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Old 2013-03-06, 16:06   Link #3161
Flere821
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcus H. View Post
I disagree. There should be a better way for Kinji to get decent foes than to give everyone powers. Someone who was able to amass mercenaries or do anything with money or someone who has trained so well in martial arts that Kinji's bullets are swiftly evaded would be decent foes for Kinji.
You mean, like what's happening in the latest volume of HnA with the Hong Kong Triad? (In all seriousness though, it took them quite a while to get to that strategy >.<)
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Old 2013-03-06, 19:46   Link #3162
Marcus H.
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Well at least they got to the Triad. But face it, it's already too late for that. The plot's gone to shit.
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Old 2013-03-06, 21:36   Link #3163
ArchmageXin
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I personally find HnA's setting to be a terrifying world. I don't think there ever was an anime/manga/Light novel that scared me more.
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Old 2013-03-06, 21:57   Link #3164
Endscape
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Originally Posted by ArchmageXin View Post
I personally find HnA's setting to be a terrifying world. I don't think there ever was an anime/manga/Light novel that scared me more.
Seriously? That sounds like quite the exaggeration. Now, Kore wa Zombie Desu Ka, that's a scary world.
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Old 2013-03-07, 00:22   Link #3165
ArchmageXin
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Originally Posted by Endscape View Post
Seriously? That sounds like quite the exaggeration. Now, Kore wa Zombie Desu Ka, that's a scary world.
Let me see here...

Crime is so high children (JR high school kids and up) are drafted as armed Mercs. In U.S they can't even drive a car yet

Armed Mercs, since is for $$$, it imply anyone can buy them (See: Bad guys)

Firearm law is amazing liberal. Aria can fire them IN SCHOOL with no repercussions. You pull that stunt in ANY police/security force in the the current world you would be arrested, or at least get some hard time.

Plea bargain = Get out of jail free card. Underage criminals go off free

Criminals are not prosecuted for major crimes LIKE BOMBING AIRLINES, but innocent woman get tossed in jail for 900 years, even after 200-400 years are proven to be done by others, no "alternative" investigation are made. One can't but help to think if the butei and courts are so lazy to investigate they just figure screw some woman over and make her daughter risk her life to catch a ton of violent criminals.

Oh yea, the criminals who did this? They go to SCHOOL and enjoy a taxpayer paid education.

Where are the police? Does this mean justice is now "for hire" only? What happen if someone get murdered and no one pay for an investigation?

And the list go on. Like I said, the only society with this recipe in other media are usually corporation-dominate all types (See video game: Syndicate, Deux Ex, etc)
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Old 2013-03-07, 01:08   Link #3166
Endscape
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArchmageXin View Post
Let me see here...

Crime is so high children (JR high school kids and up) are drafted as armed Mercs. In U.S they can't even drive a car yet
You have a point here, though most teenage Butei don't handle serious crime. Our protagonists are exceptions.

Quote:
Armed Mercs, since is for $$$, it imply anyone can buy them (See: Bad guys)
Butei aren't allowed to commit crimes, if they do, they get three times the punishment of normal people.

Plus, calling them mercenaries is a bit misleading. They're more like private investigators, bounty hunters, private security, etc given police powers and connected to the government.

Quote:
Firearm law is amazing liberal. Aria can fire them IN SCHOOL with no repercussions. You pull that stunt in ANY police/security force in the the current world you would be arrested, or at least get some hard time.
Eh, that's typical romcom slapstick comedy.

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Plea bargain = Get out of jail free card. Underage criminals go off free
First, Riko and Jeanne are underaged, so they probably got some consideration for that. Riko at least never killed anyone, though I don't know about Jeanne. Second, they were giving info on an extremely dangerous terrorist organiztion. In real life, countries have been known to release real terrorists in exchange for prisoners, so it's not that odd.

Quote:
Criminals are not prosecuted for major crimes LIKE BOMBING AIRLINES,
See above.

Quote:
but innocent woman get tossed in jail for 900 years, even after 200-400 years are proven to be done by others, no "alternative" investigation are made. One can't but help to think if the butei and courts are so lazy to investigate they just figure screw some woman over and make her daughter risk her life to catch a ton of violent criminals.
You do realize that the organization that framed her is so top secret that telling people about it is a crime? Not much normal police can do about that.

Quote:
oh yea, the criminals who did this? They go to SCHOOL and enjoy a taxpayer paid education.
See my earlier point.

Quote:
Where are the police? Does this mean justice is now "for hire" only? What happen if someone get murdered and no one pay for an investigation?
Police still exist, we just don't see them much since our protag has little to do with them.
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Old 2013-03-07, 04:26   Link #3167
whitecloud
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hooray for vol 10.... thanks for all the translator...its almost finished...but just one thing that bothering me...where is ch3? the rest is near done...
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Old 2013-03-07, 08:33   Link #3168
tsunade666
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Chapter 3 has a different registered translator.
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Old 2013-03-07, 11:47   Link #3169
ArchmageXin
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Quote:
You have a point here, though most teenage Butei don't handle serious crime. Our protagonists are exceptions.
Depend on what you define as "serious" I think any crime you need a gun to stop constitute "serious". Especially in Japan with a conservative weapon code.

Quote:
Butei aren't allowed to commit crimes, if they do, they get three times the punishment of normal people.
Like that matter with a clearly loose code of crime punishment. Like I don't know, BOMB an Air Plane? And at least three near murders if not outright murders? (Remember Riko gunned down at least a bus driver and airline pilots)


Quote:
Plus, calling them mercenaries is a bit misleading. They're more like private investigators, bounty hunters, private security, etc given police powers and connected to the government.
Which has a host of problems to its own from an law enforcement point of view. Again, it come back to "what the heck the world is going when 14 years old girls are sent against the Triad/Mafia" <---See Aria back story.

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Eh, that's typical romcom slapstick comedy.
I think it can be done better than reckless gunfire. But then, this isn't a world that make sense.

Quote:
First, Riko and Jeanne are underaged, so they probably got some consideration for that. Riko at least never killed anyone, though I don't know about Jeanne. Second, they were giving info on an extremely dangerous terrorist organiztion. In real life, countries have been known to release real terrorists in exchange for prisoners, so it's not that odd.

Also, Riko claim she never killed anyone, but as I point out above, she put a lot of people's live in danger, including mortally wounding a bus driver with drive by machine gun fire.

In real life, mobsters like that would been thrown into jail, and PLEA bargain doesn't work this way. It is meant for the state to save money on a really difficult case/lack of evidence, it is usually an reduction of sentence, not complete cart-blanche to walk away, and Riko's crimes are way to high for any law enforcement to let her WALK and go to class.

What you are thinking of is "Granting immunity", again, whatever Riko/Jeanne could provide didn't offer enough even let Aria's Mom to get out. It is dubious at best.

Quote:
You do realize that the organization that framed her is so top secret that telling people about it is a crime? Not much normal police can do about that.
The same organization that got taken apart in like...a book later? And a secret organization that don't even appear to work together, the police must be down right stupid. It would had been more plausible if I-U was actually bribing the law enforcement rather than "we are so powerful the police afraid of us."

Quote:
Police still exist, we just don't see them much since our protag has little to do with them.
Clearly police exist enough that we don't need high school gunmen...oh wait.
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Old 2013-03-07, 13:47   Link #3170
Endscape
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Originally Posted by ArchmageXin View Post
Depend on what you define as "serious" I think any crime you need a gun to stop constitute "serious". Especially in Japan with a conservative weapon code.
You have a bit of a point with teenagers being allowed to carry guns, but most teenage Butei don't really deal with crime.

Quote:
Like that matter with a clearly loose code of crime punishment. Like I don't know, BOMB an Air Plane? And at least three near murders if not outright murders? (Remember Riko gunned down at least a bus driver and airline pilots)
Riko's not a good example since she turned state's evidence. Really getting three times the punishment is a good deterrent.

Quote:
Which has a host of problems to its own from an law enforcement point of view. Again, it come back to "what the heck the world is going when 14 years old girls are sent against the Triad/Mafia" <---See Aria back story.
You're right in that it has a lot of issues, but then again most of those careers I mentioned get basically no government oversight depending on the country. And as I said, Aria isn't a good example.

Quote:
I think it can be done better than reckless gunfire. But then, this isn't a world that make sense
I've seen worse done in other series, so it doesn't really bother me that much.

Quote:
Also, Riko claim she never killed anyone, but as I point out above, she put a lot of people's live in danger, including mortally wounding a bus driver with drive by machine gun fire.

In real life, mobsters like that would been thrown into jail, and PLEA bargain doesn't work this way. It is meant for the state to save money on a really difficult case/lack of evidence, it is usually an reduction of sentence, not complete cart-blanche to walk away, and Riko's crimes are way to high for any law enforcement to let her WALK and go to class.
First, comparing them to mobsters is a bad comparison, they're more like terrorists. Second, terrorists have been freed in RL, 280 of them to free 1 captured soldier. I don't think letting 2 juvenile terrorists go for info on a dangerous terrorist group is so outrageous.

Quote:
What you are thinking of is "Granting immunity", again, whatever Riko/Jeanne could provide didn't offer enough even let Aria's Mom to get out. It is dubious at best.
They didn't let them out just for Aria's mom, that was a part of it, but they really let them go for info on I.U.

Quote:
The same organization that got taken apart in like...a book later? And a secret organization that don't even appear to work together, the police must be down right stupid. It would had been more plausible if I-U was actually bribing the law enforcement rather than "we are so powerful the police afraid of us."
You didn't address my point at all. How do you expect the police to deal with an organization they most likely don't know exists? In fact, I.U. isn't even based in Japan, so they couldn't do much anyway. Besides, I.U. on.y got taken down so easily because that was Sherlock's plan.

Quote:
Clearly police exist enough that we don't need high school gunmen...oh wait.
Jokes aside, the existence of the police has been mentioned in universe, so they do exist.
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Last edited by Endscape; 2013-03-07 at 14:16.
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Old 2013-03-10, 13:07   Link #3171
ArchmageXin
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Quote:
but most teenage Butei don't really deal with crime.
So what do they do for a living that need to have guns? (Note: This is Japan we are talking about, where gun laws are a lot more tight than USA that must murders use bats) Issuing firearms to freshmen tell you something about law order at that point.

So Riko, Aria, etc are all bad examples. But then, the author present them up front shows what a Butei might be up against.

Quote:
First, comparing them to mobsters is a bad comparison, they're more like terrorists. Second, terrorists have been freed in RL, 280 of them to free 1 captured soldier. I don't think letting 2 juvenile terrorists go for info on a dangerous terrorist group is so outrageous.
Actually, Terrorism doesn't work that way, they usually suffer even worse than mobsters since terrorists are a lot more dangerous than the Mob. (See U.S.A Drone strike on Al Queda), the stuff Riko do would qualify direct SWAT team attack with "alive is good, dead no one getting charged" AKA Bin Laden treatment.

The 280 terrorist for 1 is a special case. With national attention (In Israel) and thousands of politics between several nations. Riko is allowed to walk back into class with no repercussion, no discussion, no media attention. There is a HUGE difference.
Quote:
You didn't address my point at all. How do you expect the police to deal with an organization they most likely don't know exists? In fact, I.U. isn't even based in Japan, so they couldn't do much anyway. Besides, I.U. on.y got taken down so easily because that was Sherlock's plan.
If the IU is so powerful, yet it has the time to frame some random girl's Mom for 900 years, and its #2 and #5 and #6 were easily dispatched...there was no minions, no henchmen, no organization. It make me think the police does not know IU's existence is because they probably isn't powerful enough to be even acknowledged. Kind of like the police isn't likely going to bug the local dungons and dragons club...

I think we can agree to disagree, but compared to other series I read, I am really surprised Hidan lasted to V 13...
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Old 2013-03-11, 19:23   Link #3172
Endscape
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Originally Posted by ArchmageXin View Post
So what do they do for a living that need to have guns? (Note: This is Japan we are talking about, where gun laws are a lot more tight than USA that must murders use bats) Issuing firearms to freshmen tell you something about law order at that point.
They do some stuff, but as I said, the average Butei student doesn't handle dangerous crimes.

Quote:
So Riko, Aria, etc are all bad examples. But then, the author present them up front shows what a Butei might be up against.
Actually, no it doesn't. That's like reading One Piece and thinking that what the Strawhats do is typical of pirates, even in that universe.

Quote:
Actually, Terrorism doesn't work that way, they usually suffer even worse than mobsters since terrorists are a lot more dangerous than the Mob. (See U.S.A Drone strike on Al Queda), the stuff Riko do would qualify direct SWAT team attack with "alive is good, dead no one getting charged" AKA Bin Laden treatment.
I know how terrorism works, you were the one that compared them to mobsters, and I corrected you.

Quote:
The 280 terrorist for 1 is a special case. With national attention (In Israel) and thousands of politics between several nations. Riko is allowed to walk back into class with no repercussion, no discussion, no media attention. There is a HUGE difference.
I know that that was a special case, the point was that, due to the circumstances, they let those guys go, so letting terrorists go isn't entirely out of the realm of possibility. Riko is a minor, and the law usually gives consideration to minors, not to mention her circumstances. Plus, as I already said, she gave them info on IU, a terrorist organization with nuclear missiles, and she didn't kill anyone. I don't think it that odd.

Quote:
If the IU is so powerful, yet it has the time to frame some random girl's Mom for 900 years, and its #2 and #5 and #6 were easily dispatched...there was no minions, no henchmen, no organization. It make me think the police does not know IU's existence is because they probably isn't powerful enough to be even acknowledged. Kind of like the police isn't likely going to bug the local dungons and dragons club...
Perhaps you should reread the series, if you're going to make comments on it. Aria is hardly a random girl, and her Mom getting framed is part of Sherlock's plan. And IU does have some sort of organization, hell they have nuclear weapons, as I stated earlier. About the police thing, as I stated, IU is a top secret, the police would never hear about it in RL either, plus they are an international terror group, it isn't the police's business anyway.
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Old 2013-03-18, 12:20   Link #3173
hoshino_crimsonwings
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Need this question answered before I buy the 11th volume (One after Kaname was introduced); does Kaname get killed? I need to know this. Hope someone can answer me.
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Old 2013-03-18, 15:59   Link #3174
Flere821
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Need this question answered before I buy the 11th volume (One after Kaname was introduced); does Kaname get killed? I need to know this. Hope someone can answer me.
Spoiler for Kaname:
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Old 2013-03-18, 17:13   Link #3175
hoshino_crimsonwings
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Thank you for the timely response!
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Old 2013-03-19, 19:35   Link #3176
nhormight
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from now what is relationship between Kinji and Aria now?
someone can answer me?
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Old 2013-03-20, 01:30   Link #3177
Flere821
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from now what is relationship between Kinji and Aria now?
someone can answer me?
Spoiler for Reationship:
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Old 2013-03-20, 06:32   Link #3178
Endscape
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Originally Posted by Flere821 View Post
Spoiler for Reationship:
Spoiler for relationship:
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Old 2013-03-20, 17:21   Link #3179
Flere821
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Spoiler for relationship:
Arc still in progress.
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Old 2013-03-20, 19:18   Link #3180
tsunade666
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what happen? how did it turn into something like this?
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