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Old 2013-01-23, 02:14   Link #23361
Chaos2Frozen
The Evil Within
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Drangelic, or by a different name...
Age: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by dcdfvr View Post
in ToAruverse yea. see #2 Kakine as reference. so long as the heart isn't destroyed or head not lopped off/crushed, crushed bodies parts and what not mean nothing.

there was also terra still being alive for a couple mins even after aqua crushed half his body before he finally died.

also the two aztec girl's bodies

All special circumstances and not the norm. Plus we're not talking about one or two limps here, we're talking about literally flattening them into nothing... Case in point, the chuck of road that Slivia dropped on Thor.

As for Terra, a couple of minutes? lol try a few seconds
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Old 2013-01-23, 02:20   Link #23362
dcdfvr
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Join Date: Jan 2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
All special circumstances and not the norm. Plus we're not talking about one or two limps here, we're talking about literally flattening them into nothing.

As for Terra, a couple of minutes? lol try a few seconds
i consider if a few mins as it was still long enough for aqua to tell him he wasn't going to heaven and giving a reaction face back to aqua

and i'm pretty sure misaka can make use of artifical cyborg limbs and manage a body somehow. there's also the fact there are enough clones of her where AC can just transplant her brain into the body of one of the clones and no one would ever notice

from what i read brunhild wanted to try to kill her with a sonic boom and causing her muscles and other tissues to burst from within. not flattening her to nothing
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Old 2013-01-23, 02:22   Link #23363
shmaster
Hanged Man & Chariot
 
 
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The big difference between Touma and Shirou is that Shirou wants to enact justice, be the super hero. Pretty simple.

But Touma now? What he said to Birdway basically translates to "I want to be Jesus Christ, you have sinned for not crucifying me to bleed for the rest of the universe."
And I really really want to bang my head to the wall when I read his whole "It is not logical to save people, but emotional" rant.

Just what went wrong with this boy. He is really making Fiamma to look more human than him.
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Old 2013-01-23, 02:25   Link #23364
leukrota
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Now that I think about it, the only Saint-like Saint so far is Kanzaki, who is always concerned about saving her enemy. The rest don't seem to give a squat about mass producing human pasta.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dcdfvr View Post
from what i read brunhild wanted to try to kill her with a sonic boom and causing her muscles and other tissues to burst from within. not flattening her to nothing
Do you think a mushy brain can withstand what the muscles and other tissues can't.

Quote:
Originally Posted by shmaster View Post
Just what went wrong with this boy. He is really making Fiamma to look more human than him.
It's Birdway's fault, she hit his head too hard.
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Old 2013-01-23, 02:28   Link #23365
Chaos2Frozen
The Evil Within
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Drangelic, or by a different name...
Age: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by dcdfvr View Post
from what i read brunhild wanted to try to kill her with a sonic boom and causing her muscles and other tissues to burst from within. not flattening her to nothing
Erm, did you think Brunhild was aiming that giant claymore to miss her when she got all the way up close?

Quote:
Brunhild Eiktobel charged up to a point right in front of Mikoto and vigorously swung up the claymore hanging down from one hand.
If so she wouldn't have bothered right ?

Last edited by Chaos2Frozen; 2013-01-23 at 02:40.
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Old 2013-01-23, 02:32   Link #23366
Cosmic Eagle
宿命に全てを奪われた少女
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: 宿命と時間の巻きに
Quote:
Originally Posted by shmaster View Post
The big difference between Touma and Shirou is that Shirou wants to enact justice, be the super hero. Pretty simple.

But Touma now? What he said to Birdway basically translates to "I want to be Jesus Christ, you have sinned for not crucifying me to bleed for the rest of the universe."
And I really really want to bang my head to the wall when I read his whole "It is not logical to save people, but emotional" rant.

Just what went wrong with this boy. He is really making Fiamma to look more human than him.
Leo...you might as well ask what went wrong with my own Tasogare
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Old 2013-01-23, 02:37   Link #23367
Chaos2Frozen
The Evil Within
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shmaster View Post
But Touma now? What he said to Birdway basically translates to "I want to be Jesus Christ, you have sinned for not crucifying me to bleed for the rest of the universe."
And I really really want to bang my head to the wall when I read his whole "It is not logical to save people, but emotional" rant.
I'm pretty sure that's not what he was saying.

What he's saying is that if you're going to use logic as the only reason to save people, then you could argue that logically speaking nothing would matter in the end since everything would always eventually die. He's not saying that you don't need logic, he's saying that you definitely need emotions.

Secondly, you're definitely twisting what he meant- Instead of sacrificing hundreds of thousands of innocent people, what Birdway could have done is to approach him from the very beginning to minimize the number of people involved from hundreds of thousands to just one person. He was already in this fight anyway, Birdway didn't have to lie and manipulate so many people, all she had to do was to ask him.
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Old 2013-01-23, 02:41   Link #23368
dcdfvr
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by leukrota View Post

Do you think a mushy brain can withstand what the muscles and other tissues can't.
most likely no but with ToAruverse anything's a possibility

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
Erm, did you think Brunhild was aiming that giant claymore to miss her when got all the way up close?



If so she wouldn't have bothered right ?
that doesn't tell us her intention as
Quote:
She also twisted her wrist to lay the giant sword down flat as she swung it.

Normally, this may have been an attempt to not hit one’s opponent with the blade of the sword. However, the situation here was different. Brunhild Eiktobel could move at supersonic speeds and the claymore she held was like a giant sword made by attaching a grip to a metal sheet.

By laying the blade flat, she could use it like a giant fan made of steel.

An overwhelmingly violent fan that used the massive shockwave created when an object moved at supersonic speeds.

That would end it.
that could be to cause a shockwave incase mikoto dodged or to smash her directly. we'll never really know since it failed
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Old 2013-01-23, 02:43   Link #23369
apsody243
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Join Date: Dec 2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
I'm pretty sure that's not what he was saying.

What he's saying is that if you're going to use logic as the only reason to save people, then you could argue that logically speaking nothing would matter in the end since everything would always eventually die. He's not saying that you don't need logic, he's saying that you definitely need emotions.

Secondly, you're definitely twisting what he meant- Instead of sacrificing hundreds of thousands of innocent people, what Birdway could have done is to approach him from the very beginning to minimize the number of people involved from hundreds of thousands to just one person. He was already in this fight anyway, Birdway didn't have to lie and manipulate so many people, all she had to do was to ask him.
Amen to that, Couldn't have said it better myself. The biggest difference that I see between Touman and Shirou is that the later, apart for being obsessed with his savior also suffers from self inflicted guilt over being the only one that was saved.
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Old 2013-01-23, 02:47   Link #23370
Chaos2Frozen
The Evil Within
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Drangelic, or by a different name...
Age: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by dcdfvr View Post
that could be to cause a shockwave incase mikoto dodged or to smash her directly. we'll never really know since it failed
Ahh but see, even if the shockwave is the 'back-up', that would still mean her weapon was intended to hit Mikoto
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Old 2013-01-23, 02:50   Link #23371
Sumeragi
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Location: Dai Korai Teikoku
I think it's simple: Mikoto is not as weak as many thought her as being.
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Old 2013-01-23, 02:51   Link #23372
leukrota
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dcdfvr View Post
that could be to cause a shockwave incase mikoto dodged or to smash her directly. we'll never really know since it failed
She was trying to kill her in an efficient way, to me it's that straightforward. Kill her then help Silvia against Thor and then go after Touma, cause they were interfering with their plan to sabotage Othinus.
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Old 2013-01-23, 02:55   Link #23373
shmaster
Hanged Man & Chariot
 
 
Join Date: May 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
I'm pretty sure that's not what he was saying.

What he's saying is that if you're going to use logic as the only reason to save people, then you could argue that logically speaking nothing would matter in the end since everything would always eventually die. He's not saying that you don't need logic, he's saying that you definitely need emotions.

Secondly, you're definitely twisting what he meant- Instead of sacrificing hundreds of thousands of innocent people, what Birdway could have done is to approach him from the very beginning to minimize the number of people involved from hundreds of thousands to just one person. He was already in this fight anyway, Birdway didn't have to lie and manipulate so many people, all she had to do was to ask him.
But what changes can he made by using him as the bait?
Ultimately speaking, events at Hawaii and Baggage City is inevitable.

Othinus need the Volcano to be her cauldron, Othinus need a test ground for her holistic theory.
Even if Touma can lure her out, her organization can still carry out their objective. Have you forgotten, that in the Hawaii incident, there is only one formal Gremlin member presence with two other part timers?

Think about it, if Birdway didn't drag everyone into Hawaii, what would happen instead. Yeah right, let's lure Othinus per Touma's idea. Othinus can bring her entire organization sans three people to meet Touma, and that three people can cause much more chaos in Hawaii with no people to stop them.
Touma is merely an obstacle to crush, not a reason for Othinus to change her strategical objective.

Sure, you can argue the Hawaii incident lead to the creation of Science Guardian, and made Gremlin choose Baggage City for the Holistic experiment.... But hey, at least we now know clear location where the experiment will occur. Far better than not knowing what is the next location that Gremlin will commit their next atrocity.

I am getting pretty sick of Touma's logic. He completely overlook the fact that whether Birdway manipulate the events or not, Othinus is still going to do what she is going to do. Yet, he speaks as if everyone dies because of Birdway. And his only reasoning behind that is because Birdway didn't sacrifice him. Am I the only one who sees the fallacy in this?
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Old 2013-01-23, 02:56   Link #23374
Chaos2Frozen
The Evil Within
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sumeragi View Post
I think it's simple: Mikoto is not as weak as many thought her as being.
That's not it What started this was the idea that Brunhild was 'holding back' during her fight
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Old 2013-01-23, 02:58   Link #23375
Sumeragi
Banned
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
That's not it What started this was the idea that Brunhild was 'holding back' during her fight
And we now know she wasn't holding back, at least in the sense she was using her full physical strength.
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Old 2013-01-23, 03:01   Link #23376
shmaster
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sumeragi View Post
And we now know she wasn't holding back, at least in the sense she was using her full physical strength.
This doesn't sound right though. This is like saying Birdway was not holding back against Touma because she went all out on her Minor Arcana, despite not a single card of Major Arcana is used.
It is hard to say Brunhild was not holding back too as she used only her physical strength without any offensive use of magic.
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Old 2013-01-23, 03:05   Link #23377
kuroishinigami
Ava courtesy of patchy
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by shmaster View Post
But what changes can he made by using him as the bait?
Ultimately speaking, events at Hawaii and Baggage City is inevitable.

Othinus need the Volcano to be her cauldron, Othinus need a test ground for her holistic theory.
Even if Touma can lure her out, her organization can still carry out their objective. Have you forgotten, that in the Hawaii incident, there is only one formal Gremlin member presence with two other part timers?

Think about it, if Birdway didn't drag everyone into Hawaii, what would happen instead. Yeah right, let's lure Othinus per Touma's idea. Othinus can bring her entire organization sans three people to meet Touma, and that three people can cause much more chaos in Hawaii with no people to stop them.
Touma is merely an obstacle to crush, not a reason for Othinus to change her strategical objective.

Sure, you can argue the Hawaii incident lead to the creation of Science Guardian, and made Gremlin choose Baggage City for the Holistic experiment.... But hey, at least we now know clear location where the experiment will occur. Far better than not knowing what is the next location that Gremlin will commit their next atrocity.

I am getting pretty sick of Touma's logic. He completely overlook the fact that whether Birdway manipulate the events or not, Othinus is still going to do what she is going to do. Yet, he speaks as if everyone dies because of Birdway. And his only reasoning behind that is because Birdway didn't sacrifice him. Am I the only one who sees the fallacy in this?
Well, he's not exactly the brightest boy after all , but his idea is not as absurd as you think. Remember in addition to sacrificing him, he also ask Birdway to spread the rumor that his right hand is much more dangerous to their plan than it actually is. If the rumor work, and probably with few rumor addition such as Ollerus interference, they might be able to lure the whole Gremlin gang out with making him as the target. It's a very naive thought I admit, but his message is clear, if Birdway has to sacrifice someone to lure out Othinus, first try to sacrifice him first instead of other people.
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Old 2013-01-23, 03:07   Link #23378
Sumeragi
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It sounds right, because we're unsure as to what kind of magic she is capable of using at the moment. Is her Valkyrie's Norse Magic Style or Stigma stronger? For that matter, exactly what kind of powers are they?
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Old 2013-01-23, 03:09   Link #23379
leukrota
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Join Date: Mar 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by shmaster View Post
This doesn't sound right though. This is like saying Birdway was not holding back against Touma because she went all out on her Minor Arcana, despite not a single card of Major Arcana is used.
It is hard to say Brunhild was not holding back too as she used only her physical strength without any offensive use of magic.
Depends on how you define holding back. If it's anything short of full strenght (and not just physical) then yeah. If it's going easy on the opponent then no.

She has a good reason to not use her full strenght though, as it'd be bad if she's burned out by the time Othinus makes her appearance.
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Old 2013-01-23, 03:09   Link #23380
Eternal Regnum771
Super Sadist
 
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by shmaster View Post
I am getting pretty sick of Touma's logic. He completely overlook the fact that whether Birdway manipulate the events or not, Othinus is still going to do what she is going to do. Yet, he speaks as if everyone dies because of Birdway. And his only reasoning behind that is because Birdway didn't sacrifice him. Am I the only one who sees the fallacy in this?
No, you're not alone. Touma often grates he with his arguments and ideals, but the ones he gave to Birdway takes the cake for being wall-banging worthy. Birdway is in the right and has the stronger stance, but Touma being Touma...he has tunnel vision and regardless of the arguments he gives that's emotion based, he'll just go IDTI anyways.
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