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Old 2013-02-07, 21:52   Link #201
JohnNiles
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Normal is the lowest difficulty? ._.
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Old 2013-02-07, 22:15   Link #202
Iron Maw
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadow5YA View Post
It wouldn't work because of how FE game mechanics are structured. You are given a set amount of characters and are expected to accumulate stats and gear in a limited amount of time (i.e. the story Chapters; FE normally does not have random battles for grinding like Sacred Stones and this game do).

The enemies are also designed to have stats and growth that mirror the general (expected) level of your overall party because of the limited number of chapters and therefore limited amount of EXP for levels. If you carry over stuff like unique or Silver weapons with high MT or stats, you would overpower everything.
They could do what some games with NG+ do and that is transfer a limited amount data over for the next plathrough (i.e such as only skills, gold and current class). Most FE games are pretty easy to begin with in their default difficulty so NG+ would hardly change anything here. This would mainly be for hard mode which IS usually balances very differently. It would add more of an incentive replay and class experimentation really.

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You're playing on Normal. You expect a challenge on the lowest difficulty?
I didn't even know this, was it like that in JPN version, or is there some DMC3 style shenanigans going on?
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Old 2013-02-07, 22:43   Link #203
GDB
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Originally Posted by Simonsy View Post
and so on as long as I like?
Yes, though it'd be better to go to other classes to get their skills.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Iron Maw View Post
I didn't even know this, was it like that in JPN version, or is there some DMC3 style shenanigans going on?
It was like this in the Japanese. Just for the record, this is par for the course. Previous FE games in the US with Easy/Normal/Hard were actually renamed from Normal/Hard/Insane.
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Old 2013-02-07, 22:44   Link #204
Shadow5YA
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Originally Posted by Iron Maw View Post
They could do what some games with NG+ do and that is transfer a limited amount data over for the next plathrough (i.e such as only skills, gold and current class). Most FE games are pretty easy to begin with in their default difficulty so NG+ would hardly change anything here. This would mainly be for hard mode which IS usually balances very differently. It would add more of an incentive replay and class experimentation really.
The problem is that even a single stat point can be the difference between not doubling and doubling an enemy. If promoted classes carry over (which have huge stat gains by design), you're already blowing through several early chapters because of the advantage. The same issue follows with skills: some of them provide very powerful advantages, like Adept allowing for double attacks, which can easily turn the tide of the game.

The entire point of NG+ bonuses in RPGs is to give you advantages that allow your party to blow through the main game content so that you can get to the more powerful, extra/postgame fights more quickly. In a FE game where the the main story is the entire focus of the game and there is no extra NG+ only postgame bosses to be found, there is no point.

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Originally Posted by Iron Maw View Post
I didn't even know this, was it like that in JPN version, or is there some DMC3 style shenanigans going on?
Pretty sure it was like that in the Japanese version as well.
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Old 2013-02-07, 23:10   Link #205
serenade_beta
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Originally Posted by GDB View Post
What does this even mean?
Ah~ Not much. Pretty much used towards anime girls that look or feel "too old".


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Originally Posted by GDB View Post
Didn't the Japanese DL version just come out a couple of weeks back, despite the physical copy coming out a year or two ago?
I believe so. I bought the real copy for FE:A, because it came out a lot earlier than the DL version and I wanted it at that time.
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Old 2013-02-07, 23:53   Link #206
Alchemist007
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I like how you called it the "real" copy.
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Old 2013-02-08, 00:04   Link #207
Guy Incognito
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadow5YA View Post
It wouldn't work because of how FE game mechanics are structured. You are given a set amount of characters and are expected to accumulate stats and gear in a limited amount of time (i.e. the story Chapters; FE normally does not have random battles for grinding like Sacred Stones and this game do).

The enemies are also designed to have stats and growth that mirror the general (expected) level of your overall party because of the limited number of chapters and therefore limited amount of EXP for levels. If you carry over stuff like unique or Silver weapons with high MT or stats, you would overpower everything.


What post-first playthrough unlockables FE games DO have however is higher difficulty (Hard for older games, Lunatic+ for the New Mystery of the Emblem remake and this game), CG viewer, sound test, and for this game specifically, Fame carryover, Support conversation viewer, and Avatar and bonus characters for hire with gold.



You're playing on Normal. You expect a challenge on the lowest difficulty?
it called normal not easy
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Old 2013-02-08, 00:24   Link #208
Simonsy
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Originally Posted by Dovahkyon View Post
it called normal not easy
There is no lower difficulty.

I believe you start by choosing either Normal or Hard. Not sure if lunatic is available at start.

But I also chose normal first. man it was a tough choice. I wish there was an Easy difficulty so I didn't feel like such a wussy picking normal.

But I like to play through first so I know which characters I like, when classes become available, ect.
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Old 2013-02-08, 00:56   Link #209
Simonsy
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Does anyone autopromote in this game?

You know so I have to say worry about getting someone to lvl 20 before Chapter "x"

Or is there no worry and its all purely master seal promotion?
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Old 2013-02-08, 03:19   Link #210
Laith
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There's no autopromotion, not even for Crom.
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Old 2013-02-08, 13:40   Link #211
willx
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Old 2013-02-08, 14:07   Link #212
Iron Maw
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GDB View Post
It was like this in the Japanese. Just for the record, this is par for the course. Previous FE games in the US with Easy/Normal/Hard were actually renamed from Normal/Hard/Insane.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadow5YA
Pretty sure it was like that in the Japanese version as well.
Whelp:


Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadow5YA View Post
The problem is that even a single stat point can be the difference between not doubling and doubling an enemy. If promoted classes carry over (which have huge stat gains by design), you're already blowing through several early chapters because of the advantage. The same issue follows with skills: some of them provide very powerful advantages, like Adept allowing for double attacks, which can easily turn the tide of the game.
Why that is certainly true to some extent, it's still comes down to proper balancing though. Most enemies in FE hard modes traditionally huge stats and are normally 2-3 levels above your characters. With heavily reduced stats, the level gains aren't going to have a real effect until later, especially since enemy level and class won't be static. Not to mention A.I could possibly have access to forged equipment like do here in Awakening. Skills shouldn't much of an issue either since the opposition will able to use them as well as have enemy only abilities like in Lunartic mode. It may take some work, but I don't see it as an impossibility. It just seems like NG+ wouldn't be a bad idea with games adjustable difficulty like FE IMO.

Quote:
The entire point of NG+ bonuses in RPGs is to give you advantages that allow your party to blow through the main game content so that you can get to the more powerful, extra/postgame fights more quickly. In a FE game where the the main story is the entire focus of the game and there is no extra NG+ only postgame bosses to be found, there is no point.
Generally, that is normally the case however there are definitely games that use NG+ without or limited postgame content as challenge. Front Mission 5 (another strategy RPG) and Dragon's Dogma for example have NG+, but it's primary for their hard mode. Tactics Ogre (PSP remake) also has NG+ and postgame content (which can done after the first playthrough). But interesting enough it's challenge comes more from the former than the later.

EDIT:

@willx: awesome!
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Old 2013-02-08, 14:20   Link #213
Simonsy
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Quick question. Most of my guys are starting to get to lvl 20, so...

Do you guys suggest using Master Seal and leveling to lvl 20 first or using second seal now and getting other classes skills.

I'm asking cause I assume if I use second seal that I will be considered a low level and thus level very quickly and then can get the skills that go with that class quickly as well as gain stats quickly. Then second seal again and go back to what I was originally going ot master class.

Or will the leveling be the same as if I master class and I should just master class cause those skills are much better than a non-promoted skills?

For example. Chrom is lvl 20. Should I second class him to say cavalier and get its two skills, then reclass to Lord and then finally great lord. Or whatever other combination I think of. Or should I make him Great Lord first then reclass to say Cavalier and back to Lord and finally great lord again. Again whatever combination, doesn't matter, just using example.


I'm just thinking if I second seal right now, I will have same stats yet the game thinks I'm level 1. So killing the currrent enemies will net me huge xp and level up super fast and thus stats improve faster as well as access to new skills quicker. Or is that now how it works. Will I level the same as if i used master seal?
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Old 2013-02-08, 15:12   Link #214
GDB
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I believe the formula for Second Sealing is:

ilevel = ilevel + (roundup(Current_Level x 50%)

Your ilevel determines how much experience you gain per hit/kill. A promoted unit is considered level 20 + shown level (so a level 4 Paladin, for example, is equivalent to level 24). There's a cap on the ilevel that's based on your mode, though I don't recall what they are off hand. I think Lunatic is 70 or 90, Hard is 50 or 70, and Normal is 30 or 50. Something like that. You can keep leveling, but the ilevel won't increase, so you won't get less exp per kill.
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Old 2013-02-08, 17:22   Link #215
Shadow5YA
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Originally Posted by Iron Maw View Post
Whelp:
Tactics Ogre (PSP remake) also has NG+ and postgame content (which can done after the first playthrough). But interesting enough it's challenge comes more from the former than the later.
Huh? I can't speak for the other games since I haven't played them, but Tactics Ogre's sidequests and postgame content is definitely more massive and more challenging than the main game. Enemies in story battles have fixed levels and don't scale with your party's level until after you beat the game and obtain The World tarot. Then there's the massive Palace of the Dead with over 100 floors, San Bronsa Ruins, playing through other story routes, beating all four chapters of CODA which requires playing through multiple routes (Law and Chaos at least), and gearing yourself to beat all of that, which includes grinding skill EXP to have the weapon mastery AND the Imbue element skill maxed.
In the main game, all you need is... some decently leveled units.

Like I said, the Fire Emblem series is built on using strategy with limited resources. It's hard to imagine how they could balance the enemies to keep up with your increase in stats except to raise their level as well to match yours... and if that's the case, why not just make the main game longer?
In fact, that's exactly what they did. In Radiant Dawn and this game, they added 2nd tier promotions for a higher level cap so the main game would be longer.
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Old 2013-02-08, 18:26   Link #216
Hiroi Sekai
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Ended up DL'ing it because our GameStop said they weren't expecting any more until past the 20th. That, and I had a gift card that I could use on Ni no Kuni with this result.

Either way, this game is so damned great. I love how they left all of the staple priniciples intact, so I don't have to learn a new weapon/magic triangle and stuff like that. I love the game feel of it all. Probably gonna go back to play the GBA versions after this, now that I'm in the mood.
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Old 2013-02-08, 18:45   Link #217
Iron Maw
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Originally Posted by Shadow5YA View Post
Huh? I can't speak for the other games since I haven't played them, but Tactics Ogre's sidequests and postgame content is definitely more massive and more challenging than the main game. Enemies in story battles have fixed levels and don't scale with your party's level until after you beat the game and obtain The World tarot. Then there's the massive Palace of the Dead with over 100 floors, San Bronsa Ruins, playing through other story routes, beating all four chapters of CODA which requires playing through multiple routes (Law and Chaos at least), and gearing yourself to beat all of that, which includes grinding skill EXP to have the weapon mastery AND the Imbue element skill maxed.
In the main game, all you need is... some decently leveled units.
PotD and Pirate's Graveyard were more tedious than difficult to me. I had beaten both them around Lv 30-35 and only had problems when I was trying to grab loot. I found the main game a little harder (NG+) due to the various conditions (like trying to save Cerya on Neutral ) and most of the enemies coming with upgraded equipment and skills. This is compounded by the fact that you're often ambushed or separated from your party in quite a few battles there. Postgame really just had some guys with slightly higher stats and the fights were not much different than random encounters. I do agree episodes 2 (the last battle of PotD) and 4 of CODA along with the San Bronsa Ruin were pretty tough.

Quote:
Like I said, the Fire Emblem series is built on using strategy with limited resources. It's hard to imagine how they could balance the enemies to keep up with your increase in stats except to raise their level as well to match yours... and if that's the case, why not just make the main game longer?
In fact, that's exactly what they did. In Radiant Dawn and this game, they added 2nd tier promotions for a higher level cap so the main game would be longer.
I don't disagree with you, but I would just not like all the effort put into one playthrough to completely disappear. That has always been the main thing I liked about NG+. It's not huge deal eitherway.

Last edited by Iron Maw; 2013-02-09 at 00:44.
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Old 2013-02-08, 18:46   Link #218
GDB
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It's hard to get through Normal on older games for me now. I tried doing FE7 a few weeks back to get ready for this, and I figured, hey, I'll do Hector Mode and unlock Hector Hard Mode. Got to like, chapter 20, and got bored. Wrecked everything in my path with too much ease.

As far as NG+ goes, you get DLC. Use said DLC as such. Otherwise, you get Renown. Use that to buy stuff early in new game.
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Old 2013-02-08, 18:49   Link #219
Iron Maw
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To be fair you're playing Hector.

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Originally Posted by GDB View Post

As far as NG+ goes, you get DLC. Use said DLC as such. Otherwise, you get Renown. Use that to buy stuff early in new game.
Yeah, the DLC sounds pretty great for skill mixing (repeatable maps FTW).

Last edited by Iron Maw; 2013-02-08 at 19:00.
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Old 2013-02-08, 18:58   Link #220
GDB
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Hector was actually my lowest level main fighter. Eliwood, Lyn, Guy, Raven, Florina, and even Matthew were all just hulk smashing everything.
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