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View Poll Results: Psycho-Pass - Episode 21 Rating
Perfect 10 31 57.41%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 13 24.07%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 5 9.26%
7 out of 10 : Good 2 3.70%
6 out of 10 : Average 1 1.85%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 2 3.70%
4 out of 10 : Poor 0 0%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 0 0%
Voters: 54. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2013-03-14, 23:10   Link #41
Roger Rambo
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Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
Tomomi had a truly badass send off. The guy really deserves props for being the only person thus far to actually overwhelm Makishima in hand-to-hand combat. I have to admit I found it amusing for the oldest major character to be able to take down the young, fit, and fast Makishima.
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Old 2013-03-14, 23:20   Link #42
creb
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Such a sappy episode.

I guess I could make fun of old-guy for letting Makishima go, but I'm not that tasteless. I think.

He's still breathing, so I wonder if Gen is really going for a (relatively) happy ending shot of all of them, beat and battered-but alive, emerging from that complex, with Makashima neutralized, alive, but oopsie, suffering major brain damage; Kogami prevented from killing Makashima, and paralyzed by Aki (which is obviously her intent with the deal she made concerning her Dominator); and the Sybil system forced to allow Kogami to live, while gnashing its teeth at being unable to integrate Makashima into its mesh. End Scene, fans gnashing their teeth over how the big questions concerning the direction this fictional society should head in were never answered.

Though, if someone was going to die, I can't be the only one that thinks Yuri is actually the prime suspect for that role, can I?

Last edited by creb; 2013-03-14 at 23:32.
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Old 2013-03-14, 23:49   Link #43
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Interesting episode. I feel like not a lot happened, even though Tomomi kicked the bucket. I'm more interested in how they're gonna do this last episode, as I feel there's enough story left for 2. I get the feeling I'm gonna be disappointed.
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Old 2013-03-14, 23:56   Link #44
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Originally Posted by merakses View Post
Tomomi was trying to get a choke hold on Makishima. That's why Maki put his right hand where it was - in order to prevent that choke hold from happening.
That's true. OTOH, the method that he needed to use to keep himself from being choked immobilized one of his hands. Tomomi clearly had the upper hand in this situation.
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Originally Posted by merakses View Post
Of course, Tomomi does seem to weigh at least a good 20 kilograms more than Makishima. He had a slight advantage there.
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Old 2013-03-15, 00:08   Link #45
merakses
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He's still breathing, so I wonder if Gen is really going for a (relatively) happy ending shot of all of them, beat and battered-but alive, emerging from that complex, with Makashima neutralized, alive, but oopsie, suffering major brain damage; Kogami prevented from killing Makashima, and paralyzed by Aki (which is obviously her intent with the deal she made concerning her Dominator); and the Sybil system forced to allow Kogami to live, while gnashing its teeth at being unable to integrate Makashima into its mesh. End Scene, fans gnashing their teeth over how the big questions concerning the direction this fictional society should head in were never answered.
I'm pretty sure he died. Besides, such an ending wouldn't really be in Uro's style.
From the still-alive cast, the ones who carry the ideas set in Psycho Pass are Makishima and Akane. That's why I feel that everyone else has a pretty high chance of getting killed in the last episode.
By the way, how many people think that Makishima will manage to destroy the food supply system and thus complete his goal of bringing down Sybil? Personally, I think this is the ending Uro will choose.
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Old 2013-03-15, 00:54   Link #46
creb
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Originally Posted by merakses View Post
I'm pretty sure he died. Besides, such an ending wouldn't really be in Uro's style.
From the still-alive cast, the ones who carry the ideas set in Psycho Pass are Makishima and Akane. That's why I feel that everyone else has a pretty high chance of getting killed in the last episode.
By the way, how many people think that Makishima will manage to destroy the food supply system and thus complete his goal of bringing down Sybil? Personally, I think this is the ending Uro will choose.
To some extent, the safe money is on Akane "winning". It's just really a matter of to what degree, and considering how little time is left, I'm starting to think it's not going to be a win on the type of scale so much of the arguing back and forth has focused on for the last 20 episodes. At the very least, if he's going big, it'll just be the insinuation that change is in the air, since it's obvious there isn't enough time to really show the actual change occur and its aftermath.

Gen isn't exactly adverse to mostly "happy" endings, despite his reputation.
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Old 2013-03-15, 02:11   Link #47
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I knew it was going to happen eventually, but... Geez, watching that really made me depressed. Poor Ginoza. Masaoka loved him so, so, so much more than he realized (or was willing to acknowledge). Like others, even though he was one of the first people I expected to die in this series, that broke my heart.

Akane and/or Shinya, PLEASE wreck Makishima.
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Old 2013-03-15, 04:37   Link #48
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Originally Posted by cyth View Post
I didn't think Makishima's solitude had a meaningful place in the story, but wrong again. Prior to the second half of the show I had a chance to read a manga by Kobayashi Yoshinori unabashedly titled An Individual Without Society is not Human. In it he argues the necessity of the public sphere in one's life and that no matter how much one tries to reject it, our belief that our thoughts and actions carry meaning invalidate that effort.

It seems as if Makishima truly believes he's alone because of Sibyl. He kills people to tell the system, that, yes, he is alone, yet at the same time he is oblivious to the connection he established with MWPSB, so in a way he's actually not alone?
That a old theory a ton of psychologist hold.Thing is they are wrong there are those people who truely want to be alone isolationist who separate themselves from all society.

And to say Maki kills because the system and society reject him is a joke,Sad thing is even in this world he would be a mass murderer. He is one of those sick people who think everyone's life is a joke and they don't see the truth that he does and he finds that as a excuse to mass murder thing is its just a excuse. He really is no different than the joker as I said before just with out the jokes.

http://www.youtube.com/v/_hhQaTgu5AQ


Ill be fucking damned they even have the batman+joker connection. Makishima+Kogami connection. The guy living in madness trying to push the guy who still has value in the world to the edge...is this like a story archetype or something that has older examples ?
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Old 2013-03-15, 05:08   Link #49
Traece
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Originally Posted by Soconfused View Post
Interesting episode. I feel like not a lot happened, even though Tomomi kicked the bucket. I'm more interested in how they're gonna do this last episode, as I feel there's enough story left for 2. I get the feeling I'm gonna be disappointed.
There's not been a lot that's happened in the recent episodes at all, actually. The pacing slowed down quite a bit to serve that "calm before the storm" ending. I have no problem with this, personally. I found myself surprised when the ending of these recent episodes came up because I was just no longer aware of the length of time that passed.
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Originally Posted by creb View Post
To some extent, the safe money is on Akane "winning". It's just really a matter of to what degree, and considering how little time is left, I'm starting to think it's not going to be a win on the type of scale so much of the arguing back and forth has focused on for the last 20 episodes. At the very least, if he's going big, it'll just be the insinuation that change is in the air, since it's obvious there isn't enough time to really show the actual change occur and its aftermath.
Eh, you'd be surprised what can be accomplished in 20 minutes. Psycho-Pass has taken advantage of both slow and fast pacing very effectively, and I've yet to be really bothered by any of it. It seems very likely that Akane will ultimately be the victor, potentially at a cost of Kogami. What is almost certain is that regardless of everything that's happened, the Sybil System plot has been all but abandoned. Yet, I'm OK with this as it'll serve as a fantastically bitter ending. Too many anime have a big conspiratorial reveal and then that becomes the focus, so having this be unchanged in the end is a good way to go.

Also, as sad as it was to see pops die, I have to give the man credit for finally getting his action scene. He kicked Makishima's ass, and I loved every second of it. Though I was a bit confused as to the nature of his robotic arm, as I would expect it to give him a huge advantage in strength. I guess it wasn't designed to act beyond human limitations? Though the most surprising thing of all was the method he used to dispose of the pipe bomb, which was the absolute worst method I can think of. I honestly thought he was going to dive on it.
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Old 2013-03-15, 05:42   Link #50
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There's still one way I could see Sibyl sort of "unraveling" in the last 20-odd minutes of narrative to be told.

And ironically, that's if Sibyl "wins".

Makishima truly loathes Sibyl, I think. Whatever you think of him overall, he's been rather consistent in pointing out flaws in the Sibyl system of Japan, and expressing his general disdain of it. This episode was no exception.

Now, suppose Akane successfully achieves her goals, and brings Makishima back to Sibyl. His brain is forcibly removed, and added into the Sibyl collective. All of Makishima's thoughts, likely totally unrestrained, are now "felt" and "heard" throughout the whole of Sibyl. In the immediate aftermath of being forced into the Sibyl collective, these thoughts are likely to be decidedly negative towards Sibyl, and likely tinged with significant anger.

Sibyl doesn't understand Makishima. Maybe part of that is that they don't understand why he hates Sibyl. But if and when he's added into the Sibyl collective, maybe they'll understand well enough...

Makishima's anti-Sibyl thoughts could unravel Sibyl from the inside, force them to confront troubling truths about their system that they were never really forced to confront before.

You could get a sort of "Does not compute... does not compute... does not compute!" breakdown ending for Sybil.


I don't think this is particularly likely, but I think there's some chance of it. I have to admit that I'd find it a deliciously ironic ending.
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Old 2013-03-15, 05:52   Link #51
cyth
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*snip*
In the clip you pasted, Joker said "all it takes is one bad day to reduce the sanest man alive to lunacy." But we know that Makishima isn't a classical villain with a tragic past. His one quip with the world is that he feels alienated from it. Whether we can attribute this to Sibyl (since he's been given special treatment) is a topic of discussion, but a direct comparison with Joker I just don't see. He's a philosophy otaku driven mad by Sibyl's virtual prison (he thinks he's in).

As for Kobayashi Yoshinori, well, he is an old guy. But for you to better understand his point, let me just link you to the manga. It's only 12 pages long; give it a read!
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Old 2013-03-15, 09:51   Link #52
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I don't really understand where comparisons to the joker are coming from either. That actually seems like a lazy comparison to me because they both deal in chaos but their reasons for that are very different.

I also don't really see Makishima as the complete antithesis to Kougami, the way Joker is to Batman. If anything I think Makishima has a closer connection to Akane (but the series decided not to play that up).
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Old 2013-03-15, 10:24   Link #53
4Tran
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This was a really conventional episode, but it was still pretty good. As usual, Psycho-Pass is best when it sticks to action/tension and stays away from the dialogue.

I'm not sure how they can justify sending only four policemen to potentially keep Japan from falling into ruin. Luckily, the story trys to avoid dwelling on this. It sort of kills any sense of urgency though. And the plant can't be turned off without turning off the security system? Who designed this place - TEPCO?

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Originally Posted by Kanon View Post
Yayoi raised a giant death flag in this ep but it's doubtful she'll die. Her death would have little to no impact on the other characters (this episode marked the first time she interacted with one of her coworkers in a meaningful way, and Akane had too much on her mind to care), so it'd be pretty pointless to kill her. She's probably going to sit in the control room like a good girl while Akane resolves the conflict.
It'd be pretty pointless to do anything with her for that matter. The only way that Yayoi will be allowed to play a significant role in the show is for her to die.

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Originally Posted by Kirarakim View Post
I also don't really see Makishima as the complete antithesis to Kougami, the way Joker is to Batman. If anything I think Makishima has a closer connection to Akane (but the series decided not to play that up).
If the show associated Makishima to Akane, there'd be nothing for Kougami to do!
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Old 2013-03-15, 10:26   Link #54
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I also don't really see Makishima as the complete antithesis to Kougami, the way Joker is to Batman. If anything I think Makishima has a closer connection to Akane (but the series decided not to play that up).
The biggest reason that Kougami isn't Batman, is that Kougami isn't a psychologically traumatized 10 year old boy.

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Sorry; dynamic content not loaded. Reload?

Seriously. Go to 56 seconds. Batman is apologizing to his dead parents grave about how he doesn't want to become a costumed vigilante freak and beat up hoodlums. As if his parents WANTED him to do this. Can you honestly look at this guy and say that he isn't batshit loco? The emotional and intellectual angst that Joker and Batman put into fighting with each-other makes allot more sense when you realize they're both insane.


Kougami's feelings towards Makishima are positively normal by comparison. Kougami attributes the death of his partner and other innocent people to Makishima. And because of that, Makishima is going to become a hunting dog and tear Makishima's throat out. It's ultimately why Makishima can't psychologically trip up Kougami the same way Joker can Batman. Batman is a traumatized little boy playing dress-up, and Kougami is a hunting dog.



It's actually one reason why I'm a bit surprised they didn't decide to play up the Makishima/Akane setup more. Ultimately, Akane was the one who was philosophically inclined to dwell over and make a counter point to the things Makishima said. Kougami simply wants to kill him.
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Old 2013-03-15, 13:35   Link #55
Dengar
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Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
There's still one way I could see Sibyl sort of "unraveling" in the last 20-odd minutes of narrative to be told.

And ironically, that's if Sibyl "wins".

Makishima truly loathes Sibyl, I think. Whatever you think of him overall, he's been rather consistent in pointing out flaws in the Sibyl system of Japan, and expressing his general disdain of it. This episode was no exception.

Now, suppose Akane successfully achieves her goals, and brings Makishima back to Sibyl. His brain is forcibly removed, and added into the Sibyl collective. All of Makishima's thoughts, likely totally unrestrained, are now "felt" and "heard" throughout the whole of Sibyl. In the immediate aftermath of being forced into the Sibyl collective, these thoughts are likely to be decidedly negative towards Sibyl, and likely tinged with significant anger.

Sibyl doesn't understand Makishima. Maybe part of that is that they don't understand why he hates Sibyl. But if and when he's added into the Sibyl collective, maybe they'll understand well enough...

Makishima's anti-Sibyl thoughts could unravel Sibyl from the inside, force them to confront troubling truths about their system that they were never really forced to confront before.

You could get a sort of "Does not compute... does not compute... does not compute!" breakdown ending for Sybil.


I don't think this is particularly likely, but I think there's some chance of it. I have to admit that I'd find it a deliciously ironic ending.
The Sibyl system is not a computer. Think of it as a large council of people who will keep debating an issue until a consensus is reached. Except operating at the speed of thought. Which is pretty damn fast.

If Makishima is added to the mix, it could add a voice that understands the human need for freedom, which would change the way Sibyl operates ever so slightly.


Previous additions probably changed the 'system' in a similar manner.
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Old 2013-03-15, 13:45   Link #56
Traece
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I'm not sure how they can justify sending only four policemen to potentially keep Japan from falling into ruin. Luckily, the story trys to avoid dwelling on this. It sort of kills any sense of urgency though. And the plant can't be turned off without turning off the security system? Who designed this place - TEPCO?
It's been said numerous times throughout the show that MWPSB staff is tiny. There are a couple other divisions, but still just a few. Additionally, Division 1 is the only division that has been given the classified information they're working with right now. Honestly, despite the threat being faced a single division is really all that's needed. Plus, if they sent more people they would just die.
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Old 2013-03-15, 14:31   Link #57
ookamigirl
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Akane and others arrived at the facility.
Makishima was immersed into his plan there.
Kogami wants him dead, but Akane just wants to beat him to the punch.
It would be better for Kogami if Akane got to Makishima first.
Now we have yet another casualty of the hunt for Makishima..
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Old 2013-03-15, 15:12   Link #58
4Tran
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It's been said numerous times throughout the show that MWPSB staff is tiny. There are a couple other divisions, but still just a few. Additionally, Division 1 is the only division that has been given the classified information they're working with right now. Honestly, despite the threat being faced a single division is really all that's needed. Plus, if they sent more people they would just die.
My point is that it's hard to sell the "threat that threatens Japan threateningly", when the authorities feel that sending fewer personnel than there are starters on a basketball team is unnecessary. Whether it's absurd to do so is an issue of lesser importance.
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Old 2013-03-15, 17:17   Link #59
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1) You want to send an entire army just to catch one guy?
2) Those guys are the entire first division.
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Old 2013-03-15, 17:38   Link #60
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I find it ironic that in an episode where Makishima acts more like The Joker than ever before, people are now attacking the Makishima/Joker comparison (one that I myself have made before on Psycho-Pass threads).

There's plenty of good reasons for the Makishima/Joker comparison, so I don't consider it a "lazy" comparison.

1) Both are "Chaotic Evil", or at least lean heavily towards that.

2) Both are highly intelligent, and very resourceful.

3) Both clearly take pleasure in killing their targets. They're not clinical and "This must be done for the greater cause" about it. They enjoy it.

4) Makishima delights in dueling Kougami in much the same way that The Joker delights in dueling Batman.

5) There's some real similarities between their key plans. Creating riots with the aid of random crooks, and bioterrorism, are very much the sort of stuff that Joker loves doing. Joker would have heartily approved of both of Makishima's major plots during this anime.

6) Both The Joker and Makishima feel deeply alienated from the world in general. That's a big part of why they do what they do.

7) Both like using deathtraps. Makishima made that particularly clear this episode.

8) Even Makishima's choice of weaponry is increasingly Joker-esque. Freakin' dynamite for crying out loud.

9) Makishima has even adopted a classic villainous laugh with this episode.


The Joker is a clown and Makishima is a bishi... but that can be chalked up to the conventions of their respective mediums (superhero comics and anime).

Yes, there are differences between the two, but there's also substantial overlap. I think that Makishima is a bit more complex than Joker, but the two definitely lean heavily in the same direction.


I'm not going to get into Roger's extreme disrespect for Batman because that would go off on a tangent. Suffice it to say that I think Roger is really selling Batman way short here.
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