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Old 2013-02-21, 21:35   Link #7281
Sansker
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Just like Fate, who has more screen time, and that doesn't stop others from saying bad things about her. Besides I don't mean that about Cinque. We just take her parts and ask Jail to make a new one.

Just kidding. On a serious note she might do what you say and blow Cypha's devider in a badass moment. I mean just not because she might get hurt is not the way to go for me.
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Old 2013-02-21, 21:36   Link #7282
Justin_Brett
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The swords probably regenerate too.
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Old 2013-02-21, 21:37   Link #7283
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Originally Posted by Nanya01 View Post
... Who are you?! What did you do with Aki, you imposter?!
lol see? You have a reputation (infamy XD) now XD
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Old 2013-02-21, 21:38   Link #7284
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Actually, the fact that the cyborgs haven't been more up front and in combat in this entire story, is actually one of the few valid criticisms that can be leveled at Force. Sure, test new equipment... but have cyborgs standing by.
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Old 2013-02-21, 21:43   Link #7285
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I was kinda glad that Subaru finally got her lumps in the most recent chapter, to be honest. No fair lumping that all on Erio.
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Old 2013-02-21, 21:45   Link #7286
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Valid criticisms is beyond that Kaijo but is another point we can take in to consideration. So far our heroes have proof their weapons to be useless and they decisions questionable enough to make me wonder if they are not doing this on purpose. Sending their best agents away for no reason, testing their combat drones without their best instructor, going in to combat and moving the Raptors with a truck instead of just using teleportation magic… maybe is a strategy to make the enemy feel it has the upper hand here.

Who knows. As a matter of fact I think this: we saw Dividers and Devices break in the past and here. How its determinate which one can be repair in seconds? I mean I just think this after Justin_Brett mention Cypha’s blade might regenerate. Bardiche seems to be able to self repair itself from being almost totally trash to well be back on top and yet Laevatein was trash in one hit. We see Subaru breaking Divider’s blades with one hand and yet later we see them fine and I don’t think the staff in SD6 could repair Thoma’s Divider… so what is with that?
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Old 2013-02-21, 22:02   Link #7287
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If their new prototype weapons worked perfectly from the get-go and allowed them roflstomp their anti-magic foes, you would probably be complaining that it was too convenient and easy.

New equipment has bugs and isn't perfect: News at Eleven.
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Old 2013-02-21, 22:06   Link #7288
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Probably but we might never know because we don’t see that, right? Besides in the past they did use the “dangerous equipment” and went down really well. The Cartridge system was suppose to be dangerous and yet Nanoha and Fate use it with such efficiency that I wonder: “Why this wasn’t a standard equipment already?” So it totally in tone with that idea. Just because the opposite will be wrong means this is right. In fact the whole AEC thing is wrong to me. All that time making the devices look different and even sort of minor characters to be now change for generic mass produced weapons.
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Old 2013-02-21, 22:07   Link #7289
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So you'd rather the AEC weapons work perfectly like the Cartridge system did?
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Old 2013-02-21, 22:11   Link #7290
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I prefer not AEC weapons at all really but yes, they working better or at least not breaking every single scene they are use against an enemy. To this point the things look so inefficient that is almost funny see how they insist on using them. Besides I make a mistake only some equipment fails while others work just fine like Signum’s did. Work even better than the others. Consistency? What’s that?
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Old 2013-02-21, 22:23   Link #7291
Akiyoshi
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Okay we coul handwave Signum's unit working slightly better due to the time that has passed since their first confrontations with the Huckebein family (aroun two-three months IIRC) ...so the guys at the R&D department had time to work on better upgrades to make the AEC-toys to be a bit more resilient, the Gladiator shield seems to be made of a speciall alloy designed to counter divider blades ...unfortunately those weren't ready for Cypha's kryptonian strenght xDU

Personally i dislike the AEC-units for being too weird-looking, too techy and being mass produced ...painting those in different colors to reflect "personality" reminds me of a corporative employee bringing posters, stamps and figurines to it's work station in a pitiful attempt to affirm his individuality xDU
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Old 2013-02-21, 22:28   Link #7292
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Yes but if Signum's weapon was indeed upgrade why the rest weren't? They are all in the stage of develop so they need constant checks and repairs. Besides just Nanoha's has been completely trash at least once.
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Old 2013-02-21, 22:36   Link #7293
Akiyoshi
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Yeah but that happened back when she used it for the first time in real combat ...agianst Terminator Mode Tohma no less ..so she got trounced for her torubles xDU

The technicians had all the data from those fights to improve the equipements so the Gladiator and the Oxtongue seems to be benefitted from those changes. Caro's set of Frotress shields were sliced like paper by Quinn, tough. So yeah, a bit of inconsistency there xDU
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Old 2013-02-21, 22:37   Link #7294
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Because they are still working out the kinks. Let me tell ya, the F-22 Raptors that the US is working on? 20 years in the making... and they still have issues. One of the latest ones, that they have been trying to identify and fix for awhile now, is the air support system. Several pilots have died or nearly been asphyxiated when their air circulation system failed. So, the issues with the AEC units doesn't surprise me at all.

Also, we're dealing with a wide variety of powers with the Eclipse people. It's impossible to calibrate the weapons for things they hadn't encountered before. Sure, you might be able to adjust it to work better against Cypha, but then along comes Quinn with different swords and a different power, and now you have issues again.
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Old 2013-02-21, 22:39   Link #7295
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Yes but if Signum's weapon was indeed upgrade why the rest weren't? They are all in the stage of develop so they need constant checks and repairs. Besides just Nanoha's has been completely trash at least once.
Checks and repairs =/= upgrades.

To upgrade something, you have to take it apart, installs the new stuff in. Then you would have to work out all the kinks and errors. So 2-3 months won't mean much.
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Old 2013-02-21, 22:48   Link #7296
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But Thoma did analyze Quinn’s attack and compare them to Cypha’s so their nature is similar. Besides real world logic is irrelevant when technology is like 1,000 years ahead in the future Kaijo. Here we can’t make space ships that go in to space or between dimensions for that matter so it really doesn’t matter how much time we take with our weapons to deduce how much the people in Nanoha will take. Is a base but not a factor that determinates everything. So really this usefulness does surprise me.

Fact remains Quinn was able to cut down the material the AEC weapons were made of and not Cypha’s skin which later was cut by another AEC weapon. Again they reinforce the devices to endure the extra powers of the cartridge systems in A’s, and Subaru’s killer mode in StrikerS in days, not months. After their first fight with the Hückebein they sure work on upgrades but then again we have the same problem: why Signum’s is more effective?
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Old 2013-02-21, 23:03   Link #7297
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sansker View Post
But Thoma did analyze Quinn’s attack and compare them to Cypha’s so their nature is similar.
You are presuming Thoma analyzed correctly and didn't miss anything.

Quote:
Besides real world logic is irrelevant when technology is like 1,000 years ahead in the future Kaijo. Here we can’t make space ships that go in to space or between dimensions for that matter so it really doesn’t matter how much time we take with our weapons to deduce how much the people in Nanoha will take. Is a base but not a factor that determinates everything. So really this usefulness does surprise me.
Fact remains that we have a reasonable explanation grounded in reality. Tsuzuki loves his military and has copied many things from reality already. This would be just one more thing.

Quote:
Again they reinforce the devices to endure the extra powers of the cartridge systems in A’s,
Actually, they didn't reinforce the devices. Amy actually warned them not to use their higher modes since there was a danger to the device. At least, until after they got reinforced. Which didn't happen in time for the last battle.

Quote:
and Subaru’s killer mode in StrikerS in days, not months.
That was standard upgrades based on Subaru's known capabilities. Not something completely new.

Quote:
After their first fight with the Hückebein they sure work on upgrades but then again we have the same problem: why Signum’s is more effective?
Random chance. Statistically speaking, it had to happen eventually. Weren't you the one complaining about how the AEC devices all seemed useless, and now that one has proven to stand up to combat... you're complaining again?
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Old 2013-02-21, 23:14   Link #7298
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You are presuming Thoma analyzed correctly and didn't miss anything.
So when they say is like this it could not be because they are wrong... interesting. In any case Cypha did confirm that result so there is that. And if we go by the "The character could be wrong" then what can we really know?

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Fact remains that we have a reasonable explanation grounded in reality. Tsuzuki loves his military and has copied many things from reality already. This would be just one more thing.
No. This is not reality. Kids don't join military forces in reality. So we can't limit our judgment to that because this is fiction. And they already show creating things in seconds in fiction.


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Actually, they didn't reinforce the devices. Amy actually warned them not to use their higher modes since there was a danger to the device. At least, until after they got reinforced. Which didn't happen in time for the last battle.
I believe they did reinforcement for the last battle in A's but I could be wrong. In any case the devices work just fine back then. I will admit I don’t know here.


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That was standard upgrades based on Subaru's known capabilities. Not something completely new.
Still accomplish in a very short amount of time. Remember the plain you mention: 20 years and still not working well.


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Random chance. Statistically speaking, it had to happen eventually. Weren't you the one complaining about how the AEC devices all seemed useless, and now that one has proven to stand up to combat... you're complaining again?
So, you have no idea why that happen as well. You see I am saying that if the equipment is trash, is trash and is if going to work then make it work. When it goes each ways then the plot needed to go I am starting to wonder.
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Old 2013-02-21, 23:18   Link #7299
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No. This is not reality. Kids don't join military forces in reality. So we can't limit our judgment to that because this is fiction. And they already show creating things in seconds in fiction.
Kids join military forces all the time.
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Old 2013-02-21, 23:21   Link #7300
Lhklan
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So when they say is like this it could not be because they are wrong... interesting. In any case Cypha did confirm that result so there is that. And if we go by the "The character could be wrong" then what can we really know?
How about the character not knowing? There are shows out there that depict the hero's analysis being wrong you know. Keeping the readers in the dark is also a good way to keep them reading.

Quote:
No. This is not reality. Kids don't join military forces in reality. So we can't limit our judgment to that because this is fiction. And they already show creating things in seconds in fiction.
Again, it had to be belieavable. Also, those things created in fiction? Either by magic - which is usually something they already know and there are certain conditions to creating things - or the character is a goddamn genius - which would still be mood if they don't have the materials.

Also, kid not joining military forces in reality? Child soldiers in Aficia would like to say hi with their AK. (Note: YOu said "Military Forces", not "Official Military forces")

Quote:
Still accomplish in a very short amount of time. Remember the plain you mention: 20 years and still not working well.
I though she already had that, they just fine tuned it more?

Quote:
So, you have no idea why that happen as well. You see I am saying that if the equipment is trash, is trash and is if going to work then make it work. When it goes each ways then the plot needed to go I am starting to wonder.
... Just because an equipment is destroyed doesn't mean it's trash. ESPECIALLY if it's still in the prototype zone - like Signum's. There's tons of things that can be learn from a trashed equipments - sometime even more than a working one.
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