you names? Did I make fun of you?
You're questioning my ability to make a judgement. Not supported by narrative? I'm just making an example out of many possibilities as to why Misaki would want to be in the contest. I'm not saying what it was but what could be.

If you want to talk about the narrative, it told us that Misaki was at Seria's highschool not long before the contest, but not that Misaki didn't want to be there, that was her statement, not the narrator's.
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Old 2013-01-19, 20:19   Link #23012
moridin84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
Except the dialogue doesn't support it.

Again, does it sound like something someone would say after going through the trouble of dragging someone else?

Look, if later Misaki came out and say that she dragged Seria to this then I'll have nothing to say, but what we have right now is a narrative that contradicts that.
Shokuhou and Kumokawa are very untrustworthy characters. With people like that, I'd be more willing to trust their actions over their words.

And the theory is supported by the narrative, the theory is in fact derived from the narrative. It's not supported by the dialogue though.
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Old 2013-01-19, 20:26   Link #23013
leukrota
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
No, most likely it would be "Misaki-sama is so pretty! Did you join the swimsuit contest? No?! Ehhhh!BBut why? If it's you, the first place winner would be decided long before it even starts! That's such a shame... won't you reconsider please?"
I can see that scene going like this:

"Misaki-sama is so pretty! Did you join the swimsuit contest? No?! Ehhhh!BBut why? If it's you, the first place winner would be decided long before it even starts! That's such a shame... won't you re-" click "Suddenly I have a huge crave for chocolate, I'll be right back"
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Old 2013-01-19, 20:35   Link #23014
Chaos2Frozen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leukrota View Post
A dialogue quote quite suject to interpretation, that's not evidence. It's not as if the characters never lied.
Do you have any reason to suspect she's lying then?


Quote:
You're questioning my ability to make a judgement. Not supported by narrative? I'm just making an example out of many possibilities as to why Misaki would want to be in the contest. I'm not saying what it was but what could be.
I did not question your abilities, I just pointed out a possible error you might have made. I never said you are incapable of making them.

Yes you gave a lot of possibilities, but they are all base on maybes.

Quote:
If you want to talk about the narrative, it told us that Misaki was at Seria's highschool not long before the contest, but not that Misaki didn't want to be there, that was her statement, not the narrator's.
Fair enough.

Quote:
Originally Posted by moridin84 View Post
Shokuhou and Kumokawa are very untrustworthy characters. With people like that, I'd be more willing to trust their actions over their words.

And the theory is supported by the narrative, the theory is in fact derived from the narrative. It's not supported by the dialogue though.
Then I'll ask again, do you have any reason to suspect either of them of lying?

Quote:
Originally Posted by leukrota View Post
I can see that scene going like this:

"Misaki-sama is so pretty! Did you join the swimsuit contest? No?! Ehhhh!BBut why? If it's you, the first place winner would be decided long before it even starts! That's such a shame... won't you re-" click "Suddenly I have a huge crave for chocolate, I'll be right back"
Girls live off compliments, it's harder for them to turn off flattery.

Sure it could have gone that way for a couple of them, but over time it would wear her down.

Last edited by Chaos2Frozen; 2013-01-19 at 20:54.
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Old 2013-01-19, 20:58   Link #23015
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Three parts of chapter 7 are out.

"First, there was a conversation."

Shortest part ever.
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Old 2013-01-19, 20:59   Link #23016
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcus H. View Post
Guys, what are the odds that Kamachi would release a Volume 0 of Toaru Majutsu no Index Old Testament?
What would that entail that would spark any interest to would-be readers?

Though I suppose we might as well have the Railgun volumes prior to OT's Vol 1 as a Volume 0...
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Since we are all so trigger happy about certain behaviors that we do when talking about his works.

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Old 2013-01-19, 21:00   Link #23017
Chaos2Frozen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackwhite67 View Post
"First, there was a conversation."

Shortest part ever.
What the fudgestick ?!
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Old 2013-01-19, 21:04   Link #23018
leukrota
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
Do you have any reason to suspect she's lying then?
Just that she doesn't seem to be the type to be pushed by her friends/slaves. It's slightly ironic that the situation you depict where she could be influenced is also a "maybe" scenario.

Quote:
Originally Posted by blackwhite67 View Post
Three parts of chapter 7 are out.

"First, there was a conversation."

Shortest part ever.
Did Kamachi try a joke there? I didn't get it.
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Old 2013-01-19, 21:06   Link #23019
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
What the fudgestick ?!
It's Kamachi.
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Since we are all so trigger happy about certain behaviors that we do when talking about his works.

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Old 2013-01-19, 21:08   Link #23020
Hiss13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by blackwhite67 View Post
Three parts of chapter 7 are out.

"First, there was a conversation."

Shortest part ever.
What the fudgestick ?!
"What the fudgestick!?" is right. I did not see that one coming.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Master Assassin View Post
It's Kamachi.
That could explain it...
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