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Old 2013-01-24, 00:22   Link #23481
Kenju of the Right
Imagine Breaker
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Requiem-x View Post
That was sarcasm, man. It would be a huge upgrade for Shiage's group, and there's also Rikou's potential, which no doubt has been noticed by the Kihara checking out on Kakine.

Here's a thought, what if Etzali is the one in charge of taking Shiage out for whatever reason?
Hehe I know

That would be interesting although Accelerator cut off those shackles he and GROUP had because of the Dark Side

but yeah-

OMG

What if AIM Stalker causes 05 Kakine to fall in love with Rikou
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He believes.
Even though he’s tired and one leg’s in the coffin, he believes.
He believes in his right fist,
in the path that his weapon creates,
in the scene when his weapon brutally hits the enemy’s body,
that his victory will bring about a wonderful future.
Kamijou Touma’s actions are based on trust.-

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Old 2013-01-24, 00:28   Link #23482
Requiem-x
The slacking one
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
That's a pretty big leap you're making there Besides, it only allowed him to have a shot at free will. As established before, the lolis were the main trigger for the change.

So, you should be looking for flat chests.
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Old 2013-01-24, 00:28   Link #23483
Chaos2Frozen
"Where mah Justice go?!"
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Asylum beyond the Mirror
Age: 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenju of the Right View Post
What if AIM Stalker causes 05 Kakine to fall in love with Rikou
You can never have too many reasons to remove Hamazura's protagonist status
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Old 2013-01-24, 00:43   Link #23484
shmaster
The Hades
 
 
Join Date: May 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
Why are you so hung up about this point? After being tricked into causing a civil war on the Science side and seeing hundreds of people died first hand, you can bet that's the least he should do.

What? Birdway has a good reason for it so it's all forgiven? Nobody should judge her and hurt her feelings? Give me a break.
Birdway certainly can judged by the people she victimized, and I never once said she is right in what she did.
I'll actually be in agreement with Touma if himself getting victimized by Birdway is what he was ranting about. I have stated above too Birdway sacrificing people is a valid argument against her. But I truly see that is a point Touma derailed from.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
That's twisting his words and you know it.

Not trying? Are you serious? So I guess that trip to Europe was actually a side vacation.
If you consider wielding his power recklessly and irresponsibly is call trying. If you think he blindly believe he can solve the problem in Baggage City all by himself and ditching all his supporters behind is call trying. The truth is, Touma would even have difficulty get into Baggage City if not for Persi.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
Seriously where is this coming from? All he pointed out was that there is something they could have done before causing massive deaths.

He was using himself as an EXAMPLE of such a method. Putting himself on the line, 'cutting his own flesh' if he has to.
If this is the way you put... then does this example really worth anything?
I guess he is cutting his own flesh in Baggage City. But what does it amount to? Because he don't want get his supporter involved, so he can cut his own flesh, he end up arriving so late into the city, when the tragedy is half way through.
He was paper thin in front of Othinus, and would not have made it out if Ollerus had not arrived. He was just drowning in his Messiah complex.
Cutting own flesh is worthwhile as a selfless sacrifice, as it actually attracts people to support you. But Touma has cross the line by ditching other people so he can be the one to cut flesh. I guess I can now understand Mikoto's distress when she was left behind. She is one of those attracted to Touma due to his selflessness, but end up thrown behind when Touma start to take that behavior the wrong way.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
You're reading way too much into this acceptance thing.

Touma disagree with her way of doing things. Full stop. That's it.

Again with Birdway guilt... How about she actually talk to people instead of going behind everybody's backs and THEN say that nothing else could be done.

Sure, nothing could be done NOW when everything became all screwed up.
And I never disagreed on the point of Birdway being immoral and deceitful.
What I can't stand is Touma trying to say he is better when he is half baked as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
How about not letting the civil war happen? That's a damn good start if you ask me.
And lose the chance to make Gremlin become predictable to her? We already know what happened in Hawaii when Gremlin had the initiative.
Like I said, this is a lose lose situation. When you gain something, you open up another loop hole for casualties.
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Old 2013-01-24, 00:43   Link #23485
whitecloud
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
You can never have too many reasons to remove Hamazura's protagonist status
kamen rider Kakine ------> shiage
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Old 2013-01-24, 00:54   Link #23486
Kenju of the Right
Imagine Breaker
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
headcannon that Kakine uses his Dark Matter to have fun with LO, Fremea and kids around AC
__________________

He believes.
Even though he’s tired and one leg’s in the coffin, he believes.
He believes in his right fist,
in the path that his weapon creates,
in the scene when his weapon brutally hits the enemy’s body,
that his victory will bring about a wonderful future.
Kamijou Touma’s actions are based on trust.-

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Old 2013-01-24, 00:55   Link #23487
Chaos2Frozen
"Where mah Justice go?!"
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Asylum beyond the Mirror
Age: 26
shmaster, I don't want to drag this argument any longer than I have to and damper the mood, so hopefully this is the last one I'm posting on this subject since we're pretty much going in circles and enough people have already stated their thoughts on it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by shmaster View Post
If this is the way you put... then does this example really worth anything?
I guess he is cutting his own flesh in Baggage City. But what does it amount to? Because he don't want get his supporter involved, so he can cut his own flesh, he end up arriving so late into the city, when the tragedy is half way through.
He was paper thin in front of Othinus, and would not have made it out if Ollerus had not arrived. He was just drowning in his Messiah complex.
Cutting own flesh is worthwhile as a selfless sacrifice, as it actually attracts people to support you. But Touma has cross the line by ditching other people so he can be the one to cut flesh. I guess I can now understand Mikoto's distress when she was left behind. She is one of those attracted to Touma due to his selflessness, but end up thrown behind when Touma start to take that behavior the wrong way.
This example might have worked before things all went to Hell.

Maybe that two weeks it took for them to reach Academy City in NT1.
Or that three days(?) of preparation for them to go to Hawaii.

Certainly plenty of time before 'all hell has already happened'.


Quote:
Originally Posted by shmaster View Post
And I never disagreed on the point of Birdway being immoral and deceitful.
What I can't stand is Touma trying to say he is better when he is half baked as well.
When did he say he was better?

Quote:
Originally Posted by shmaster View Post
And lose the chance to make Gremlin become predictable to her? We already know what happened in Hawaii when Gremlin had the initiative.
Like I said, this is a lose lose situation. When you gain something, you open up another loop hole for casualties.
This as well wouldn't have been as bad had she bothered to tell the people helping her of her plan.
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Old 2013-01-24, 01:17   Link #23488
FiveOVER
Daydreamer
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: in the windowless building
Age: 21
@shmaster

Humans are creatures with emotions. They will always defend their thoughts and rationalize to fit those thoughts in the world. Touma believes he has the power to save people, he believes birdway has that power too.

Touma thinks that birdway use her power in the wrong way and as a result cause many casualties. He personally saw those horrible effects and his efforts at that point did little to save people. Thus, it is only normal for touma to be angry at birdway, to be human and blame birdway for those horrible things.

I'm not saying what he did was right, but its just that touma is very human. Human would always try to look for things to blame and regret not trying other methods. Thus, all he wanted to say to birdway is that he disagrees with her method and instead thinks there are other better methods. Using himself as bait is only an example.

About touma having messiah syndrome:
In my opinion, touma being all selfless and self sacrificial does not mean he is insane. You have to understand how the human mind works. It realises it can't have everything. It realises it has to weigh one thing above another. It realises that having that more important thing does not equate to happiness.

To touma, he weighs a happy life with everyone happy around him far more than a peaceful life for himself but surrounded with unhappy and dead people to the point where he is willing to sacrifice his own life for it. This is very human and normal. Its just what is most important to him. Nothing more, nothing less.
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Old 2013-01-24, 01:20   Link #23489
Cosmic Eagle
卍曼荼羅・無量大数
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: 大欲界天狗道
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post




This example might have worked before things all went to Hell.

Maybe that two weeks it took for them to reach Academy City in NT1.
Or that three days(?) of preparation for them to go to Hawaii.

Certainly plenty of time before 'all hell has already happened'.
To be honest, with the kind of allies he has, calling them wouldn't waste much time. Call Kanzaki, call Accelerator even...The English royal court also more than owes him. Giving them a call while heading over would not have hurt.
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Old 2013-01-24, 02:31   Link #23490
Chaos2Frozen
"Where mah Justice go?!"
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Asylum beyond the Mirror
Age: 26
Quote:
“I take back what I said,” said Accelerator without hesitation. That was something he did not often say. “Academy City’s #2 esper power of Dark Matter is one hell of a power. It was wasted on the likes of you. And it was clearly too much for you to control.”

“Come to think of it,” added Mugino Shizuri with a puzzled look. “Do we have any proof that this one was actually the core? The #2’s mind was scattered over the system, and this one was the closest to the surface. But nothing says what showed itself on the surface was Kakine Teitoku’s true nature. Weren’t we just battling the very outer layer of his mind this whole time? Then again, even just that was no easy task, so I guess the #2 really is no normal person. …Oh, and make no mistake. I wasn’t complimenting you when I said that. I was talking about the real one.”

Hahaha lol! Both Accelerator and Mugino sounded way too gleeful in those last moments That's some epic trolling.

Unit 05 struggling for control was a bit too matrixish for my understanding so the only parts I got was after it 'blooms into a flower' I like how they used 'infinite possibilities' in this as well, almost like it's mirroring Othinus' own 'infinite possibilities'.


So the question now is what would happen to Kakine Teitoku? Would he proceed to creep the hell out of Accelerator and Mugino with super polite mannerism and genuine happy smile and baby green innocent eyes ?
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Old 2013-01-24, 02:33   Link #23491
Sumeragi
Banned
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Dai Korai Teikoku
And we go back to the Imperial Flower Flag.

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Old 2013-01-24, 02:37   Link #23492
Chaos2Frozen
"Where mah Justice go?!"
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Asylum beyond the Mirror
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sumeragi View Post
And we go back to the Imperial Flower Flag.


New Teitoku would be a soft spoken bishounen with kind eyes and a tendency to say unintentional lady-killer one liners...

...Much like Io from Acchi Kocchi

New Teitoku Relationships!
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Old 2013-01-24, 02:43   Link #23493
Sumeragi
Banned
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Dai Korai Teikoku
"Te, Teitoku-san, you can't do that here! That is improper!"
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Old 2013-01-24, 02:48   Link #23494
Chaos2Frozen
"Where mah Justice go?!"
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Asylum beyond the Mirror
Age: 26
*Puppies and kittens slowly start to gravitate towards Teitoku and curl up around him for warmth*
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Old 2013-01-24, 02:57   Link #23495
leukrota
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
*Puppies and kittens slowly start to gravitate towards Teitoku and curl up around him for warmth*
Dunno about puppies and kittens, but lolis are already doing so, Aogami must be really jealous

Off-topic: @Sumeragi Have you seen GJ-bu? there's one cool Sumeragi there.
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Old 2013-01-24, 03:00   Link #23496
Sumeragi
Banned
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Dai Korai Teikoku
I can totally see the Judgment office being used for alternate purposes.....

@ leukrota: It's on my list. Not sure if I got the time though.
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Old 2013-01-24, 03:00   Link #23497
Chaos2Frozen
"Where mah Justice go?!"
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Asylum beyond the Mirror
Age: 26
Teitoku: "Ohaiyo, Sempai "

*Accelerator vomits blood*

Quote:
Originally Posted by leukrota View Post
Off-topic: @Sumeragi Have you seen GJ-bu? there's one cool Sumeragi there.
I've already tried recommending it to her
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Old 2013-01-24, 03:15   Link #23498
leukrota
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
There's a lot of interesting interactions possible.

Kakine: Looking great as always, Mugino-san.
*gets blown away* *reforms instantly*
Kakine: Now, now, don't get worked up so early, it's not good for your skin.
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Old 2013-01-24, 03:16   Link #23499
whitecloud
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Accelerator : who are you...!!!! Is this a play, a deception? To make me off guard !!! Oh no you don't ...you won't trick me like this...

Kakine : who is tricking you? I just here to play with last order, and want to say sorry for all I did...or at least what the other me did...
(accelerator coughing blood)

Last order : you are mean...beetle only want to play...

Fremea : yeah...he is now part of hamazura trope...

Kakine : I'm not beetle..I'm kakine...but oh well
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Old 2013-01-24, 03:19   Link #23500
Sumeragi
Banned
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Dai Korai Teikoku
If the Imperial Flower Flag rises, I want to see what the Server of Heaven might do about it.
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