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View Poll Results: Psycho-Pass - Episode 15 Rating
Perfect 10 25 36.76%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 24 35.29%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 15 22.06%
7 out of 10 : Good 4 5.88%
6 out of 10 : Average 0 0%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 0 0%
4 out of 10 : Poor 0 0%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 0 0%
Voters: 68. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2013-02-03, 23:09   Link #141
Chiaki_chan
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Join Date: May 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GDiddy View Post
Of course, now that I've said Shion will be fine, watch next episode prove me wrong and she gets offed

ETA: I watched fifteen.....I didn't see anyone going into where Shion's at...or does she work at the Ministry? I forget.


Spoiler:
she is a doctor ... no enforcer so it is normal that we have not seen in room, and she work in a BAC no?
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Old 2013-02-03, 23:32   Link #142
Roger Rambo
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Something of mild interest to me.


Aside from eye rolling at just at how weak the psycho-pass police state actually is...is anyone else a bit surprised at how quickly in comparison the mass of citizenry (the medicated, preselected to be docile and wimpy populace) reacted to the threats of the helmeted guys? Sure you had Makishima's hacker buddy spreading rumors and all...but the fact that they'd be willing to start listening to those kind of suggestions this quickly does seem to suggest this populace is overall not as docile as might have been suggested.

Course one could call the police characters discussing the perils of Psycho-hazard as an acknowledgement of this fact...though that's a bit incompatible with their belief that citizens rioting is impossible.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Reckoner View Post
When people who had acceptable pp levels before the helmet came into use start getting shot on sight I think this will shake up their society even more than it already is. Their whole society is built on these ratings. People getting life sentences because their reading is bad is different from people with acceptable psycho pass readings getting suddenly killed on sight.
Uhhh, whose talking about people who had acceptable pp levels before the helmets being shot on sight? The only people being shot on sight in the situation Ahn Mihn described are the mobs of spree killers wearing VERY distinctive and obvious helmets. I'm not exactly seeing where the public outcry comes from the cops/security robots gunning down the masked criminals actively committing arson rape and murder.

That kinda shit only fly's in the DC universe, where the only massive public outcry related to the Joker raping 2-3 dozen toddlers to death is that Batman beat up the Joker too hard.

Last edited by Roger Rambo; 2013-02-03 at 23:45.
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Old 2013-02-03, 23:44   Link #143
MeoTwister5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Rambo View Post
Something of mild interest to me.


Aside from eye rolling at just at how weak the psycho-pass police state actually is...is anyone else a bit surprised at how quickly in comparison the mass of citizenry (the medicated, preselected to be docile and wimpy populace) reacted to the threats of the helmeted guys? Sure you had Makishima's hacker buddy spreading rumors and all...but the fact that they'd be willing to start listening to those kind of suggestions this quickly does seem to suggest this populace is overall not as docile as might have been suggested.

Course one could call the police characters discussing the perils of Psycho-hazard as an acknowledgement of this fact...though that's a bit incompatible with their belief that citizens rioting is impossible.
That's precisely the thing. The fact that they're capable of these acts almost spontaneously suggests that they aren't exactly conditioned to be complacent or docile, rather they are merely being suppressed.

Hence my previous suggestion that Sybil was probably not meant to recondition society as a whole, but merely a tool to suppress what is innate and cannot be effectively eliminated from each individual.

Or, if reconditioning was indeed its purpose, then it has failed spectacularly.
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Old 2013-02-04, 07:03   Link #144
Triple_R
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Rambo View Post
Something of mild interest to me.


Aside from eye rolling at just at how weak the psycho-pass police state actually is...is anyone else a bit surprised at how quickly in comparison the mass of citizenry (the medicated, preselected to be docile and wimpy populace) reacted to the threats of the helmeted guys? Sure you had Makishima's hacker buddy spreading rumors and all...but the fact that they'd be willing to start listening to those kind of suggestions this quickly does seem to suggest this populace is overall not as docile as might have been suggested.
This is one area where I agree with you. I delved into it a bit here.

The way the general populace is rising up to deal with the helmeted people was my main quibble with the episode. I mean, that sort of rising up takes balls in a normal society, so in a (presumably) very pacified one like the one in Psycho-Pass, it's nothing short of amazing.

After all, vigilante-ism is not something I'd expect a psychologically healthy person to be eager to engage in.


But I guess the idea here is that when people's faith in lawful authority crumbles, there is a tendency to panic and overreact. And sometimes this doesn't mean hiding under your bed covers while you lock all the doors in your house - Sometimes this means riots.
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Old 2013-02-04, 07:38   Link #145
Qilin
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One thing to note here is that the average citizen in this hypothetical society is only docile to the extent that personal safety is guaranteed. Once that illusion of safety disappears, they are reduced to a frenzied state, desperate to do anything to ensure their survival. It's quite amusing really. These people just go about their lives everyday caring about their own problems. Even if a murder occurs right in front of them, they can only look on without a care, they're utterly desensitized. Now, the recent incidents with the helmet guys can said to be akin to suddenly removing that psychological anesthesia they've been under for a huge portion of their lives. With that image in my head, I don't find the response surprising in the least.

For a real world example, Sybil can be compared to a huge bank where people deposit a chunk of their hard-earned savings, their personal freedom, in exchange for keeping their money safe, or in this case, their lives. Now, due to some reason or another, Sybil bank is a thread away from bankruptcy. In this situation, it has very little choice but to convince its depositors that their money is safe and acquiring interest normally. Or else, the risk is a mass withdrawal due to the loss of confidence in the company, and such a situation would surely force the bank to declare bankruptcy. This reaction here in this episode is analogous to the livid depositor realizing that all their money is gone.
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Old 2013-02-04, 08:29   Link #146
Roger Rambo
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Except you're not addressing Triple_R's point Qulin. Even in a normal society, the average person is far more likely to respond to this kind of uncontrolled street violence by locking themselves in their homes and trying to wait it out. And these are *average* modern day people, many of whom have probably contemplated engaging in violent action in self defense. During the 1992 LA riots, the only large scale and organized citizens response to the rioting came from the Korean community. And that has to be considered that there was already ethnic tension between the Koreans and other minorities, and that many of the Korean immigrants likely had mandatory military experience in the Korean army. Preexisting mistrust towards specific groups (along with a sense of distinctive ethnic identity) and martial experience tends to be what elicits this kind of directed self defense vigilantism.


In a society where violent thoughts/tendencies are actively medicated? Where the average citizen doesn't even contemplate violence/unrest most of the time? These kinda responses seem a bit implausible. At least with how fast it progressed.
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Old 2013-02-04, 11:33   Link #147
Endscape
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Rambo View Post
Except you're not addressing Triple_R's point Qulin. Even in a normal society, the average person is far more likely to respond to this kind of uncontrolled street violence by locking themselves in their homes and trying to wait it out. And these are *average* modern day people, many of whom have probably contemplated engaging in violent action in self defense. During the 1992 LA riots, the only large scale and organized citizens response to the rioting came from the Korean community. And that has to be considered that there was already ethnic tension between the Koreans and other minorities, and that many of the Korean immigrants likely had mandatory military experience in the Korean army. Preexisting mistrust towards specific groups (along with a sense of distinctive ethnic identity) and martial experience tends to be what elicits this kind of directed self defense vigilantism.


In a society where violent thoughts/tendencies are actively medicated? Where the average citizen doesn't even contemplate violence/unrest most of the time? These kinda responses seem a bit implausible. At least with how fast it progressed.
The thing is, the reason people normally don't respond in situations like this is because of their sense of danger: they know something like that is dangerous.

But as we've seen, in the Psycho Pass world, people have a distorted sense of danger. They didn't react when someone got killed right in front of their eyes because they didn't think it was dangerous, so the reverse could be possible as well, they could recklessly attack someone because they didn't feel it was dangerous.

When you add in how repressed and stressed out the average person must be, trying to manage their psychological health, I don't find it all that odd something like this happened once they had a good justification for it.
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Old 2013-02-04, 17:58   Link #148
Roger Rambo
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The thing is, the reason people normally don't respond in situations like this is because of their sense of danger: they know something like that is dangerous.

But as we've seen, in the Psycho Pass world, people have a distorted sense of danger. They didn't react when someone got killed right in front of their eyes because they didn't think it was dangerous, so the reverse could be possible as well, they could recklessly attack someone because they didn't feel it was dangerous.
I'm noooooooooooooooooooooot really sure I buy that. Not with how the vigilante violence we've seen so far has been shown to be like.

Honor student hostages attacking the helmets
-The students eventually rushed and attacked the helmets BECAUSE they recognized how dangerous the situation was. They were being killed remorselessly one at a time. Their reaction is NOTHING but recognizing how dangerous their situation was.


The other two major cases I can remember was that case of the old man running over the helmet head with a car, and that group of people cornering a suspected helmet wearer while he was alone, then beating him to death. Both of which are opportunistic ambushes against lone suspected helmet wearers from a position of strength (in numbers, or having the advantage of a car). Taking such careful measures before attacking someone suggest NOTHING but that you understand how dangerous the situation is. And the people involved in both incidents were clearly quite apprehensive prior to making their attacks.



Maybe the first hostage situation fits, since it's a more visceral fight or flight response...but these other incidents where the citizens are deliberately planning out preemptive ambush attacks against helmets? No. This isn't the behavior of people who have no understanding of danger.
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Old 2013-02-04, 19:49   Link #149
BoyTitan
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This is the real problem Makishima has. He's such a pretentious hipster that he's unable to recognize what dystopia Sybil is modeled after.
YouTube
Sorry; dynamic content not loaded. Reload?

College boy hasn't watched enough action movies!
How the hell did I miss this movie I must watch it =D

And it has wesley snipes in it I am a huge fan of him. Must have came out when I was young I am only 20.
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Old 2013-02-04, 19:59   Link #150
Qilin
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Originally Posted by Roger Rambo View Post
In a society where violent thoughts/tendencies are actively medicated? Where the average citizen doesn't even contemplate violence/unrest most of the time? These kinda responses seem a bit implausible.
Except that's exactly what I'm saying. Violent thoughts, while actively controlled, are only restrained. They aren't diminished entirely, so what is it that restrains those violent impulses then? It's that confidence they have in the system that allows them to live without worrying about about their safety. What happens when you take away that sense of security? A sort of irrational savagery that comes with the sudden disillusionment. In that sense, I find it highly plausible.

EDIT

Actually, MeoTwister5's post expresses it quite well:
Quote:
That's precisely the thing. The fact that they're capable of these acts almost spontaneously suggests that they aren't exactly conditioned to be complacent or docile, rather they are merely being suppressed.

Hence my previous suggestion that Sybil was probably not meant to recondition society as a whole, but merely a tool to suppress what is innate and cannot be effectively eliminated from each individual.

Or, if reconditioning was indeed its purpose, then it has failed spectacularly.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Rambo View Post
At least with how fast it progressed.
In an environment where they might have been killed at any second? It's not uncommon for people to rise up in a panic once their safety is threatened. Yes, these people have been characterized as docile sheep, but do note that this apathy is contingent with their own trust in the system's ability to ensure their personal safety.
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Old 2013-02-05, 11:18   Link #151
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Watching this society rip itself to shreds is simply so satisfying

Now will Makishima prove himself or will he just fail so hard like another petty killer?
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Old 2013-02-05, 11:20   Link #152
Dengar
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I think people forget that states of mind can be highly infectuous. Violence begets violence. Ironically, it's psychopaths who are largely immune to this.
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Old 2013-02-05, 21:26   Link #153
GDiddy
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Watching this society rip itself to shreds is simply so satisfying

Now will Makishima prove himself or will he just fail so hard like another petty killer?
For story's sake, I don't see him living until the end...though he's going to enjoy himself as much as he can and probaly will die when he's damn good and ready.

It's a matter of who'll he'll take with him...Ko...Akane? Or whatever he's going to unleash.
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Old 2013-02-07, 05:45   Link #154
Traece
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What bothers me most about this recent plot escalation is, well, everything.

You have this future society where every single person is closely watched and monitored for sometimes even slight changes in their mental state. Anyone and everyone who becomes unstable enough to even have the remotest thought of a dangerous fashion is immediately rehabilitated. They have this massive network of cameras, drones, and computers assisting human law enforcers (who are merely slaves of the system). They can keep track of the average person in detail.

Yet they can't make exceptions in their database for people, or for items like helmets. They just can't do anything about anyone getting around their system, period.

The biggest issue I have with that is that NOBODY would EVER design a system like that. Period. No society past, present, or future would hand over their lives to a system and willing say: "In the off chance that our perfect system were to fail, we'll just have to accept that we're completely boned."

As far as the mass rioting goes, this is an observable human trait that doesn't really bother me. The fact that these heavily indoctrinated civilians suddenly turn to violence makes sense when you consider the propaganda being used. During scenes where the people were reading the message boards and saying that "self-defense" doesn't raise your PP, I honestly thought that it would end up being yet another issue with the system where these people genuinely had low PP because they absolutely thought they were doing the right thing.

All of that aside, since it's gone down this path I can't really complain much. There's no choice in the matter, after all. I am very curious for the almost assured plot twist when the system is finally shown. I'm fully expecting some sort of high-stakes melee between Kogari and Makishima.
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Old 2013-02-07, 15:24   Link #155
Dengar
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Uhhh, while I don't completely disagree with the whole "watch for helmets" thing, up until a few days ago, such helmets were completely unheard of. Coming up with a countermeasure takes time. Besides, the damage has already been done.
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Old 2013-02-07, 17:14   Link #156
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Originally Posted by Dengar View Post
Uhhh, while I don't completely disagree with the whole "watch for helmets" thing, up until a few days ago, such helmets were completely unheard of. Coming up with a countermeasure takes time. Besides, the damage has already been done.
Well, it's nice to see we agree on something at last.

When it comes to electronics, everything is a matter of escalation. There's really no such thing as a firewall that will be perfect for all-time. As technology improves, the balance of power will change. A new hack will be found for a previously flawless defense, of a new defense will be found for a previously unstoppable hack.

The fact it took several decades for a problem like these helmets to arise is actually to the Sibyl system's credit, imo.
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Old 2013-02-07, 17:18   Link #157
Anh_Minh
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Originally Posted by Cosmic Eagle View Post
Watching this society rip itself to shreds is simply so satisfying
I don't find it so. The manner in which it happens just isn't believable enough.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dengar View Post
Uhhh, while I don't completely disagree with the whole "watch for helmets" thing, up until a few days ago, such helmets were completely unheard of. Coming up with a countermeasure takes time. Besides, the damage has already been done.
"Shoot anyone in a helmet". It's not exactly rocket science, and will act as enough of a deterrent for almost all of those sociopaths of opportunity who had no tie to Makishima. (And it's their numbers which made them overwhelming in the first place.) It may not be perfect, but it'll buy enough time for them to find a more surgical solution if they're so inclined, and maybe relearn policework so they can root out Makishima and his organization.
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Old 2013-02-09, 06:42   Link #158
Dengar
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I don't find it so. The manner in which it happens just isn't believable enough.



"Shoot anyone in a helmet". It's not exactly rocket science, and will act as enough of a deterrent for almost all of those sociopaths of opportunity who had no tie to Makishima. (And it's their numbers which made them overwhelming in the first place.) It may not be perfect, but it'll buy enough time for them to find a more surgical solution if they're so inclined, and maybe relearn policework so they can root out Makishima and his organization.
You can't really detect a helmet using a sensor that only detects brainwaves. It's like asking a motion sensor to do a retinal scan.
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Old 2013-02-09, 10:29   Link #159
Anh_Minh
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They have optical sensors.
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Old 2013-02-09, 10:35   Link #160
Haak
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The biggest issue I have with that is that NOBODY would EVER design a system like that. Period. No society past, present, or future would hand over their lives to a system and willing say: "In the off chance that our perfect system were to fail, we'll just have to accept that we're completely boned."
*Cough* Banking system *Cough*
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